ASOIAF / Game of Thrones (SPOILERS INSIDE)

[Sirken]

Collection of season 6 stills. My God as Bran aged!

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/02/11/game-of-thrones-20-crisp-new-photos-from-season-6/

yes, but it was retarded when they were still trying to pass him off as a little child in season 4. keeping him out of season 5 was a good call imo. because it will help my brain adjust to him being so much older looking than he was 5 years ago

[holahouze]

yes, but it was retarded when they were still trying to pass him off as a little child in season 4. keeping him out of season 5 was a good call imo. because it will help my brain adjust to him being so much older looking than he was 5 years ago

Have you seen a recent pic of Rickon? Similar deal. We will cope with it. While reading books, I felt Martin started the Stark kids out a couple years too young. Very heavy sheisse to deal with for the age.

[holahouze]

yes, but it was retarded when they were still trying to pass him off as a little child in season 4. keeping him out of season 5 was a good call imo. because it will help my brain adjust to him being so much older looking than he was 5 years ago

What did you think about the speculation re: pic of Bran and Bloodraven. I've wondered how they'd handle the visions -- i think it would be pretty cool to have them out of the cave - right there witnessing things.

[Sirken]

I thought GoT final season was like a yr ago? now?

nope. Season 6 starts April 26th i believe. and it will most likely go through season 8 ;)

[Sirken]

Have you seen a recent pic of Rickon? Similar deal. We will cope with it. While reading books, I felt Martin started the Stark kids out a couple years too young. Very heavy sheisse to deal with for the age.

originally GRRM planned for this to have a 5 year gap between books three and four. which actually makes me wonder a lot about certain characters like Eddard Dayne, and of course as you mentioned, the Stark children.

to answer your question though, no i have not. i also havent seen any on set pictures of the actor that played Rickon. So either hes been well hidden, or maybe they are recasting him? i dunno tbh.

[Sirken]

What did you think about the speculation re: pic of Bran and Bloodraven. I've wondered how they'd handle the visions -- i think it would be pretty cool to have them out of the cave - right there witnessing things.

thats exactly what i think it was, a vision, or a green dream. similar to how Jojen walked up to Bran and started talking to him in his dream. i think they will be in some of the visions as they are observed, giving us a 3rd person POV as opposed to a 1st person POV.

which, i think is a good idea, because it will keep those characters interesting. but what about Hodor and Meera? :p

[holahouze]

originally GRRM planned for this to have a 5 year gap between books three and four. which actually makes me wonder a lot about certain characters like Eddard Dayne, and of course as you mentioned, the Stark children.

to answer your question though, no i have not. i also havent seen any on set pictures of the actor that played Rickon. So either hes been well hidden, or maybe they are recasting him? i dunno tbh.

Thanks for reminding me of 5 year gap. Martin did throw a number of characters into heavy stuff in their mid teens. Eddard Dayne...? Wow - so many characters and storylines for Martin to account for in the next 2000 pages.

Art Parkinson is now 14 y/o and 5'6" tall. There are a number of promo pics out there for movie San Andreas. I picked this one as it skews toward him returning as Rickon.

http://winteriscoming.net/2015/08/24/art-parkinson-rickon-stark-spotted-in-belfast/

[AenorVZ]

https://youtu.be/KYOl1qN3pBQ

I'm sure you nerds have seen it.

[Sirken]

its coming! - https://youtu.be/7pFlCj8lUFI

[barrettdc1]

its coming! - https://youtu.be/7pFlCj8lUFI

I can't fucking wait.

[AenorVZ]

its coming! - https://youtu.be/7pFlCj8lUFI

I'm dying.

[Sirken]

im still waiting for someone to point out that we were graced by the face and voice of Catelyn Stark in that teaser


just sayin...
http://i.imgur.com/E7Ogjpx.png

[AenorVZ]

So okay ... the series has gone completely off the rails and they rushed past so many plot lines that would have made the series better instead of completely fucking it up the way they have (i.e. Lady Stoneheart). But it's never too late to go back and actually do the books instead of this shitty fanfic. Last we heard, Brienne was luring Jaime into Lady Stoneheart's clutches. Do that. Get this shit back on the rails.

Edit: Seriously ... at any fucking time the writers for the series could realize "I'm shit at writing fantasy. GRRM is one of the all time greats. Maybe I should let him write the story." Same with the idiots who completely fucked up the LOtR movies.

[holahouze]

So okay ... the series has gone completely off the rails and they rushed past so many plot lines that would have made the series better instead of completely fucking it up the way they have (i.e. Lady Stoneheart). But it's never too late to go back and actually do the books instead of this shitty fanfic. Last we heard, Brienne was luring Jaime into Lady Stoneheart's clutches. Do that. Get this shit back on the rails.

Edit: Seriously ... at any fucking time the writers for the series could realize "I'm shit at writing fantasy. GRRM is one of the all time greats. Maybe I should let him write the story." Same with the idiots who completely fucked up the LOtR movies.

The teaser didn't give me any new hope that Stoneheart would included in S6, but I'd be all for it. Anything to avoid the Dorne and Stannis s5 storyline tragedies.

I also think the showrunners would be overjoyed with new Martin content. But, that's another, sad story.

[AenorVZ]

The teaser didn't give me any new hope that Stoneheart would included in S6, but I'd be all for it. Anything to avoid the Dorne and Stannis s5 storyline tragedies.

I also think the showrunners would be overjoyed with new Martin content. But, that's another, sad story.

If they just stuck to the books, they could pick up content from the new book seamlessly. But since they went off the rails in fanfic, it's much harder to get back to the book content.

[maerilith]

plz rename thread to sirkens blog

[Sirken]

So okay ... the series has gone completely off the rails and they rushed past so many plot lines that would have made the series better instead of completely fucking it up the way they have (i.e. Lady Stoneheart). But it's never too late to go back and actually do the books instead of this shitty fanfic. Last we heard, Brienne was luring Jaime into Lady Stoneheart's clutches. Do that. Get this shit back on the rails.


the good news is that it looks like they will be circling back around to do some book 4 stuff that they hadnt done yet (ie: Jaime will me going to the riverlands to deal with the blackfish and riverrun)

[Sirken]

The teaser didn't give me any new hope that Stoneheart would included in S6, but I'd be all for it. Anything to avoid the Dorne and Stannis s5 storyline tragedies.

I also think the showrunners would be overjoyed with new Martin content. But, that's another, sad story.

they cant really fix what they did to stannis, unless they didnt actually kill him. but i think itd be pretty cheesy to fake 2 two characters, or bring them back, or whatever. as for dorne, maybe its not too late? maybe somehow get Arianne on the show? i just dont know. i love Dorne, and i cant believe how poorly it was done on the show.

plz rename thread to sirkens blog

yep, over 2500 posts of me talking to myself about random shit. for your own benefit, i suggest you go google the word "blog".
<3
Sirks

[holahouze]

plz rename thread to sirkens blog

Winter is coming, is it not? Its Sirken's party.

[holahouze]

they cant really fix what they did to stannis, unless they didnt actually kill him. but i think itd be pretty cheesy to fake 2 two characters, or bring them back, or whatever. as for dorne, maybe its not too late? maybe somehow get Arianne on the show? i just dont know. i love Dorne, and i cant believe how poorly it was done on the show.



yep, over 2500 posts of me talking to myself about random shit. for your own benefit, i suggest you go google the word "blog".
<3
Sirks

I think Stannis and Myrcella are pretty dead. Muerto.

As to the show's direction, here is my thinking. The showrunners are looping back to bring in the Greyjoys and Riverlands because book 6 is still in-process and they agreed to an 8th season after they'd plotted out season 5, 6, and 7. Assuming Martin has not provided them pretty detailed info on what's to happen in his book 6 & 7 (safe bet), I think they are past the point of incorporating his story in a meaningful way - other than the ending. Martin owed them, and us, that.

[Sirken]

I think Stannis and Myrcella are pretty dead. Muerto.

As to the show's direction, here is my thinking. The showrunners are looping back to bring in the Greyjoys and Riverlands because book 6 is still in-process and they agreed to an 8th season after they'd plotted out season 5, 6, and 7. Assuming Martin has not provided them pretty detailed info on what's to happen in his book 6 & 7 (safe bet), I think they are past the point of incorporating his story in a meaningful way - other than the ending. Martin owed them, and us, that.



re: Myrcella (season 6 spoiler)
theres a leaked photo of her corpse under a blanket on the boat with Jaime in front of it : http://gameofthroneshq.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/game-of-thrones-season-6-jaime-lanniser.jpg

[holahouze]

re: Myrcella (season 6 spoiler)
theres a leaked photo of her corpse under a blanket on the boat with Jaime in front of it : http://gameofthroneshq.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/game-of-thrones-season-6-jaime-lanniser.jpg

Yep. In the boat and also in the sept with Tommen and Jamie looking on. She's deader than a doornail.

We also have the way season 5 ended with Stannis, no sightings on location, and show Briene swearing an oath to kill Renly's "killer". Stannis is a goner too - and that is a lowdown dirty rotten shame. The legitimate Baratheon's are goombazet.

Jon Snow is taking over book Stannis role in pertaining to Battle of Winterfell.

[Sirken]

RIP Stannis :( https://soundcloud.com/westorhyme/the-one-true-king-of-westeros

but i think youre right about Jon taking over Stannis' role. but you know what, fuck Brienne. by law she should have brought him to be sentenced by.. someone. and fuck Brienne again because Renly had to rightful claim to anything. hes just an ass.

maybe someone can legitimize Gendry and he can hook up with Arya. it will be the third attempt to get Stark and Baratheon together (Lyanna & Robert, Sansa & Joffrey, and then Arya & Gendry).

ugh. 2 more months on the show, and god only knows on the book.

[holahouze]

RIP Stannis :( https://soundcloud.com/westorhyme/the-one-true-king-of-westeros

but i think youre right about Jon taking over Stannis' role. but you know what, fuck Brienne. by law she should have brought him to be sentenced by.. someone. and fuck Brienne again because Renly had to rightful claim to anything. hes just an ass.

maybe someone can legitimize Gendry and he can hook up with Arya. it will be the third attempt to get Stark and Baratheon together (Lyanna & Robert, Sansa & Joffrey, and then Arya & Gendry).

ugh. 2 more months on the show, and god only knows on the book.

Ned Stark is the best friend Stannis never had. If only he'd stuck around or taken Ned's raven. Stannis really grew on me, in spite of the Red Witch. Renly got a shadow baby for his trouble. #over-reach

Stannis storyline over the last couple S5 episodes were a wreck. I think the showrunners were planning on 7 seasons and thinning the herd. Most unfortunate. Anways... they can't let Brienne go forward without some consequence. Some kind of realization along the lines of comments Jamie made about conflicting oaths.

Gendry + Arya, interesting pair. But, I'm not that into the match-making thing.

Repeating myself, but, lots of characters and storylines left adrift. Martin is sitting on a giant payday, so you know he's struggling with what he's created.

[AenorVZ]

hes just an ass.

And if honorable ned had listened to that ass, he could have prevented a war. Instead, he had to protect children by allowing thousands of children to die to war, sickness, etc.

[AzzarTheGod]

Repeating myself, but, lots of characters and storylines left adrift. Martin is sitting on a giant payday, so you know he's struggling with what he's created.

He needs to sign a new publishing deal where they can set him up with some ghost editors. Not to write the story, but just some people to bounce storyline off of.

Similar to a writers room for a television production. In TV, writers who try to write alone usually end up falling short, HBO's Nic Pizzolatto was a recent very good example of this. You need interjection when you are struggling.

I am thinking this is no different. Save the series! Change your process please RR. Do it now.

[holahouze]

And if honorable ned had listened to that ass, he could have prevented a war. Instead, he had to protect children by allowing thousands of children to die to war, sickness, etc.

And, your etc. includes a wife, a son & heir, his castle and lands, many of his people, and his remaining Children are orphans and in the wind. I almost gave up on the series and books because I could not believe Ned's decision-making. That conversation with Renly really deserved more discussion and careful consideration. Ned was really in over his head. I surrendered to it.

[holahouze]

He needs to sign a new publishing deal where they can set him up with some ghost editors. Not to write the story, but just some people to bounce storyline off of.

Similar to a writers room for a television production. In TV, writers who try to write alone usually end up falling short, HBO's Nic Pizzolatto was a recent very good example of this. You need interjection when you are struggling.

I am thinking this is no different. Save the series! Change your process please RR. Do it now.

I don't know how that would work, but something needs to change!

BTW, Martin is attending a con next week and rumors are he will be giving a reading from Winds. So, maybe a small peek is coming.

[Sirken]

And if honorable ned had listened to that ass, he could have prevented a war. Instead, he had to protect children by allowing thousands of children to die to war, sickness, etc.

if Ned had followed his brain instead of honor in any situation things would be different.
telling cersei what he learned? dumb
not leaving the city and going with baelish? dumb
not sending ravens to all of westeros (as opposed to just stannis)? dumb
not taking renly seriously? dumb
thinking a piece of paper would stop cersei? dumb
trusting baelish when confronting cersei? dumb

am i missing anything?

[Sirken]

And, your etc. includes a wife, a son & heir, his castle and lands, many of his people, and his remaining Children are orphans and in the wind. I almost gave up on the series and books because I could not believe Ned's decision-making. That conversation with Renly really deserved more discussion and careful consideration. Ned was really in over his head. I surrendered to it.

i think people just gave Ned too much credit. he (like Robb) just made a lot of bad decisions. and in Westeros, making bad decisions repeatedly doesnt grant you a long life expectancy.

[holahouze]

if Ned had followed his brain instead of honor in any situation things would be different.
telling cersei what he learned? dumb
not leaving the city and going with baelish? dumb
not sending ravens to all of westeros (as opposed to just stannis)? dumb
not taking renly seriously? dumb
thinking a piece of paper would stop cersei? dumb
trusting baelish when confronting cersei? dumb

am i missing anything?

I would emphasize the first was the worst. Well intentioned that it was. While the story needed these things to happen - ugh! Here's a couple more, real quick.

>> He totally sprinted through Gared's beheading. Gared had much to say. He wasn't going anywhere. That was a moment.
>> He allowed the Trident events to overwhelm him, perhaps by not realizing Robert was just a drunk screw-up. Sansa's direwolve dead. Micah dead. Arya's direwolve in the wind.
>> He should have had the writing of Robert's will witnessed and ravens on hand.

[AzzarTheGod]

i think people just gave Ned too much credit. he (like Robb) just made a lot of bad decisions. and in Westeros, making bad decisions repeatedly doesnt grant you a long life expectancy.

This echoes my interpretation of Ned as well. On the show he was absolutely portrayed as willfully ignorant. A luddite when it came to politics-- especially in the world of Westeros.

Robb was the father like son. Same luddite genetics when it comes to politics and got a chin-check (or gut-check in this case) by a lord just like his father.

Its hard to see them as anything more than tragic figures that couldn't play the Game, and as a function of existing in Martin's world, they were written to define the Game for the readers-- to understand that "This is Westeros".

[AenorVZ]

if Ned had followed his brain instead of honor in any situation things would be different.
telling cersei what he learned? dumb
not leaving the city and going with baelish? dumb
not sending ravens to all of westeros (as opposed to just stannis)? dumb
not taking renly seriously? dumb
thinking a piece of paper would stop cersei? dumb
trusting baelish when confronting cersei? dumb

am i missing anything?

Yeah Ned was Martin's whipping boy. He was so gleeful with his trope breaking that he really overdid his quest to put the honorable hero trope on its head. In the end it's hard to maintain suspension of disbelief.

[AenorVZ]

This is a fucking tour de force.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JkdMGgh87nw&list=PLCsx_OFEYH6uzxnqUgDBMDwEIVimUAX4m

As much as we (I) bitch about Martin's glacial pace, plot holes and other shortcomings, there comes a moment when you have to just sit back in awe of the intricacy of thought that went into this story.

Ever since Sirks introduced Preston to us, I've been eating it up. I don't wear hats like you peasants, I wear the tinfoil crown, so I believe in all conspiracies. Sirken may quibble, I just lap it up.

The greatest thing ever is Bran being manipulated by Bloodraven while Arya is simultaneously being manipulated by the descendants of Bittersteel. Bravo, GRRM, bravo. I take back all my criticisms.

[holahouze]

This is a fucking tour de force.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JkdMGgh87nw&list=PLCsx_OFEYH6uzxnqUgDBMDwEIVimUAX4m

As much as we (I) bitch about Martin's glacial pace, plot holes and other shortcomings, there comes a moment when you have to just sit back in awe of the intricacy of thought that went into this story.

Ever since Sirks introduced Preston to us, I've been eating it up. I don't wear hats like you peasants, I wear the tinfoil crown, so I believe in all conspiracies. Sirken may quibble, I just lap it up.

The greatest thing ever is Bran being manipulated by Bloodraven while Arya is simultaneously being manipulated by the descendants of Bittersteel. Bravo, GRRM, bravo. I take back all my criticisms.

Don't have much time this morning, but i did watch the Preston's 4 & 5 vids. Some interesting stuff in there, I agree. I have a quibble and a question. I would be disappointed to find that House of B&W only had one world class assassin on Jaqen's level because i envisioned it as a bigger operation. And, in order to make sense of a current Bloodraven - Bittersteel rivalry, we need to establish that the Team Bittersteel knows about Bloodraven & what he's up to. Is that done in vids 1-3?? Thanks. Later.

[AenorVZ]

Don't have much time this morning, but i did watch the Preston's 4 & 5 vids. Some interesting stuff in there, I agree. I have a quibble and a question. I would be disappointed to find that House of B&W only had one world class assassin on Jaqen's level because i envisioned it as a bigger operation. And, in order to make sense of a current Bloodraven - Bittersteel rivalry, we need to establish that the Team Bittersteel knows about Bloodraven & what he's up to. Is that done in vids 1-3?? Thanks. Later.

No, Preston doesn't explain how Team Bittersteel knew that:

A. Bloodraven is still alive and a player in world affairs

B. Jaqen knew about the glass candle

Doubtless the little green men tipped Preston off. You know nothing holahouze.

As far as Jaqen being the only assassin on his level, if they sent him after Bloodraven he's undoubtedly the best. But if the Faceless Men are pulling those kinds of contracts, they've got a lot of resources and probably have more assassins in the pipeline in case their A Team ever fails. If Jaqen can arrange for a Bravosi ship to twiddle its thumbs in Saltpans hoping Arya shows up, yeah, the Faceless Men got resources.

Speaking of the A Team, what's up with Biter going after Brienne? If they had Arya assassinate the old dude who was insuring Selwyn Tarth's ships, why wouldn't they try to capture her and hold her for ransom to keep Tarth's navy from interfering with Aegon's invasion?

[holahouze]

No, Preston doesn't explain how Team Bittersteel knew that:

A. Bloodraven is still alive and a player in world affairs

B. Jaqen knew about the glass candle

Doubtless the little green men tipped Preston off. You know nothing holahouze.

As far as Jaqen being the only assassin on his level, if they sent him after Bloodraven he's undoubtedly the best. But if the Faceless Men are pulling those kinds of contracts, they've got a lot of resources and probably have more assassins in the pipeline in case their A Team ever fails. If Jaqen can arrange for a Bravosi ship to twiddle its thumbs in Saltpans hoping Arya shows up, yeah, the Faceless Men got resources.

Speaking of the A Team, what's up with Biter going after Brienne? If they had Arya assassinate the old dude who was insuring Selwyn Tarth's ships, why wouldn't they try to capture her and hold her for ransom to keep Tarth's navy from interfering with Aegon's invasion?

Thanks. So true, but I do know one thing = i know nothing. I'm thick as a castle wall. I want to spend more time on this when i have some free time, as some of that stuff has drifted pretty far away from my memories and thinking.

[holahouze]

And, there is this. I remember once reading that Martin would not allow the show to influence his vision of the story. I wonder what that means now.

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/02/25/martin-confirms-winds-of-winter-twist-involves-character-show-killed-off/

[AenorVZ]

Look forward to your thoughts. As far as that bit on the show and series diverging, there was a simple solution to prevent this. Nobody twisted D&D's arms and told them "you absolutely have to blow through the timeline at the fastest possible speed and make a bunch of shit up." They could have just stuck to the books and they wouldn't be this far along in the timeline.

<----- is aware he sounds like a broken record

[AzzarTheGod]

D&D get a little too much respect. In hindsight, they suck.

[AenorVZ]

D&D get a little too much respect. In hindsight, they suck.

[Sirken]

D&D get a little too much respect. In hindsight, they suck.

i think its more that, we're spoiled by a very good writer, and when two noobs have to actually put pen to paper and 'create', it's just not the same, nor is it as easy as i think they thought it would be.

[AenorVZ]

The anticipation for the season is killing me. I'm either going to hate watch it or be blown away by it. There is no middle ground.

[Sirken]

have we considered the possibility the Valonqar (from maggie the frogs prophecy) is Arya?


i'm not saying im convinced, but lets think.

theres an argument going on at the asoiaf forums about the Valyrian language and whether or not its actually gender neutral. we know some words are, and we dont ever hear a term for "little sister", and so they are arguing that Valonqar would translate more appropriately to "little sibling".

Maggy says "Queen you shall be... until there comes another, younger and more beautiful, to cast you down and take all that you hold dear" the next line is Cersei asking if she and the king will have children, to which Maggy replies "Oh, aye. Six-and-ten for him, and three for you. Gold shall be their crowns and gold their shrouds, she said. And when your tears have drowned you, the valonqar shall wrap his hands about your pale white throat and choke the life from you"

and so that made me wonder, what if the Valonqar was actually the Valonqar to the younger more beautiful queen. granted, for this to play out, either Sansa would have to become the Queen in the North, or, we'd have to accept a less than literal translation. but with that being said, Sansa has 3 younger siblings. one is crippled, one is too young (i dont see Cersei living long enough to die to Rickon), and the third one is Arya. the little girl that has had Cersei at the top of her "kill list" since Arya started reciting the names. and to top it off, shes learning the ways of the faceless assassins.

food for thought.

[holahouze]

have we considered the possibility the Valonqar (from maggie the frogs prophecy) is Arya?


i'm not saying im convinced, but lets think.

theres an argument going on at the asoiaf forums about the Valyrian language and whether or not its actually gender neutral. we know some words are, and we dont ever hear a term for "little sister", and so they are arguing that Valonqar would translate more appropriately to "little sibling".

Maggy says "Queen you shall be... until there comes another, younger and more beautiful, to cast you down and take all that you hold dear" the next line is Cersei asking if she and the king will have children, to which Maggy replies "Oh, aye. Six-and-ten for him, and three for you. Gold shall be their crowns and gold their shrouds, she said. And when your tears have drowned you, the valonqar shall wrap his hands about your pale white throat and choke the life from you"

and so that made me wonder, what if the Valonqar was actually the Valonqar to the younger more beautiful queen. granted, for this to play out, either Sansa would have to become the Queen in the North, or, we'd have to accept a less than literal translation. but with that being said, Sansa has 3 younger siblings. one is crippled, one is too young (i dont see Cersei living long enough to die to Rickon), and the third one is Arya. the little girl that has had Cersei at the top of her "kill list" since Arya started reciting the names. and to top it off, shes learning the ways of the faceless assassins.

food for thought.

I've stumbled into a couple of those forum discussions. I can't quite past "his". You see a way to make that gender neutral?

It seems to me what's important is that Cersei identifies her killer as the valonqar and realizes too late its not Tyrion as she long believed. We need that satisfaction, no? I lack imagination, so Jamie still works best for me. But, a "the Stark family sends their regards" moment would work as well, so long as Cersei identifies the moment with the valonqar.

[Patriam1066]

Arya is training to become a faceless man. Who's to say she won't take the appearance of Jaime (or less likely Tyrion) to kill Cersei?

I personally think it's Jaime or Arya, and I tend to buy the idea that valyrian is gender neutral.

[holahouze]

Arya is training to become a faceless man. Who's to say she won't take the appearance of Jaime (or less likely Tyrion) to kill Cersei?

I personally think it's Jaime or Arya, and I tend to buy the idea that valyrian is gender neutral.

Martin has done a good job of blurring the PTWP clues, and I was kind of put-off that Aemon only realized High Valyrian as gender neutral on his deathbed. Still, I trust what Aemon said, so I could see Valonqar going both ways.

There are some interesting aspects to Arya being the Valonqar. Is she taking on the assignment as a FM? Aren't they supposed to pass on killing someone they know? Taking on the face of Jamie or Tyrion would presume they're dead, right? It seems they get their faces from the Hall of Faces, right? Or, is the FM's ability to change faces truly magic allowing them to take on the faces of anyone?

I guess I prefer a scenario where Arya is herself when she goes for Cersei. Then they can have their Stark moment.

[Patriam1066]

Martin has done a good job of blurring the PTWP clues, and I was kind of put-off that Aemon only realized High Valyrian as gender neutral on his deathbed. Still, I trust what Aemon said, so I could see Valonqar going both ways.

There are some interesting aspects to Arya being the Valonqar. Is she taking on the assignment as a FM? Aren't they supposed to pass on killing someone they know? Taking on the face of Jamie or Tyrion would presume they're dead, right? It seems they get their faces from the Hall of Faces, right? Or, is the FM's ability to change faces truly magic allowing them to take on the faces of anyone?

I guess I prefer a scenario where Arya is herself when she goes for Cersei. Then they can have their Stark moment.

Well, I'm going by preston's interpretation of the faceless men, as in her innate abilities would allow her to change her face. Preston is probably wrong about that, and I'm not saying that's what I think would happen. I think it will just be Arya herself killing Cersei. In a hypothetical situation where Preston was right, it would be cool to see her killing Cersei as Jaime, just for the Valonqar story. It won't happen that way because yeah, that's less satisfying than actual Jaime doing it or Arya pulling it off as herself. Oh, and no, since I was assuming the Preston Jacobs version of the FM, this would be her acting on her own, deserting them once she learns what they have to offer.

[holahouze]

New trailer. Looks like showrunners can do some awesome stuff with Bran!

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/03/08/watch-the-official-trailer-for-game-of-thrones-season-6/

[Sirken]

i just came here to post that!

im excited. when Cersei was like "i choose violence" .. it was just A+

[holahouze]

i just came here to post that!

im excited. when Cersei was like "i choose violence" .. it was just A+

Me too. Cersei - so freaking destructive. Its crazy someone hasn't put her down yet.

[barrettdc1]

i just came here to post that!

im excited. when Cersei was like "i choose violence" .. it was just A+

I think this will be the best season yet.

[holahouze]

Well, I'm going by preston's interpretation of the faceless men, as in her innate abilities would allow her to change her face. Preston is probably wrong about that, and I'm not saying that's what I think would happen. I think it will just be Arya herself killing Cersei. In a hypothetical situation where Preston was right, it would be cool to see her killing Cersei as Jaime, just for the Valonqar story. It won't happen that way because yeah, that's less satisfying than actual Jaime doing it or Arya pulling it off as herself. Oh, and no, since I was assuming the Preston Jacobs version of the FM, this would be her acting on her own, deserting them once she learns what they have to offer.

I've surrendered to reality - we know next to nothing about FM's recruiting/training/business practices. Feel free to indulge yourself on PJ's visions. Depending on how things turn out for Margarey, I could see Loras as Valonqar. But, that isn't as good of option to me.

I like Arya. I don't think she's getting away scot-free from FM.

[Sirken]

Alt Shift X made a great video on Varys today, here:
https://youtu.be/0M_hhVg9XUE

[AenorVZ]

Charlie's trailer breakdown:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5O2MYnHQovU

[Sirken]

gravedigger confirmed as Sandor Clegane ;)

https://youtu.be/Acaf3q0du90

[AzzarTheGod]

The way Ian McShane kayfabe pretends he cares about keeping a secret while simultaneously droppin loads is an art form in itself.

really talented actor, and this makes me even more impressed by his no fucks given.

No confirmation on Cleganebowl. Fingers crossed gravedigger is very early on the season.

[AenorVZ]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8VorLjtdRQ

Preston said Cleganebowl get de-hyped.

[AzzarTheGod]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8VorLjtdRQ

Preston said Cleganebowl get de-hyped.

Officially de-hyped.

But I still feel ending his evil madman brothers life to set things right, among other things, seems like a worthy cause to raise a sword again.

[Sirken]

The way Ian McShane kayfabe pretends he cares about keeping a secret while simultaneously droppin loads is an art form in itself.

really talented actor, and this makes me even more impressed by his no fucks given.

No confirmation on Cleganebowl. Fingers crossed gravedigger is very early on the season.

i dont think we'll see clegane bowl. "the hound" is dead remember. and Sandor is reformed, at peace, etc. as much as i want it, i just am starting to think it won't be a thing.

[Sirken]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8VorLjtdRQ
Preston said Cleganebowl get de-hyped.

Officially de-hyped.
But I still feel ending his evil madman brothers life to set things right, among other things, seems like a worthy cause to raise a sword again.

i 100% agree with everything preston said

[AenorVZ]

Season 6 pics (not new)

http://www.makinggameofthrones.com/production-diary/exclusive-pictures-season-6

Keep dem links coming.

[holahouze]

i dont think we'll see clegane bowl. "the hound" is dead remember. and Sandor is reformed, at peace, etc. as much as i want it, i just am starting to think it won't be a thing.

Gregor is pretty dead as well. But I wonder if any of this matters to the showrunners. They might think a Clegane showdown would be entertaining.

[AenorVZ]

This is pretty cool:

http://www.makinggameofthrones.com/production-diary/50-things-season-2-pt-1

[AzzarTheGod]

Gregor is pretty dead as well. But I wonder if any of this matters to the showrunners. They might think a Clegane showdown would be entertaining.

Still de-hyped. But with D&D there could be a "fuck it" moment at any given time if the pacing of the season doesn't fit.

We need to kill 20 minutes on this episode. Uhh sir, theres this thing called cleganebowl. "Well, start writing..."

[holahouze]

Still de-hyped. But with D&D there could be a "fuck it" moment at any given time if the pacing of the season doesn't fit.

We need to kill 20 minutes on this episode. Uhh sir, theres this thing called cleganebowl. "Well, start writing..."

That's what I'm talking about!

I didn't see anyone comment on Davos having Longclaw. That's interesting. Does that mean he's LC? Who's he looking to fight - NW, wildings, Others? I'm thinking Davos leads effort to protect Jon's body from the black bastards to killed him.

[AenorVZ]

I hope Davos is just being modest and he slices and dices with that m-fucker.

[AzzarTheGod]

That's what I'm talking about!

I didn't see anyone comment on Davos having Longclaw. That's interesting. Does that mean he's LC? Who's he looking to fight - NW, wildings, Others? I'm thinking Davos leads effort to protect Jon's body from the black bastards to killed him.

Jon gonna warg out and have a little fun with Davos while he's still technically dead in a dream state maybe. /tinfoil

Wondering also if the Tower of Joy sequence will happen while he is knocked out.

[holahouze]

I hope Davos is just being modest and he slices and dices with that m-fucker.

Me too. But he's a smuggler/sailor, plus he's missing a few digits. It's his leadership that will matter.

[Sirken]

That's what I'm talking about!
I didn't see anyone comment on Davos having Longclaw. That's interesting. Does that mean he's LC? Who's he looking to fight - NW, wildings, Others? I'm thinking Davos leads effort to protect Jon's body from the black bastards to killed him.

hes not lord commander, hes just defending Jon's body and needed a sword (because Davos doesnt carry one). the murderers are trying to get Jon's body, either to burn or to send to Ramsay as proof that Jon is dead :)

[Sirken]

found a decently interesting video on Dinosaurs in the world of Ice and Fire

https://youtu.be/K1pCPWeQ0eE

[holahouze]

hes not lord commander, hes just defending Jon's body and needed a sword (because Davos doesnt carry one). the murderers are trying to get Jon's body, either to burn or to send to Ramsay as proof that Jon is dead :)

Agreed. I just finished re-read of 5th book. I jumped chapters to read Davos in one gulp. Good character. So many differences from show.

[Sirken]

Jon gonna warg out and have a little fun with Davos while he's still technically dead in a dream state maybe. /tinfoil

Wondering also if the Tower of Joy sequence will happen while he is knocked out.

i strongly suspect that Jon warged into Ghost as Jon was dying, i think this is commonly accepted due to the prologue of book 5. i also very much believe that Ghost will tear throats out of necks if the murderers get through that door.

as for the timing of the vision, it really depends how long they keep Jon dead for. i highly doubt ToJ will be the first thing Bran sees, and i dont expect Jon to stay dead longer than 2 episodes, with him getting a rezz sometime in Ep3.

[Sirken]

and then, im curious on thoughts of this, its a screen shot from the latest trailor, you can watch it not frozen here: https://youtu.be/CuH3tJPiP-U?t=1m5s (just start at 1:05)

possibly, maybe, please god.. Coldhands?

http://i.imgur.com/ijEZATV.png

[holahouze]

and then, im curious on thoughts of this, its a screen shot from the latest trailor, you can watch it not frozen here: https://youtu.be/CuH3tJPiP-U?t=1m5s (just start at 1:05)

possibly, maybe, please god.. Coldhands?

http://i.imgur.com/ijEZATV.png

I would be all-in on a Coldhands appearance/role! They truly missed out with Sam/Gilly & Bran, etc jouneys.

That picture is too dark for me to see what's happening. But, I would guess that is not a wilding. Gotta be a whitewalker.

[AenorVZ]

Rehash of the trailer but pretty funny:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bf_GFhrWKnI

Histories and Lore narrated by the cast from the Season 5 BluRay:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RzWo97BBeOs

[Sirken]

I would be all-in on a Coldhands appearance/role! They truly missed out with Sam/Gilly & Bran, etc jouneys.

That picture is too dark for me to see what's happening. But, I would guess that is not a wilding. Gotta be a whitewalker.

it could be a walker, but to me it looks like its wearing furs, similar to wildling garbs.
could also be Benjen i suppse



and then sidenote- Stannis is 100% dead on the show. i know many have already accepted that, but some part of me hoped. but after this, hes dead dead - https://youtu.be/XrbFyIdG3W0

[holahouze]

it could be a walker, but to me it looks like its wearing furs, similar to wildling garbs.
could also be Benjen i suppse



and then sidenote- Stannis is 100% dead on the show. i know many have already accepted that, but some part of me hoped. but after this, hes dead dead - https://youtu.be/XrbFyIdG3W0

Sorry, i was thinking one thing and typed another. I would guess the figure in the foreground is a wight. Thus, the wilding garb and the figure swinging fire makes some sense. But, resolution on my laptop is poor in dimly lit scenes - could be a grumpkin for all i can make out.

Thanks for the link. How funny is it that Dillane's personality seems similar to Stannis. Grumpy. Doing his duty and taking a shit job for a few million pounds.

I went back and pulled up the Renly death episode after the Stannis/Brienne S5 episode. Brienne swore an oath to avenge Renly. You know about her and her oaths. The red witch would do well to avoid Brienne - if she puts the pieces together.

I think Stannis and his family were victims of 7 season thinking by showrunners. If they'd known there was going to be 8 seasons, they would have handled it differently. Course, I think most of season 5 suffered from trying to write logical arcs for 7 seasons with the ending in mind, while waiting for new content.

Now, showrunners have an extra season and no new content. Anything could happen - as long as it nudges them toward finish line, as they know it. So, bring on Coldhands, Benjen, Aegon, Stoneheart, etc.

[derpcake]

it could be a walker, but to me it looks like its wearing furs, similar to wildling garbs.

looks like its fleeing

do walkers flee?

[AenorVZ]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zs7xO5P3Az4

[Sirken]

looks like its fleeing

do walkers flee?

in the trailer it looks like its running towards the horse imo

[holahouze]

Two links here from new/recent ad drops for Thrones. Anybody seen the video?

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/03/25/so-a-game-of-thrones-commercial-with-new-footage-just-aired/

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/03/25/new-game-of-thrones-season-6-photos-released/

[AenorVZ]

Can't believe no reaction to Kit Harrington singing "Wildling" to the music of "Wild Thing."

[AenorVZ]

Two links here from new/recent ad drops for Thrones. Anybody seen the video?

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/03/25/so-a-game-of-thrones-commercial-with-new-footage-just-aired/

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/03/25/new-game-of-thrones-season-6-photos-released/

UGGGGGGH nobody got video???

[holahouze]

UGGGGGGH nobody got video???

Other making contact with Bran during vision... Did not see that coming. We're not in Kansas anymore.

[Sirken]

UGGGGGGH nobody got video???

havent found the video. the nerd at emergency awesome said its not online yet (https://youtu.be/DDnz9xw7Z_A). so we'll just have to wait. you know one way or another we'll get it ;)

[Sirken]

Other making contact with Bran during vision... Did not see that coming. We're not in Kansas anymore.

yea. that was really fucked up. im thinking the nights king can sense bran, or the bloodraven, or the type of magic being used.. and just .. reached out for it

[holahouze]

Video format has dropped. Seems a lot of it a continuation of previous trailer's scenes. Scroll down to near bottom of page. Enjoy.

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/03/26/so-a-game-of-thrones-commercial-with-new-footage-just-aired/

[Sirken]

better quality if you just wanna see the teaser from march madness -https://youtu.be/dKrhgVFTI6I

[AenorVZ]

Posting in an awesome thread where an awesome trailer just dropped.

[beyondinfin]

4 WEEKS MOTHERFUCKERS!!

...TWOW...still TBA :(

[Sirken]

so in the second trailor, do we think WunWun is break through the gates of Winterfell? or the gates of Castle Black?

[holahouze]

so in the second trailor, do we think WunWun is break through the gates of Winterfell? or the gates of Castle Black?

Clearly fight looming at Castle Black. I think Wun Wun will go postal in book, too, so i like that connection. I'm in for Castle Black.

I think the battle for Winterfell has already been fought. RIP Stannis. I think the Battle of the Bastards will settle who controls North - and Winterfell. Open-minded about Ramsey dying there are going on the lam.

I also watched a vid the other day that had interesting crackpot speculation. Remember the scene in big vid drop of two burning flayed corpses? Roose and Walda.

[Sirken]

Clearly fight looming at Castle Black. I think Wun Wun will go postal in book, too, so i like that connection. I'm in for Castle Black.

I think the battle for Winterfell has already been fought. RIP Stannis. I think the Battle of the Bastards will settle who controls North - and Winterfell. Open-minded about Ramsey dying there are going on the lam.

I also watched a vid the other day that had interesting crackpot speculation. Remember the scene in big vid drop of two burning flayed corpses? Roose and Walda.

honestly i think theres a better chance of Ramsay killing Roose than the other way around.

ive heard that, but i dont think thats the case. i think its more likely thatd be a northern lord. its being used as intimidation, and killing Roose would please the Stark supporters, not intimidate them. although you could be right, because losing Roose would be a good first step to the downfall of the Boltons imo

[AenorVZ]

Hopefully it's Wun Wun busting out Ghost.

[holahouze]

The below link is analysis for the 4.24 drop. Its very long - 45 minutes, but it includes some impressive research, cross references, and speculation. There's some jibber jabber of course, but i found it a worthwhile watch.

Here's a random thought. After re-reading 5th book, I was struck by how the Boltons sowed the seeds for Theon's escape. Overly confident in Ramsay's brainwashing? The one Theon shot in trailer shows dogs - Ramsay's girls. I think it would be funny if the girls track Theon and then don't attack him because they recognize him as one of their pack. #backfire I'll tack this on, it would seem out of character if Ramsay sent out some of his crew and his girls to find Theon and Sansa. He's want to be on that hunt, right?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHTcr3bM59o

[AenorVZ]

At 32 min Dayne doesn't look as badass as he needs to. Interesting that BG says this is what kingsguard armor for the period should look like. Her stuff is pretty well sourced. Also, her voice is a lot less annoying to me than Rawrist. Good find!

[AzzarTheGod]

I'm rather sick of the Bolton's portrayal. Fingers crossed they do away with the entire family this season. Decidedly not a very GoT thing to have happen, (giving the people what they want) but I'm hoping D&D whack both father and son by the end of the season.

Not overly interested in Ramsey's quest to become a somebody. I liked the dynamic better when Roose was wheeling and dealing. When they settled into Winterfell I just didn't care for them anymore.

[holahouze]

At 32 min Dayne doesn't look as badass as he needs to. Interesting that BG says this is what kingsguard armor for the period should look like. Her stuff is pretty well sourced. Also, her voice is a lot less annoying to me than Rawrist. Good find!

We'll have to see how it turns out. But, i will be disappointed if Dayne isn't swinging Dawn, and if there is really only Ned + 5. If they're going to show 6, why not stick with canon and use 7. I also pictured Howland as much smaller physically, armed with spear, net, etc. Gear appropriate to the Neck. I still expect TOJ to be awesome reveal.

[holahouze]

I'm rather sick of the Bolton's portrayal. Fingers crossed they do away with the entire family this season. Decidedly not a very GoT thing to have happen, (giving the people what they want) but I'm hoping D&D whack both father and son by the end of the season.

Not overly interested in Ramsey's quest to become a somebody. I liked the dynamic better when Roose was wheeling and dealing. When they settled into Winterfell I just didn't care for them anymore.

I, too, view Roose as a scheming climber one step ahead of everyone else. But, he's made or is making mistakes. He has no natural allies other than Ramsay - good luck with that. I think when events start to turn on him, he'll be a goner. Season 6 exit will be no surprise.

I do wonder about Ramsay. The showrunners have made him smarter and more daring than books. The North needs to be well rid of both of them, but i wouldn't be surprised if they kept Ramsay around as a fly in the ointment. Reek/Theon and Sansa/Arya escaped from him. Betrayed him. And, i could see showrunners keeping him around and making that a secondary storyline.

[AenorVZ]

Watching season 2, episode 8. What a waste of Stannis in the end. His scenes with Davos are the best.

[Sirken]

The below link is analysis for the 4.24 drop. Its very long - 45 minutes, but it includes some impressive research, cross references, and speculation. There's some jibber jabber of course, but i found it a worthwhile watch.

Here's a random thought. After re-reading 5th book, I was struck by how the Boltons sowed the seeds for Theon's escape. Overly confident in Ramsay's brainwashing? The one Theon shot in trailer shows dogs - Ramsay's girls. I think it would be funny if the girls track Theon and then don't attack him because they recognize him as one of their pack. #backfire I'll tack this on, it would seem out of character if Ramsay sent out some of his crew and his girls to find Theon and Sansa. He's want to be on that hunt, right?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHTcr3bM59o

so, there was an interview with ramsay (https://youtu.be/LkIunmGS0Ss?t=30s) where i think they let go a spoiler confirming that Roose will be killed by Ramsay this season. skip to the 30second mark if you dont wanna watch the whole thing

[Sirken]

At 32 min Dayne doesn't look as badass as he needs to. Interesting that BG says this is what kingsguard armor for the period should look like. Her stuff is pretty well sourced. Also, her voice is a lot less annoying to me than Rawrist. Good find!

while im sure shes right and thats Arthur Dayne, it really REALLY bothers me that he has two swords instead of Dawn.

[Sirken]

Watching season 2, episode 8. What a waste of Stannis in the end. His scenes with Davos are the best.

im pretty certain that the showrunners either didn't like the character of Stannis, or they didn't like the actor portraying him. either way, they shipped him off early, and never did him justice in the show.

saw an interview with the actor that plays stannis basically talking shit about the show (story here: http://winteriscoming.net/2016/03/16/stephen-dillane-stannis-admits-he-didnt-enjoy-game-of-thrones/), so im pretty certain they killed him off for reals

[holahouze]

im pretty certain that the showrunners either didn't like the character of Stannis, or they didn't like the actor portraying him. either way, they shipped him off early, and never did him justice in the show.

saw an interview with the actor that plays stannis basically talking shit about the show (story here: http://winteriscoming.net/2016/03/16/stephen-dillane-stannis-admits-he-didnt-enjoy-game-of-thrones/), so im pretty certain they killed him off for reals

I think you're right. And, they knew Stannis was unlikely to make it to Martin's ASOIAF finish line. But, it was an extremely poor use of the Stannis character and storyline. I'm still so upset about it i'm standing beside myself.

I'm glad they are using s6 to use some book 4/5 storylines they skipped, but I'm really coming around to the idea that the show and books will be different stories with similar/same ending now.

[AzzarTheGod]

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/03/16/stephen-dillane-stannis-admits-he-didnt-enjoy-game-of-thrones/), so im pretty certain they killed him off for reals

For me, this is confirmation Stannis wanted off the show and had a say in it. He declined all GoT press and refused to work with the suits.

No speculation required.

[AenorVZ]

they let go a spoiler confirming that Roose will be killed by Ramsay this season.

I find it hard to believe GRRM will kill off Roose this way. We're talking about a Doran Martell level schemer getting bested by his sociopathic son whom he's perfectly aware is sociopathic.

while im sure shes right and thats Arthur Dayne, it really REALLY bothers me that he has two swords instead of Dawn.

ToJ? Yay! They fucked up Arthur Dayne? Typical D&D.

they shipped him off early, and never did him justice in the show.

I can't help thinking Dillane would have embraced the part more if not for D&D's tinkering. Thanks for that link because it's wonderful insight into the actor. It makes complete sense that he killed so many scenes given his stature as an actor. What a waste of one of the best things on the biggest television series in history.

[AzzarTheGod]

I can't help thinking Dillane would have embraced the part more if not for D&D's tinkering. Thanks for that link because it's wonderful insight into the actor. It makes complete sense that he killed so many scenes given his stature as an actor. What a waste of one of the best things on the biggest television series in history.

Sorely misused talent.

Sucks D&D couldn't make it work with him, although I am not surprised. The clout Spillane has is just way over D&D's depths. This probably caused additional friction.

[Sirken]

I find it hard to believe GRRM will kill off Roose this way. We're talking about a Doran Martell level schemer getting bested by his sociopathic son whom he's perfectly aware is sociopathic.
surely, but are you just never going to be in the same room as him? planning and plotting aside, if i jump over a table at you with a knife, i dont care how good you are at scheming, you better be good in a knife fight.
and IF roose gets got by ramsay, thats really the only type of way i can see it happening. a situation where Roose never sees it coming.

[Sirken]

Sorely misused talent.

Sucks D&D couldn't make it work with him, although I am not surprised. The clout Spillane has is just way over D&D's depths. This probably caused additional friction.

it really is too bad. i was always a fan of Stannis, and they just never did him justice.

[Sidelle]

Naked & Afraid: Celebrity Edition (starring Peter Dinklage) :D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQ44aQWnH4I&nohtml5=False&nohtml5=False#t=242.405916

[AzzarTheGod]

so, there was an interview with ramsay (https://youtu.be/LkIunmGS0Ss?t=30s) where i think they let go a spoiler confirming that Roose will be killed by Ramsay this season. skip to the 30second mark if you dont wanna watch the whole thing

Ah Sirks based on this link, at the time-stamp you referenced:

It sounds like they are referring to a scene where Ramsey is flaying someone else, and Roose watches on and winces. I believe this is a reference to a scene either last season or 2 seasons ago. Its blurry, but I seem to recall some flaying aroundthe Winterfell siege and settlement of House Bolton.

I had to listen to it literally 20-odd times before I could even understand him and then another 10 times word-by-word. But if you listen again I think you'll probably draw the same conclusion that I did.

[Sirken]

Ah Sirks based on this link, at the time-stamp you referenced:

It sounds like they are referring to a scene where Ramsey is flaying someone else, and Roose watches on and winces. I believe this is a reference to a scene either last season or 2 seasons ago. Its blurry, but I seem to recall some flaying aroundthe Winterfell siege and settlement of House Bolton.

I had to listen to it literally 20-odd times before I could even understand him and then another 10 times word-by-word. But if you listen again I think you'll probably draw the same conclusion that I did.

does the guy not say "earned the flaying of his son" ?

[AzzarTheGod]

So I'm going to make a second attempt tonight and be a supernerd, each word will go down on paper. I'm on cooldown. Burned out on it pretty good last night before bed when I made that post, I was in a haze.

Also left-handed, so there's that. Can't trust left handers.

[AzzarTheGod]

Apparently at one point, D&D were passionate about the books.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vhkZTJS94ME&feature=player_detailpage#t=267

How the times change..

[holahouze]

does the guy not say "earned the flaying of his son" ?

I didn't hear it that way. I put on closed captioning, but it mangles what is said, unfortunately. What I saw/heard is, the participant says, "isn't it something that the man who instigated the red wedding winces at his son's flaying, that says something". Then Iwan says "yeah", rubs his face kind of sheepishly, and before he can say anything else is interrupted by the moderator and the subject changed. Could be totally wrong.

I tend to think Ramsay will kill Roose in both book and show, though the circumstances could well be different. In the show, I could see Roose holding Ramsay responsible for losing Sansa and Theon. Ramsay also lost Miranda, who has some kind of sick connection to. Roose could also object to the "pink letter" being sent. And, the coup de grace is Roose's marriage to Walda and pregnancy.

Its a good bit more complicated in the books. Some of the above could be true, but Roose has also been making mistakes and is surrounded by flimsy and fake alliances. But, i think book Roose will have a escape hatch. You said upstream that Roose will go down in a way he will not expect. I think Ramsay will be what he doesn't plan for.

[AenorVZ]

Naked & Afraid: Celebrity Edition (starring Peter Dinklage) :D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQ44aQWnH4I&nohtml5=False&nohtml5=False#t=242.405916

lmao

[AenorVZ]

Azzar making the ultimate sacrifice for this thread #Respect

[Sirken]

I didn't hear it that way. I put on closed captioning, but it mangles what is said, unfortunately. What I saw/heard is, the participant says, "isn't it something that the man who instigated the red wedding winces at his son's flaying, that says something". Then Iwan says "yeah", rubs his face kind of sheepishly, and before he can say anything else is interrupted by the moderator and the subject changed. Could be totally wrong.

I tend to think Ramsay will kill Roose in both book and show, though the circumstances could well be different. In the show, I could see Roose holding Ramsay responsible for losing Sansa and Theon. Ramsay also lost Miranda, who has some kind of sick connection to. Roose could also object to the "pink letter" being sent. And, the coup de grace is Roose's marriage to Walda and pregnancy.

Its a good bit more complicated in the books. Some of the above could be true, but Roose has also been making mistakes and is surrounded by flimsy and fake alliances. But, i think book Roose will have a escape hatch. You said upstream that Roose will go down in a way he will not expect. I think Ramsay will be what he doesn't plan for.

i relistened and youre right about what he says. but that said, i think you're right anyway, and Ramsay will kill Roose. but i think it'll be because Ramsay will have no other choice. either Roose will try to replace him as heir, or Ramsay will be worried that his father wants him dead for losing the key to the north.

[AenorVZ]

lol at ya'll for studying that shit like the zapruder film =)

In frame 356 Roose's head goes back ... and to the left ... back ... and to the left ...

[holahouze]

lol at ya'll for studying that shit like the zapruder film =)

In frame 356 Roose's head goes back ... and to the left ... back ... and to the left ...

Ha! You started my morning off with a laugh. #grassyknoll I just put on closed captioning and then did a little deciphering. Started losing my hearing a while back, and for some reason, British accents are especially troublesome.

You know, there's a pretty lengthy list of folks that would welcome taking swing at Roose. His approval rating is in the dumper.

[AenorVZ]

Yep he's like the Jeb Bush of the North.

[holahouze]

New Thrones trailer. Some new scenes, some previous scenes expanded. Good stuff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EI0ib1NErqg&feature=youtu.be

p.s. i spy Amanda Peet

[Sirken]

Ha! #grassygnoll
Fixed that for you ;)

[AenorVZ]

New Thrones trailer. Some new scenes, some previous scenes expanded. Good stuff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EI0ib1NErqg&feature=youtu.be

p.s. i spy Amanda Peet

Holy SHIT need another 15 minute video from Preston explaining this 90 second clip.

Also:

http://www.coolminiornot.com/pics/pics8/img429c07fba877f.jpg

[AenorVZ]

Okay so a few things on Charlie vs Preston:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ko6sZY-LYqA

First of all, that's ya boy the dual-wielding Arthur Dayne, Sirks. I'm not sure why Charlie seems confused about who that is in northern armor getting slewn. Obviously it's not Ned but one of Ned's bros, all of whom die except Howland the Frog Wielder.

Secondly, I must sadly betray Preston, King of Tinfoil, and disagree with this idea he has that resurrection doesn't happen in Martin's universe, only corpse animation/puppetry. Preston is convinced that Lady Stoneheart is reanimated but doesn't have Kat's consciousness. But what about Beric? He's been brought back six times or whatever and that's a hell of a corpse animation job if he's sitting there passing judgement and going toe to toe with the Hound.

Yep, sorry Preston, I gotta jump off the bandwagon on that one. Less than two weeks to go!

[holahouze]

Okay so a few things on Charlie vs Preston:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ko6sZY-LYqA

First of all, that's ya boy the dual-wielding Arthur Dayne, Sirks. I'm not sure why Charlie seems confused about who that is in northern armor getting slewn. Obviously it's not Ned but one of Ned's bros, all of whom die except Howland the Frog Wielder.

Secondly, I must sadly betray Preston, King of Tinfoil, and disagree with this idea he has that resurrection doesn't happen in Martin's universe, only corpse animation/puppetry. Preston is convinced that Lady Stoneheart is reanimated but doesn't have Kat's consciousness. But what about Beric? He's been brought back six times or whatever and that's a hell of a corpse animation job if he's sitting there passing judgement and going toe to toe with the Hound.

Yep, sorry Preston, I gotta jump off the bandwagon on that one. Less than two weeks to go!

Good analysis. Quick turnaround. So far, I'm surprised by a couple things: I've always assumed the struggle with the Others would be the last big thing in the books. Its kind of weird that that's going to happen in show before Dany sets out for Westeros. And, it's weird that no Dorne scenes/characters have dropped. Course, we may get some of that yet...

And, WTH happened to Bloodraven's birthmark?? Come on.

Below is Liam Cunningham interview with Conan. @ 1:49 they show a fuller clip of Davos with Jon, Ghost, etc. I think Ghost is going to wreck somebody. #teamGhost

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Toam5br4lBE

p.s. i was wrong about Amanda Peet. Thought maybe Benioff snuck her in there.

[AenorVZ]

Preston trailer analysis just dropped.

[AenorVZ]

Ghost confirmed bout to snack on Ollie.

[Sirken]

Okay so a few things on Charlie vs Preston:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ko6sZY-LYqA

First of all, that's ya boy the dual-wielding Arthur Dayne, Sirks. I'm not sure why Charlie seems confused about who that is in northern armor getting slewn. Obviously it's not Ned but one of Ned's bros, all of whom die except Howland the Frog Wielder.

Secondly, I must sadly betray Preston, King of Tinfoil, and disagree with this idea he has that resurrection doesn't happen in Martin's universe, only corpse animation/puppetry. Preston is convinced that Lady Stoneheart is reanimated but doesn't have Kat's consciousness. But what about Beric? He's been brought back six times or whatever and that's a hell of a corpse animation job if he's sitting there passing judgement and going toe to toe with the Hound.

Yep, sorry Preston, I gotta jump off the bandwagon on that one. Less than two weeks to go!

the guy with one sword i think is Dayne, the dual wielder has to be one of his kingsguard brothers imo.

Preston takes a lot of leaps, but Beric even tells us that he loses a piece of himself each time, and Thoros tells us that the longer they are dead, the harder it is to bring them back and i assume the more fucked up they are. however, i think stoneheart does have some of Cat in there, she reacting exactly how Cat would react imo.

[holahouze]

the guy with one sword i think is Dayne, the dual wielder has to be one of his kingsguard brothers imo.

Preston takes a lot of leaps, but Beric even tells us that he loses a piece of himself each time, and Thoros tells us that the longer they are dead, the harder it is to bring them back and i assume the more fucked up they are. however, i think stoneheart does have some of Cat in there, she reacting exactly how Cat would react imo.

I don't think the Red God rules will apply to Jon's resurrection. I'm betting on the Old God's mojo. Who knows how that'll work?

[AzzarTheGod]

I don't think the Red God rules will apply to Jon's resurrection. I'm betting on the Old God's mojo. Who knows how that'll work?

I'm in this camp as well. Jon has never embraced anything but the Old Gods.

Its more GoT theme to have the Old Gods intervention than the Lord of Light. Lord of Light is too predictable. That would be REALLY shitty writing on the TV show if it ends up being 100% lord of Light bullshit.

And I do mean real shit writing, like terrible, cringe inducing, searching the beach for a shark to jump type of writing. Even for the books, it would be atrocious writing.

The neglected, forsaken, Old Gods end up doing fuckall for anyone in this series and its all about the Lord of Light they have been shoving down your throats? Please. Theres just no fucking way both D&D and GRRM both write it that way. Maybe I could see D&D, but not both.

If you think its going to be just the Lord of Light's sole work of mercy, please expound. I'm very interested.

[AenorVZ]

Shit's gold: https://www.reddit.com/r/fuckolly

[AzzarTheGod]

The Kingsguard will not fold up like Olly's child mind when he was asked to betray Jon.

Olly is a goner if he doesn't stab Thorne in the back in an act of redemption. Here's to hoping he doesn't do just that and ends up dead anyway.

[holahouze]

I'm in this camp as well. Jon has never embraced anything but the Old Gods.

Its more GoT theme to have the Old Gods intervention than the Lord of Light. Lord of Light is too predictable. That would be REALLY shitty writing on the TV show if it ends up being 100% lord of Light bullshit.

And I do mean real shit writing, like terrible, cringe inducing, searching the beach for a shark to jump type of writing. Even for the books, it would be atrocious writing.

The neglected, forsaken, Old Gods end up doing fuckall for anyone in this series and its all about the Lord of Light they have been shoving down your throats? Please. Theres just no fucking way both D&D and GRRM both write it that way. Maybe I could see D&D, but not both.

If you think its going to be just the Lord of Light's sole work of mercy, please expound. I'm very interested.

I am agreeing with you about Jon's resurrection. I haven't put a lot of thought into it, but I also agree with you about your thoughts on Preston's re-animation theories. Now, we may find that the Red God resurrection comes with a catch. Like, maybe they are resurrected for/with a purpose. So while some segment of their consciousness returns, they may not have 100% free will.

[holahouze]

Shit's gold: https://www.reddit.com/r/fuckolly

Ha! Poor kid is just misunderstood.

[holahouze]

The Kingsguard will not fold up like Olly's child mind when he was asked to betray Jon.

Olly is a goner if he doesn't stab Thorne in the back in an act of redemption. Here's to hoping he doesn't do just that and ends up dead anyway.

I've always thought there was an ass-kicking coming for the NW who sided with Marsh/Thorne. Maybe this is how D&D will handle that. I don't think there's good reason why Olly should be spared, but I can give you a couple possibilities:

#1, Davos is not a butcher. If Thorne's NW cabal lay down their swords, Davos will figure out some other way.

#2, Suppose Jon did warg into Ghost. Its possible Ghost will spare Olly.

I could settle for either of these two options, provided Thorne goes down. Ghost takes out Thorne, I think. #teamGhost

P.s., I think Bran will pay Jon a visit along the lines 3 eyed crow visited him when he was in a coma. Its an Old Gods thing.

[AenorVZ]

she reacting exactly how Cat would react imo.

Yeah I was convinced that was totally Cat.

[AzzarTheGod]

I could settle for either of these two options, provided Thorne goes down. Ghost takes out Thorne, I think. #teamGhost


Hoping for several Thorne scenes post-Jon death before he dies (if). Wouldn't mind if Jon is dead 90% of the season and Thorne has to manage the NW affairs and politics for a bit. Actually that's the most interesting aspect of this plot turn. If this is the case, imo, Davos will not kill Thorne right away. We will get to see Davos reaction, and how the disagreement with Thorne evolves with Davos and the new Kingsguard I feel we may get 1 or 2 episodes at the Wall with the NW post-Jon before action is taken.

If they give Thorne only 1 additional scene prior to dying I'd be disappointed. I want to see him and the NW immediately post-Jon and what Thorne says to his men, how he sold it, how he is selling it, and how the NW is feeling after the fact.

Its easy to go along with something in a big group and commit the act together, the aftermath not so easy. Some Thorne and Davos scenes would be most welcome.

[holahouze]

Hoping for several Thorne scenes post-Jon death before he dies (if). Wouldn't mind if Jon is dead 90% of the season and Thorne has to manage the NW affairs and politics for a bit. Actually that's the most interesting aspect of this plot turn. If this is the case, imo, Davos will not kill Thorne right away. We will get to see Davos reaction, and how the disagreement with Thorne evolves with Davos and the new Kingsguard I feel we may get 1 or 2 episodes at the Wall with the NW post-Jon before action is taken.

If they give Thorne only 1 additional scene prior to dying I'd be disappointed. I want to see him and the NW immediately post-Jon and what Thorne says to his men, how he sold it, how he is selling it, and how the NW is feeling after the fact.

Its easy to go along with something in a big group and commit the act together, the aftermath not so easy. Some Thorne and Davos scenes would be most welcome.

I would be fine with that. Although we may learn of Thorne's motivations when he assembles his attack crew before going for Jon. I would like that. Beyond that - the showrunners have made Thorne irredeemable IMO.

[holahouze]

Thought I would share a couple things:

Here is some info on AGOT beyond season 6. I think we might be past the point of showrunners planning to include TWOW content (whenever released).

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/04/15/game-of-thrones-final-2-seasons-could-be-much-shorter-than-10-episodes/

And, HBO will have a new show to discuss each episode afterward. It will be hosted by Greenwald and Ryan from the defunct Grantland site. They have not read the books, so they approach each episode as TV critics. They're pretty interesting and they're Grantland schtick was pretty funny.

[AzzarTheGod]

Thought I would share a couple things:

Here is some info on AGOT beyond season 6. I think we might be past the point of showrunners planning to include TWOW content (whenever released).

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/04/15/game-of-thrones-final-2-seasons-could-be-much-shorter-than-10-episodes/

And, HBO will have a new show to discuss each episode afterward. It will be hosted by Greenwald and Ryan from the defunct Grantland site. They have not read the books, so they approach each episode as TV critics. They're pretty interesting and they're Grantland schtick was pretty funny.

Meh when an HBO shows season length is cut short, even if "intentional", its means the writing wasn't there to support it.

See another popular HBO primetime series True Detective.

TD season 1, stellar amazing. TD season 2, was shorted by 2 episodes, saw very weird writing and barely passable as a primetime show with weird endings.

See another popular HBO primetime series Boardwalk Empire.

The season before the final season was passable enough. The final season was cut short by 3-4 episodes and the characters were completely unbelievable in their actions and behavior severing any emotional attachment, against a wrapup plot that was completely transparent.

So. Are you ready for some Lord of Light resurrection? Kidding, I think this season will be stellar.

[Sirken]

just gonna leave this here

http://i.imgur.com/gzpv0aK.png

[Sirken]

Thought I would share a couple things:

Here is some info on AGOT beyond season 6. I think we might be past the point of showrunners planning to include TWOW content (whenever released).

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/04/15/game-of-thrones-final-2-seasons-could-be-much-shorter-than-10-episodes/

this doesnt smell good. Jon will be back no later than Ep3 because we've seen him on set for the battle of Winterfell.

i have a feeling the end of this show will not be great. at least it wont ruin the books at this rate ;)

[AzzarTheGod]

this doesnt smell good. Jon will be back no later than Ep3 because we've seen him on set for the battle of Winterfell.

i have a feeling the end of this show will not be great. at least it wont ruin the books at this rate ;)

Whether Jon is dead or alive for much of the season is probably not of much consequence.

Now the possibility of Stoneheart on the other hand-- that is some consequence.

[holahouze]

Meh when an HBO shows season length is cut short, even if "intentional", its means the writing wasn't there to support it.

See another popular HBO primetime series True Detective.

TD season 1, stellar amazing. TD season 2, was shorted by 2 episodes, saw very weird writing and barely passable as a primetime show with weird endings.

See another popular HBO primetime series Boardwalk Empire.

The season before the final season was passable enough. The final season was cut short by 3-4 episodes and the characters were completely unbelievable in their actions and behavior severing any emotional attachment, against a wrapup plot that was completely transparent.

Yeah. They've created/adapted an all-time hit TV show and its bothersome to them because its become a full-time job. Something about that doesn't sit well with me. But I haven't finished my first caffe Verona, so I'll stop here because I feel like complaining about season 5.

I don't know who the Lord of Light will resurrect, but it won't be Jon. I think they're going to rub a little Grecian Formula 44 weirwood paste on his butt & shock him back to life.

So. Are you ready for some Lord of Light resurrection? Kidding, I think this season will be stellar.

[Sirken]

Whether Jon is dead or alive for much of the season is probably not of much consequence.

Now the possibility of Stoneheart on the other hand-- that is some consequence.

theres no confirmation it was actually her, and i havent seen anything else as a second source so i wouldnt get my hope up.

but the WotW nerds are usually pretty accurate with information

[holahouze]

Whether Jon is dead or alive for much of the season is probably not of much consequence.

Now the possibility of Stoneheart on the other hand-- that is some consequence.

I'll throw another log on the Stoneheart fire. Although i'm in the Sansa as Stoneheart avenger corner.

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/04/17/huge-spoiler-to-return-to-game-of-thrones-for-season-6/

[AenorVZ]

Some Thorne and Davos scenes would be most welcome.

Totally. I love Thorne on the show. His heroics during the seige of Castle Black I thought was one of the best things DnD have done one the show. As I've mentioned before in this thread, I thought that was an instance of DnD doing what GRRM does so often in the books, flipping a villanous character into heroic actions that make you rethink your feelings about that character.

Beyond that - the showrunners have made Thorne irredeemable IMO.

Nah. Show Thorne is the kinda guy you want to have in your foxhole when the shit goes down.

TD season 1, stellar amazing. TD season 2, was shorted by 2 episodes, saw very weird writing and barely passable as a primetime show with weird endings.

TD Season 2 wasn't that bad. Dude spends 10-15 years developing season one and people expect him to just pull that out of his ass again six months after wrapping on an initial season that was his life's work.

See another popular HBO primetime series Boardwalk Empire.

Now that dead horse they shot and donated to the glue factory.

ONE WEEK FAM

!!!

[holahouze]

Here's some confirmation on some of the trailer analysis. How'd i miss Davos and Sansa being the one's to rally the north??

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/04/18/liam-cunningham-reveals-a-new-character-and-others-tease-the-coming-of-the-white-walkers/

[Sirken]

ONE WEEK FAM

you have no idea how excited i am, and its good to see you back in this thread :)

[Sirken]

I'll throw another log on the Stoneheart fire. Although i'm in the Sansa as Stoneheart avenger corner.

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/04/17/huge-spoiler-to-return-to-game-of-thrones-for-season-6/

i love this and hadn't seen it before. as much as i really really want LSH in the show, im with you guys on them giving the role to Sansa. i mean what else is there for her to do? however, another interesting tidbit is this; the last time we see jaime and brienne in the books, she is telling him the bs about the hound and sansa, and we are led to believe shes bringing him back to LSH's camp. in the trailers we can clearly see scenes where brienne is at riverrun, and jaime is riding through a lannister war camp. yes this camp could be outside the twins, but i think it more likely that it's the siege at riverrun, and jaime is there to end it. Brienne doesn't know LSH in the show, but maybe Sansa will ask Brienne to bring her Jaime as a sign to prove her loyalty to Sansa and the Stark cause.

[AenorVZ]

That the Faceless Men know about the White Walkers lends itself to Preston's theory that Jaquen was hired to kill Bloodraven.

[holahouze]

i love this and hadn't seen it before. as much as i really really want LSH in the show, im with you guys on them giving the role to Sansa. i mean what else is there for her to do? however, another interesting tidbit is this; the last time we see jaime and brienne in the books, she is telling him the bs about the hound and sansa, and we are led to believe shes bringing him back to LSH's camp. in the trailers we can clearly see scenes where brienne is at riverrun, and jaime is riding through a lannister war camp. yes this camp could be outside the twins, but i think it more likely that it's the siege at riverrun, and jaime is there to end it. Brienne doesn't know LSH in the show, but maybe Sansa will ask Brienne to bring her Jaime as a sign to prove her loyalty to Sansa and the Stark cause.

There's speculation that the Davos trailer scene with Mormont banner showing and one of Sansa's scenes are same place. As in, there in same place & time. So, she could be Stoneheart avenger + rallying the North. Big-time character development. And, from show perspective, in much better position to "use" Littlefinger, rather than kill him.

[holahouze]

That the Faceless Men know about the White Walkers lends itself to Preston's theory that Jaquen was hired to kill Bloodraven.

It appears so, but I don't see the bread crumbs or hints for this. I mean, who on the planet knows about Bloodraven? And, would they know about Bran? This would be an interesting assignment for Arya.

[Patriam1066]

I think you're right Sirken: the show won't spoil the books anymore. So on the show, I could see them giving Sansa the revenge arc, since they have to move quickly. But a few questions I have about the books:

Just re-read A Feast for Crows. Baelish is even more pro than I remember. I know Sansa will be his downfall, but do y'all think that means she rises to the top, or near it? I really think if she becomes the power in the Vale (through Harry) and potentially a claimant to Riverrun and Winterfell, she could become VERY powerful. I don't see Dany surviving the story, so could Sansa eventually become queen?

My second question is about Aegon. Since the show wrote him off and GRRM waited til book 5 to introduce him, I feel that fAegon is probably a Blackfyre and more or less just shows Varys' and Illyrio's motivation behind the events. That said, given the turmoil in westeros, why couldn't he make trouble?

God damnit I want the winds of winter. Dorne is still uncommitted, the ironborn and fAegon have landed....
So much shit could happen

Oh and I can't wait to see that scene this season with Davos and "Ghost" (Jon's Warg soul inside him) defending Jon's body. The trailers have been legit so far

[Sirken]

That the Faceless Men know about the White Walkers lends itself to Preston's theory that Jaquen was hired to kill Bloodraven.
the faceless men dont actually need to be aware of the whitewalkers. they just need to be hired by someone who is aware of the whitewalkers ;)

[Sirken]

I think you're right Sirken: the show won't spoil the books anymore. So on the show, I could see them giving Sansa the revenge arc, since they have to move quickly. But a few questions I have about the books:

Just re-read A Feast for Crows. Baelish is even more pro than I remember. I know Sansa will be his downfall, but do y'all think that means she rises to the top, or near it? I really think if she becomes the power in the Vale (through Harry) and potentially a claimant to Riverrun and Winterfell, she could become VERY powerful. I don't see Dany surviving the story, so could Sansa eventually become queen?

My second question is about Aegon. Since the show wrote him off and GRRM waited til book 5 to introduce him, I feel that fAegon is probably a Blackfyre and more or less just shows Varys' and Illyrio's motivation behind the events. That said, given the turmoil in westeros, why couldn't he make trouble?

God damnit I want the winds of winter. Dorne is still uncommitted, the ironborn and fAegon have landed....
So much shit could happen

Oh and I can't wait to see that scene this season with Davos and "Ghost" (Jon's Warg soul inside him) defending Jon's body. The trailers have been legit so far

Honestly, i see Harry being a complete dick to Sansa. maybe because she'll be Baelish's bastard, maybe because Harry is just a dick. but part of the reason i think the show did Sansa the way they did with Ramsay last season is because Harry will do those same things to her anyway (and the show isnt including Harry). i think ultimately Sansa will rule in the Vale, or hell, maybe she'll end up with Tyrion. who knows. But Sansa has no claim to the iron throne. while i can also see Dany dying, i can't see Jon dying, and he has a better claim than Sansa. hell, Rickon has a better claim than Sansa. i think it more likely that Westeros be ruled by Jon Snow, or will break apart in seven different kingdoms again.

i agree with you about Aegon. but i also like the theory that hes Illyrio's son by his wife whom was a female descendant of the Blackfyre line. and thats just the thing, he CAN make trouble. hell, by the end of book 5, hes already making trouble having secured Griffin's Roost and some surrounding areas for his base of operations. however if he was smart, he would have tried to take Dragonstone first and make that his base of operations. you know, for the nostalgic Aegon the Conqueror feels.

and Dorne. only The Seven know what games Doran Martell is playing.. well them and maybe Preston Jacobs ;)

[AenorVZ]

It appears so, but I don't see the bread crumbs or hints for this. I mean, who on the planet knows about Bloodraven? And, would they know about Bran? This would be an interesting assignment for Arya.

Yeah this will be fascinating to find out how the faceless men, and for that matter whoever hired them, came to know so much.

the faceless men dont actually need to be aware of the whitewalkers. they just need to be hired by someone who is aware of the whitewalkers ;)

Yeah seriously. This gone be some next level shit.

[AzzarTheGod]

the faceless men dont actually need to be aware of the whitewalkers. they just need to be hired by someone who is aware of the whitewalkers ;)

luved this post.

[Sirken]

It appears so, but I don't see the bread crumbs or hints for this. I mean, who on the planet knows about Bloodraven? And, would they know about Bran? This would be an interesting assignment for Arya.

at a bare minimum, Marwyn the Mage should know about Bloodraven due to the glass candles. Quaithe may as well, however we're all much less sure how her magics or abilities work.

[Sirken]

luved this post.

just imagine how much the faceless men would charge for something like that.

a large part of me believes that Jaqan was after something that was north of the wall, and that Sam took it with him when he left for Oldtown. Jaqan was going to the wall, and for that to me a thing, im forced to believe Jaqan wanted to be captured and sent to the wall. however, the next time we see him is with Pate in Oldtown. the only thing that has changed are the location of Sam, Gilly, Maester Aemon, and whatever possessions they brought with them on the voyage. and imo, its one of those things that Jaqan is (for whatever reason) going after.

[Redi]

rewatching season 5 prepping for sunday

man I love HBO

[holahouze]

at a bare minimum, Marwyn the Mage should know about Bloodraven due to the glass candles. Quaithe may as well, however we're all much less sure how her magics or abilities work.

Ok. As usual, you've lapped me. But, I don't see a connection to Bloodraven. I can pull out Feast, but give me a hint what I'm missing. I know Mage is a bit of a renegade at Citadel. Has pumped Sam for info and learned about Maester Aemon. And, is now headed out seeking Dany. I'm guessing to help her with her dragons and get her butt to Westeros. Missing a Bloodraven-FM connection.

[MrSparkle001]

How far-fetched do you guys think this is?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZ4anyro9y4

It's something I've considered as a possibility but never too seriously, not nearly as much as Jon Snow anyway.

[Pokesan]

How far-fetched do you guys think this is?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZ4anyro9y4

It's something I've considered as a possibility but never too seriously, not nearly as much as Jon Snow anyway.

it seems too perfect for the most likable character to be ~magic holy dragonrider~

then again, american tolkien

[AzzarTheGod]

it seems too perfect for the most likable character to be ~magic holy dragonrider~

then again, american tolkien

is he really the most likable? I mean hes fucking likable..but is he unanimously so among the entire non-nerd cool and normal spectrum of pals?

I don't know any premium TV fans that weren't already interested in fantasy before getting into GoT. Forget about the books. Doubt anyone else here does either.

[Pokesan]

is he really the most likable? I mean hes fucking likable..but is he unanimously so among the entire non-nerd cool and normal spectrum of pals?

I don't know any premium TV fans that weren't already interested in fantasy before getting into GoT. Forget about the books. Doubt anyone else here does either.

http://www.imdb.com/poll/3IN8hqimhJY/results?ref_=po_sr

Good point though, it could be all or mostly Dinklage.

[holahouze]

How far-fetched do you guys think this is?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZ4anyro9y4

It's something I've considered as a possibility but never too seriously, not nearly as much as Jon Snow anyway.

Martin has planted clues. Whether that was to "entertain" us or there's something to it, we'll have to wait. Based on trailer, the show could be getting into this.

[holahouze]

is he really the most likable? I mean hes fucking likable..but is he unanimously so among the entire non-nerd cool and normal spectrum of pals?

I don't know any premium TV fans that weren't already interested in fantasy before getting into GoT. Forget about the books. Doubt anyone else here does either.

Azzar, I would count myself a non-nerd. I've never read another fantasy novel, unless we're counting Harry Potter. Although I have read magical realism and enjoyed - like Marquez, Allende, Murakami. Can i use this as a defense for being so dense?

Pretty hooked on ASOIAF, though.

I don't think Tyrion is most likeable, especially in books. He is relatable. Emotional attraction to the disadvantaged. He is in a small group of characters that I've both liked and disliked (or been disappointed in).

3 1/2 days to go!

[Sirken]

Ok. As usual, you've lapped me. But, I don't see a connection to Bloodraven. I can pull out Feast, but give me a hint what I'm missing. I know Mage is a bit of a renegade at Citadel. Has pumped Sam for info and learned about Maester Aemon. And, is now headed out seeking Dany. I'm guessing to help her with her dragons and get her butt to Westeros. Missing a Bloodraven-FM connection.
again, im not saying Marwyn and Quiathe surely know about Bloodraven. im just saying that due to magic, they might and it cant be ruled out ;)


is he really the most likable? I mean hes fucking likable..but is he unanimously so among the entire non-nerd cool and normal spectrum of pals?
I don't know any premium TV fans that weren't already interested in fantasy before getting into GoT. Forget about the books. Doubt anyone else here does either.
GRRM has said multiple times that Tyrion is his favorite character. so while he might not have been the fan favorite of book readers, he was always GRRM's favorite.


Martin has planted clues. Whether that was to "entertain" us or there's something to it, we'll have to wait. Based on trailer, the show could be getting into this.
dont forget, GRRM also loves to drop red herrings to throw us off track

[Sirken]

How far-fetched do you guys think this is?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZ4anyro9y4

It's something I've considered as a possibility but never too seriously, not nearly as much as Jon Snow anyway.

ive heard this before, its just hard for me to subscribe to. Tyrion has two different color'd eyes, neither are purple like Targs. Tyrion doesnt have the platinum hair either. also, i think Tywin would have killed Tyrion if he thought it was the mad kings bastard rape baby. i just can't see Tywin swallowing his family pride to raise Tyrion as his own.

that said, its very possible. i dont remember the exact details, but i know the timelines match up for the mad king and johanna being in the same place.

[AzzarTheGod]

ive heard this before, its just hard for me to subscribe to. Tyrion has two different color'd eyes, neither are purple like Targs. Tyrion doesnt have the platinum hair either. also, i think Tywin would have killed Tyrion if he thought it was the mad kings bastard rape baby. i just can't see Tywin swallowing his family pride to raise Tyrion as his own.

that said, its very possible. i dont remember the exact details, but i know the timelines match up for the mad king and johanna being in the same place.

Yeah...only way that subplot for Tyrion would make sense (under the watchful eye of Tywin) would be if someone, a midwife/nanny dyed his hair his entire life from birth, and the readers were given the explanation that the genes just weren't strong with him because he was a dwarf.

But then Tyrion would have full knowledge/suspicion that he was a bastard, but could have possibly lived the lie that maybe "the genes just weren't strong with him". IDK. The Tyrion character already deems himself a bastard of sorts, I doubt the above scenario would have changed his chapters in the books very much at all and could have worked.

Just bullshitting about what it would take to make the tinfoil Tyrion bastard plot believable in GRRM's world. Tywin is just too controlling and slick to have a bastard in his midst and grant it titles.

[MrSparkle001]

Jon doesn't have purple eyes or light hair either but I'm fully convinced he's a Targaryen.

It's also possible Tywin either didn't know Tyrion wasn't his or because of whatever reason that hasn't yet been revealed he was forced to live with it.

Or it's not true and is just a theory. Who knows.

It's also possible Tyrion is a Targaryen on the show but not in the books.

[Heywood]

Season 6 Episode 1 stills leaked.

Rumor has it that the episode itself has leaked too. Anyone got a link?

[AenorVZ]

If you haven't watched Preston's Season 5 Watch series, hell wrong wichu?

But I bring it up here because, if you haven't seen it or haven't seen it in a while, Preston's takedown of DnD at the 8:25 mark is just exquisite:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks9VeB5vI70&list=PLCsx_OFEYH6v2FD9XJgcb_9v3kCestglT&index=10

Should be in a museum somewhere.

[AzzarTheGod]

Season 6 Episode 1 stills leaked.

Rumor has it that the episode itself has leaked too. Anyone got a link?

Was unable to get a confirm, earliest "leak" I saw was 10+ days ago...seemed suspicious so I didn't download.

[holahouze]

Jon doesn't have purple eyes or light hair either but I'm fully convinced he's a Targaryen.

It's also possible Tywin either didn't know Tyrion wasn't his or because of whatever reason that hasn't yet been revealed he was forced to live with it.

Or it's not true and is just a theory. Who knows.

It's also possible Tyrion is a Targaryen on the show but not in the books.

You just made my brain hurt. I can not imagine the magnitude of fan reaction if the show treated Tyrion's parentage different from books. It would be the doom all over again.

[holahouze]

again, im not saying Marwyn and Quiathe surely know about Bloodraven. im just saying that due to magic, they might and it cant be ruled out ;)


Thanks for reply. I get it. Both Marwyn's and Quaite's stories are thin on detail, but there is magic in them. I feel Bloodraven and Bran will face opposition is whatever it is they intend to do, so i'm interested in clues who or what that might be.

[MrSparkle001]

You just made my brain hurt. I can not imagine the magnitude of fan reaction if the show treated Tyrion's parentage different from books. It would be the doom all over again.

Fans are already unhappy with how different the show is from the books, and if season 6 follows the pattern it will only vaguely resemble the books.

[Wonkie]

Dornish master plan HYPE get HYPE!

[AenorVZ]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jK-NcRmVcw

[Slippn_Jimmy]

Less than two hours!! omfg!!

[Sirken]

i'm interested in clues who or what that might be.
you and me both

[Sirken]

Fans are already unhappy with how different the show is from the books, and if season 6 follows the pattern it will only vaguely resemble the books.

theres only really a couple things that i think readers are really pissed about (ie: see everything about the dornish storyline/plot.

Doran Martel is extremely similar to Tywin in the books, in the show i have no idea what they are doing with Dorne. essentially the show is just trying to give you the meat and potatoes of the story. no sides of rice or veggies, no dessert, nada.

but sadly you are right, every season seems to stray further and further from the books. however that doesnt piss me off. it just means the show isn't going to spoil a ton of things that i actually care about from the books ;)

[Pokesan]

Muh dornish master plans

[Fael]

Love how the martell guards just stood there and let it all go down. What terrible writing the Dorne plot is.

[AzzarTheGod]

Muh dornish master plans

Hahah

[Robbintha Hood]

That ending tho. Jon rezz inc.

Man, I have a feeling that Jon won't be rezzed. Knowing how this series has gone thus far, they probably put Kit Harrington's name in the opening credits just to mess with folks.

[AenorVZ]

Love how the martell guards just stood there and let it all go down. What terrible writing the Dorne plot is.

Go to 8:25: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks9V...stglT&index=10

They haven't gotten any better.

[AenorVZ]

Notes from my Season 6 Hatewatch:

Okay so this opens with a bit of clunkiness. Almost the entire night's watch is in the great hall either siding with Thorne or accusing him of murder. This means people have seen Jon's body, but nobody secured the crime scene. Davos walks outside and there isn't a soul outside of Castle Black.

No explanation of how Theon and Sansa survived the fall that killed Randa.

"Go north, only north." She's suffering hypothermia and you think she can march weeks in the snow with no provisions?

Pretty good fight scene but the dogs poofed.

Areo Hotah went out like a bitch. One little girl took him out with one little prick in the back? He wasn't on alert with a sand snake present?

Trystane went out like an even bigger bitch. Turned his back on one of them?

And finally the Dornish Master Plan is revealed: Doran carefully planned for 17 years only to get murdered by Oberyn's paramour and bastard after they apparently won over his entire guard right under his and Hotah's noses.

And then Tyrion and Varys go strolling around Mereen with no guard. DnD are fucking stupid. Cause nobody knows there's a Westerosi dwarf that's suddenly running the city on Daenerys' behalf. It took real effort for this shit to get more dumb than Season 5. Take a bow DnD.

[AzzarTheGod]

whoo I'm low on oxygen. been laughing all this time. This episode gave me Boardwalk Empire final season vibes.

maybe i'll have some formative thoughts after I recover from the Dornish Master Plan

[Fael]

Its sad really that we have to suspend our belief episode by episode just to enjoy the good parts of the show.

Sadly George does it too in the books. The dissolution of Robb's 10,000 strong army at the Twins and the wildlings / loyal watchmen when Jon was killed at the wall is equally inexplicable.

[Sidelle]

That was the laziest piece of shit season opener for any show in the history of EVER that I've patiently waited almost a whole year to see. WHERE IS ANYTHING RESEMBLING A MOTHERFUCKING PAYOFF FOR REMAINING A LOYAL FAN AND HBO CUSTOMER YEAR AFTER YEAR? EVEN AFTER THE VICIOUS KICK IN THE COOTER they dished out when they canceled ROME a few years back, one of the coolest HBO series ever produced.

I could have maybe forgiven them a little - like if it were only one storyline for one major character that was all jacked up, but no - they went and fucked up virtually all of it.

And now I'm having this awful feeling that Jon Snow definitely won't be coming back. Ever.

[Patriam1066]

Notes from my Season 6 Hatewatch:

Areo Hotah went out like a bitch. One little girl took him out with one little prick in the back? He wasn't on alert with a sand snake present?

Trystane went out like an even bigger bitch. Turned his back on one of them?

And finally the Dornish Master Plan is revealed: Doran carefully planned for 17 years only to get murdered by Oberyn's paramour and bastard after they apparently won over his entire guard right under his and Hotah's noses.

And then Tyrion and Varys go strolling around Mereen with no guard. DnD are fucking stupid. Cause nobody knows there's a Westerosi dwarf that's suddenly running the city on Daenerys' behalf. It took real effort for this shit to get more dumb than Season 5. Take a bow DnD.

Couldn't agree more. WTB the Winds of Winter

[AenorVZ]

whoo I'm low on oxygen. been laughing all this time. This episode gave me Boardwalk Empire final season vibes.

maybe i'll have some formative thoughts after I recover from the Dornish Master Plan

Good call. Make sure you've caught your breath before you watch this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JxoX0Y59yQ

[Pokesan]

starting to remind of TWD - trouble occurs because every character makes retarded choices.

[Sirken]

Love how the martell guards just stood there and let it all go down. What terrible writing the Dorne plot is.

i dont even want to talk about how badly HBO did Dorne, and then instead of trying to fix it, they just kill off everyone as to not have to deal with it. F you david & dan.

[Sirken]

Man, I have a feeling that Jon won't be rezzed. Knowing how this series has gone thus far, they probably put Kit Harrington's name in the opening credits just to mess with folks.

sadly youre wrong. Jon is the only nerd in the story with actual plot armor thanks to the whole R+L=J

not to mention the entire reason the show had Melisandre meet Thoros was in case show watchers were too dumb to connect dots on their own. Mel will bring Jon back, and it will restore her faith in the Red God.

[Sirken]

Notes from my Season 6 Hatewatch:

Okay so this opens with a bit of clunkiness. Almost the entire night's watch is in the great hall either siding with Thorne or accusing him of murder. This means people have seen Jon's body, but nobody secured the crime scene. Davos walks outside and there isn't a soul outside of Castle Black.

No explanation of how Theon and Sansa survived the fall that killed Randa.

"Go north, only north." She's suffering hypothermia and you think she can march weeks in the snow with no provisions?

Pretty good fight scene but the dogs poofed.

Areo Hotah went out like a bitch. One little girl took him out with one little prick in the back? He wasn't on alert with a sand snake present?

Trystane went out like an even bigger bitch. Turned his back on one of them?

And finally the Dornish Master Plan is revealed: Doran carefully planned for 17 years only to get murdered by Oberyn's paramour and bastard after they apparently won over his entire guard right under his and Hotah's noses.

And then Tyrion and Varys go strolling around Mereen with no guard. DnD are fucking stupid. Cause nobody knows there's a Westerosi dwarf that's suddenly running the city on Daenerys' behalf. It took real effort for this shit to get more dumb than Season 5. Take a bow DnD.

/applaud

all of that x2

[AzzarTheGod]

i dont even want to talk about how badly HBO did Dorne, and then instead of trying to fix it, they just kill off everyone as to not have to deal with it. F you david & dan.

Heh and then they dare tell HBO brass that their story is finished shorter than the 2 additional seasons planned and inform them they can't even deliver on a full 2 seasons. Yuck..

Fuck them both in the ass with a poolstick. Unless of course there are some pleasant redeeming reasons as to why Dorne had to be railroaded off the show.

Even then, at this point not getting a full 2 seasons is crystal clear.

[holahouze]

You guys need a pep talk. Any of us up to the challenge?

I thought Davos asking for mutton was hysterical!

[AenorVZ]

Unless of course there are some pleasant redeeming reasons as to why Dorne had to be railroaded off the show.

I swear they watched Preston's vids and they were like "fuck, there's no way our audience is smart enough to get half of that. Kill everyone!"

I thought Davos asking for mutton was hysterical!

Okay fine, that was pretty good.

[holahouze]

A & A, you guys are big Thorne fans. I thought his speech to NW was very well done.

[beyondinfin]

RIP Dorne on the show, we (literally) hardly knew ye. Why even have Doran on the damn show in the first place?

Also the preview for next episode had my head wanting to explode already.

[Robbintha Hood]

sadly youre wrong. Jon is the only nerd in the story with actual plot armor thanks to the whole R+L=J

not to mention the entire reason the show had Melisandre meet Thoros was in case show watchers were too dumb to connect dots on their own. Mel will bring Jon back, and it will restore her faith in the Red God.

Sadly, you're speculating that R+L=J. :p

[Sirken]

You guys need a pep talk. Any of us up to the challenge?
I thought Davos asking for mutton was hysterical!

i will always love davos. i have a soft spot for certain onions

[Sirken]

RIP Dorne on the show, we (literally) hardly knew ye. Why even have Doran on the damn show in the first place?

Also the preview for next episode had my head wanting to explode already.

i think they intended to do some Dorne. but then they heard the universal reaction of how bad it was, and its easier to axe the entire story... so they did.

[Sirken]

Sadly, you're speculating that R+L=J. :p

ok. you hold that thought until the end of season 6 and we'll talk again. im not wasting my time arguing R+L=J with you. if you havent arrived at that conclusion yet, then we're reading two different books :)

[Sirken]

https://i.imgur.com/bizV5a1.png

[holahouze]

^^^ nice.

too late, i fear.

[AzzarTheGod]

lol great pic....


I am re-watching the episode again since the first run gave me bus shock and amounted to a real mind-eraser.

If you have no idea what bus shock means, read on:

Ok, in Vanilla, there was a big class balancing intiitative. Every major change patch a new class would get their changs, and before said patch the devs asked for feedback from the community.

His initiative was actually quite successful, and a lor of class got some fundamental bad things fixed. So, it comes to the Shamans turn. There is a thread full of good and intresting ideas. However, the CM responsible for collating this feedback was sick the week he was meant to do it, so another CM took over. Our patch got pushed back as a result of this and someone else went in our place.

So next patch comes about, and they do Shaman AND Mage at the same time. Mage gets a good load of stuff and a lot of problems fixed. Shaman get about 1 buff with the rest of the changes being nerfs.

At least I think that is how it came about.

The shaman forums go absolutely mental. Someone suggests that the Dev responsible for this gets 'Hit by a bus', and the term Bus Shock was then coined. People believe that to this day the apparent shoddy treatment Shaman get is a repercussion of this incident

Full archive of all relevant bus shock links here to explain more about the phenomenon of coining this term, and Blizzard's official response and reaction to the bus shock incident. Must read if you played WoW, were involved in the community, and are familiar with some of the community managers at the time.

https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comments/pid7a/bus_shock/

[Robbintha Hood]

ok. you hold that thought until the end of season 6 and we'll talk again. im not wasting my time arguing R+L=J with you. if you havent arrived at that conclusion yet, then we're reading two different books :)

I'm not an idiot. Obviously, R+L=J makes the most sense. I'm arguing just for the sake of arguing. But, GoT and ASOIAF, at this point, are more like:

http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/bttf/images/e/ee/Familyguy-bttf2.jpg

So who really knows what the hell is going to happen. That's probably what makes the HBO series the most intriguing, besides the massive amounts of boobs displayed in all 5 seasons. Hell we even got to see 100+ year old boobs in the last episode (/shiver).

[Safon]

Show has reached cringe-worthy levels of terrible, HBO has really lost it's way

[AenorVZ]

i will always love davos. i have a soft spot for certain onions

Onion Knight stays having onions.

A & A, you guys are big Thorne fans. I thought his speech to NW was very well done.

That was the pep talk we all needed.

https://i.imgur.com/bizV5a1.png

http://57.media.tumblr.com/4913a9a8eb2f4342c27225a1114e63b7/tumblr_nrc8iyF8Hm1qdqyxho3_500.gif

Show has reached cringe-worthy levels of terrible, HBO has really lost it's way

This thread has become like the Fuck Olly reddit except DnD are Olly.

[Mandalore93]

In fairness the Dorne master plot is "Let's have a secret marriage pact that basically only three people, all of whom are over 40 know about so that when the parties come of age then we'll announce the marriage and use Dorne, the least populated area of the seven kingdoms to have a Targaryen rebellion against a powerblock of the Westlands-Stormlands-Vale-North all of whom are connected by first degree marriages/wardships/bloodlines in general."

And I'm not even going to mention the fact that Doran wants to side with the Targs despite the fact that Aerys II got his sister and her children killed by imprisoning them instead of sending them away.

Doran=low energy cuck 4 real

I honestly always thought the Dorne plot line even in the books was fucking stupid. It's only the deus ex dragons that Martin fucking loves to use time and time and time and time and time and time and time and time and time and time and time and time again.

Also, with R+L=J the entire narrative that the books seem to be working towards makes no sense.

[Patriam1066]

In fairness the Dorne master plot is "Let's have a secret marriage pact that basically only three people, all of whom are over 40 know about so that when the parties come of age then we'll announce the marriage and use Dorne, the least populated area of the seven kingdoms to have a Targaryen rebellion against a powerblock of the Westlands-Stormlands-Vale-North all of whom are connected by first degree marriages/wardships/bloodlines in general."

And I'm not even going to mention the fact that Doran wants to side with the Targs despite the fact that Aerys II got his sister and her children killed by imprisoning them instead of sending them away.

Doran=low energy cuck 4 real

I honestly always thought the Dorne plot line even in the books was fucking stupid. It's only the deus ex dragons that Martin fucking loves to use time and time and time and time and time and time and time and time and time and time and time and time again.

Also, with R+L=J the entire narrative that the books seem to be working towards makes no sense.

Well, what other chance did Doran have? He has the lowest population and no real alliances, as you mentioned. Doesn't that mean waiting it out was pretty much his best option? I think you're not giving the Dornish master plan enough credit, nor are you giving the potential for a Dornish + dothraki army to bring real devastation to westeros

Regardless of what you think about the Dornish story arc, the way the show portrayed it was incredibly stupid. Why get such a good actor to play Doran to have him be in like 5 scenes total? Why get such horrible actresses to play the sand snakes? The show at this point just seems lazy and poorly written.

As for your last point, what do you think doesn't make sense about R+L=J? Westeros will be at war across its south, the wall will come down, and a resurrected Jon will rally the north to fight back against the Others. Dany will FINALLY land in westeros, seeing how she's been seeking a moral purpose (saving humanity for an apocalyptic invasion will finally give her justification to leave her freed slaves). The third head of the dragon will reveal himself / herself (I have no idea who this is, I suspect it will be Bran warging a dragon but I'm honestly not sure if he and the children of the forest will be on that side of the conflict) and we'll have war!!!!!

Dany will die in the conflict. A victorious Jon, ever noble and ever with the stark traits, will deny himself the iron throne and instead become lord of Winterfell. He will place Rickon on some appropriate seat... Maybe Riverrun as lord paramount of the trident. And he'll place Sansa on the iron throne. This will bring the north, the vale, and the riverlands into an alliance.

Probably wrong about all of that, especially since I have no idea what fAegon is going to do, but it's my $.02

[Mandalore93]

Was a typo mate. Meant that without R + L = J the narrative would make no sense. It's canon as far as I and most of the community believe

[Mandalore93]

Also, I don't think the horse lords were ever apart of the original plan and would work against Doran's plan.

[Patriam1066]

The dothraki probably weren't part of the original plan. Neither was Dany. I'm simply saying that both are reasons why you'd be cautious. Doran rebelling early, say around the time that Balon Greyjoy did, might've worked. It probably wouldn't have though. Waiting it out and plotting for his entire life was probably the only thing the Prince of Dorne could've hoped for. It was always a long shot, but it seems like a much smarter way to go than the alternative.

Unless you're a mastermind like Baelish, I think Doran did OK for himself. At the very least, he's outlasted the lannisters and most likely the Baratheons as well. Not to mention the Arryns, the Tullys, etc.....

My biggest problem with the Dornish story, like the fAegon story, is that we start to see it in book 4/5. That leads me to believe that they're either filler or GRRM lost his mind. Like I've said in earlier posts, however, I think fAegon has a real shot to cause some havoc. It's obvious he won't, but say he were to marry Arianne....

Dorne + the golden company + KL and the north in chaos.... The realm might just say fuck it, let's go with an option that's better than Cersei.

Again, I have no idea what will happen, I jut think it's unfair to shit on Dorne. Not gonna lie though, the ancillary nature of that story to the central one is poor writing on GRRM's part, so I agree with you about the narrative falling apart at this point. He has so much shit going on that even he it seems doesn't know what will happen next, or to whom.

[AenorVZ]

The show at this point just seems lazy and poorly written.

We're beyond seems.

[AenorVZ]

My biggest problem with the Dornish story, like the fAegon story, is that we start to see it in book 4/5. That leads me to believe that they're either filler or GRRM lost his mind.

I don't think there's any question that Martin is victim to some of the same compulsion to create further sprawl in his story that Robert Jordan was subject to. Now, I have no information, but I suspect that the Dorne plot was planned out long in advance, not tacked on to the end. It strikes me as something like Silmarillion where it was part of the overarching mythology.

But Martin made an editorial decision to concentrate the story arc on what are considered the main characters in the first three books. Now, I won't lie, I think he put his best effort into those three books and, if he had Dorne outlined, he probably didn't have it planned in great detail.

[JurisDictum]

This book has gotten so damn popular, its hard to keep plot twists hidden. Only like what...maybe 5% of readers would have honestly picked up on that Jon Snow being Jon Targaryen? Now damn near everyone that has read the books knows, and you can tell by his interviews that he thought about changing it based on that (maybe he did).

A problem he spoke openly about was trying to get Danny in Westeroes in a way that seemed natural and not weirdly forced. Honestly I think it's going to be a lot easyer to untie this maraneeze knot in the books than in the show. The show is going to have to modify things a lot based on what they already changed.

[Sirken]

so im here with my nerdpal Keith, and he just suggested that on the show Mel could sacrifice herself to rezz Jon. what do you pals think on that? could that be how the red woman gets sent off?

[AzzarTheGod]

so im here with my nerdpal Keith, and he just suggested that on the show Mel could sacrifice herself to rezz Jon. what do you pals think on that? could that be how the red woman gets sent off?

On the show that could very well be what that ending scene with her was about. Possible foreshadowing by showing people she is very old, preparing us a little bit for her loss. Why else take so much time to show us her true age in a closing sequence in what is just about the final season of the show...

[Mandalore93]

The lightning lord did sacrifice himself to bring back the wolf bitch.

And Doran is stupid. I'm not at my computer right now so I can't run down how his plan is silly beyond what I already did

[holahouze]

On the show that could very well be what that ending scene with her was about. Possible foreshadowing by showing people she is very old, preparing us a little bit for her loss. Why else take so much time to show us her true age in a closing sequence in what is just about the final season of the show...

My first thought was she was laying down to die. After seeing these posts this morning, I went back and watched the trailers, and I think we've seen every Mel snippet they shared. So we could be headed there. She has to serve some purpose other than sabotaging the Baratheon family (Jon).

I'm not a fan of the Red God resurrection theories and forecasts. I think Jon comes back more, not less. And anways, Mel seriously needs a pick me up. She's more than depressed, she's losing or lost her faith. Notice that she's been bundling up, wearing cloaks, crawling under fur covers? Her mojo is tanking. Davos going to fix that?

[Mandalore93]

She has to serve some purpose other than sabotaging the Baratheon family (Jon).

Unless this is hot off the press, cutting edge tinfoil then Jon isn't related to the Baratheons except through like a great-great-great-great grandmother.

[holahouze]

Unless this is hot off the press, cutting edge tinfoil then Jon isn't related to the Baratheons except through like a great-great-great-great grandmother.

Ha! You know what i meant. ;)

[AzzarTheGod]

My first thought was she was laying down to die. After seeing these posts this morning, I went back and watched the trailers, and I think we've seen every Mel snippet they shared. So we could be headed there. She has to serve some purpose other than sabotaging the Baratheon family (Jon).

I'm not a fan of the Red God resurrection theories and forecasts. I think Jon comes back more, not less. And anways, Mel seriously needs a pick me up. She's more than depressed, she's losing or lost her faith. Notice that she's been bundling up, wearing cloaks, crawling under fur covers? Her mojo is tanking. Davos going to fix that?

Said it before, Red God resurrection for Jon is bad captain obvious writing (I don't care if the Red God is associated with the Targaeryans (sp don't care) and its Jon Targaryens true religion, that doesn't save this at all for me). Why doesn't it work for me on the show is because of "LOOK LOL RED PRIEST MAGIC" all 6 seasons, episode after episode, over and over, scene after scene. Its just dumb ass writing (show-wise). Book-wise however, I don't have any beef with it at all because there is no red magic saturation and Red Priest story force-feeding going on.

but it certainly seems we are heading down that road.

Were about 1 or 2 episodes away from jumping the shark. That opening episode placed us on the beach, were searching for sharks now. Or did we already jump it with the Dornish Master Plan?

[holahouze]

Said it before, Red God resurrection for Jon is bad captain obvious writing (I don't care if the Red God is associated with the Targaeryans (sp don't care) and its Jon Targaryens true religion, that doesn't save this at all for me). Why doesn't it work for me on the show is because of "LOOK LOL RED PRIEST MAGIC" all 6 seasons, episode after episode, over and over, scene after scene. Its just dumb ass writing (show-wise). Book-wise however, I don't have any beef with it at all because there is no red magic saturation and Red Priest story force-feeding going on.

but it certainly seems we are heading down that road.

Were about 1 or 2 episodes away from jumping the shark. That opening episode placed us on the beach, were searching for sharks now. Or did we already jump it with the Dornish Master Plan?

I started a S5 re-watch a month or so ago, and may the Olde Gods be my witness, I could not finish. I resolved that i would not allow Dorne to ruin S6. Couldn't simply ignore Dorne in ep1, but so far, I'm ok. In the books, I do think Obara and Tyene could hose a lot of things up for Doran, so that didn't exactly come out of nowhere for me.

Otherwise, we are of like minds. On the subject of storytelling, what did you think of:

>> Davos motivation for securing Jon's body. Was that because he saw the Traitor sign and sensed trouble? I get why moving/guarding Jon's body is important, but I didn't get why Davos would. BTW, Davos can read. RIP Shireen.
>> Why was Davos staring at Jon's crime scene after body removed? That seemed important.

[Sirken]

Said it before, Red God resurrection for Jon is bad captain obvious writing (I don't care if the Red God is associated with the Targaeryans (sp don't care) and its Jon Targaryens true religion, that doesn't save this at all for me). Why doesn't it work for me on the show is because of "LOOK LOL RED PRIEST MAGIC" all 6 seasons, episode after episode, over and over, scene after scene. Its just dumb ass writing (show-wise). Book-wise however, I don't have any beef with it at all because there is no red magic saturation and Red Priest story force-feeding going on.

here's the thing. in the books, Mel and Thoros never, ever meet (at least from the point that we are introduced to each character in the books). in the show, Mel and Thoros do meet, and the show makes it super blatant clear that the viewers are made aware of the conversation between Mel and Thoros regarding resurrection and Beric Dondarion.

it might not be good, clever, or creative writing.. but it's gonna happen none the less.

although, after watching them butcher Aero Hotah and Doran and essentially the Martel bloodline, i guess i shouldn't expect things to make a ton of sense anymore. maybe prince charming with just wake Jon up with true love's kiss.

[Sirken]

Davos motivation for securing Jon's body. Was that because he saw the Traitor sign and sensed trouble? I get why moving/guarding Jon's body is important, but I didn't get why Davos would. BTW, Davos can read. RIP Shireen.
Why was Davos staring at Jon's crime scene after body removed? That seemed important.

i loved the Davos & Shireen scenes. totally missed the fact that Davos could even read the sign.

lots of people have asked about the Davos staring at the crime scene. but i just cant see secret meaning there. its a big shocking deal, and i think its just trying to be dramatic.

[holahouze]

HBO has released descriptions of ep2 and ep3.

http://winteriscoming.net/2016/04/25/hbo-releases-descriptions-for-episodes-2-and-3/

[Gitem]

Would really have preferred to see John Snow warg'd into Ghost upon death but muhh Kit Harrington's star power lol rez'd he's alive u mad? gonna definitely happen.

stupid

[holahouze]

i loved the Davos & Shireen scenes. totally missed the fact that Davos could even read the sign.

lots of people have asked about the Davos staring at the crime scene. but i just cant see secret meaning there. its a big shocking deal, and i think its just trying to be dramatic.

Show gave us clear shot of Davos looking at sign, and he's now a "learned man" thanks to Shireen :). It will be interesting to see what they do when Davos & Mel discuss Shireen.

While we don't know how this shakes out in book, i'm finding this story-telling a bit odd. I guess they're just working up to a big NW-Wilding showdown.

I'm still hoping Bran + Old Gods will pay Jon a visit while he's out, but that's probably unlikely.

[AzzarTheGod]

I'm still hoping Bran + Old Gods will pay Jon a visit while he's out, but that's probably unlikely.

I think its safe to say that's beyond D&D's capability at this point after they trainwrecked the Dorn plotline. Didn't end up rewatching the episode, cringed thinking about firing it up again.

heres hoping for episode 2.

[holahouze]

Welp. That happened...

[Gitem]

his Roose is COOOKED

savage

[Gitem]

that rez ceremony was real dumb

especially compared to thoros's iirc in the books

felt more difficult to cast than some fucking mumbled words

and sulking away

either way episode was 6/10

roose dead gr8

[AenorVZ]

Would really have preferred to see John Snow warg'd into Ghost upon death

Who says he isn't?

[AenorVZ]

These HBO elves are ruining my immersion.

[holahouze]

I feel like s6 is being run through one of Richard Hendrick's compression algorithms.

[gummab]

Waited a year for utter shite...

[Millburn]

Didn't Thoros say that he learned how to resurrect because he had complete despair and given up all hope when Beric died and not knowing what to do he spoke the only words that came to his mind...like that's how he learned the skill. I totally saw that happening with Melisandre but... but... it just wasn't driven home enough and faltered in the delivery. I dunno like I see what they were trying to do and it was ALMOST there but they needed to do something different at castle black to keep that pressured despair up on Mel and it just became a big ol MEH for me.

[holahouze]

Didn't Thoros say that he learned how to resurrect because he had complete despair and given up all hope when Beric died and not knowing what to do he spoke the only words that came to his mind...like that's how he learned the skill. I totally saw that happening with Melisandre but... but... it just wasn't driven home enough and faltered in the delivery. I dunno like I see what they were trying to do and it was ALMOST there but they needed to do something different at castle black to keep that pressured despair up on Mel and it just became a big ol MEH for me.

Yeah, something like that. Thoros had been in a prolonged back-slide. I'm underwhelmed.

There was a ton of stuff happening in this episode. I'm going to re-watch it tonight, but I was underwhelmed by most of the major developments. Kind of surprised at how quiet it is here. :confused:

[Fael]

Find it hard to believe that book Melissandra doesn't know how to resurrect.

[Sirken]

regarding ep2:

so, im betting that Hodor got kicked in the head by a horse to become the Hodor we all know and love. wonder why they changed his name from Walder. also, i noticed Tyrion is the only one in the Mereen group that hasnt literally lost his cock. and speaking of Tyrion, when he releases the dragons, i was wondering, is there another way in or out of that pyramid? because those dragons will no longer fit through the door.

grats to everyone that predicted Ramsay would slew Roose. do you guys think this will play out the same way in the books? hell, maybe Roose is already dead in the book, and we just don't know about it. cause remember the "Pink Letter" is signed "Ramsay Bolton, Trueborn Lord of Winterfell". so i'm just saying, i could absolutely see that being a thing.

Sansa now knows that Arya, Bran, and Rickon are all still alive, and assumes Jon is the Lord Commander of the Nights Watch. so this is probably the best she's felt since Ned was arrested. and Theon, i don't think i hate him anymore. i kinda just feel bad for him now. the rope bridge scene with Euron & Balon was super cheesy imo. i still am not convinced thats how it played out in the books, but can't be sure. i do think the whole "Euron hired the faceless men (with a dragon egg) to take out Balon" theory is fun and while not probable, surely is possible. and it's for sure folks, we're getting that Kingsmoot. wonder if Theon will be back by then, or if it will just be Euron vs Asha/Yara.

i love Davos. Mel was all like "i just don't believe it's real anymore!" and Davos is like "Lady, i've seen a demon shadow baby assassin crawl out of your snatch, its F'ing real". during the rezz ceremony i was expecting to see Mel's ruby glow or shine or something, and it didn't. i was also expecting a sacrifice, a life for a life type thing. Beric had to go for LSH to be a thing, and hell, Shireen just had to go for no reason. for a brief moment i thought Ghost was going to die.

i know some people were expecting Jon to not come back til later in the season, but im glad they got that all out of the way. we all knew Jon was coming back, and we all knew Melisandre was gonna bring him back. i still wonder if Shireen will be sacrificed in some way that is related to bringing back Jon in the book. and now i'm also left to wonder what Mel will do. i'm sure she'll have no trouble convincing Jon that her God is real.

as for the previews, all that matters is that we are getting ToJ next week!

[LGraves]

Pretty much everything Sirken just said. Davos is probably my favorite character and i'm really curious as to what happens to Theon.

The whole production of the show seems like it shot different or maybe they are just going at a faster pace. But it feels different this season, so far.

[Spyder73]

regarding ep2:

for a brief moment i thought Ghost was going to die.

Definitely thought Ghost was going to stop breathing and then Jon's eyes pop wide open. I am quite disappointed by the entire sequence to be honest, it feels like a cheesy way to bring Jon back. This will be seen by many as the "jump the shark" episode. Part of GoT appeal is that its far more based in "reality" than other fantasy shows...I think there was a lot of eye rolling going on nationwide last night at the end of the episode.

I have read all the books and I realize this show has TONS of fantasy/magic elements, but resurrecting Jon Snow and the magic animating the white walkers seem like 2 different animals all together. I think the writers thought the entire LSH angle was goofy so they decided to nix it - now i feel like Jon and LSH could reunite at some point.

Overall A+, still one of the best shows around