the i dont care about politics anymore thread

[Basanos]

Is Elizondo's non-dinosaur idea based on the incredibly sparse fossil record we have on almost all creatures of the past? Or is this something more magical than that?How old is the Earth, Homesteaded?

[Homesteaded]

How old is the Earth, Homesteaded?

I believe the latest dating methods put it at like 4.68B years?

[Basanos]

I believe the latest dating methods put it at like 4.68B years?Hehe just checking. See how easy that was, Elizondo?

Like, what specific parts of, uh, "dinosaur theory" do you take issue with? What makes it BS?

[Elizondo]

Hehe just checking. See how easy that was, Elizondo?

Like, what specific parts of, uh, "dinosaur theory" do you take issue with? What makes it BS?

What came first

The theory of Dinosaurs or the 'discovery' of Dinosaurs

I believe the latest dating methods put it at like 4.68B years?

Clever girl

[Reiwa]

Just for the hell of it: how do we even know half life is constant? :o

[Lune]

Just for the hell of it: how do we even know half life is constant? :o

That's a can of worms that actually gets to some of the most profound questions that underlie our universe. Does randomness exist or is the entire universe deterministic? But the short answer at this point is, because it's all we've ever observed.

So it's like asking, "How do we know gravity is always F = G(m1m2/r^2)".

[Homesteaded]

That's a can of worms that actually gets to some of the most profound questions that underlie our universe. Does randomness exist or is the entire universe deterministic? But the short answer at this point is, because it's all we've ever observed.

So it's like asking, "How do we know gravity is always F = G(m1m2/r^2)".

The idea of random is pretty tough to defend.

[Homesteaded]

What came first

The theory of Dinosaurs or the 'discovery' of Dinosaurs

So your theory is that the idea of Dinosaurs preceded the evidence, and we just backfilled our own idea once we found large bones.

I'm pretty interested in Geology, even though I'm a CS Major I had to take a bunch of other science related courses and I've focused on Geology. What is your theory for large bones that are found?

[Lune]

The idea of random is pretty tough to defend.

I believe this too. The universe seems deterministic. This was also Einstein's position: "God does not play dice".

However, best evidence since Einstein's times says randomness, or something that looks like randomness, definitely exists at the quantum level. As well as in nuclear decay.

[Homesteaded]

It seems obvious that anything perceived as random is more often than not a lack of mechanical understanding. I certainly don't know enough about quantum mechanics to say it isn't random but I think you know what I'm saying.

[Elizondo]

So your theory is that the idea of Dinosaurs preceded the evidence, and we just backfilled our own idea once we found large bones.

I'm pretty interested in Geology, even though I'm a CS Major I had to take a bunch of other science related courses and I've focused on Geology. What is your theory for large bones that are found?

I recommend looking into Sir Richard Owen and "The Bone Wars"

Out of the 142 specimens found, only 32 are considered 'legit' in Dino World

The outright fraud perpetuated by Marsh and Cope is beyond comical and absurd

[Basanos]

What came first

The theory of Dinosaurs or the 'discovery' of DinosaursAs I recall the bones were discovered long before any theories of evolution were published.

You don't need one or the other to come first, though, it isn't a cart and a horse. You find evidence, then figure out the rest later as you find other evidence for other things that may or may not be related. Science has always worked this way.

See: dark matter, dark energy, proton decay

[Danth]

As I recall the bones were discovered long before any theories of evolution were published.

Go back farther, to something like the Permian, and you get dragonfly-like insects that were feet across instead of inches. Whether you're talking about bugs or dinos, smaller species existed as well, just the big animals get most the publicity. Joe Public doesn't care about a dinosaur the size of a turkey. We have dinosaurs the size of turkeys alive today....they're called turkeys.

Even moreso than the individual species, the (literal) rise and fall of the continental landmasses, drying and flooding cycles with changes in sea levels, increases and decreases in global atmospheric oxygen and carbon percentages and huge changes to global temperatures and climate all make for interesting study. Mt. Everest started its existence underwater--lots of limestone. Now it's uplifted higher than anything else--just took awhile. Wacky things happen when you give the Earth large enough time scales. We're just an insignificant blip, insofar as geologic time cares.

Danth

[Elizondo]

As I recall the bones were discovered long before any theories of evolution were published.

You don't need one or the other to come first, though, it isn't a cart and a horse. You find evidence, then figure out the rest later as you find other evidence for other things that may or may not be related. Science has always worked this way.

See: dark matter, dark energy, proton decay

I didn't say Evolution. I said the 'theory' that giant monsters existed millions of years ago. That didn't come about until Richard Owen.

We're talking about bones of millions and millions of animals that supposedly lived. No complete skeleton has ever been found that I'm aware of and the total count is less than 3000. There are no real Dinosaur skeletons displayed in a museum. They are all fakes.

Most of the fake skeletons and design of what they supposedly looked like are based on nothing more than a tooth or single 'bone'. It's all reconstruction. That's not Science. That's fantasy and imagination.

There wasn't an 'explosion' of Dinosaur bones being discovered and 'new species' being found (and later proven to be frauds) until after the term "Dinosauria" was coined by Richard Owen.

There are a few claims of bones found previous, but the person who discovered them didn't claim it was a dinosaur (or an animal that lived millions of years previously) and another find was from a 'fossil hunter' (wow what a coincidence!). There's even supposedly a bone found in the late 1600s but only a drawing exists which isn't proof.

If you look at who discovered them, it wasn't random people or workers by accident. It was all by people who had a financial interest in their discovery. The history of Dinosaur bones is filled with laughable fraud from a bunch of a con men and we haven't even started talking about feathers yet.

[magnetaress]

You're wrong Elizondo. I've been to actual digs and fossil beds. Idk where u got ur numbers. There aren't a ton of trex skeles and megafauna left. Butt there are tons and tons of variations on the little raptors etc etc.

I do believe there's errors in the paleontology of like the t rex butt that isn't proof mega fauna didn't exist. They just put it together wrong.

[Elizondo]

You're wrong Elizondo. I've been to actual digs and fossil beds. Idk where u got ur numbers. There aren't a ton of trex skeles and megafauna left. Butt there are tons and tons of variations on the little raptors etc etc.

I do believe there's errors in the paleontology of like the t rex butt that isn't proof mega fauna didn't exist. They just put it together wrong.

There are not a 'ton of trex skeles'

You're straight up lying

[PRogers]

La Brea tar pits.

The earth also had periods of time when the o2 in the atmosphere was 10% or so higher which allowed growth to sizes unlike anything we see today.

[PRogers]

We know this because scientists have found pockets of air trapped in amber and ice.

[Elizondo]

La Brea tar pits.

The earth also had periods of time when the o2 in the atmosphere was 10% or so higher which allowed growth to sizes unlike anything we see today.

There are no dinosaurs at La Brea Tar Pits

[Danth]

...

Out of curiousity, how big are you willing to entertain? Keep in mind elephants can exceed seven tons or so and blue whales--truly monstrous creatures--readily exceed a hundred tons. Within relatively recent history (ie, within historic times) creatures like moas and elephant birds reached ten or twelve feet tall, larger than any still-extant birds.

[PRogers]

Extinct is extinct. Time is time.

Whats 40,000 to 400,000 to 40,000,000?

"Dinosaur" is just a word. Doesnt actually mean a species or group of creatures.

Are 100 million year old bacteria dinosaurs?

[Elizondo]

Out of curiousity, how big are you willing to entertain? Keep in mind elephants can exceed seven tons or so and blue whales--truly monstrous creatures--readily exceed a hundred tons. Within relatively recent history (ie, within historic times) creatures like moas and elephant birds reached ten or twelve feet tall, larger than any still-extant birds.

Elephants and Blue Whales are easily observed and living animals actively being studied today

Dinosaurs are not

[Reiwa]

Extinct is extinct. Time is time.

Whats 40,000 to 400,000 to 40,000,000?

"Dinosaur" is just a word. Doesnt actually mean a species or group of creatures.

Are 100 million year old bacteria dinosaurs?

Doesn't it mean 'terrible lizard'? Terrible as in great

[Elizondo]

"Dinosaur" is just a word. Doesnt actually mean a species or group of creatures.

https://www.sciencefriday.com/articles/the-origin-of-the-word-dinosaur/

When Sir Richard Owen, a naturalist and paleontologist, took a look at the three fossils together, he had a stunning realization: Unlike contemporary reptiles, both the Megalosaurus and Iguanodon had five vertebrate at the base of their spine that appeared to have fused together during their lifetime. Owen hypothesized that the same was true of Hylaeosaurus—something that would link the three mysterious species together.

He catalogued his observations in an 1841 edition of Report of the British Association for the Advancement of Science: “The combination of such characters… altogether peculiar among Reptiles… all manifested by creatures far surpassing in size the largest of existing reptiles, will, it is presumed, be deemed sufficient ground for establishing a distinct tribe or sub-order of Saurian Reptiles, for which I would propose the name of Dinosauria.”

Owen had compounded two Greek words: deinos, which means “horrible” or “fearful,” and the previously used sauros. The result: A terrifying lizard.

Doesn't it mean 'terrible lizard'? Terrible as in great

Yes

[PRogers]

All reptiles are not lizards.

Stromatolites are not dinosaurs. 3,500,000,000 years old.

Not a dinosaur.

They either existed before you were born or they didnt.

[magnetaress]

There are not a 'ton of trex skeles'

That is exactly what I said. Carefully reread that comment :)

[Danth]

Elephants and Blue Whales are easily observed and living animals actively being studied today

Dinosaurs are not

So? That's not the question. How large an animal can you accept? After all, plenty of ancient dinosaur species were medium or small even if the big ones generate the most public notice.

Modest-size dinosaurs are alive today. We call them birds.

[magnetaress]

https://youtube.com/@HistoryoftheEarth

Really good channel. I don't 100% agree with everything butt they make a solid effort .

[Elizondo]

So? That's not the question. How large an animal can you accept? After all, plenty of ancient dinosaur species were medium or small even if the big ones generate the most public notice.

It's not a question of size. None of the bones you observe in a museum are real Dinosaur bones. Period. If you as a layman ever asked if you could inspect real Dinosaur bones you'd be laughed at

Modest-size dinosaurs are alive today. We call them birds.

lol Dino feathers

That is exactly what I said. Carefully reread that comment :)

Yes I read your comment. The actual answer is 1 that was only recently 'discovered' a few years ago after falling during a duel with a Tricerotops

Just like a Disneyland! Wow so fantastical. What a find!

[Danth]

It's not a question of size. None of the bones you observe in a museum are real Dinosaur bones. Period. If you as a layman ever asked if you could inspect real Dinosaur bones you'd be laughed at

Technically correct since fossils aren't bones, strictly speaking, but that doesn't mean anything practical insofar as the discussion cares. It was a question of size because of your earlier comment making fun of "giant monsters." If you deny the existence of all ancient extinct species, that's a broader claim than I understood you to be making initially.

[Elizondo]

Technically correct since fossils aren't bones, strictly speaking, but that doesn't mean anything practical insofar as the discussion cares. It was a question of size because of your earlier comment making fun of "giant monsters." If you deny the existence of all ancient extinct species, that's a broader claim than I understood you to be making initially.

Are you claiming that the giant 50' tall monsters didn't exist but the smaller ones did?

[Basanos]

Go back farther, to something like the Permian, and you get dragonfly-like insects that were feet across instead of inches. Whether you're talking about bugs or dinos, smaller species existed as well, just the big animals get most the publicity. Joe Public doesn't care about a dinosaur the size of a turkey. We have dinosaurs the size of turkeys alive today....they're called turkeys.

Even moreso than the individual species, the (literal) rise and fall of the continental landmasses, drying and flooding cycles with changes in sea levels, increases and decreases in global atmospheric oxygen and carbon percentages and huge changes to global temperatures and climate all make for interesting study. Mt. Everest started its existence underwater--lots of limestone. Now it's uplifted higher than anything else--just took awhile. Wacky things happen when you give the Earth large enough time scales. We're just an insignificant blip, insofar as geologic time cares.

DanthOne of the most interesting courses I ever took was Historical Geology, which dealt with this sort of subject over time specifically. Geological and astronomical timescales are fascinating.

Elephants and Blue Whales are easily observed and living animals actively being studied today

Dinosaurs are notThis is why I opened with how old do you think the Earth actually is.

I want to know where you draw the line when it comes to animals that existed before us.

Like, what about the remains of a wooly mammoth? What about fossilized bacteria?

[Jibartik]

Bro if you want to marvel at chicken bones at the museum go for it. Enjoy.

19965

chicken bones

https://i.imgur.com/81gu5R3.gif

after they made all the chicken nuggets, this was what they built with the leftovers.

[Elizondo]

One of the most interesting courses I ever took was Historical Geology, which dealt with this sort of subject over time specifically. Geological and astronomical timescales are fascinating.

This is why I opened with how old do you think the Earth actually is.

I want to know where you draw the line when it comes to animals that existed before us.

Like, what about the remains of a wooly mammoth? What about fossilized bacteria?

Giving up so soon on the existence of giant monsters in your coloring books?

Dinobirds? Like Archaeopteryx? Oh NM proven Hoax.

[Danth]

Are you claiming that the giant 50' tall monsters didn't exist but the smaller ones did?

Me? Not me. You were the one who said "giant monsters" and brought up examples of huge creatures sizes' estimated from maybe a bone or two, which specifically references claims relating to a few possible giant sauropod species.

For my part I accept the Earth has been around a long time and lots of species have come and gone, some small, some large. I regard the claims noted above relating to some specific species as dubious but other ancient species are decently well-understood. In fact I believe in them more than I believe in YOU. I do not believe the persona you exhibit on this board is entirely reflective of non-internet behavior.

Danth

[Elizondo]

Me? Not me. You were the one who said "giant monsters" and brought up examples of huge creatures sizes' estimated from maybe a bone or two, which specifically references claims relating to a few possible giant sauropod species.

This is literally one the first drawings made by Owen

19968

For my part I accept the Earth has been around a long time and lots of species have come and gone, some small, some large. I regard the claims noted above relating to some specific species as dubious but other ancient species are decently well-understood. In fact I believe in them more than I believe in YOU. I do not believe the persona you exhibit on this board is entirely reflective of non-internet behavior.

Danth

Which Dinosaurs are well understood with an abundance of fossils having been found?

Provide some examples:

In the meantime, can you explain to me how this animal was able to mate? Thanks

19967

[Elizondo]

19969

[magnetaress]

Long penises probably.

[Elizondo]

Long penises probably.

You didn't dig up that bone when you were on site?

[unsunghero]

I saw the clip and this Curry guy was acting like a total cunt about it though

Now is the time, if you are homeless and living in CO, make a bee line for that hotel. They had to fire the employee who asked if Curry was a guest, probably will put all their other employees through “sensitivity training”, and change the rules to never ask anyone loitering in the hotel if they are a guest

This is just like when that Starbucks asked the black guys to leave, they played the race card, and the entire Starbucks chain had to change their policy about non-paying customers loitering and became homeless drop in centers for them to do heroin at for months afterwards

It was fuckin hilarious. Homeless people in CO, now is your time! Get to that hotel, free stays in the lobby thanks to this Curry guy! Lolol

[Jibartik]

hasnt aged a day

[Basanos]

Giving up so soon on the existence of giant monsters in your coloring books?

Dinobirds? Like Archaeopteryx? Oh NM proven Hoax.Why are you so intent on avoiding basic questions?

How old is the Earth? Were wooly mammoths real? What about things like stromatolites?

[Jibartik]

According to the Television (not missinformation like the internet) the HISTORY channel says the earth is 7,000 years old and created by small human sized lizards, and they killed giants that ruled the earth as our protectors, and now rule us secretly.

They manipuplate the bones found from our once great protectors to look like basterized monstrosities.

Thats what the TV told me about HISTORY at least.

[Elizondo]

Why are you so intent on avoiding basic questions?

How old is the Earth? Were wooly mammoths real? What about things like stromatolites?

Is this an interrogation? lol

You kept stalking me in threads and bringing up the subject of Dinosaurs. I think the topic is rather comical, but you insist on it, so here we are

Now you want to talk about Mammoths?

Make up your mind dude. If you want to enjoy your giant monsters in your coloring books and gawk at fake bones in museums, like I said before, enjoy

[Jibartik]

Ok... would you believe, GIANT hairy elephants?

iS4z4zF-g44

[Jibartik]

https://i.imgur.com/ohKhCBD.gif

HDPF6gWGFRA

[Homesteaded]

Listen Elizondo,

I’m truly not dismissing this idea and I love these rabbit holes. I think the question of mammoths is fair because no one alive witnessed a mammoth, just like Dinosaurs. We’re trying to feel out the edges of your idea.

[Reiwa]

According to the Television (not missinformation like the internet) the HISTORY channel says the earth is 7,000 years old and created by small human sized lizards, and they killed giants that ruled the earth as our protectors, and now rule us secretly.

They manipuplate the bones found from our once great protectors to look like basterized monstrosities.

Thats what the TV told me about HISTORY at least.

BEEF

[Basanos]

Is this an interrogation? lol

You kept stalking me in threads and bringing up the subject of Dinosaurs. I think the topic is rather comical, but you insist on it, so here we are

Now you want to talk about Mammoths?

Make up your mind dude. If you want to enjoy your giant monsters in your coloring books and gawk at fake bones in museums, like I said before, enjoyThe fact that you have avoided answering these simple questions four times is very odd. You're outright deflecting and it shows.

How old is the Earth? Where do you draw the line?

[Reiwa]

What the fuck it's a baseball card?

Fuck you.

[Botten]

What the fuck it's a baseball card?

Fuck you.

Trump's shameless money grab: Donald's anticipated 'MAJOR ANNOUNCEMENT' turns out to be sweepstake for his $99 Superman baseball cards - as his popularity craters just weeks after announcing 2024 run (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11542713/Trumps-MAJOR-ANNOUNCEMENT-99-Superman-baseball-cards.html)

[Skarne]

rofl

[PRogers]

Trump's shameless money grab: Donald's anticipated 'MAJOR ANNOUNCEMENT' turns out to be sweepstake for his $99 Superman baseball cards - as his popularity craters just weeks after announcing 2024 run (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11542713/Trumps-MAJOR-ANNOUNCEMENT-99-Superman-baseball-cards.html)

This is real?

[unsunghero]

Listen Elizondo,

I’m truly not dismissing this idea and I love these rabbit holes. I think the question of mammoths is fair because no one alive witnessed a mammoth, just like Dinosaurs. We’re trying to feel out the edges of your idea.

Elizondo’s kid gonna be pretty bummed, I know myself as a kid went through a serious dinosaur phase before going into a shark phase

[Basanos]

This is real?Life is a journey

[PRogers]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jEP224Sa4Rw

Oh, life could be a dream
(Sh-boom)
If I could take you up in paradise up above
(Sh-boom)
If you would tell me I'm the only one that you love
Life could be a dream, sweetheart
Hello, hello, again, sh-boom
And hopin' we'll meet again

[Shourty]

Hi kids. Just swooping in to drop a funny.

[Botten]

Hi kids. Just swooping in to drop a funny.

Oh Elizondo you aren't ever going to live this down.

Horza was right! See how Trumps see himself. Coming to the people as a light from the heavens. A messianic embarrassment to America.

19976

I think it is pretty blatant that this narcissistic obese failure of a MAGA leader is only grifting his base with these new NFTs.

You can now put all your failure focus in to Defacto Sand zzzzzz (so low energy)

And as always keep flailing conservatives!

Will McCarthy even get the house speaker seat .. HA! Love the infighting!

[Basanos]

Hi kids. Just swooping in to drop a funny.I am willing to put twenty bucks down so the forums can get one for Elizondo for Christmas

[Botten]

Hurry while supplies last!
I call this one the village clown.

19978

[Toxigen]

https://youtu.be/tiGkiD4asO4

what are the political implications of letting this kind of behavior go unchecked?

[unsunghero]

Got my Trump card!

[unsunghero]

All I need is 44 more Trump cards and I automatically get a dinner with Trump in Miami according to the website, although it does say I will be responsible for paying the dinner check

[Lune]

Anyone see the extremely poorly photoshopped tuxedo one? Holy fuck lol I could have done a better job

[unsunghero]

Lol they get 900 migrants and declare state of emergency?

Pussies. Welcome to your new role as a border state

[unsunghero]

^
From a different article:

“Thousands of migrants continue to cross from Mexico into South Texas, overwhelming city resources as homeless shelters reach capacity, forcing some migrants to sleep outside in below-freezing temperatures”

— some of you may freeze to death. But this is all for The Greater Good

[Botten]

^
From a different article:

“Thousands of migrants continue to cross from Mexico into South Texas, overwhelming city resources as homeless shelters reach capacity, forcing some migrants to sleep outside in below-freezing temperatures”

— some of you may freeze to death. But this is all for The Greater Good

Almost sounds better than torture by the cartel.

I know let’s build a wall to keep them out from freezing.

Trump border wall between US and Mexico blows over in high winds (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jan/30/trump-border-wall-between-us-and-mexico-blows-over-in-high-winds)

Can you imagine if we built more of that poorly thought up wall instead of the GOP stealing money for themselves from the crowd funding.

But, Conservatives am I right? :rolleyes:

[unsunghero]

Almost sounds better than torture by the cartel.

I know let’s build a wall to keep them out from freezing.

Trump border wall between US and Mexico blows over in high winds (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jan/30/trump-border-wall-between-us-and-mexico-blows-over-in-high-winds)

Can you imagine if we built more of that poorly thought up wall instead of the GOP stealing money for themselves from the crowd funding.

But, Conservatives am I right? :rolleyes:

Ya pretty sad tbh all this modern tech in the Information Age and we still can’t figure out a structure that could actually prevent people from crossing. I imagine most of the border wall is a dilapidated joke

But really, anyone trying to sneak over is either 1. Stupid or 2. Up to no good like transporting drugs

Because it’s not needed. Go to a normal point of entry, queue up for asylum, you’ll be rejected but before then you’ll be released into the US. Don’t attend your rejection hearing. Presto

[Reiwa]

Ya pretty sad tbh all this modern tech in the Information Age and we still can’t figure out a structure that could actually prevent people from crossing. I imagine most of the border wall is a dilapidated joke

But really, anyone trying to sneak over is either 1. Stupid or 2. Up to no good like transporting drugs

Because it’s not needed. Go to a normal point of entry, queue up for asylum, you’ll be rejected but before then you’ll be released into the US. Don’t attend your rejection hearing. Presto

Jails are expensive (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catch_and_release_(immigration)#Under_Donald_Trump )

[Botten]

Ya pretty sad tbh all this modern tech in the Information Age and we still can’t figure out a structure that could actually prevent people from crossing. I imagine most of the border wall is a dilapidated joke

But really, anyone trying to sneak over is either 1. Stupid or 2. Up to no good like transporting drugs

Because it’s not needed. Go to a normal point of entry, queue up for asylum, you’ll be rejected but before then you’ll be released into the US. Don’t attend your rejection hearing. Presto

Right, lets separate the family and send them back without their kids and later we can send their kids to find and stuff!

That will teach them!!!

[unsunghero]

Right, lets separate the family and send them back without their kids and later we can send their kids to find and stuff!

That will teach them!!!

No instead they can join the homeless on the streets, adding more trash, pollution, and congestion, probably get addicted to drugs because they can’t make a living in a foreign place that they can’t speak the language and have no marketable skills

Oh and in the process collapse social services for everyone else under the increased burden

That will teach everyone the value of altruism

[Reiwa]

No instead they can join the homeless on the streets, adding more trash, pollution, and congestion, probably get addicted to drugs because they can’t make a living in a foreign place that they can’t speak the language and have no marketable skills

Oh and in the process collapse social services for everyone else under the increased burden

That will teach everyone the value of altruism

Either you let them in free or run the world's most expensive adult daycare.

[unsunghero]

Either you let them in free or run the world's most expensive adult daycare.

It’s both. We either care for them in a immigration center still nicer than their shithole of a home country or else our food banks and homeless shelters and social services cares for them in whatever shanty they end up in

Same outcome, different methods

[Reiwa]

Reddit won't like it, but maybe it's time for private sector immigrant holding facilities.

(I assume the problem will solve itself by invoking the private sector :o)

[Reiwa]

It’s both. We either care for them in a immigration center still nicer than their shithole of a home country or else our food banks and homeless shelters and social services cares for them in whatever shanty they end up in

Same outcome, different methods

I do think the latter is cheaper somehow. Maybe because churches.

[unsunghero]

I do think the latter is cheaper somehow. Maybe because churches.

We’ll see. In one of the articles Biden is asking for $4 billion to send for support for border cities

Infrastructure will buckle. Same as hospitals did under the covid press

[unsunghero]

It’s funny we had a police request today for the biggest homeless tent I have seen in a while built around a tree, right in the parking lot of a outpatient medical building

The request was some homeless might be in need of shelter support. There are no shelters other than our homeless skid row which isn’t a shelter just miles of tents but it has a queue for church shelters that fills in the morning. No one ever wants to go there

The full story we got was that the medical office building is tired of the burgeoning homeless encampment on their property, but the cop pushed the buck onto us and left. We didn’t even bother to approach the tent and just left since the cops had already left

Looks like the medical staff get fucked lol. My co-worker said they shoulda known having their office in that part of town

[unsunghero]

Another thing is that people don’t realize how crafty someone who’s scrapping to get by can be

Due to there being no shelters, homeless have figured out they can call the Domestic Violence hotline and just lie about being in a DV relationship. It’s not like the person on the phone OR the staff at DV shelters say “your boyfriend beats you? Show me your bruises then”. They just take people’s word for it. They might not even have a boyfriend

This means that the domestic violence shelters have been perma-full for months. People might not realize it, but you can actually call the DV hotline and say “my bf beats me to within an inch of my life and has threatened to kill me, I need a safe place to hide, I have no friend/family supports” and the DV hotline staff will have to answer as nicely as they can, basically, “sorry but we have no shelter availability. Try not to die”

[Elizondo]

The fact that you have avoided answering these simple questions four times is very odd. You're outright deflecting and it shows.

How old is the Earth? Where do you draw the line?

How am I deflecting?

The topic you brought up is Dinosaurs. You're the one that keeps deflecting and changing the subject.

Stick to the topic YOU brought up. Dinosaurs. I'm starting to get bored with your clumsy attempt at playing gotcha.

[Botten]

Another thing is that people don’t realize how crafty someone who’s scrapping to get by can be

Due to there being no shelters, homeless have figured out they can call the Domestic Violence hotline and just lie about being in a DV relationship. It’s not like the person on the phone OR the staff at DV shelters say “your boyfriend beats you? Show me your bruises then”. They just take people’s word for it. They might not even have a boyfriend

This means that the domestic violence shelters have been perma-full for months. People might not realize it, but you can actually call the DV hotline and say “my bf beats me to within an inch of my life and has threatened to kill me, I need a safe place to hide, I have no friend/family supports” and the DV hotline staff will have to answer as nicely as they can, basically, “sorry but we have no shelter availability. Try not to die”

Pretty horrible the richest country in the world is held back by one party that keeps the rich richer and the poor starving and uneducated.

You could argue that helping the poor unmotivates them to get educated, work or better themselves but the same can be said about keeping them poor giving them less of a chance to dig themselves out since social programs and safety nets are cut; to help the rich get a tax break.

And 70% tax rate on the rich doesn’t unmotivate them to try to get more money. Everyone wants more money.

And statics already show trickle down is BS

[Elizondo]

Pretty horrible the richest country in the world is held back by one party that keeps the rich richer and the poor starving and uneducated.

You could argue that helping the poor unmotivates them to get educated, work or better themselves but the same can be said about keeping them poor giving them less of a chance to dig themselves out since social programs and safety nets are cut; to help the rich get a tax break.

And 70% tax rate on the rich doesn’t unmotivate them to try to get more money. Everyone wants more money.

And statics already show trickle down is BS

19982

[unsunghero]

Pretty horrible the richest country in the world is held back by one party that keeps the rich richer and the poor starving and uneducated.

You could argue that helping the poor unmotivates them to get educated, work or better themselves but the same can be said about keeping them poor giving them less of a chance to dig themselves out since social programs and safety nets are cut; to help the rich get a tax break.

And 70% tax rate on the rich doesn’t unmotivate them to try to get more money. Everyone wants more money.

And statics already show trickle down is BS

Part of the reason we are in the mess that we are is the assumption that simply throwing more money at a complex issue like homelessness is a solution

People become more and more reluctant to just throw money at a problem when they see that previous money spent is not fixing things

All these systems are connected. One assumption that is a safe assumption is the more uneducated homeless people you pack into an area, such as millions coming across the border, the more nearby cities infrastructure will buckle under the load

And since these systems are already buckling under our own citizen’s needs, adding millions more to me seems like a recipe for disaster

When freakin Gavin Newsom, champion of the sanctuary city concepts, is begging the federal gov’t to do something, we are getting pretty fucked

[Elizondo]

19983

[unsunghero]

It’s like when Botten mentions not wanting to separate immigrant parents from their children…

Ok…if we allow them to join the other homeless immigrants in makeshift shantytowns, what happens when the kids start getting underfed, cold, and sick?

The state is still not going to allow immigrant kids to starve in some shanty. They’ll take them away from their parents and try to cram them into a CPS shelter. Which causes there to be less options for American citizen’s abused or neglected kids that need shelter

So all of this stuff has a ripple effect. And it still could result in kids being separated. Now this is a worst case scenario, I am not saying it is going to be the norm. But it becomes more likely the more people who are in need come

[Botten]

19982

Anyone can rob to get rich. Republicans do it all the time. Funny how both are criminals that can live their lives in jail if they do it in an extreme fashion.

[Reiwa]

It’s like when Botten mentions not wanting to separate immigrant parents from their children…

Ok…if we allow them to join the other homeless immigrants in makeshift shantytowns, what happens when the kids start getting underfed, cold, and sick?

The state is still not going to allow immigrant kids to starve in some shanty. They’ll take them away from their parents and try to cram them into a CPS shelter. Which causes there to be less options for American citizen’s abused or neglected kids that need shelter

So all of this stuff has a ripple effect. And it still could result in kids being separated. Now this is a worst case scenario, I am not saying it is going to be the norm. But it becomes more likely the more people who are in need come

It's the law(or judicial precedent? hmm!) you can't detain children for more than 21 days

[Reiwa]

And 70% tax rate on the rich doesn’t unmotivate them to try to get more money. Everyone wants more money.



It does give them a shitton less capital to expand and hire more workers and/or improve their process and products. Growth is important.

The upper bracket(s) already pay more than 70% of all income tax revenues.

[Reiwa]

When freakin Gavin Newsom, champion of the sanctuary city concepts, is begging the federal gov’t to do something, we are getting pretty fucked

California can end their sanctuary status at any time but they'd rather pay slavery reparations than use federal money as federally requested.

[Botten]

Part of the reason we are in the mess that we are is the assumption that simply throwing more money at a complex issue like homelessness is a solution

People become more and more reluctant to just throw money at a problem when they see that previous money spent is not fixing things

All these systems are connected. One assumption that is a safe assumption is the more uneducated homeless people you pack into an area, such as millions coming across the border, the more nearby cities infrastructure will buckle under the load

And since these systems are already buckling under our own citizen’s needs, adding millions more to me seems like a recipe for disaster

When freakin Gavin Newsom, champion of the sanctuary city concepts, is begging the federal gov’t to do something, we are getting pretty fucked

330 million in a nation that has almost 20 Trillion GDP a year.

Oh please!! We could afford to give a yearly salary of $40,000 and still have a middle class and rich who opt out of it.

And our military is the biggest glut. 1.64 Trillion each year that is absolutely ridiculous.

[Elizondo]

Anyone can rob to get rich. Republicans do it all the time. Funny how both are criminals that can live their lives in jail if they do it in an extreme fashion.

19984

[Reiwa]

330 million in a nation that has almost 20 Trillion GDP a year.

Oh please!! We could afford to give a yearly salary of $40,000 and still have a middle class and rich who opt out of it.

And our military is the biggest glut. 1.64 Trillion each year that is absolutely ridiculous.

The 1.64T figure includes mandatory spending which isn't counted in "the budget".

It means entitlements.

[Botten]

It’s like when Botten mentions not wanting to separate immigrant parents from their children…

Ok…if we allow them to join the other homeless immigrants in makeshift shantytowns, what happens when the kids start getting underfed, cold, and sick?

The state is still not going to allow immigrant kids to starve in some shanty. They’ll take them away from their parents and try to cram them into a CPS shelter. Which causes there to be less options for American citizen’s abused or neglected kids that need shelter

So all of this stuff has a ripple effect. And it still could result in kids being separated. Now this is a worst case scenario, I am not saying it is going to be the norm. But it becomes more likely the more people who are in need come

Tortured and poor vs poor and working a job no one in America wants (like picking crops)

[Reiwa]

330 million in a nation that has almost 20 Trillion GDP a year.

What did Botten mean by this? All GDP is government revenue? :p

[unsunghero]

It's the law(or judicial precedent? hmm!) you can't detain children for more than 21 days

If I was an immigrant family but with the knowledge that I have from working in the BH field as long as I have, I would knowingly separate from my kid

Rather than try to sneak across and/or survive with my kid on the streets, I would give up custody to a giant shelter/school specifically re-purposed for exclusively parent-less immigrant children (thousands of kids without parents come across the border, little known fact) in my state called Southwest Key. I’ve been to it and it’s pretty nice

My kid would have a decent education and upbringing there, far better than any life I could give them on the street or whatever hovel I could find, which would potentially result in me losing custody anyway once the kid had a bad health scare or something

But Southwest Key was pretty much full when I went there a few years ago, I have no idea if it’s even a viable option now

[Botten]

19984

Moot. Because republicans do the same but are not one person.
Again Republicans and that guy rob others to get rich.

Do it too extremely you go to jail. Which a LOT of republicans do.

[Elizondo]

Moot. Because republicans do the same but are not one person.
Again Republicans and that guy rob others to get rich.

Do it too extremely you go to jail. Which a LOT of republicans do.

Bro this is one of the biggest fraud scandals in History and potentially money sent to #Ukraine laundered for Democrat campaign efforts?

Whataboutism not gonna work this time. So Sorry.

[Botten]

Bro this is one of the biggest fraud scandals in History and potentially money sent to #Ukraine laundered for Democrat campaign efforts?

Whataboutism not gonna work this time. So Sorry.

Again very few vs many many more Republicans doing this extreme criminal activity.
Nice try thou.

[unsunghero]

What did Botten mean by this? All GDP is government revenue? :p

Funding and economics is over my head and pay grade, I don’t pretend to have knowledge of these

I just see the border as a leaking ship. We can try to fund a million different ways to bail out the water but I prefer to focus on fixing the leak

[Reiwa]

Funding and economics is over my head and pay grade, I don’t pretend to have knowledge of these

I just see the border as a leaking ship. We can try to fund a million different ways to bail out the water but I prefer to focus on fixing the leak

It's a huge tangle of bullshit procedures, precedents, and laws. I don't think it was intentional but here we are.

4g7mUeqUHWM

[Elizondo]

Again very few vs many many more Republicans doing this extreme criminal activity.
Nice try thou.

But Republicans Republicans Republicans not passing mustard

So Sorry

[Basanos]

How am I deflecting?

The topic you brought up is Dinosaurs. You're the one that keeps deflecting and changing the subject.

Stick to the topic YOU brought up. Dinosaurs. I'm starting to get bored with your clumsy attempt at playing gotcha.Where is all the comedy you nornally experience reading posts on these forums? You're serious about this subject, all of a sudden?

How old is the Earth, Elizondo?

[Botten]

But Republicans Republicans Republicans not passing mustard

So Sorry

Yeah Republicans stupidly complain about mustard in general is an issue too.

Obama Mustard Attack Becomes Full-Blown Right-Wing Talking Point (https://www.huffpost.com/entry/obama-mustard-attack-beco_n_199953)

Keep flailing.

Now why don’t you go pick up a Trump NFT you laughing stock of a MAGA political alt-right party.

[unsunghero]

It's a huge tangle of bullshit procedures, precedents, and laws. I don't think it was intentional but here we are.


One way to start is not repealing title 42

Covid is crushing again in az, it makes complete sense to keep title 42 in place for our sake as a border state

Edit: for example, we had 24 employees in the last month come down with covid. We are on the precipice, according to our CEO, of having to go back to mask on 100% of the time at work. And we are talking those n95’s face huggers, not the comfy blue ones

[Elizondo]

Where is all the comedy you nornally experience reading posts on these forums? You're serious about this subject, all of a sudden?

How old is the Earth, Elizondo?

lol dude

Are we done talking about Dinosaurs now? You done?

What's the next topic you want to discuss? Neglecting loved ones who have cancer to post on elf forums or legalizing kid porn / pedophilia?

Yeah Republicans stupidly complain about mustard in general is an issue too.

Obama Mustard Attack Becomes Full-Blown Right-Wing Talking Point (https://www.huffpost.com/entry/obama-mustard-attack-beco_n_199953)

Keep flailing.

Now why don’t you go pick up a Trump NFT you laughing stock of a MAGA political alt-right party.

lol 10+ year old Huffpo Article

[Reiwa]

One way to start is not repealing title 42

Covid is crushing again in az, it makes complete sense to keep title 42 in place for our sake as a border state

Edit: for example, we had 24 employees in the last month come down with covid. We are on the precipice, according to our CEO, of having to go back to mask on 100% of the time at work. And we are talking those n95’s face huggers, not the comfy blue ones

Yep title 42 as extant is dependent on the COVID emergency order being in place.

https://www.swcocada.com/hp_wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Lebron-Pic.jpg

[Basanos]

What's the next topic you want to discuss?How old is the Earth, Elizondo? That's the next topic.

We're just having a good time on the forums. Can't imagine why you won't just answer this simple question.

[Elizondo]

How old is the Earth, Elizondo? That's the next topic.

We're just having a good time on the forums. Can't imagine why you won't just answer this simple question.

Sorry man

The two options were:

1) Neglecting loved ones who have cancer to post on elf forums

2) Legalizing kid porn / pedophilia

Why do you want to legalize kid porn, Basanos?

[Basanos]

lol he's getting p. mad

How old is the Earth, Elizondo?

[Reiwa]

lol he's getting p. mad

How old is the Earth, Elizondo?

Some multiple of 12 years if we measured it in tritium half-lifes

[Elizondo]

lol he's getting p. mad

How old is the Earth, Elizondo?

lol he's getting p. mad

Why do you want to legalize kid porn, Basanos?

[Basanos]

lol he's getting p. mad

Why do you want to legalize kid porn, Basanos?Get better at deflection. How old is the Earth?

Some multiple of 12 years if we measured it in tritium half-lifesI wanna see him explain it!

[Botten]

lol 10+ year old Huffpo Article



But Republicans Republicans Republicans not passing mustard

So Sorry

Yeah Republicans stupidly complain about mustard in general is an issue too.

Obama Mustard Attack Becomes Full-Blown Right-Wing Talking Point


lol 10+ year old Huffpo Article

Says the guy mocking someone talking about the Republicans party’s faults and tries to relate it to something as nonsensible as passing the mustard in the 2 last hour or so.

You are just complaining using something as mundane as passing the mustard as your talking point.

Some things never change like Worthless Republicans talking points about your problems with illegal immigrants and wanting a stupid southern boarder wall. That either blows over from the wind or the funds for it are stolen by Republicans criminally fleecing their base… Again Even

[PRogers]

Ive been reading this forum for a few days and some of you are a little too fixated on children and their genitals. Thats weird. Creepy even.

Gross.

[magnetaress]

Some multiple of 12 years if we measured it in tritium half-lifes

+ or - 12 x 12 to some 12th power.

I could live with it.

[magnetaress]

It's a huge tangle of bullshit procedures, precedents, and laws. I don't think it was intentional but here we are.

4g7mUeqUHWM

This is literally 2049

[Lune]

The only way to solve immigration is to implement nationwide RealID like they were about to try in Florida before the RNC's corporate sponsors reminded them that they don't actually want to solve immigration, just use it as a wedge issue.

If they can't get hired, they won't come. Policymakers have known this for decades. Neither Republicans nor Democrats actually want to fix the immigration issue. The depressing effect on labor costs is too valuable to corporations.

Europe is trying things like nearly a year of paid maternity and PATERNITY leave, and literally paying you to try to get you to have children.

In the US we just import replacements.

[magnetaress]

Y politicians and lobbies r dumb.

Lol.

6_gLE-iq0ts

Light frequencies matter 2 lol. Fyi.

[Basanos]

Ive been reading this forum for a few days and some of you are a little too fixated on children and their genitals. Thats weird. Creepy even.

Gross.It's a defense mechanism, and just a feeble attempt at controlling conversation when it's moving in a direction they don't like. They don't believe it either.

[magnetaress]

They did the same to Lincoln over greenbacks.

K4GR27see3U

[Elizondo]

Ive been reading this forum for a few days and some of you are a little too fixated on children and their genitals. Thats weird. Creepy even.

Gross.

19990

Says the guy mocking someone talking about the Republicans party’s faults and tries to relate it to something as nonsensible as passing the mustard in the 2 last hour or so.

Bro, it was a play on words ...

Pass Muster

Hope that helps

[Velthak]

Ingrates.


Next thread.

[Jibartik]

All it would take to get the 50 thousand interpreters and allies that are under threat of death in afghanastan every day, is 1 order from the guy who bailed on them so quick their brothers and sisters fell off the plane as it flew away. (also killed 13 soldiers in the process and a car full of 7 kids with a drone strike)

But instead they are moving out 250 a week - that's how little Americans care about follow-through, or actual people.

You'd rather shoot your way through any problem, then lift one fucking finger to solve one.

Elon musk is a problem, yet we got 50k people who risked their lives to help us now stuck in Afghanistan and nobody here gives a shit.

There is no value in a westerner, they are a souless machine capable of only pressing like dislike and buy it now buttons.

Climatists that order goods from around the globe. Communists that use Amazon.

[magnetaress]

All it would take to get the 50 thousand interpreters and allies that are under threat of death in afghanastan every day, is 1 order from the guy who bailed on them so quick their brothers and sisters fell off the plane as it flew away. (also killed 13 soldiers in the process and a car full of 7 kids with a drone strike)

But instead they are moving out 250 a week - that's how little Americans care about follow-through, or actual people.

You'd rather shoot your way through any problem, then lift one fucking finger to solve one.

Elon musk is a problem, yet we got 50k people who risked their lives to help us now stuck in Afghanistan and nobody here gives a shit.

There is no value in a westerner, they are a souless machine capable of only pressing like dislike and buy it now buttons.

Climatists that order goods from around the globe. Communists that use Amazon.

I feel u man

butt

I5X67pS9k0c

I don't know how to turn the ship around. :o

I agree with you tho. )))

[Basanos]

19990



Bro, it was a play on words ...

Pass Muster

Hope that helpsHaha, if you really believed there were pedophiles on this forum, what are you doing conversing with them?

Anyways, how old is the Earth?

[unsunghero]

The only way to solve immigration is to implement nationwide RealID like they were about to try in Florida before the RNC's corporate sponsors reminded them that they don't actually want to solve immigration, just use it as a wedge issue.

If they can't get hired, they won't come. Policymakers have known this for decades. Neither Republicans nor Democrats actually want to fix the immigration issue. The depressing effect on labor costs is too valuable to corporations.

Europe is trying things like nearly a year of paid maternity and PATERNITY leave, and literally paying you to try to get you to have children.

In the US we just import replacements.

Not a bad idea

[Reiwa]

Not a bad idea

10th amendment

[Botten]

Bro, it was a play on words ...

Pass Muster

Hope that helps

Elizondo: 'but I meant this Reeeeeeeeeeee

keep flailing

[Reiwa]

Elizondo: 'but I meant this Reeeeeeeeeeee

keep flailing

The Rohirrim were mustered at Dunharrow.

[unsunghero]

Manufactured crisis

Fake news

No one cares about more future homeless

No one cares that about fentanyl becoming the new leading cause of drug OD death

It’s

All

For

The

Greater

Good

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=T_ZQCN7jZWE

[unsunghero]

…

[Basanos]

Don't worry, those numbers will definitely go up

[unsunghero]

Also funny that those churches that most Dems despise are the only ones feeding these people, living the American Dream, otherwise they’d be starving to death or stealing from stores

[Reiwa]

Manufactured crisis

Fake news

No one cares about more future homeless

No one cares that about fentanyl becoming the new leading cause of drug OD death

It’s

All

For

The

Greater

Good

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=T_ZQCN7jZWE

Hey there's an idea. Do away with the 100 mile border zone limitation. (https://www.aclu.org/other/constitution-100-mile-border-zone)

2/3 of Americans live in that 'limited' zone anyway so just declare Equal Protection and fuck the rest of us equally. For the greater good!

(The chick in the video implicitly suggested this)

[unsunghero]

^
I was thinking fire all border patrol staff. Everyone gets in. We have unlimited room and jobs so shouldn’t be a problem

But only single adult men carrying fentanyl qualify for benefits like food stamps. They are providing the most in demand product for our economy, we already lost the war on drugs so what is the point, consenting adults and all that

[Reiwa]

https://i.imgur.com/r2AOMk7.jpg

[Basanos]

^
I was thinking fire all border patrol staff. Everyone gets in. We have unlimited room and jobs so shouldn’t be a problem

But only single adult men carrying fentanyl qualify for benefits like food stamps. They are providing the most in demand product for our economy, we already lost the war on drugs so what is the point, consenting adults and all thatJust call them what they are, entrepreneurs

[Botten]

Manufactured crisis

Fake news

No one cares about more future homeless

No one cares that about fentanyl becoming the new leading cause of drug OD death

It’s

All

For

The

Greater

Good


And nothing changes when the right is in power on these topics.

Immigrant caravans, border walls and the debt is never a problem when a Republican is president. Surprise surprise :rolleyes:

[Botten]

^

Mitch McConnell Dusts Off the GOP’s Debt Ceiling Scam: Republicans are pretending to be the party of fiscal responsibility again.

"For the last 40 years, whenever a Republican is president, conservatives in Congress have happily embarked on a bacchanalia of tax cuts and hikes on defense spending. Whenever a Democrat takes office, the GOP suddenly rediscovers its commitment to austerity, bemoaning the debt being passed on to our children. This hypocrisy is particularly acute when it comes to the debt ceiling, a pointless procedural quirk that doesn’t increase spending but allow debts incurred by already approved spending to be paid off." — Alex Shephard.

Manufactured garbage the Republican voters lap up.

[unsunghero]

I love the fake concern on Jake Trapper’s face in the video

Afterwards he goes home to his 90% white neighborhood, pours himself a glass of wine and sits in a bath saying “Thank Lord Science I don’t have 900 Nicaraguans pitching tents outside my neighborhood”

Pay me enough and I can fake concern like that too

[Jibartik]

https://i.imgur.com/r2AOMk7.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/SIr3fIy.png

https://i.imgur.com/161I89u.png

[Jibartik]

^
I was thinking fire all border patrol staff. Everyone gets in. We have unlimited room and jobs so shouldn’t be a problem

But only single adult men carrying fentanyl qualify for benefits like food stamps. They are providing the most in demand product for our economy, we already lost the war on drugs so what is the point, consenting adults and all that

ok also, how about a purge night?

[Reiwa]

Maybe maybe maybe (https://www.cnn.com/2022/12/16/politics/january-6-committee-trump-criminal-charges-doj/index.html)

Isn't this the same story we got a week ago?

When is the Title 42 show on?

[PRogers]

This is getting funnier and funnier. Went from pedophiles to homeless people and how democrats hate churches and fentanyl.

You guys really hate each other. Obsessive hatred.

Imagine saying any of this, out loud. You're that guy.

In honor of the trolling my avatar has been chosen.

[Jibartik]

Were like in the 1980s of the turner diary plot.

[Reiwa]

This is getting funnier and funnier. Went from pedophiles to homeless people and how democrats hate churches and fentanyl.

You guys really hate each other. Obsessive hatred.

Imagine saying any of this, out loud. Yeah, you're that guy.

Don't you find it exciting that they're releasing the report on the Winter Solstice?

Darkest Night of the Year, baby!

m a g i s t e r i u m i m p e r i a l i s l e x

[magnetaress]

it used to be u had to go get permission to go to juarez (you weren't supposed to go)

now juarez comes to u lawl



No one cares that about fentanyl becoming the new leading cause of drug OD death


y do we have to illegally manufacture suicide pills tho

also we could find a better way than fentanyls

https://i.imgur.com/WHMDCg0.jpg

[Jibartik]

The best thing about that is that it isn't about her not caring.

Its about how she knows the reader doesn't care about the people she doesn't, either.

People are rock bottom dumb now though, so they missed it entirely and started howling like they were animals a zoo about it. Which, they are.

[magnetaress]

that's why it was the best thing ever

g-d bless :D

[magnetaress]

what is a really balsy move tho is wearing all white haha that shit gets dirty so ez

[Jibartik]

what is a really balsy move tho is wearing all white haha that shit gets dirty so ez

lnGHB-kI2ZM

[Reiwa]

https://i.imgur.com/SIr3fIy.png

https://i.imgur.com/161I89u.png

I think it breeds the question of whether they settle migrants outside of the 'border exclusion zone(s)' (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chernobyl_Exclusion_Zone).

[magnetaress]

voulentarily shrinking ur own borders is a dumb move lawl we wind up like crimea p soon

[Jibartik]

LETS DO IT

why fight it, lets try to tip the boulder off the sombrero faster!

Whatever the democrats want? IM FOR it.

[magnetaress]

latin languages are eaz to learn anyway

lnGHB-kI2ZM

good movie lol the guy on that picture in the background v familiar

[Jibartik]

latin languages are eaz to learn anyway



good movie lol the guy on that picture in the background v familiar

I love that they keep arguing about it. Great scene.

[PRogers]

Elon Musk is an immigrant.

What is he even talking about?

[Elizondo]

Haha, if you really believed there were pedophiles on this forum, what are you doing conversing with them?

Anyways, how old is the Earth?

Yea I feel dirty engaging with you. You're a total degenerate scumbag for sure. No argument there.

I don't want to answer you because then you'll stop asking 50 times a day but if you insist, fine

A day older than it was yesterday

Elizondo: 'but I meant this Reeeeeeeeeeee

keep flailing

lol dude

It's really a thing:

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Doesn%27t%20Cut%20the%20Mustard

The phrase has since passed into common usage describing anything that does not meet a certain standard.

Don't give me your crap excuses, That Doesn't Cut the Mustard.

Pass Muster + Cut The Mustard =

Post another 15 year old Huffpo article I guess?

[Basanos]

How old is the Earth, Elizondo?

[Botten]

….
lol dude

It's really a thing:

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Doesn%27t%20Cut%20the%20Mustard



Pass Muster + Cut The Mustard =

Post another 15 year old Huffpo article I guess?

Urbandictionary post -> by Vauxhall Burgundy August 21, 2006

The irony.

K hypocrite!

[Reiwa]

Urbandictionary post -> by Vauxhall Burgundy August 21, 2006

The irony.

K hypocrite!

O7tiIWIm8Ys

[Elizondo]

Urbandictionary post -> by Vauxhall Burgundy August 21, 2006

The irony.

K hypocrite!

lol touche

How old is the Earth, Elizondo?

A day older than it was yesterday

[Basanos]

I understand given recent events that you are probably questioning your own identity, Elizondo. But you should have the conviction in your own beliefs that let you answer such a question with confidence. Not avoid it repeatedly and give non-answers, like a coward.

How old is the Earth, Elizondo?

[Jibartik]

I swear to God liberals in the establishment are so racist.

The guy on CNN just asked the guy he was interviewing about illegal immigrants, “how sophisticated is their knowledge do they know anything about our politics?”

Like as if these illegal immigrants are Subhumans and don’t understand the concepts of other countries governments.

I swear to God man the generation that’s alive today and this country is the dumbest generation that this country has ever had.

[magnetaress]

dude rich authoritarian ppl are racist lawl

[Basanos]

Why do you watch CNN jib? I don't watch Daily Wire shows

[unsunghero]

I swear to God liberals in the establishment are so racist.

The guy on CNN just asked the guy he was interviewing about illegal immigrants, “how sophisticated is their knowledge do they know anything about our politics?”

Like as if these illegal immigrants are Subhumans and don’t understand the concepts of other countries governments.

I swear to God man the generation that’s alive today and this country is the dumbest generation that this country has ever had.

Say “I’d like to apply for asylum”

Be released into the United States

Ignore future asylum rejection hearing

Welcome to the United States, stay as long as you like or until a Dem grants you amnesty at some future point

It’s not exactly rocket science. And yes they know what to do

[unsunghero]

“The termination of the authority is expected to lead to an increase in border crossings since authorities will no longer be able to quickly expel them as has been done since March 2020”

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2022/12/14/politics/biden-administration-prepares-surge/index.html

They also know, or have heard, tittle 42 will be expiring soon as well

[magnetaress]

Why do you watch CNN jib? I don't watch Daily Wire shows

it helps to look at everyone even the propogandists every once in awhile

[magnetaress]

dems that think this whole immigration thing is good for them are really dumb because most of the ppl who come from brazil or ecuador aren't going to vote for democrats lol (when and if they ever can vote)

i'm in favor of extremely authoritarian conservative borders. Just warn ppl they will be killed and have a few warning shots first, then killshots with drones.

if u get caught later like deep inside and aren't in drone kill range and are truly illegal no papers perma prison over at the ENron plant maybe u can buy ur freedom after 5 years and passing a test

[Elizondo]

I understand given recent events that you are probably questioning your own identity, Elizondo. But you should have the conviction in your own beliefs that let you answer such a question with confidence. Not avoid it repeatedly and give non-answers, like a coward.

How old is the Earth, Elizondo?

Projection noted

I answered you btw

[Basanos]

Projection noted

I answered you btwHow old is the Earth, Elizondo?

[unsunghero]

dems that think this whole immigration thing is good for them are really dumb because most of the ppl who come from brazil or ecuador aren't going to vote for democrats lol (when and if they ever can vote)

i'm in favor of extremely authoritarian conservative borders. Just warn ppl they will be killed and have a few warning shots first, then killshots with drones.

if u get caught later like deep inside and aren't in drone kill range and are truly illegal no papers perma prison over at the ENron plant maybe u can buy ur freedom after 5 years and passing a test

I think it’s more a long term goal for Dems. An illegal immigrant can’t vote (unless they cheat to, let’s hope that isn’t happening), but any child of theirs born in the US is a naturalized citizen who can. So the question is who will their children vote for? Unless a Dem grants their parents amnesty and then I’m sure they’ll vote for whoever does

Otherwise I like your idea

We need not ignore the appeal of cheap labor for companies too. That is part of the reason both Dems and to some extent conservatives fake caring about mass immigration but don’t really

[magnetaress]

its sensible so it won't happen

sorry unsung

[Reiwa]

We need not ignore the appeal of cheap labor for companies too. That is part of the reason both Dems and to some extent conservatives fake caring about mass immigration but don’t really

American workers are too expensive to be competitive in many sectors.

Not Rodrigo's fault they priced themselves out of the market.

[unsunghero]

We need not ignore the appeal of cheap labor for companies too. That is part of the reason both Dems and to some extent conservatives fake caring about mass immigration but don’t really

“BuT ThEy TaKe tHe JoBs AmEriCaNs doN’T wAnT, like working in fields picking fruit”

Yea the reason Americans don’t want those jobs is they are hard and pay shit. And the REASON they pay shit is why raise wages for an American to entice them to take the job when you can hire an illegal for 3$/hour?

This is why those jobs will always pay shit and how American low skill laborers get fucked

[unsunghero]

American workers are too expensive to be competitive in many sectors.

Not Rodrigo's fault they priced themselves out of the market.

No it’s Rodrigo’s bosses fault for breaking the law to hire them

Unless our laws don’t matter

[magnetaress]

American workers are too expensive to be competitive in many sectors.

Not Rodrigo's fault they priced themselves out of the market.

more american workers would take lower paying harder jobs but theres the legal/civil issues at hand which they no longer can control with votes also those companies that own property are bad the means of production is an issue now

i mean i fucking joined the military and got paid pennies AND was forcibily vaxxed when civilians in my position where getting paid like triple figures so... there u have it

[Reiwa]

No it’s Rodrigo’s bosses fault for breaking the law to hire them

Unless our laws don’t matter

The law is how they became too expensive!

[Reiwa]

more american workers would take lower paying harder jobs but theres the legal/civil issues at hand which they no longer can control with votes also those companies that own property are bad the means of production is an issue now

Picking fruit pays shit because fruit is not very valuable.

[unsunghero]

The law is how they became too expensive!

Evidence required

[Basanos]

“BuT ThEy TaKe tHe JoBs AmEriCaNs doN’T wAnT, like working in fields picking fruit”

Yea the reason Americans don’t want those jobs is they are hard and pay shit. And the REASON they pay shit is why raise wages for an American to entice them to take the job when you can hire an illegal for 3$/hour?

This is why those jobs will always pay shit and how American low skill laborers get fuckedThis is a feature of capitalism, not a bug

[unsunghero]

Picking fruit pays shit because fruit is not very valuable.

I was using it as an example

Is cleaning toilets and having hygiene in a business environment valuable? Or should we allow shit all over the floor

[magnetaress]

@undsunghero

if its not obvious to u by now

our laws do not matter unless u are certain classes than certain laws apply in certain situations :p

[Reiwa]

Evidence required

Nah I'm good.

[magnetaress]

Picking fruit pays shit because fruit is not very valuable.

Ecosystems and fruits are important. That's why rich ppl have big gardens and own islands outside of the industrial zones. fenced in by private security forces soon to be drones

[Reiwa]

Ecosystems and fruits are important. That's why rich ppl have big gardens and own islands outside of the industrial zones.

How much should a banana cost, $10?

[magnetaress]

How much should a banana cost, $10?

1 social credit

bananas maybe should be luxuries tho especcially if they are not domestic but a computer can tell u how many social credits theys should be :p

(now im being a bit flippant butt u get the idea)

ppl should have a greenhouse tho if they want that they can tend to that has bananas in it, they are not hard even in frozen ass places like alaska butt they gotta do the maintance or they get the protien shakes and no bananas

or maybe just the needle

[unsunghero]

The bottom line is having a huge pool of low skill laborers willing to work ILLEGALLY (not legal to hire them) is detrimental to low skill labor wages for every job they are interested in taking, which will pretty much be ANY job offered to them

But Dems, the party of Teh Working Class don’t give a shit about that because hey, cheap labor good for our companies

[magnetaress]

The bottom line is having a huge pool of low skill laborers willing to work ILLEGALLY (not legal to hire them) is detrimental to low skill labor wages for every job they are interested in taking, which will pretty much be ANY job offered to them

But Dems, the party of Teh Working Class don’t give a shit about that because hey, cheap labor good for our companies

yeah i agree and there is definately a place in the middle we should be meeting probablly closer to $10 a banana tho realistically under capitalism considering inflation

[Basanos]

The bottom line is having a huge pool of low skill laborers willing to work ILLEGALLY (not legal to hire them) is detrimental to low skill labor wages for every job they are interested in taking, which will pretty much be ANY job offered to them

But Dems, the party of Teh Working Class don’t give a shit about that because hey, cheap labor good for our companiesHow do you think your average business owner with employees votes?

Weird that you'd perceive this issue in Democrats but not Republicans

[Reiwa]

The bottom line is having a huge pool of low skill laborers willing to work ILLEGALLY (not legal to hire them) is detrimental to low skill labor wages for every job they are interested in taking, which will pretty much be ANY job offered to them

But Dems, the party of Teh Working Class don’t give a shit about that because hey, cheap labor good for our companies

It's either immigants(money sometimes stays in US) or guest workers(money always exits US)

[magnetaress]

u cant give immigrants (or the lower class) $10 a banana tho they will quickly be able to afford land again so its best to try and fix the price of bananas at $2 a banana and sue ppl for using monsanto bananas

[Botten]

The bottom line is having a huge pool of low skill laborers willing to work ILLEGALLY (not legal to hire them) is detrimental to low skill labor wages for every job they are interested in taking, which will pretty much be ANY job offered to them

But Dems, the party of Teh Working Class don’t give a shit about that because hey, cheap labor good for our companies

That is Capitalism. You are arguing for socialism; no matter what the job is get paid enough.

[Reiwa]

u cant give immigrants (or the lower class) $10 a banana tho they will quickly be able to afford land again so its best to try and fix the price of bananas at $2 a banana and sue ppl for using monsanto bananas

We grow more food than our farming labor can harvest.

What the hell else should we do to bring it in?

[unsunghero]

That is Capitalism. You are arguing for socialism; no matter what the job is get paid enough.

Paid enough to want to work it

Just because you don’t think $16/hour picking fruit or cleaning toilets is enough, some poor black American might

Don’t twist my words to say “enough to live on”, that shit is a cop out I will never say this because everyone has different standards of living and most people who complain about jobs not paying “enough to live on” have terrible fucking budgeting

We are talking enough to entice an American to take the job. But it will never get that high because they can hire Jose to clean the toilet for $3/hour ILLEGALLY, thus screwing the poor black American citizen out of a chance to earn some income that isn’t welfare

And that’s assuming Jose can even get the job for $3/hour. Maybe he doesn’t and then his life is sitting in a sleeping bag (hopefully not outside your neighborhood right? NOT IN MY BACKYARD) waiting for his free church meal at 6pm every day for the rest of his life. What a great American Dream life. And yes probably still better than the shithole he came from, not arguing that

[Reiwa]

Paid enough to want to work it

Just because you don’t think $16/hour picking fruit or cleaning toilets is enough, some poor black American might

Don’t twist my words to say “enough to live on”, that shit is a cop out I will never say this because everyone has different standards of living and most people who complain about jobs not paying “enough to live on” have terrible fucking budgeting

We are talking enough to entice an American to take the job. But it will never get that high because they can hire Jose to clean the toilet for $3/hour ILLEGALLY, thus screwing the poor black American citizen out of a chance to earn some income that isn’t welfare

And that’s assuming Jose can even get the job for $3/hour. Maybe he doesn’t and then his life is sitting in a sleeping bag (hopefully not outside your neighborhood right? NOT IN MY BACKYARD) waiting for his free church meal at 6pm every day for the rest of his life. What a great American Dream life. And yes probably still better than the shithole he came from, not arguing that

Americans benefit by eating (some of) the cheaply harvested food.

[unsunghero]

Americans benefit by eating the cheaply harvested food.

Finding an excuse to do an illegal activity is terrible ethics IMO

My friends benefit from me driving them home drunk by not having to pitch in for an Uber

[Reiwa]

Finding an excuse to do an illegal activity is terrible ethics IMO

Morality, ethics, or legalism? 🐼

[unsunghero]

Morality, ethics, or legalism? 🐼

It’s illegal and has negative ripple effects but because I can find one possible positive none of the other stuff matters

Let’s do this for all our laws

[Reiwa]

It’s illegal and has negative ripple effects but because I can find one possible positive none of the other stuff matters

Let’s do this for all our laws

RDrfE9I8_hs

[Basanos]

Paid enough to want to work it

Just because you don’t think $16/hour picking fruit or cleaning toilets is enough, some poor black American might

Don’t twist my words to say “enough to live on”, that shit is a cop out I will never say this because everyone has different standards of living and most people who complain about jobs not paying “enough to live on” have terrible fucking budgeting

We are talking enough to entice an American to take the job. But it will never get that high because they can hire Jose to clean the toilet for $3/hour ILLEGALLY, thus screwing the poor black American citizen out of a chance to earn some income that isn’t welfare

And that’s assuming Jose can even get the job for $3/hour. Maybe he doesn’t and then his life is sitting in a sleeping bag (hopefully not outside your neighborhood right? NOT IN MY BACKYARD) waiting for his free church meal at 6pm every day for the rest of his life. What a great American Dream life. And yes probably still better than the shithole he came from, not arguing thathttps://i.imgur.com/Unc4Nnj.jpeg

[unsunghero]

^
It’s not capitalism when it’s illegal

That’s like saying de-frauding your customers is “just capitalism”

It’s illegal to hire non-citizens for pennies/hour borderline slave labor. Obviously if it had nothing but benefits it wouldn’t be illegal

And finding one benefit as an excuse to justify it to me seems like a cop out. “I throw my trash out the window of my car because it provides jobs for highway cleanup crews, I’m benefitting the economy”

[Basanos]

^
It’s not capitalism when it’s illegal

That’s like saying de-frauding your customers is “just capitalism”

It’s illegal to hire non-citizens for pennies/hour borderline slave labor. Obviously if it had nothing but benefits it wouldn’t be illegal

And finding one benefit as an excuse to justify it to me seems like a cop out. “I throw my trash out the window of my car because it provides jobs for highway cleanup crews, I’m benefitting the economy”Human slavery was legal, is that also not capitalism?

Yes, yes, I realize slavery existed well before Adam Smith and shit I just think "crony capitalism" is just capitalism

[Reiwa]

^
It’s not capitalism when it’s illegal

That’s like saying de-frauding your customers is “just capitalism”

It’s illegal to hire non-citizens for pennies/hour borderline slave labor. Obviously if it had nothing but benefits it wouldn’t be illegal

And finding one benefit as an excuse to justify it to me seems like a cop out. “I throw my trash out the window of my car because it provides jobs for highway cleanup crews, I’m benefitting the economy”

Okay, we decide to pay more for the same banana but also harvest more banana than we can eat, but our banana is then too expensive for the global market to bear and goes to rot, so we make up the loss by increasing the price of our banana.

Something like that.

For the record, I don't even dislike nationalists. I would prefer if they were right. But that simply isn't so.

[Basanos]

It is perfectly legal for a company to build a factory in Indonesia and pay workers pennies on the dollar compared to an American worker. In fact, this sort of thing is why most of us can afford stuff.

Is that also not capitalism?

[Lune]

^
It’s not capitalism when it’s illegal

That’s like saying de-frauding your customers is “just capitalism”

It’s illegal to hire non-citizens for pennies/hour borderline slave labor. Obviously if it had nothing but benefits it wouldn’t be illegal

And finding one benefit as an excuse to justify it to me seems like a cop out. “I throw my trash out the window of my car because it provides jobs for highway cleanup crews, I’m benefitting the economy”

Illegal immigration is illegal like weed is illegal.

Republicans could fix it today in their states today by creating and enforcing RealID employment laws. If they can't work, they won't come. However, corporations won't let them because they dramatically bring down the cost of labor. (Remember, this is largely what led to Brexit. Brits got sick of their corporations importing millions of third world Muslims and Poles.)

It's not that "Some poor black might work for that $16", it's that if there wasn't an immigrant around to work for pennies, they'd have to pay more than pennies.

[unsunghero]

Human slavery was legal, is that also not capitalism?

Yes, yes, I realize slavery existed well before Adam Smith and shit I just think "crony capitalism" is just capitalism

Was illegal yes

I don’t think it’s right to blame capitalism, I think the blame should be put on liars and hypocrites

The party of the working class doesn’t care when something causes a net negative to the American working class. And the SECURE TEH BORDER conservatives don’t care when they hire illegals for their companies to save a few bucks. The same hypocrites that rage about illegals bringing drugs over that end up either buying those drugs themselves or else their kids they are neglecting eventually do. Supporting cartels with their wallets

[Basanos]

'Workers of the world, unite!' has the word "world" in it for this very reason

[Danth]

We grow more food than our farming labor can harvest.

What the hell else should we do to bring it in?

Realistically? Beyond a correction in the wage rates for agricultural labor you'd see some shift in the relative proportions of crops being grown. Some require a lot more manhours than others. Most of the major staples go well with mechanization but I suspect it'd reduce the variety of cheaply-available foods back to norms more typical of the 1940's or 50's when labor costs were a much more limiting factor than they are today. Might also see the U.S. exporting less foodstuffs with associated destabilization in some other regions of the world. It rapidly turns into a messy proposition.

Without going to that extreme, I'd like to see migrant or immigrant workers at least extended good labor protections. They're too often treated deplorably.

Danth

[Lune]

It is perfectly legal for a company to build a factory in Indonesia and pay workers pennies on the dollar compared to an American worker. In fact, this sort of thing is why most of us can afford stuff.

Is that also not capitalism?

Don't you know? Republicans don't actually like the free market, it's just rhetoric that helps them reconcile why they shouldn't have to pay taxes.

[Basanos]

Was illegal yes

I don’t think it’s right to blame capitalism, I think the blame should be put on liars and hypocrites

The party of the working class doesn’t care when something causes a net negative to the American working class. And the SECURE TEH BORDER conservatives don’t care when they hire illegals for their companies to save a few bucks. The same hypocrites that rage about illegals bringing drugs over that end up either buying those drugs themselves or else their kids they are neglecting eventually do. Supporting cartels with their walletsThose liars and hypocrites are capitalists, whether they are Democrats or Republicans. Even Democratic Socialist types do this, it's why we Actual Leftists will also criticize the Nordic model of socialism.

An ideology can't take responsibility for anything. We can only blame people. Conservative critique of capitalism is baffling.

[unsunghero]

It is perfectly legal for a company to build a factory in Indonesia and pay workers pennies on the dollar compared to an American worker. In fact, this sort of thing is why most of us can afford stuff.

Is that also not capitalism?

Most stuff is stuff we don’t need

“Well this is how we’ve always done it” is a shitty reason to continue a bad practice

Throwing one’s hands up in the air and saying “in this day and age with our modern tech and information we just can’t find an alternative solution to this problem other than exploiting third world workers” just isn’t convincing me. Call me stubborn

[Basanos]

Let's try this from the other end.

What changes are you suggesting? Would the Republican party in general, assuming it is in control of the presidency, house, and senate... support whatever changes you'd want to see?

[Homesteaded]

Most stuff is stuff we don’t need

“Well this is how we’ve always done it” is a shitty reason to continue a bad practice

Throwing one’s hands up in the air and saying “in this day and age with our modern tech and information we just can’t find an alternative solution to this problem other than exploiting third world workers” just isn’t convincing me. Call me stubborn

Creative solutions are the answer. Either way we need a societal change. Accumulation of “stuff” is a very real problem. A problem I believe is caused by a lack of moral bedrock. Science is the new religion.

[Basanos]

Don't you know? Republicans don't actually like the free market, it's just rhetoric that helps them reconcile why they shouldn't have to pay taxes.Engaging people during this form of rhetoric is how you actually create change. I obviously have big issues with Republicans, and agree with you, but conversations like this are opportunities.

[unsunghero]

Let's try this from the other end.

What changes are you suggesting? Would the Republican party in general, assuming it is in control of the presidency, house, and senate... support whatever changes you'd want to see?

A start could be arresting and imprisoning the companies admin staff who hire illegals. It’s done, and they do tend to throw the book at them, but it’s rare

Giving financial incentives to hire Americans and produce here could be another way

Would repubs support it? No idea

[Danth]

Let's try this from the other end.

What changes are you suggesting? Would the Republican party in general, assuming it is in control of the presidency, house, and senate... support whatever changes you'd want to see?

Given the republicans general contempt for the working class you know damnned well what would happen--nothing. They'd fill their own pockets while blaming the other side and the politics-as-a-sports-team bunch would continue lapping it up. That being said the democrats are no better today. That party's modern incarnation is largely indistinguishable from the republicans in any way that genuinely matters, loud harping on insubstantial wedge issues notwithstanding. Once in awhile they find a way to do something right, like the Obama administration pushing hard for new school construction--that was legitimately good work--but for the most part they're practically and disappointingly just about the same.

[Basanos]

A start could be arresting and imprisoning the companies admin staff who hire illegals. It’s done, and they do tend to throw the book at them, but it’s rare

Giving financial incentives to hire Americans and produce here could be another way

Would repubs support it? No ideaI would like to believe that most people, regardless of party, would see this as the neo-slavery it is. They do bust folks sometimes.

I personally think the Republican party might support the incentives you suggest, but I am more skeptical that they'd change any existing laws to make punishment more severe. I would wager there are powerful lobbying groups that would prefer the status quo, or even rolling back protections further.

https://www.justice.gov/usao-sdga/pr/human-smuggling-forced-labor-among-allegations-south-georgia-federal-indictment

[unsunghero]

It won’t change though, and it will be interesting to see the cities homeless demographic shift in the coming years

Luckily, despite being in a border state, I live in the north and nicer part of the city. So I can simulate being a politician in an ivory tower and not care because it won’t affect me directly. Well, only at work it will because we help everyone regardless of immigration status

Going on a hike, peace!

[Reiwa]

A start could be arresting and imprisoning the companies admin staff who hire illegals. It’s done, and they do tend to throw the book at them, but it’s rare

Uphold Xi Un-sung thought

[Basanos]

Creative solutions are the answer. Either way we need a societal change. Accumulation of “stuff” is a very real problem. A problem I believe is caused by a lack of moral bedrock. Science is the new religion.Can you name any creative solutions?

[Reiwa]

Can you name any creative solutions?

Innovation

[Basanos]

Innovationhttps://y.yarn.co/acea6cee-bbde-4ed1-bbae-0bb7e73485e3_text.gif

[Danth]

Innovation

Which brings us to problems on the other side of it: A lot of smaller- and medium-size operations don't *want* to mechanize because the equipment manufacturers are increasingly hostile to deal with. John Deere has spent years trying to make farmers unable to even repair their own machinery. Nearly all the non-amish farms around here use illegals, and most of them use decades-old equipment, and the above problem definitely contributes.

Complex problems unfortunately don't have simple one-step solutions. Took decades to get us to where we are and it'll take a long time to un-screw it if sufficient desire to do so even materializes.

[Elizondo]

Ahh Socialism/Communism

20001

[Basanos]

I do not think the desire to solve the problem will exist until the shelves are empty, in some sense. Maybe it will be the coffee that convinces rich people these problems are real, but part of me suspects it will be the mass riots

[Basanos]

Ahh Socialism/Communism

20001https://i.imgur.com/1mEZnql.jpeg

[Elizondo]

Socialism/Communism making dumpster diving great again

20002

[Jibartik]

https://i.imgur.com/4RRLrRu.png

[Lune]

Ahh Socialism/Communism

You've been operant conditioned like a dog to associate third world culture with socialism, which has never actually been tried in a functional, advanced culture. (Except for European mixed markets which resulted in better societies than the USA, by every metric but military spending and number of billionaires).

It's frankly pathetic and I feel bad for you.

Here let me show you something else you've been trained in, Pavlonian style.

MAINSTREAM MEDIA!

How do you feel?

[Reiwa]

You've been operant conditioned like a dog to associate third world culture with socialism, which has never actually been tried in a functional, advanced culture. (Except for European mixed markets which resulted in better societies than the USA, by every metric but military spending and number of billionaires).

It's frankly pathetic and I feel bad for you.

Here let me show you something else you've been trained in, Pavlonian style.

MAINSTREAM MEDIA!

How do you feel?

What about Russia?

[Lune]

What about Russia?

Russia isn't a functional, advanced culture. They have (had) a small, core elite intelligentsia that was able to attempt to compete with NATO scientifically, but you can see how that went down. The rest just barely have indoor plumbing.

It took Western Europe millennia to culturally evolve into democracy. How well do you think it works out trying to impose European political systems onto vastly different cultural values? Not well, unless you're Japan or South Korea, which happen to be very compatible.

[Reiwa]

Russia isn't a functional, advanced culture.

https://i.imgur.com/ybxkiJL.gif

[Elizondo]

You've been operant conditioned like a dog to associate third world culture with socialism, which has never actually been tried in a functional, advanced culture. (Except for European mixed markets which resulted in better societies than the USA, by every metric but military spending and number of billionaires).

It's frankly pathetic and I feel bad for you.

Here let me show you something else you've been trained in, Pavlonian style.

MAINSTREAM MEDIA!

How do you feel?

Ahh the 'never been tried' canard from the true believer

lol

[Lune]

Woof!

[Elizondo]

20003

[Basanos]

Woof!Please help me sealion Elizondo into telling us how old he thinks the Earth is, so far the results of merely asking have been spectacular.

I have a t-shirt from the Ark Experience, my irony poisoning is terminal

[Botten]

It won’t change though, and it will be interesting to see the cities homeless demographic shift in the coming years

Luckily, despite being in a border state, I live in the north and nicer part of the city. So I can simulate being a politician in an ivory tower and not care because it won’t affect me directly. Well, only at work it will because we help everyone regardless of immigration status

Going on a hike, peace!

The missing workers who are never coming back (https://www.axios.com/2022/12/16/the-missing-workers-who-are-never-coming-back)

The other 1.5 million comes from a decline in immigration and "a surge in deaths."

It is almost like all the complaining from the Right is just brainwashing because actually our economy is better with these immigrants.

Right falls for manufactured BS

[unsunghero]

The missing workers who are never coming back (https://www.axios.com/2022/12/16/the-missing-workers-who-are-never-coming-back)



It is almost like all the complaining from the Right is just brainwashing because actually our economy is better with these immigrants.

Right falls for manufactured BS

Any recent decline in immigration is a lie

There was a decline in immigration when Trump was pres because immigrants knew they would likely be rejected

And yes there are labor shortages that should BE FILLED BY AMERICAN CITIZENS

So ironic that you Dems cheer when people quit in order to force employers to raise wages then also cheer for illegals taking American’s jobs and lowering wages

Contradict harder

[Basanos]

How do you think you're gonna get American citizens to do those jobs?

[Elizondo]

Please help me sealion Elizondo into telling us how old he thinks the Earth is, so far the results of merely asking have been spectacular.

I have a t-shirt from the Ark Experience, my irony poisoning is terminal

20004

[unsunghero]

How do you think you're gonna get American citizens to do those jobs?

Can start by paying them more

Refusing to work in order to force a wage increase is a smart tactic, I’ve never had a problem with it


It’s just now Dems, of all people for some reason, try to fall back on BUT MUH CAPITALISM REQUIRES BORDERLINE SLAVE LABOR FOR [x] INDUSTRY TO NOT FAIL

Sort of like how they go BUT MUH PRIVATE COMPANY when a private company does something they like

But no, let’s instead of paying American citizens more let’s have millions of people stream across an invisible line undocumented, with unknown medical issues or criminal histories, and unknown intentions and possessions, and hope that a decent chunk of them will streal those jobs for $3/hour because MUH CAPITALISM

[Reiwa]

Can start by paying them more

Refusing to work in order to force a wage increase is a smart tactic, I’ve never had a problem with it


It’s just now Dems, of all people for some reason, try to fall back on BUT MUH CAPITALISM REQUIRES BORDERLINE SLAVE LABOR FOR [x] INDUSTRY TO NOT FAIL

Sort of like how they go BUT MUH PRIVATE COMPANY when a private company does something they like

But no, let’s instead of paying American citizens more let’s have millions of people stream across an invisible line undocumented, with unknown medical issues or criminal histories, and unknown intentions and possessions, and hope that a decent chunk of them will streal those jobs for $3/hour because MUH CAPITALISM

Would you rather have cheaper food or higher wages?

[Basanos]

Can start by paying them more

Refusing to work in order to force a wage increase is a smart tactic, I’ve never had a problem with it


It’s just now Dems, of all people for some reason, try to fall back on BUT MUH CAPITALISM REQUIRES BORDERLINE SLAVE LABOR FOR [x] INDUSTRY TO NOT FAIL

Sort of like how they go BUT MUH PRIVATE COMPANY when a private company does something they like

But no, let’s instead of paying American citizens more let’s have millions of people stream across an invisible line undocumented, with unknown medical issues or criminal histories, and unknown intentions and possessions, and hope that a decent chunk of them will streal those jobs for $3/hour because MUH CAPITALISMSo, would you support an increase in the Federal minimum wage?

Are you also implying that if immigration was somehow under control, that employers would see the light on their own and start raising wages to compete with other employers?

Maybe the Republicans raise the Federal minimum wage someday when there's enough widespread poverty that people are camping out on the golf courses, but I have precisely zero faith in the idea that employers will raise wages in the right conditions. The only reason I've personally seen wages go up towards the bottom of the spectrum is due to the pandemic.

Around here, those higher wages that were being offered during the pandemic have already sunken down to nearly their pre-pandemic levels. The McDonald's down the street has a sign up that says it is hiring at $11/hour, they're still understaffed as hell. As they should be at that pay rate.

[unsunghero]

Would you rather have cheaper food or higher wages?

If more expensive food means not breaking the law then I’d rather pay more for food

It’s like let’s just stop all health standard laws too. Food is more expensive when you have to prepare it ethically and follow some annoying heath codes

Remove the health codes and we can save a lot of money

[unsunghero]

So, would you support an increase in the Federal minimum wage?

Are you also implying that if immigration was somehow under control, that employers would see the light on their own and start raising wages to compete with other employers?

Maybe the Republicans raise the Federal minimum wage someday when there's enough widespread poverty that people are camping out on the golf courses, but I have precisely zero faith in the idea that employers will raise wages in the right conditions. The only reason I've personally seen wages go up towards the bottom of the spectrum is due to the pandemic.

Around here, those higher wages that were being offered during the pandemic have already sunken down to nearly their pre-pandemic levels. The McDonald's down the street has a sign up that says it is hiring at $11/hour, they're still understaffed as hell. As they should be at that pay rate.

I don’t know enough about min wage, it confuses me

For example, in my state min wage is still ridiculously low, but no one pays that. Every fast food restaurant I’ve seen are advertising starting at $16+/hour

Technically an employer would have to raise wages in order to keep the business running, unless the CEO wants to scrub the toilets himself. But it doesn’t play out that way when there’s this never ending pool of under the table dirt cheap labor

The invisible hand would normally be correcting the labor supply/demand price ideally

[unsunghero]

It’s just weird because it reminds me of our busted healthcare system

Both parties acknowledge it has problems but only the republicans seem to be frequently saying “well yea but it’s probably not going to get any better and it’s too hard to change so…./shrug” while the Dems call for healthcare reform

Yet for our underground low skill labor market both parties seem to go “well yea but it’s probably not going to get any better and it’s too hard/expensive to fix so…./shrug”

Very picky regarding one’s battles

[Basanos]

It’s just weird because it reminds me of our busted healthcare system

Both parties acknowledge it has problems but only the republicans seem to be frequently saying “well yea but it’s probably not going to get any better and it’s too hard to change so…./shrug” while the Dems call for healthcare reform

Yet for our underground low skill labor market both parties seem to go “well yea but it’s probably not going to get any better and it’s too hard/expensive to fix so…./shrug”

Very picky regarding one’s battlesThe two things are related, labor to healthcare. The fact that your healthcare is tied to your employment status, for the average person, is not a mistake. This gives employers enormous leverage over you.

In our case, for example, the fact that I'm still technically employed, and thus insured, is totally a decision by my decent boss. There's no law requiring them to do that. They're covering my healthcare premiums while we deal with this, despite the fact that I work zero hours.

Protections built into ACA are the only reason my wife hasn't lost her job, that whole pre-existing conditions thing, and is therefore insured. If we weren't, the bills we have would already be in the millions.

I'd think more capitalists would support, at least, detaching healthcare from our employers, but I have personally never seen that argument from anyone on the right. Maybe I just missed it. All I ever see from the right myself is "we should get costs down" but nobody ever seems to have any idea how.

The fact that healthcare is tied to employment in America is not only unethical, and actively causing harm to Americans, it's anti-competitive. Then again, this pandemic and the last six years or so have taught me many Americans do not understand capitalism, socialism, or even feudalism.

[Reiwa]

If more expensive food means not breaking the law then I’d rather pay more for food

It’s like let’s just stop all health standard laws too. Food is more expensive when you have to prepare it ethically and follow some annoying heath codes

Remove the health codes and we can save a lot of money

I think there is a moral imperative in producing as much food as reasonably possible.

In other words, fuck the law. 😼

[Basanos]

I think there is a moral imperative in producing as much food as reasonably possible.That's only gonna get more pronounced as various climate crises force more and more people out of countries closer to the equator, too. Fortress America is already on its way