Lols TMO

[Geofizzle]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=47giSVbF8VE#t=117

Hey rog - why arent these guys getting suspensions for purposely training?

[JayN]

purposely training I dont think so, Im sure chest will cry until something happens though. Lets not all forget who was in the zone first clearing?

[jaybone]

purposely training I dont think so, Im sure chest will cry until something happens though. Lets not all forget who was in the zone first clearing?
obviously didnt clear much faggot

[khanable]

I like the guy saying kal ort por in ooc

[Hitpoint]

Chest asking for two weeks raid suspension, lol. We give up two VS and suddenly Chest thinks he can raid suspend anyone for any reason. It has nothing to do with a raid target. This is an individual player suspension at best.

[Fael]

That link goes to the supposed VS train of taken trackers.

WTF u guys talking about now?

[JayN]

chest tears = free loot I thought you guys learned by now, pays to be bloomin-onion pals w/rogeans

[Troubled]

Chest asking for two weeks raid suspension, lol. We give up two VS and suddenly Chest thinks he can raid suspend anyone for any reason. It has nothing to do with a raid target. This is an individual player suspension at best.

Individual suspensions are handed out without 1 guild needing to talk to another. I think this is a different case, as Sirken seems to have pointed out with his petition response.

[Socratic]

This is fucking stupid. As a TMO member i'm sickened. It's one thing for certain players to be so fucking careless and bad at this game that they train people. It's another thing entirely for fucking moron motherfuckers to think training someone is suddenly a good idea (which is what it looked like), regardless of the fact that this had nothing to do with a real raid target.

Personally I hope all the people involved with this shit get suspended for at least a week. Fucking morons.

Wanting TMO to get raid suspended for fear drama you start by jumping another guild's raid is kinda weak imo, but it's Chest, so I don't think anyone is surprised. Still, these idiots are shameful, regardless of the low class move by BDA.

[Man0warr]

We didn't jump them.

Someone checked Fear, found it was all up and no one in zone - AE fear raid called. As we are mustering at portal, a few TMO and then GT are mustering as well.

~4 TMO and ~12ish GT decide to rush into Fear ahead of us (because fuck BDA right? TMO will do whatever they can do mess with BDA including "leading" a fear clear for GT).

Chest says fuck that and we go in a few seconds later and do what we planned to do anyways. We somehow managed to do 2 AE pulls without training their force on the other side of the zone, also.

It's not like we pulled a Taken and zoned into Fear an hour after a guild had been in there and AE'd the rest of the zone down - all 3 guilds zoned in seconds apart.

[Fael]

where is the fraps?

[Man0warr]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1CRVZBZuo4

Pretty cut and dry - Dinacarl standing beside us suspiciously until Unbrella starts yammering in OOC and then goes and grabs temple mobs and trains the shit out of us - Fraps even has him targeted and sees him when he flops behind our raid.

[Socratic]

I'm being told TMO/GT were in the zone for nearly an hour before BDA zoned in. Who the fuck knows tho.

[Tiggles]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=47giSVbF8VE#t=117

Hey rog - why arent these guys getting suspensions for purposely training?

Good post, Thanks Fountree.

[Antarctica]

Both Fear and KC trains look pretty deliberate. I hope Rogean takes a look at these incidents. GMs are pretty good at being fair, but at the rate that guilds on this server are acting up with a flying middle finger to GMs, it's going to take Top Gun to put people in their place. If BDA and Taken have not pm'ed your respective fraps to Rogean, do so. In the best interest of this server and starting Velious out right, this kind of stuff needs to be rectified.

[Fael]

We didn't jump them.

Someone checked Fear, found it was all up and no one in zone - AE fear raid called. As we are mustering at portal, a few TMO and then GT are mustering as well.

~4 TMO and ~12ish GT decide to rush into Fear ahead of us (because fuck BDA right? TMO will do whatever they can do mess with BDA including "leading" a fear clear for GT).

Chest says fuck that and we go in a few seconds later and do what we planned to do anyways. We somehow managed to do 2 AE pulls without training their force on the other side of the zone, also.

It's not like we pulled a Taken and zoned into Fear an hour after a guild had been in there and AE'd the rest of the zone down - all 3 guilds zoned in seconds apart.

2 guilds at the zone, and they move in when they see you are enroute.

You guys are complete dicks 90% of the time, particularly when chest is in charge of things. You have this chip on your shoulder attitude where you think everyone else is out to screw you.

Anyways. That said, there is no rule against being assholes; and if you choose to break customs of the game, you can. But don't expect others to honor your control of raid planes from here on out.

That said, if its found that dinacarl intentionally trained you; then he should take a week vacation.

Dolic

[Man0warr]

2 guilds at the zone, and they move in when they see you are enroute.



They were in the zone, about 10 seconds before us, and only rushed in because TMO saw a chance to make BDA look like bad guys to a smaller Class R guild. As I heard, GT had scheduled Fear for ~15 min after all guilds rushed in.

We all got outside Fear at the same time.

[Fael]

Just watched it. If thats not intentional, its extremely reckless.

Dinacarl should be punished accordingly.

As to yall zoning in and proceeding to AE the zone when you weren't there first: i will never honor your fear raids anymore. Anytime I feel like doing AOE fear, your being there will not stop me.

Peace,

Dolic

[Man0warr]

You sure don't read do you - rushing in to Fear undermanned (when BDA had 30 outside) to take advantage of the "first in Plane claims it" common courtesy just to make BDA look bad doesn't really count.

It's not like your guild hasn't come in and sniped mobs right from under another guild that had been in Fear/Hate for far longer than TMO/GT had been in the zone (10 seconds at most).

[Frieza_Prexus]

Just watched it. If thats not intentional, its extremely reckless.

Dinacarl should be punished accordingly.

Agreed. This appears, at best, to be extremely negligent, and at worst flagrant training. Extreme negligence warrants punitive action on his account without an extremely good explanation.

[Fael]

You sure don't read do you - rushing in to Fear undermanned (when BDA had 30 outside) to take advantage of the "first in Plane claims it" common courtesy just to make BDA look bad doesn't really count.

It's not like your guild hasn't come in and sniped mobs right from under another guild that had been in Fear/Hate for far longer than TMO/GT had been in the zone (10 seconds at most).

My understanding is that they were there marshalling first.

[Man0warr]

Banning a single TMO account doesn't do jack shit, Dinacarl can go play some other account you guys have laying around.

It's obvious that Unbrella ordered the train from his comments - if you guys are going to hold Chest/BDA accountable for stuff his guild members do/say, you can't claim the opposite for Dinacarl.

Entire guild should be raid suspended because of the actions of a co-leader and member in a raid zone.

If someone in BDA did the same, I'd expect the same punishment.

[Man0warr]

My understanding is that they were there marshalling first.

They weren't - it was simultaneous at best.

[quido]

I gotta admit I laughed my ass off when I saw this. Props to Dinacarl for having the balls to do it so ostentatiously lol - this is what we call civil disobedience

maybe next time put a little distance between you and your train though bro

[Ambrotos]

Since when was there a rule saying you can't raid a zone even if someone is there?

[Frieza_Prexus]

Banning a single TMO account doesn't do jack shit, Dinacarl can go play some other account you guys have laying around.

If Dinacarl did it on purpose, he should be guild removed, not given alternate account access.

Having read Unbrella's comments I still doubt he ordered the train. If he did, then we're in different territory.

[Ravager]

Since when was there a rule saying you can't raid a zone even if someone is there?

This. Everything is FTE, because you guys made it that way. You can't have it both ways.

[Splorf22]

Banning a single TMO account doesn't do jack shit, Dinacarl can go play some other account you guys have laying around.

I had Raev banned once by Eunomia for intentional training (Winterfresh deserved every mob). Neither of my other two toons were banned, so it was pretty pointless.

I wonder how it would work if everyone was limited to 1 loginserver account (with an appropriate transition period as toons were shuffled around).

[SyanideGas]

Since when was there a rule saying you can't raid a zone even if someone is there?

Exactly this. There have been so many times where multiple guilds would be killing mobs in different areas of the planes, there isn't a rule against that.

[JayN]

TMO's been doing Shiverback skeleton crew for a few weeks now, trying to gear out our monks. Weve been able to raid inside fear side by side with other guild such as asgard without any drama like this in the past.

its just chests entitlement attitude that fucks everything up for everyone. Dudes so used to having everything served up to him on a shiny platter at whims notice. Hes lost all of his perspective.

[Fael]

Banning a single TMO account doesn't do jack shit, Dinacarl can go play some other account you guys have laying around.

It's obvious that Unbrella ordered the train from his comments - if you guys are going to hold Chest/BDA accountable for stuff his guild members do/say, you can't claim the opposite for Dinacarl.

Entire guild should be raid suspended because of the actions of a co-leader and member in a raid zone.

If someone in BDA did the same, I'd expect the same punishment.

Substantial evidence is evidence that rises above mere suspicion. You don't even have that. You people are so ridiculous.

In a fair world, you deserved to be trained judging by how you zoned into fear to AE the WHOLE ZONE even though some other people where there first.

Unfortunately, training ass holes is illegal on p99.

Dolic

[quido]

The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.

I regret that I have but 12 lives to give for my guild.

[Tiggles]

I don't see any raid targets up so why raid suspensions? Ban Dinawhatever and move on.

I was in vent with Unbrella and he never told anyone to train.

[Fael]

Exactly this. There have been so many times where multiple guilds would be killing mobs in different areas of the planes, there isn't a rule against that.

Its not a rule. Its a social custom that has been the norm for a long time. If someone is there, you coordinate. You don't say fuck off and take the whole zone.

Now you can. And i will in the future when my desire to raid fear happens to align with yours.

[Juevento]

Confirmed. Unbrella ordered the train.

http://youtu.be/hopNAI8Pefg?t=1m32s

[Cecily]

Since when was there a rule saying you can't raid a zone even if someone is there?

I remember a don't be a douche bag rule in one of the older server rule posts which specifically mentioned that you probably shouldn't do a plane if another guild was clearing first. This, of course, was never enforced or respected by anyone.

[captnamazing]

TMO crying about people steamrolling ahead of them and killing mobs is fucking hilarious.
I agree it was a dick move for BDA to take the Fear pop.
But I literally can't believe my eyes when I see TMO complaining about this.

Anyway, you guys are hypocritical scum and deserve suspension after 2 blatant trains in such a small amount of time.

No one stands in the way of BDA - Premier Raid Guild

[Geofizzle]

The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.

I regret that I have but 12 lives to give for my guild.

http://d1h1icg9nkzvny.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/The-Patriot-1.jpg

[Ele]

i don't even know what this thread is about anymore

[Fael]

TMO crying about people steamrolling ahead of them and killing mobs is fucking hilarious.
I agree it was a dick move for BDA to take the Fear pop.
But I literally can't believe my eyes when I see TMO complaining about this.

Anyway, you guys are hypocritical scum and deserve suspension after 2 blatant trains in such a small amount of time.

No one stands in the way of BDA - Premier Raid Guild

The irony goes both ways doesn't it?

[Bboboo]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1CRVZBZuo4

Pretty cut and dry - Dinacarl standing beside us suspiciously until Unbrella starts yammering in OOC and then goes and grabs temple mobs and trains the shit out of us - Fraps even has him targeted and sees him when he flops behind our raid.


Monk stood next to that group long enough to know where they were, running out directly at them, over them even, what do you thinks gunna happen even if he were to magically out run the mobs casting range.

All he had to do was hold down left or right for two seconds to avoid this.

[JayN]

Poor Dina he'll never get those arms now!

[Ambrotos]

I don't see any raid targets up so why raid suspensions? Ban Dinawhatever and move on.

I was in vent with Unbrella and he never told anyone to train.

Right on the head.

[Cookiefist]

Looks to me that one guild was leap-frogged by another. So, the other guild being leap-frogged responded the way anyone would by competing for the zone they were preparing for.

[JayN]

for some reason leap frogging isnt a crime on this "Classic Server"

[Fuddwin]

Poor Chest (Variety)

[Shinko]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ivNLDnetOwk

BDA STEALING TMO RAGEFIRE

[quido]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lplx-vHY61I

[khanable]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ivNLDnetOwk

BDA STEALING TMO RAGEFIRE

A fucking +

[Tecmos Deception]

I don't see any raid targets up so why raid suspensions? Ban Dinawhatever and move on.

Right on the head.

I guess if you guys want to see things continue in this vein then yeah, a couple weeks off for a single account of one player would be grat.

[Tecmos Deception]

grat. wtf :(

[Nirgon]

No one stands in the way of BDA - Premier Raid Guild

8)

[Ambrotos]

That's the way I would look at it as. A single person who decided to be stupid. No reason to involve an entire guild. So I am wrong with how it should be handled considering the recent events and GM statements.

Seems with Sirken's response about working it out between guilds falls under the Server Raid Rules, and he considers it a raid. Makes sense since Sky is allowed during suspensions, but fear isn't. So Chest has that point to consider in his petition. They can't/won't/not able to work it out so the staff should become involved and rule accordingly that the precedent has been set before hand. Other guilds have had issues, couldn't work it out so the staff became involved and guilds were suspended.

So with Chest being right or wrong with what type of punishment(guild or person) he wants is negated with how Sirken considers this as a Raid issue.

[Swifty]

tl:dr

Fuck BDA

[Locust]

tl:dr

Fuck BDA

lol but did u c those fraps?

[Swifty]

lol but did u c those fraps?

The game is rigged.

[captnamazing]

8)

;)

[Frieza_Prexus]

There's no current provision in the rules, but the status of the planes as a raid is a bit inflated with the advent of so many people 1 grouping and 8 man AEing it. So, I think that might bear a bit of consideration if people are actually going to revisit what is and is not a raid.

Even so, a single player getting his train on in fear shouldn't really fall under "guild activity." There have been plenty of times pickup fear raids were trained, and solo acts are dealt with on an individual basis.

If the leadership ordered the hit then we're in a whole different arena.

[bktroost]

as Deru stated, the server staff favor the Class C guilds and permit them certain privileges we do not have as a reward for being the more competitive class. This is new information for us as a group and we'll have to consider this in the future when disputes arise.


When Class C have fraps of each other suspensions go out. When they want to work things out among themselves, they get off Scot free.

Class R gets a textbook definition of training... we'll see what happens.

[bktroost]

.

[Cookiefist]

Hows come everywheres I looks I sees villainy.

[Jarnauga]

There's no current provision in the rules, but the status of the planes as a raid is a bit inflated with the advent of so many people 1 grouping and 8 man AEing it. So, I think that might bear a bit of consideration if people are actually going to revisit what is and is not a raid.

Even so, a single player getting his train on in fear shouldn't really fall under "guild activity." There have been plenty of times pickup fear raids were trained, and solo acts are dealt with on an individual basis.

If the leadership ordered the hit then we're in a whole different arena.

..just imagine what TMO would do when it's phara dar or cazic thule amirite

[Lazie]

..just imagine what TMO would do when it's phara dar or cazic thule amirite

Well we know IB would just KS and blame ignorance.

[Funkutron5000]

Well we know IB would just KS and blame ignorance.

Or train PD trackers. Or train PD onto an opposing raid. Nexona also works really well for training raids.

[Lazie]

Or train PD trackers. Or train PD onto an opposing raid. Nexona also works really well for training raids.
...and give you an embarrassed smile after. :o

[Frieza_Prexus]

..just imagine what TMO would do when it's phara dar or cazic thule amirite

If it's a single player on their own then that player should be punished. When it's done by a person in a position of authority or condoned by the leadership then you have a different story. If the guild unfairly capitalizes on the situation or fails to discipline the player, then you can explore the leadership's actions as ratification.

[sanforce]

tl:dr

Fuck BDA

This man is a gentleman and a scholar - I agree with his opinion.

[Kekephee]

Have we talked yet about Unbrella in ooc immediately after the train, smirking and winking and giving us 3 different stories about "Oh, SORRY, I guess the person who was supposed to get aggro from Dinacarl for the pull just forgot to click him with see invis, LOL ;-)" because that, for me, was a pretty shameless display of I-don't-give-a-fuck-what-my-guys-do-ery from someone who's supposed to be a guild leader

[BigLe2e]

Substantial evidence is evidence that rises above mere suspicion. You don't even have that. You people are so ridiculous.

In a fair world, you deserved to be trained judging by how you zoned into fear to AE the WHOLE ZONE even though some other people where there first.

Unfortunately, training ass holes is illegal on p99.

Dolic

Obviously didnt AE the whole zone if there were still enough mobs to train them with.

[Lazie]

Obviously didnt AE the whole zone if there were still enough mobs to train them with.

We are talking about BDA here. 3 mobs in VS pit is enough to train them apparently.

[BigLe2e]

We are talking about BDA here. 3 mobs in VS pit is enough to train them apparently.

Depending on the mobs and what they were doing at the time, 3 mobs could be a death sentence! But you missed the point.. AE whole zone, not all but 3 mobs, whole zone. No mobs -> no train. Seems like exaggeration and TMO propaganda to say "you zoned into fear to AE the WHOLE ZONE" but still be able to muster up 15+ mobs to drop on top of them after.

[YendorLootmonkey]

LOL at TMO rules lawyers:

At VS: "Oh, well, uh, that wasn't a train... that was just a pull. Therefore we didn't train you and it was not raid disruption."

At Fear: "Oh, well, uh... you were disrupting the entire zone with AE, so... therefore... wait, it was just one guy acting on his own, so... uh..."

Some things never change.

[Lazie]

Depending on the mobs and what they were doing at the time, 3 mobs could be a death sentence! But you missed the point.. AE whole zone, not all but 3 mobs, whole zone. No mobs -> no train. Seems like exaggeration and TMO propaganda to say "you zoned into fear to AE the WHOLE ZONE" but still be able to muster up 15+ mobs to drop on top of them after.

I think the words were BDA zoned in to AE the zone and monopolize the spawns without negotiating with the party of players already present. I mean I don't know why they left any mobs up at all you can AE all of fear in one pull. I think they honestly were just rushing to get the mobs they wanted without working with the people already there as evidenced by Chest's response of "Fuck off" when contacted about a reasonable compromise.

[hatelore]

This is typical TMO fashion. Watch how they turn this around and rule lawyer it as if it was Bda's fault. Fuckin blue is dead. I really do not miss it.

[hatelore]

2 guilds at the zone, and they move in when they see you are enroute.

You guys are complete dicks 90% of the time, particularly when chest is in charge of things. You have this chip on your shoulder attitude where you think everyone else is out to screw you.

Anyways. That said, there is no rule against being assholes; and if you choose to break customs of the game, you can. But don't expect others to honor your control of raid planes from here on out.

That said, if its found that dinacarl intentionally trained you; then he should take a week vacation.

Dolic

a week vacation lol, fuck you. That pos deserves a good 6 month suspension, check the fraps.

[BigLe2e]

I think the words were BDA zoned in to AE the zone and monopolize the spawns
You thought wrong, copy pasted part of Dolic's response for accuracy. I know its hard to see but notice the all caps "WHOLE ZONE" - sometimes caps are hard to read in RNF cuz it implies umad or something, Idk?

[Lazie]

You thought wrong, copy pasted part of Dolic's response for accuracy. I know its hard to see but notice the all caps "WHOLE ZONE" - sometimes caps are hard to read in RNF cuz it implies umad or something, Idk?

Well Dolic wasn't there so I imagine he assumed. I mean what they were doing was a whole zone disruption. Running a kite around other people where simply sitting would get them killed.

[Kekephee]

Well Dolic wasn't there so I imagine he assumed. I mean what they were doing was a whole zone disruption. Running a kite around other people where simply sitting would get them killed.

-Zone disruption, around other people where sitting gets them killed
-Number of trains that occurred that day: 1, wasn't ours
-Number of people who were sitting who ours mobs attacked: 0
-Zone disruption

[jaybone]

Well Dolic wasn't there so I imagine he assumed. I mean what they were doing was a whole zone disruption. Running a kite around other people where simply sitting would get them killed.

nice deflection faggot

[Lazie]

-Zone disruption, around other people where sitting gets them killed
-Number of trains that occurred that day: 1, wasn't ours
-Number of people who were sitting who ours mobs attacked: 0
-Zone disruption

You sir are wrong about this. 2 folks died when the pull train of BDA stopped to kill them. You didn't see us petitioning.

[Fael]

The original link was the vs thing. Someone finally posted the fear train at which point I agreed that it was blatant as hell.

I was intentionally trained by several people (FE and Getsome and co) at rage fire.
I lost the kill because of it.

I petitioned with pics and logs and nothing came of it.
Largely because I posted it in rnf. There use to be a file that if you posted in rnf no action would happen.

Regardless. How was bdA hurt here? Non raid setting. Post fear clear. How much time did they lose.
That said. Blatant training is bull shit by itself.

He should be punished accordingly. But six months is laughable. Hell sentenza was banned like a month on his 10th blatant offense.

Dolic

[BigLe2e]

Well Dolic wasn't there so I imagine he assumed. I mean what they were doing was a whole zone disruption. Running a kite around other people where simply sitting would get them killed.

To sum up: BDA monopolizes WHOLE ZONE by running a kite around other people where simply sitting would get them killed, yet no one from TMO/GT was killed. TMO manages to find enough mobs not monopolized to accidentally on purpose train/kill BDA raid force. People not there argue in favor of TMO based on assumptions of being there an hour before. So BDA with an hour set back (supposedly) comes in, trains all the good mobs without killing the competition, gets the lewts, and TMO responds in typical troll fashion with trains and RNF speculation. Did I miss anything?

[Hitpoint]

To sum up: BDA monopolizes WHOLE ZONE by running a kite around other people where simply sitting would get them killed, yet no one from TMO/GT was killed. TMO manages to find enough mobs not monopolized to accidentally on purpose train/kill BDA raid force. People not there argue in favor of TMO based on assumptions of being there an hour before. So BDA with an hour set back (supposedly) comes in, trains all the good mobs without killing the competition, gets the lewts, and TMO responds in typical troll fashion with trains and RNF speculation. Did I miss anything?

You missed the part where our officers tried to make amends and Chest demanded no less than 2 months raid suspension.

[Lazie]

To sum up: BDA monopolizes WHOLE ZONE by running a kite around other people where simply sitting would get them killed, yet no one from TMO/GT was killed. TMO manages to find enough mobs not monopolized to accidentally on purpose train/kill BDA raid force. People not there argue in favor of TMO based on assumptions of being there an hour before. So BDA with an hour set back (supposedly) comes in, trains all the good mobs without killing the competition, gets the lewts, and TMO responds in typical troll fashion with trains and RNF speculation. Did I miss anything?

Because we don't petition accidental trains. 2 people did die while sitting during their pull. We don't hold grudges over stuff like that.

[arsenalpow]

You missed the part where our officers tried to make amends and Chest demanded no less than 2 months raid suspension.

2 months as a rebuttal to Unbrella's offer of having Dinacarl pull a raid for us. We offered 2 weeks and that was rebuffed as well.

[Lazie]

2 months as a rebuttal to Unbrella's offer of having Dinacarl pull a raid for us. We offered 2 weeks and that was rebuffed as well.

Because a suspension of raid mobs when no raid mobs were involved isn't a reasonable offer. If raid mobs were on the table for a train in fear when nothing is in window whats to stop people from getting a guild suspended over a train in Seb at NG or in KC at LCY when someone in the guild blatantly trains. I mean you actually have to see through the rage to be reasonable here.

[BigLe2e]

Did I miss anything?

You sir are wrong about this. 2 folks died when the pull train of BDA stopped to kill them. You didn't see us petitioning.

Got a fraps, prove it. Or maybe they trained themselves? The TMO monk showed how easy it is to get lost and get people killed when youre madbadorsad. Is that how this works here?

[BigLe2e]

Because a suspension of raid mobs when no raid mobs were involved isn't a reasonable offer. If raid mobs were on the table for a train in fear when nothing is in window whats to stop people from getting a guild suspended over a train in Seb at NG or in KC at LCY when someone in the guild blatantly trains. I mean you actually have to see through the rage to be reasonable here.

Dont blatantly train? Problem solved.

[hatelore]

To sum up: BDA monopolizes WHOLE ZONE by running a kite around other people where simply sitting would get them killed, yet no one from TMO/GT was killed. TMO manages to find enough mobs not monopolized to accidentally on purpose train/kill BDA raid force. People not there argue in favor of TMO based on assumptions of being there an hour before. So BDA with an hour set back (supposedly) comes in, trains all the good mobs without killing the competition, gets the lewts, and TMO responds in typical troll fashion with trains and RNF speculation. Did I miss anything?

This is why you are stupid. No one "accidentally on purpose" does anything for one. For two, the fraps were crystal clear. Not to mention I have been at many raids where TMO intentionally trained us then came on here to rule lawyer it into the fucking ground. You sir, deserve a Retard Star Award.

[Lazie]

Dont blatantly train? Problem solved.

Wasn't me talk to the culprit.

[Hitpoint]

2 months as a rebuttal to Unbrella's offer of having Dinacarl pull a raid for us. We offered 2 weeks and that was rebuffed as well.

Typically when a train occurs, there is no punishment for the trainer. When there's clear fraps (which there is), a week long suspension for the individual is standard, or something along those lines. IMO having the monk pull for you isn't a terrible offer, since absolutely nothing was lost here. It's definitely more reasonable than your counter offer.

[Man0warr]

Regardless. How was bdA hurt here? Non raid setting. Post fear clear. How much time did they lose.

It was after our first AE pull, so it did slow us (we did 1 more AE pull then a few stragglers/golems).

It wasn't a total wipe because we aren't idiots and we expect such shenanigans from TMO, same reason we had Fraps going on the first place.

[Frieza_Prexus]

2 months as a rebuttal to Unbrella's offer of having Dinacarl pull a raid for us. We offered 2 weeks and that was rebuffed as well.

Two weeks is an absolutely unreasonable offer. Cut off your hands or cut off your dick? Try offering something realistic; people might take you seriously for once. It'll take some getting used to, but you should try it. Who knows, you might be seen as something more than a raging demagogue.

[BigLe2e]

This is why you are stupid. No one "accidentally on purpose" does anything for one. For two, the fraps were crystal clear. Not to mention I have been at many raids where TMO intentionally trained us then came on here to rule lawyer it into the fucking ground. You sir, deserve a Retard Star Award.

You misunderstood what I said, or tried to say. Of course that train was on purpose. I've been on raids with you where TMO comes in late to fear, trains/steals all the good mobs and leaves us with nothing. I find it funny that TMO really wants to argue BDA monopolizes anything on P99 when they get beat to the mobs for once.

[BigLe2e]

Because we don't petition accidental trains. 2 people did die while sitting during their pull. We don't hold grudges over stuff like that.

But if the train was intentional and wiped most of your raid force, would you? Sounds like something that might have happened just recently....

[Lazie]

But if the train was intentional and wiped most of your raid force, would you? Sounds like something that might have happened just recently....

No. It has happened to me before. I send a tell to an officer, I upload fraps and message the offending guild member from the other side. We usually find a reasonable resolution among ourselves. Believe it or not a lot of people even though they may get angry in the second something happens can calm down and be reasonable when you talk to them. Chest seems to be the exception to that rule above all others.

[Fael]

Should have posted your grievance in petition and let the staff take care of it.

Instead you bring it to the rant forums in an attempt to run your mouth and get back at TMO and all the wrongs we've done against.

I honestly hope dinacarl will be taught a stern; but honestly they should do nothing in hopes that bda leadership will learn their lesson.

Dolic

[hatelore]

I love how Tmo likes to argue that it is only worth a week suspension. Fuck, why not train everytime then? a week isn't shit, I say set an example and ban his ass for a good long time. 1 week my ass, that sets an example that if you train and shit on a whole raid force, all you have to do is take a week break.

[Fael]

Ps rants and flames while driving is hard.

[JayN]

/pras Dina carl for putting casual leap frogging scum in their places, BDA sub-human RMT trash

[jaybone]

I think lazie might be one of the worst posters on this site. No one beating Tiggles though.

[Lazie]

I think lazie might be one of the worst posters on this site. No one beating Tiggles though.

:)

[bigsykedaddy]

We didn't jump them.

Someone checked Fear, found it was all up and no one in zone - AE fear raid called. As we are mustering at portal, a few TMO and then GT are mustering as well.

~4 TMO and ~12ish GT decide to rush into Fear ahead of us (because fuck BDA right? TMO will do whatever they can do mess with BDA including "leading" a fear clear for GT).

Chest says fuck that and we go in a few seconds later and do what we planned to do anyways. We somehow managed to do 2 AE pulls without training their force on the other side of the zone, also.

It's not like we pulled a Taken and zoned into Fear an hour after a guild had been in there and AE'd the rest of the zone down - all 3 guilds zoned in seconds apart.


That's not true, we were in there killing monkeys , fetids, spiders an hour before you guys even showed up at the portal... We have logs to prove it too

[Fael]

I love how Tmo likes to argue that it is only worth a week suspension. Fuck, why not train everytime then? a week isn't shit, I say set an example and ban his ass for a good long time. 1 week my ass, that sets an example that if you train and shit on a whole raid force, all you have to do is take a week break.

Generally their is gradation in punishments. First offense second offense etc.
Hence to use faz as an example. He blatantly trained a few times like 2 years ago. First offense a week or two. Second offense same. Third or fourth it jumped to month or more ban

Even then. It's not very productive to randomly train. What's the reward ? What so you get out of it to compensate for suspension ?

[bigsykedaddy]

To sum up: BDA monopolizes WHOLE ZONE by running a kite around other people where simply sitting would get them killed, yet no one from TMO/GT was killed. TMO manages to find enough mobs not monopolized to accidentally on purpose train/kill BDA raid force. People not there argue in favor of TMO based on assumptions of being there an hour before. So BDA with an hour set back (supposedly) comes in, trains all the good mobs without killing the competition, gets the lewts, and TMO responds in typical troll fashion with trains and RNF speculation. Did I miss anything?

two of our enchanters were killed when you guys zoned in. We didn't petition.

[Man0warr]

That's not true, we were in there killing monkeys , fetids, spiders an hour before you guys even showed up at the portal... We have logs to prove it too

Chest already posted logs of him checking fear on a tracker with himself and Syzzurp as only ones in zone, and then 5 min later as only him in zone - he then called for raid and we zoned in ~20 min later.

So if you were in there, you wiped or left.

[Lazie]

Chest already posted logs of him checking fear on a tracker with himself and Syzzurp as only ones in zone, and then 5 min later as only him in zone - he then called for raid and we zoned in ~20 min later.

So if you were in there, you wiped or left.

Bullshit. He posted logs 30 minutes before we zoned in. He showed logs 13 minutes after we zoned in. He then should logs when BDA zoned in 20 minutes after we had already been in zone and broken Fear. His "Mere Seconds" comment really went out the window quickly.

[Man0warr]

Bullshit. He posted logs 30 minutes before we zoned in. He showed logs 13 minutes after we zoned in. He then should logs when BDA zoned in 20 minutes after we had already been in zone and broken Fear. His "Mere Seconds" comment really went out the window quickly.

I don't think you know how Time zones work. Here's what Chest posted:

[Mon Jun 02 17:14:06 2014] [ANONYMOUS] Syzzurp <The Mystical Order>
[Mon Jun 02 17:14:06 2014] [ANONYMOUS] Ezekiel <Bregan D`Aerth>
[Mon Jun 02 17:14:06 2014] There are 2 players in Plane of Fear.
[Mon Jun 02 17:14:36 2014] You are low on drink.
[Mon Jun 02 17:15:23 2014] You are low on drink.
[Mon Jun 02 17:16:09 2014] You are low on drink.
[Mon Jun 02 17:16:55 2014] You are low on drink.
[Mon Jun 02 17:17:41 2014] You are low on drink.
[Mon Jun 02 17:18:27 2014] You are low on drink.
[Mon Jun 02 17:19:13 2014] You are low on drink.
[Mon Jun 02 17:19:33 2014] Players on EverQuest:
[Mon Jun 02 17:19:33 2014] ---------------------------
[Mon Jun 02 17:19:33 2014] [ANONYMOUS] Ezekiel <Bregan D`Aerth>
[Mon Jun 02 17:19:33 2014] There is 1 player in Plane of Fear.

5:17 pm central - he checked zone with no one there.

5:21 pm central - Raid was called

[Mon Jun 02 17:54:11 2014] You have entered Plane of Fear.

5:54 pm central - We zoned in, right after GT zoned in following TMO.

Your timeline doesn't match up here Lazie. How could he post logs of 30 min before you zoned in and we didn't zone in until 20 min after that? Only 37 minutes ellapsed from being no one in zone but Chest on our Fear tracker, and us zoning in right after GT rushed in.

[sanforce]

i think bda should be suspended for a week for a being #1 worst guild on the server

[Lazie]

I don't think you know how Time zones work. Here's what Chest posted:



5:17 pm central - he checked zone with no one there.

5:21 pm central - Raid was called



5:54 pm central - We zoned in, right after GT zoned in following TMO.

Your timeline doesn't match up here Lazie. How could he post logs of 30 min before you zoned in and we didn't zone in until 20 min after that? Only 37 minutes ellapsed from being no one in zone but Chest on our Fear tracker, and us zoning in right after GT rushed in.

You were not in zone at 5:54. I know I was in zone. Chest even further explains in his post that he was the person in the zone at 5:54 and he posted logs of TMO in zone when they zoned in....8 minutes later at 6:02. Unbrella further showed you guys weren't in zone at 5:55 via his logs but were at 5:59 20 minutes after the full group of TMO was in the zone and already broken the zone in.

I mean..It's fun to tell lies when defending yourself but the logs of everyone have been posted you guys weren't in zone for 45 minutes after that initial zone check by Chest. Syzzurp was in zone already at that time getting a group together to break it via his logs. The group Syzzurp got together was in Fear breaking it 20 minutes before BDA decided to go in and try to monopolize the zone and your officer told people to fuck off when people contacted him about a compromise.

[Man0warr]

Your numbers keep changing, so it's hard to argue with you.

[Kekephee]

That's not true, we were in there killing monkeys , fetids, spiders an hour before you guys even showed up at the portal... We have logs to prove it too

Bullshit. He posted logs 30 minutes before we zoned in.



The group Syzzurp got together was in Fear breaking it 20 minutes before BDA decided to go in and try to monopolize the zone and your officer told people to fuck off when people contacted him about a compromise.



one hour

30 minutes

20 minutes


Not that any of this is even relevant

[Lazie]

Your numbers keep changing, so it's hard to argue with you.

My numbers haven't changed they are hard coded in all the logs posted. Unbrella has the best logs of the time that transpired during us zoning in and BDA zoning in 20 minutes later.

[Lazie]

one hour

30 minutes

20 minutes


Not that any of this is even relevant

I never said 1 hour that was someone else. I said Chest logged in and checked the zone 30 minutes before we had our group there. He then checked it 13 minutes after we had already zoned in. He knew it was being killed. Your guild then zoned in roughly 7 minutes after he checked it. Which was 20 minutes after we had zoned in and broke it. Yes it matters this is RNF after all and proving Chest a ragehard and liar is essential.

[BigLe2e]

two of our enchanters were killed when you guys zoned in. We didn't petition.

Fraps? Could have trained yourselves for all we know.

[Pint]

why doesnt tmo just give bda the ct/draco that ib cant engage this weekend and call it a win. get trained on a random fear clear score a free ct, sounds pretty reasonable. obviously dinacarl has to go, what a dipshit.

[Emsee]

Fuck that.

[JayN]

All you chums saying that it was a "solo" incident and those of you who buy that are unbelievable.

Look at how long that scrub was sitting there at their AE, while supposedly "raiding" with his guild who had low numbers. You can't tell me that noob was just sitting there watching the sights for a few MINUTES without talking in /gu or /tells with friends contemplating/discussing what he was about to do.

It is obvious that it is a "well sorry bro you got caught, you're getting thrown under the bus", which i'm sure he was made well aware of before doing it and will be retagged at some point in the near future.

http://rptd.ch/misc/funny/hannibal.jpg

Good thing there are not logs for gms to check just in case of this very thing!

[sanforce]

i think it was an accident.... he clearly desynced. hah!

[TrendyDru]

damn dat ***** thursty

[Alarti0001]

We didn't jump them.

Someone checked Fear, found it was all up and no one in zone - AE fear raid called. As we are mustering at portal, a few TMO and then GT are mustering as well.

~4 TMO and ~12ish GT decide to rush into Fear ahead of us (because fuck BDA right? TMO will do whatever they can do mess with BDA including "leading" a fear clear for GT).

Chest says fuck that and we go in a few seconds later and do what we planned to do anyways. We somehow managed to do 2 AE pulls without training their force on the other side of the zone, also.

It's not like we pulled a Taken and zoned into Fear an hour after a guild had been in there and AE'd the rest of the zone down - all 3 guilds zoned in seconds apart.

Lol at a BDA member thinking he matters

[triad]

fucking children

[Arclyte]

This message is hidden because Alarti0001 is on your ignore list.

[VANVEM]

http://rptd.ch/misc/funny/hannibal.jpg

Good thing there are not logs for gms to check just in case of this very thing!

THIS!

this is why TMO should be raid banned, the intentional training is a bannable offense, and should be dealt with.

BUT the Fact that a TMO officer was present, did nothing to stop/hinder/or correct the actions of their guild member is PATHETIC!. Nothing will ever change if this is not addressed.

The GM's want people to work things out on their own? FINE!

The implement a policy that makes GM intervention on punishments 10X greater if they are forced to intervene.

TMO blatantly trains 2 weeks in a row and wants to offer a guild COMPLETELY capable of pulling their own mobs a puller for a raid? Are you FUCKING STUPID?

TMO is derailing the topic because they do not want to talk about the issue that Umbrella was present and if not actively participate in the planning of, then at least guilty of promoting the train after the fact.

THAT should merit sanctions on its own. if the "Top" guild on the server has LOSERS running it, then the entire guild should pay for the actions of said officer, and that goes for every guild, you want to name an officer and follow them, then pay the price.

just as in RL leaders are responsible for the actions of their subordinates, whether or not they had previous knowledge or not.

**** props to any TMO that can "SPecifically address the issues, and not derail******

bet you cant do it

[Lazie]

THIS!

this is why TMO should be raid banned, the intentional training is a bannable offense, and should be dealt with.

BUT the Fact that a TMO officer was present, did nothing to stop/hinder/or correct the actions of their guild member is PATHETIC!. Nothing will ever change if this is not addressed.

The GM's want people to work things out on their own? FINE!

The implement a policy that makes GM intervention on punishments 10X greater if they are forced to intervene.

TMO blatantly trains 2 weeks in a row and wants to offer a guild COMPLETELY capable of pulling their own mobs a puller for a raid? Are you FUCKING STUPID?

TMO is derailing the topic because they do not want to talk about the issue that Umbrella was present and if not actively participate in the planning of, then at least guilty of promoting the train after the fact.

THAT should merit sanctions on its own. if the "Top" guild on the server has LOSERS running it, then the entire guild should pay for the actions of said officer, and that goes for every guild, you want to name an officer and follow them, then pay the price.

just as in RL leaders are responsible for the actions of their subordinates, whether or not they had previous knowledge or not.

**** props to any TMO that can "SPecifically address the issues, and not derail******

bet you cant do it

You just derailed with fiction. Good read though.

[quido]

I'm offering Chest 3 million platinum in restitution for his immense suffering.

[Gotharic]

We didn't jump them.

Someone checked Fear, found it was all up and no one in zone - AE fear raid called. As we are mustering at portal, a few TMO and then GT are mustering as well.

~4 TMO and ~12ish GT decide to rush into Fear ahead of us (because fuck BDA right? TMO will do whatever they can do mess with BDA including "leading" a fear clear for GT).

Chest says fuck that and we go in a few seconds later and do what we planned to do anyways. We somehow managed to do 2 AE pulls without training their force on the other side of the zone, also.

It's not like we pulled a Taken and zoned into Fear an hour after a guild had been in there and AE'd the rest of the zone down - all 3 guilds zoned in seconds apart.

We were in the zone for 10 minutes before BDA jumped in...check the logs, just saying....

Gotharic
Guild Leader
Genocidal Tendencies

[Kekephee]

We were in the zone for 10 minutes before BDA jumped in...check the logs, just saying....


10 minutes

That's not true, we were in there killing monkeys , fetids, spiders an hour before you guys even showed up at the portal... We have logs to prove it too

One hour

[Gotharic]

TMO was in there before GT was, I'm not sure how long TMO was in there for.

[chief]

Why is this in raid discussion? I dont see any mobs in window. Suspend dinacarl for being a moran and training bda.

[VANVEM]

this is R/F not raid Discussion, and there is more to it, quit trying to simplify it to meet your own ends

[Lazie]

this is R/F not raid Discussion, and there is more to it, quit trying to simplify it to meet your own ends

Except there isn't more to it.

[hatelore]

Except there isn't more to it.

Except there is. Raid suspend TMO for 1 month and call it a job well done.

[Lazie]

Except there is. Raid suspend TMO for 1 month and call it a job well done.

Over what ? What exactly did BDA lose again ? Why would there be any punishment except for the guy who did something on his own ? I mean we are willing to compensate anything you guys lost. Just explain what it was.

[quido]

wipe tmo clean

[hatelore]

Lazie, go to bed, TMO needs a ban for this. Support it, get behind it, take action, and make it happen. I am counting on you. We all, are counting on you. Good night son.

[JayN]

TMO done welldone throw em out, time for them to go dirty whistles

[Lazie]

Lazie, go to bed, TMO needs a ban for this. Support it, get behind it, take action, and make it happen. I am counting on you. We all, are counting on you. Good night son.

So BDA lost nothing but wants to be compensated ? Thanks.

[Troubled]

http://theonceandfuturecoffeeaddict.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/2da1.jpeg?w=540&h=403

[Troubled]

http://theonceandfuturecoffeeaddict.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/2da1.jpeg?w=540&h=403
Sorry bros.
http://theonceandfuturecoffeeaddict.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/2da1.jpeg?w=540&h=403

[hatelore]

I like the part were right when the loot was being devided, the douche bag trains and kills everyone. That was really neato. You have to give TMO props, when they go douche, they do it in bloody chunks.

Lazie, how long will you be a cheerleader for tmo and when if ever, will you lets your nuts drop and be a man? Oh wait, those lewt hungry eyes wont allow that right? lol. Keep cheerleading man, the fraps paint a very clear picture for anyone who is honest (not in tmo).

[SyanideGas]

http://theonceandfuturecoffeeaddict.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/286380-that-really-rustled-my-jimmies.jpeg?w=420&h=557

[Lazie]

I like the part were right when the loot was being devided, the douche bag trains and kills everyone. That was really neato. You have to give TMO props, when they go douche, they do it in bloody chunks.

Lazie, how long will you be a cheerleader for tmo and when if ever, will you lets your nuts drop and be a man? Oh wait, those lewt hungry eyes wont allow that right? lol. Keep cheerleading man, the fraps paint a very clear picture for anyone who is honest (not in tmo).

What are we discussing here ? Seems you are more worried about loot than I am. I don't think anyone has said that train didn't look intentional. I don't know what the guys intentions were. I do know he got guild removed for it and it looks like a bad decision while he was upset. TMO has reached out for a reasonable compensation for what an individual did while wearing the guild tag. We just need to know what needs to be compensated.

Do you guys want us to come in and AE fear for you once ? Twice ?

I mean we are trying to understand what you guys lost because of his actions. You guys never have an answer for that. I mean a fair compensation for you guys I am all for. Even though Chest and BDA broke some PNP policies themselves we can look past that. Just come up with what you think is fair and let us know. Trying to ask for a raid suspension when raid mobs weren't lost because of his train is unreasonable to say the least. No one is defending what happened and we weren't before trying to work with you guys.

[hatelore]

Compensation would be a raid ban, He wears your flag, Your flag deserves a ban.

2 weeks, NO PAY!

[VANVEM]

Since TMO still wont address the issue let me ask in a much easier way for you to understand.....

Does TMO condone/support/defend Unbrella's role in this event?

Before you go saying there was no 'role", watch the video again, and watch the ooc communication.

Then we get to the part where Unbrella is an officer of TMO, and why the entire guild should be sanctioned.

[derpcake]

I remember when good guilds used to sanction their members for shit like this.

I guess everyone here is desperate.

[bigsykedaddy]

Was an estimate whatever Lazie has on logs is correct.

[Nekkojakk]

God blue is a god damn joke

[Peekayyoo]

So BDA lost nothing but wants to be compensated ? Thanks.

It's not compensation. It's about deterrence. To stop TMO and other guilds from doing this is in the future. This is criminal court son.

[Man0warr]

It's not compensation. It's about deterrence. To stop TMO and other guilds from doing this is in the future. This is criminal court son.

Exactly.

[Lazie]

Exactly.

Except it wasn't a guild that did it. It was one player. Logic fails you guys.

[Clark]

Except it wasn't a guild that did it. It was one player. Logic fails you guys.

[Man0warr]

Except Unbrella was also in the zone, and obviously condoned it by his OOC chat.

Of course he lawyered up after the Fraps came out, but he was in full douche mode until that.

[Fazlazen]

B- train imo

[Jizzebel]

Old TMO filled up of morons

New TMO still filled up of morons

[Fazlazen]

Old TMO filled up of morons

New TMO still filled up of morons

This is no way to speak about your superiors.

[BurgyK]

This should have been posted on a Monday

[Skywarp]

This just gets better.

4 members of TMO and GC are clearing entrance in fear.
TMO apparently had been there for almost an hour doing a crawl.
BDA monk Reyjyn or however you spell this shit zones in and flops to
See what's happening. Chest makes the calls for a kite to start up and have Bda zone in
And truck over to north wall. Unfortunately when Chestnuts and guild zone in they
Train the people killing at portal either way. Unbrella survives the chaos with
A Mage summon and keeps the survivors up from total wipe.

So...Chest full well knowing a force was engaged at zone beforehand pretty much
Said fuck them in a nut shell from the start.

Keep it classy Chesticle.

[hatelore]

Disregard Lazie, he isn't even a full FE reject, only partial. I think he came from a smaller guild, so his experience is minimal, he just loves to try to look important. Lazie go be a good cheerleader and give some senior a bj in the back of his car~

[Sckrilla]

Old TMO filled up of morons

New TMO still filled up of morons
BDA still the whiniest bitches on the server since.... forever. GJ!

[Cookiefist]

God blue is a god damn joke

Jelly.

[Fael]

Bda has already been shown to be blatant liars.

1. GT was in zone ten minutes before they were. It was their first fear raid by the way.
2. TMo was in zone well before them.
3. They still zone in and ae the whole zone outside of the temple which everyone knows is worthless.
4. Sadly I believes it as you described: GT "rushed in" etc, both got there near same time.
5. Biggest group of hypocritical liars.



Dolic

[Fael]

Disregard Lazie, he isn't even a full FE reject, only partial. I think he came from a smaller guild, so his experience is minimal, he just loves to try to look important. Lazie go be a good cheerleader and give some senior a bj in the back of his car~

Lazies importance derives from the fact that he FTe and pulls vp dragons. What do you besides leapfrogging GTendancies first fear raid ?

Dolic

[Lazie]

Disregard Lazie, he isn't even a full FE reject, only partial. I think he came from a smaller guild, so his experience is minimal, he just loves to try to look important. Lazie go be a good cheerleader and give some senior a bj in the back of his car~

You really should type less. Every time you do it just makes you look even more ignorant.

[Splorf22]

Lazies importance derives from the fact that he FTe and pulls vp dragons

I can just see his gravestone now: Here lies Lazie, an important FTE jav spammer on the Project 1999 EverQuest Emulator. Taken from us too soon by an attack of epilepsy after 97 hours of continuous monkery, may he rest in peace.

[Lazie]

Except Unbrella was also in the zone, and obviously condoned it by his OOC chat.

Of course he lawyered up after the Fraps came out, but he was in full douche mode until that.

Being a douche doesn't mean he knew about a blatant train or condoned it. Just saying. If being a douche was against server rules BDA would be disbanded by now thanks to Chest.

[Lazie]

I can just see his gravestone now: Here lies Lazie, an important FTE jav spammer on the Project 1999 EverQuest Emulator. Taken from us too soon by an attack of epilepsy after 97 hours of continuous monkery, may he rest in peace.

You forgot to mention I would have one finger curled in a tapping position because all the cartilage had disappeared in the finger.

[Fountree]

Im just curious when Lazie will get a crown so he can join the countless other TMO vp monks in ghost heaven. Youre really not special, but keep enjoying the success others who you shit on regularly built. Just because monks and necros FD and therefore can pull vp doesnt really impres me. Gratz on choosing to roll that class lol.

[Lazie]

Im just curious when Lazie will get a crown so he can join the countless other TMO vp monks in ghost heaven. Youre really not special, but keep enjoying the success others who you shit on regularly built. Just because monks and necros FD and therefore can pull vp doesnt really impres me. Gratz on choosing to roll that class lol.

You seem bitter. Please explain how I shit on anyone. Should be an interesting read.

[Uuruk]

You seem bitter. Please explain how I shit on anyone. Should be an interesting read.

http://www.troll.me/images/bush/nice-try-you-faggot.jpg

[hatelore]

You really should type less. Every time you do it just makes you look even more ignorant.

I stay away from blue, lol that is what I do. The raid scene is so toxic thanks your piece of shit guild, I went to red, where I can at least kill douchebags like you and your guild. Blue is dead lol.

[Fael]

Just because monks and necros FD and therefore can pull vp doesnt really impres me.

Common misconception. Any class or race with sneak can pull just as effectively. Most people are either too lazy or lack the balls to do it.

Dolic

[Detoxx]

BDA looking for more handouts? Nothing new here...move along

[Gaffin 7.0]

who is this detoxx guy

[Lazie]

GM tells Chest he is being unreasonable.. Chest responds "We are too far apart on the issue to work this out". Chest is the only one trying to keep the gap that wide. We told you Chest what you want is being too unreasonable for what occurred. Now learn to be fair and reasonable like most of us learned before we left high school.

[Arteker]

I can just see his gravestone now: Here lies Lazie, an important FTE jav spammer on the Project 1999 EverQuest Emulator. Taken from us too soon by an attack of epilepsy after 97 hours of continuous monkery, may he rest in peace.

i saw you trying hard with no sccues in vp with ur monk and dying but dont worry i did to with serpiente loraen sniff sniff i guess we are just like seltious, dps munks

[arsenalpow]

GM tells Chest he is being unreasonable.. Chest responds "We are too far apart on the issue to work this out". Chest is the only one trying to keep the gap that wide. We told you Chest what you want is being too unreasonable for what occurred. Now learn to be fair and reasonable like most of us learned before we left high school.

or we've had multiple talks with Mazam and there's a fundamental difference of opinion.

[Detoxx]

BDA just trained me at Quillmane, and I demand justice!

It seems the logical solution is BDA takes 2 months off and all class R raid targets are now given to TMO during the time lapsed.

Making petition now.

[Lazie]

or we've had multiple talks with Mazam and there's a fundamental difference of opinion.

The fundamental difference is Mazam is a fair guy that doesn't hold grudges. He does what is best for others for the most part with informed decisions that are reasonable. You simply hold on to grudges and only try to get what benefits you the most. It's time to change man.

[arsenalpow]

The fundamental difference is Mazam is a fair guy that doesn't hold grudges. He does what is best for others for the most part with informed decisions that are reasonable. You simply hold on to grudges and only try to get what benefits you the most. It's time to change man.

the fundamental difference is that mazam doesn't see this as a raid dispute and he's trying to insulate his guild with as many layers of protection as possible. It was only Dinacarl, it was only Unbrella, there wasn't enough TMO to constitute a raid, etc etc

Mazam is a nice guy, but he's willing to make changes only up to the point where TMO would lose something meaningful. It WAS a raid, in a RAID zone, and my RAID got wiped the fuck out, then TMO leadership laughed it up.

[quido]

it was pretty funny though

[Detoxx]

the fundamental difference is that mazam doesn't see this as a raid dispute and he's trying to insulate his guild with as many layers of protection as possible. It was only Dinacarl, it was only Unbrella, there wasn't enough TMO to constitute a raid, etc etc

Mazam is a nice guy, but he's willing to make changes only up to the point where TMO would lose something meaningful. It WAS a raid, in a RAID zone, and my RAID got wiped the fuck out, then TMO leadership laughed it up.

You are so bitter lol. Ever think of TAKING a BREAK from EVERQUEST?

[Gaffin 7.0]

You are so bitter lol. Ever think of TAKING a BREAK from EVERQUEST?

Detoxx Blooddrunk - 60 Warlord
Zerorez Se`Tinn - 60 High Priest
Mortishin - 60 Oracle
Omnia - 60 Sorcerer

http://i58.tinypic.com/dzgx2r.jpg

[khanable]

it was pretty funny though

no matter what comes of it

I think everyone can agree that shit was pretty glorious in terms of raw training

[Lazie]

the fundamental difference is that mazam doesn't see this as a raid dispute and he's trying to insulate his guild with as many layers of protection as possible. It was only Dinacarl, it was only Unbrella, there wasn't enough TMO to constitute a raid, etc etc

Mazam is a nice guy, but he's willing to make changes only up to the point where TMO would lose something meaningful. It WAS a raid, in a RAID zone, and my RAID got wiped the fuck out, then TMO leadership laughed it up.

Oh boy here comes the semantics, rage, and wild theories. Even the GMs are not going to call what Dinacarl did on his own a raid dispute. Even if it was a raid dispute what did you guys lose that we can compensate to come to an agreement ? I mean we can AoE fear for you a couple times and let you loot the corpses if you feel you lost possible fear gear over Dinacarl's actions.

I doubt Mazam is trying to insulate himself from anything or TMO for that matter. We have a history built up since the rules changed of working out our problems in a timely manner and will continue to do so. We are trying to find a reasonable solution for what happened. You are the one that keeps raging out and coming up with theories of people's motives that are as I said wild.

Answer one simple question for me Chest. What did BDA lose that was meaningful that needs to be replaced ? You seem to think TMO as a whole needs to lose something meaningful for the actions of one player then by all means lets make it equal to what you lost. So tell us what you lost...besides your temper again.

[Detoxx]

Detoxx Blooddrunk - 60 Warlord
Zerorez Se`Tinn - 60 High Priest
Mortishin - 60 Oracle
Omnia - 60 Sorcerer

http://i58.tinypic.com/dzgx2r.jpg

I did it all without MQ2 too! Plus some chardok AoE mixed in.

Fuck a epic, yaks work fine bro

[jaybone]

BDA just trained me at Quillmane, and I demand justice!

It seems the logical solution is BDA takes 2 months off and all class R raid targets are now given to TMO during the time lapsed.

Making petition now.

got fraps fgt?

[Gaffin 7.0]

I did it all without MQ2 too!



http://i61.tinypic.com/1440651.gif

[Detoxx]

Hey gaffin are you as irrelevant on red as you were on blue?

[Gaffin 7.0]

i was raidin when your shit ass was standin in ec tunnel with noob gear *****

[Detoxx]

i was raidin when your shit ass was standin in ec tunnel with noob gear *****

And that makes you more relevant how? Youd be nothing if u werent retarded enough to post pics of you using mq2 bro, sorry to break it to ya

[Fael]

Chest and bda suffered extreme emotional trauma from the willful wanton and malicious conduct of dinacarl.
Dinacarl knew chest has a fragile emotional condition and therefore the extreme trauma suffered by chest and bda was foreseeable, not to mention their pixel bodies were ravaged and dinacarl must take his victims as they come-- mentally instable and all.

Accordingly. Dinacarl should pay 10,000 pp in compensation damages and 100,000 in punatives.

Dolic, Esq.

[Imslap]

Im just curious when Lazie will get a crown so he can join the countless other TMO vp monks in ghost heaven. Youre really not special, but keep enjoying the success others who you shit on regularly built. Just because monks and necros FD and therefore can pull vp doesnt really impres me. Gratz on choosing to roll that class lol.

I remember when Fountree posted on TMO forums after we lost an FTE saying that he wants access to someone's Monk/SK/Necro so he can pull VP because clearly everyone in the guild are incompetent trash.

I really need to find that post. I would love to post it. You were a fucking useless crybaby in TMO and are a useless crybaby outside of it.

[Gaffin 7.0]

forgot that was my only character i got banned in tmo

http://i61.tinypic.com/6zsimv.gif

[Detoxx]

I remember when Fountree posted on TMO forums after we lost an FTE saying that he wants access to someone's Monk/SK/Necro so he can pull VP because clearly everyone in the guild are incompetent trash.

I really need to find that post. I would love to post it. You were a fucking useless crybaby in TMO and are a useless crybaby outside of it.

Bro Fountree is the greatest druid to ever grace VPs sacred ground while standing at the entrance and doing...nothing. At all. Ever. Not even dispell.

[Imslap]

I remember when Fountree posted on TMO forums after we lost an FTE saying that he wants access to someone's Monk/SK/Necro so he can pull VP because clearly everyone in the guild are incompetent trash.

I really need to find that post. I would love to post it. You were a fucking useless crybaby in TMO and are a useless crybaby outside of it.

Found it.

http://i.imgur.com/ycuEwRm.png

[Fountree]

Found it.

http://i.imgur.com/ycuEwRm.png

To be honest, I still stand behind that entire thing and yes, the skill set in TMO is pretty much incompetent trash now when compared to our members a few years ago.

You're a fine example of that.

[Fountree]

Yeah detoxx, no one would have cared including me if a member didn't purposely let me die after asking for help. Stop deflecting the issue to me. The death didn't really matter to me it was a dude purposely being a dick to a guildie.

[Jarnauga]

1) TMO members regularly call for training BDA in RnF
2) TMO members does
3) TMO "but that was just ONE member, not the whole guild"
4) new RnF post about said accident riddled with calls to train BDA

[Detoxx]

You bring the issue on yourself by peering your useless face in every thread bashing the guild that rewarded an incompetent non factor with good loot for doing nothing only after selling an item you were supposed to hold for MQ to satisfy your greed some more.

Get over yourself

[Jarnauga]

Also, big LALz to Unbrella for proposing that Dinacarl pulls hate for BDA to Chest.

Chest can pull Hate/Fear/sky with his eyes closed while taking care of his corgis

[Fountree]

I don't blame you guys for getting so defensive. I'm a threatening figure both of obviously. Have you even hit 1000 raids yet Detoxx? You Imslap? Well then you really have no basis to call me out. So please stop parroting whatever Alarti and co. say to discredit me and my tenure with TMO. They're just trying to save face for the FE merger and amongst a lot of other bad decisions.

Me getting kicked for MQing that? People have done much worse in TMO lol. Keep thinking its about that and not the leadership trying to silence my voice. You are supporting a guild that looks and feels nothing like the original P99 TMO and places value only on kills and pixels and not on loyal membership. There's drama and grumbling going on in this new incarnation everyday, I hear about it, I see it and I feel it.

[Fountree]

to both of you* edit :P

[Fael]

Also, big LALz to Unbrella for proposing that Dinacarl pulls hate for BDA to Chest.

Chest can pull Hate/Fear/sky with his eyes closed while taking care of his corgis

So can every one else, Particularly when there is no competition.

[Jarnauga]

So can every one else, Particularly when there is no competition.

you should have offered them Orc belts or something

[Detoxx]

Earned: 1405.50 Spent: 36.00 Adjustment: 118.96 Current: 1488.46
Last 30 Days: 7% of raids Last 60 Days: 11% of raids Last 90 Days: 9% of raids Lifetime (07/14/11 - 05/14/14): 45% of raids

Earned: 871.00 Spent: 21.00 Adjustment: 123.50 Current: 973.50
Last 30 Days: 65% of raids Last 60 Days: 66% of raids Last 90 Days: 70% of raids Lifetime (01/31/13 - 06/04/14): 59% of raids

I see myself with nearly as much dkp as you and more tracking...with less loot. Been in the guild 3 years less than you.

Get off your soapbox.

[Detoxx]

2* years

[Ella`Ella]

Accordingly. Dinacarl should pay 10,000 pp in compensation damages and 100,000 in punatives.

Hon. Dolic

FTFY

[jaybone]

I remember when Fountree posted on TMO forums after we lost an FTE saying that he wants access to someone's Monk/SK/Necro so he can pull VP because clearly everyone in the guild are incompetent trash.

I really need to find that post. I would love to post it. You were a fucking useless crybaby in TMO and are a useless crybaby outside of it.

Least he wants to step up unlike your fat piece of shit ass.

[Gaffin 7.0]

http://i60.tinypic.com/2dky14k.gif

[Detoxx]

Least he wants to step up unlike your fat piece of shit ass.

Thats fine and dandy and all, but berating the people currently spamming fte for hours on end while you stand at the zone in bitching kind of takes away from the nobility of it all.

Who are you anyways?

[Fazlazen]

i was raidin when your shit ass was standin in ec tunnel with noob gear *****

You do realize you raided maybe a total of 20 times in your tenure on blue, right?

[Turp_SmokinPurp]

Except Unbrella was in the zone, and obviously condoned it.

he lawyered up after the Fraps came out, but he was in full douche mode until that.

If this was true Unbrella would not be responding to your "officer" or whoever the hell you had represent chest/BDA in tells (to weak to tell Himself) Shortly after the train.
If he was a douche He would of ignored or just trolled. A douche does NOT try to first figure out wtf you guys caught on fraps , than try to work it out.
Even saying What can I do to make this up to BDA? Getting nothing from the BDA rep.
Making up his own offer (even if it was weak, he still offered) An BDA's Representative come out with "uh no we are good on pullers "BUT THAT WAS A NICE OFFER THOUGH HEHEHEHE" Finally , after craving for blood , come up with some 2 month or 2 week suspension shit.
A real douche would not of even entertained your BDA rep. Not try to be reasonable EVEN when you come at him with a 2 month fear suspension or 2 week full raid LOL.
You bitches are the fucking douche bags. You guys are a joke.

An lets be honest. No one is mad here except BDA. It is just dumb to see this .
BDA , just like the GM's have stated. Could easily of came up with something more reasonable. Like ban the few people that was in TMO in fear (not during a raid mob timer) for 2 week or something like that. Going balls to the wall for a raid suspension over some AE fear trash train...
GOOD LUCK

You can clearly see BDA are giving these off the wall resolutions that no party would agree to , on hopes that GM's will take matters it into their own hands an hand out the usual 2 week raid suspension. Again,
GOOD LUCK

[Gaffin 7.0]

You do realize you raided maybe a total of 20 times in your tenure on blue, right?

on 1 char yeah ive had multiple lvl 60's

[Detoxx]

Detoxx Blooddrunk - 60 Warlord
Zerorez Se`Tinn - 60 High Priest
Mortishin - 60 Oracle
Omnia - 60 Sorcerer

http://i58.tinypic.com/dzgx2r.jpg

Calls me out for having multiple level 60's then....

on 1 char yeah ive had multiple lvl 60's

hah

[Gaffin 7.0]

never said i didnt have time but you shouldnt call out people for saying take a break when you on 24/7

[Detoxx]

Theres a difference between being on too much, and holding unbridled hate towards someone your entire existence on the server and becoming so bitter that everyone hates you except your own brainwashed cronies.

[Gaffin 7.0]

besides carry on with the usual bda vs tmo bull shit its tldr and never read it anyway who cares about scrub gaffin ya feels.

later

[Emsee]

Let's not forget who reached out first only to the retort of "fuck off" on what could have completely abolished this whole thing. The pinnacle of officer behavior.

[Ravager]

I wonder what the monk that TMO threw under the bus has to say about his actions.

[Emsee]

Dinacarl is cool as hell, but honestly nobody threw anyone anywhere. He did what he did, knowing that shit is one of the biggest no-no's in EQ and suffered the consequences.

[arsenalpow]

Let's not forget who reached out first only to the retort of "fuck off" on what could have completely abolished this whole thing. The pinnacle of officer behavior.

here's the actual conversation, get your facts straight.

[Mon Jun 02 17:58:11 2014] Unbrella says out of character, 'wtf are you doing?'
[Mon Jun 02 17:58:15 2014] Unbrella says out of character, 'chest'
[Mon Jun 02 17:58:17 2014] Unbrella says out of character, 'send me a tel'
[Mon Jun 02 17:58:52 2014] Unbrella tells you, 'yo'
[Mon Jun 02 17:59:13 2014] You told Unbrella, 'what'
[Mon Jun 02 17:59:18 2014] Unbrella tells you, 'what the fuck are you doing?'
[Mon Jun 02 17:59:20 2014] Syzzurp says out of character, 'we were here first bro... we are only after the monkies and fiends'
[Mon Jun 02 17:59:24 2014] You told Unbrella, 'what the fuck does it look like?'
[Mon Jun 02 17:59:28 2014] You say out of character, 'syzz'
[Mon Jun 02 17:59:34 2014] Unbrella tells you, 'kiting fear and shitting on our camp'
[Mon Jun 02 17:59:41 2014] Unbrella tells you, 'we're here for monkeys and fetids'
[Mon Jun 02 18:00:13 2014] You told Unbrella, 'we're here to ae the zone'
[Mon Jun 02 18:00:23 2014] Unbrella tells you, 'well we're here first'
[Mon Jun 02 18:00:25 2014] Unbrella tells you, 'so fuck off'
[Mon Jun 02 18:00:30 2014] Unbrella tells you, 'if you're going to be a snatch'
[Mon Jun 02 18:01:16 2014] Syzzurp tells you, 'really?'
[Mon Jun 02 18:01:19 2014] You told Syzzurp, 'yes'
[Mon Jun 02 18:01:24 2014] Syzzurp tells you, 'can I get the boots if they drop thats all we're after'
[Mon Jun 02 18:01:28 2014] You told Syzzurp, 'no, fuck you'
[Mon Jun 02 18:01:36 2014] Syzzurp tells you, 'we were here first'
[Mon Jun 02 18:01:56 2014] Unbrella says out of character, 'Sorry to Genocidal Tendancies, your friends in BDA are shitting on your first fear raid.'

[hatelore]

Hey Sirken, Dura, do you plan on banning TMO for there recent actions? Inquiring minds want to know. Thanks!

2 weeks would be a decent suspension, but they have def earned a month for there recent actions at VS and now Fear.

[Fazlazen]

here's the actual conversation, get your facts straight.

[Mon Jun 02 17:58:11 2014] Unbrella says out of character, 'wtf are you doing?'
[Mon Jun 02 17:58:15 2014] Unbrella says out of character, 'chest'
[Mon Jun 02 17:58:17 2014] Unbrella says out of character, 'send me a tel'
[Mon Jun 02 17:58:52 2014] Unbrella tells you, 'yo'
[Mon Jun 02 17:59:13 2014] You told Unbrella, 'what'
[Mon Jun 02 17:59:18 2014] Unbrella tells you, 'what the fuck are you doing?'
[Mon Jun 02 17:59:20 2014] Syzzurp says out of character, 'we were here first bro... we are only after the monkies and fiends'
[Mon Jun 02 17:59:24 2014] You told Unbrella, 'what the fuck does it look like?'
[Mon Jun 02 17:59:28 2014] You say out of character, 'syzz'
[Mon Jun 02 17:59:34 2014] Unbrella tells you, 'kiting fear and shitting on our camp'
[Mon Jun 02 17:59:41 2014] Unbrella tells you, 'we're here for monkeys and fetids'
[Mon Jun 02 18:00:13 2014] You told Unbrella, 'we're here to ae the zone'
[Mon Jun 02 18:00:23 2014] Unbrella tells you, 'well we're here first'
[Mon Jun 02 18:00:25 2014] Unbrella tells you, 'so fuck off'
[Mon Jun 02 18:00:30 2014] Unbrella tells you, 'if you're going to be a snatch'
[Mon Jun 02 18:01:16 2014] Syzzurp tells you, 'really?'
[Mon Jun 02 18:01:19 2014] You told Syzzurp, 'yes'
[Mon Jun 02 18:01:24 2014] Syzzurp tells you, 'can I get the boots if they drop thats all we're after'
[Mon Jun 02 18:01:28 2014] You told Syzzurp, 'no, fuck you'
[Mon Jun 02 18:01:36 2014] Syzzurp tells you, 'we were here first'
[Mon Jun 02 18:01:56 2014] Unbrella says out of character, 'Sorry to Genocidal Tendancies, your friends in BDA are shitting on your first fear raid.'

you both look like a couple of faggots. Back in the old days, this kind of insolence would have gotten you back in crushbone farming Dvinn.

[Emsee]

Was that before or after you zoned in "seconds later"?

[Detoxx]

Those logs make you look like a real innocent person in all this chest. Really....they do.....

[Ravager]

Dinacarl is cool as hell, but honestly nobody threw anyone anywhere. He did what he did, knowing that shit is one of the biggest no-no's in EQ and suffered the consequences.

I was wondering what Dinacarl had to say. Not what you had to say about my wondering.

[Emsee]

I was wondering what Dinacarl had to say. Not what you had to say about my wondering.

Too bad.

[Detoxx]

He was wondering about what you were wondering dincarl had to say about what emsee was wondering

[Ravager]

Too bad.

Why?

[VANVEM]

Answer one simple question for me Chest. What did BDA lose that was meaningful that needs to be replaced ? You seem to think TMO as a whole needs to lose something meaningful for the actions of one player then by all means lets make it equal to what you lost. So tell us what you lost...besides your temper again.

Man you have some nerve! You want Chest tocome answer "one simple question" while the whole time you have side stepped mine.

Since TMO still wont address the issue let me ask in a much easier way for you to understand.....

Does TMO condone/support/defend Unbrella's role in this event?

Before you go saying there was no 'role", watch the video again, and watch the ooc communication.

Then we get to the part where Unbrella is an officer of TMO, and why the entire guild should be sanctioned.


Now Lazie, you fucking hypocrite. lets try this again, and I can keep posting it to make sure you somehow missed in your previous readings (like that could even be possible)

Does TMO condone/support/defend Unbrella's role in this event? Yes or No

Its really not that difficult of a question, please post if you are still having difficulty in comprehension.

[Lazie]

Man you have some nerve! You want Chest tocome answer "one simple question" while the whole time you have side stepped mine.




Now Lazie, you fucking hypocrite. lets try this again, and I can keep posting it to make sure you somehow missed in your previous readings (like that could even be possible)

Does TMO condone/support/defend Unbrella's role in this event? Yes or No

Its really not that difficult of a question, please post if you are still having difficulty in comprehension.

Already answered that before. Not my fault you can't keep up with the BS you spew and the responses it gets.

[JayN]

Does TMO condone/support/defend Unbrella's role in this event? Yes or No

yes he tried to resolve this issue and was told to fuck off.

How about this do you support/condone/defend Chest your guild leaders actions or behavior ?

answer that smartass

[hatelore]

Jayn, stfu and go do meth. Ban tmo 2014~

[quido]

Chest is a great man

[hatelore]

You got that right, quido is on the side of the rightous. Pras for choosing wisely and correctly.

[JayN]

Jayn, stfu and go do meth. Ban tmo 2014~

solid answer http://www.spearboard.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=132714&d=1279897104

[quido]

Chest's mom got raped by Henry Rollins.

[Gaffin 7.0]

http://i62.tinypic.com/19r14.gif

[Frieza_Prexus]

this is why TMO should be raid banned, the intentional training is a bannable offense, and should be dealt with.

BUT the Fact that a TMO officer was present, did nothing to stop/hinder/or correct the actions of their guild member is PATHETIC!. Nothing will ever change if this is not addressed.

Unbrella got snarky, and that was the wrong thing, but that should carry no penalty or punishment. It just means he acted like an ass. If you've been paying attention, you'd notice that we have dealt with the offender. The presence of an officer is meaningless if there was no real way to prevent the train. If he knew it was going to happen or if he ordered it, that'd be one thing. Here, someone took the matter into their own hands and ran off the rails. There's nothing that Unbrella could have realistically done to foresee this.


The GM's want people to work things out on their own? FINE!

The implement a policy that makes GM intervention on punishments 10X greater if they are forced to intervene.

Then we end up in a situation where one party, with little to lose, holds the greater party hostage (see Catherin & raid discussions).

TMO is derailing the topic because they do not want to talk about the issue that Umbrella was present and if not actively participate in the planning of, then at least guilty of promoting the train after the fact.

If I say I think someone deserved something does that make me responsible for it? While it's certainly poor taste to pop off as an officer, getting lippy doesn't mean that you should retroactively be considered the cause of something.

THAT should merit sanctions on its own. if the "Top" guild on the server has LOSERS running it, then the entire guild should pay for the actions of said officer, and that goes for every guild, you want to name an officer and follow them, then pay the price.

just as in RL leaders are responsible for the actions of their subordinates, whether or not they had previous knowledge or not.

In real life, supervisors are responsible for the actions that are within the scope of the underling's duties. When Chest finally snaps and shoots a bunch of people while wearing his work uniform no one will be able to sue Burger King. Shooting people isn't something the management would put him up to nor is it something they should have foreseen. The only responsibility on Burger King is to say "Woah, yeah, he's crazy. GTFO."

That's precisely what happened here. Dinacarl went too far, and the guild has dealt with him.

I find it hilarious how willing people are to attach severe liability to situations that are clearly beyond the control of the ostensibly supervisory parties. If the guild leadership helps someone break the rules, or if they knew or should have known that something bad would happen then you can attach liability. If they refused to discipline the person then you can consider action, especially if that person screws up again after the leadership agreed to continue housing that person.

Does TMO condone/support/defend Unbrella's role in this event? Yes or No

Stop setting up a false narrative. You're framing the issue as if Unbrella has done something actionable. He got mouthy, but he still was clearly making himself available for honest attempts at resolution. Unbrella did not train BDA. There is one crime here, and it was punished to the maximum extent within TMO's power.

[Anichek]

There is one crime here, and it was punished to the maximum extent within TMO's power.

So that person was guild removed, on all characters and accounts, from TMO?

I'm not RnF'ing, I'm asking....I likely missed a post that clarified the guild's sentence on him.

[Hitpoint]

So that person was guild removed, on all characters and accounts, from TMO?

I'm not RnF'ing, I'm asking....I likely missed a post that clarified the guild's sentence on him.

It's in the raid discussion thread that Chest posted.

[Frieza_Prexus]

So that person was guild removed, on all characters and accounts, from TMO?

I'm not RnF'ing, I'm asking....I likely missed a post that clarified the guild's sentence on him.

Yes.

[Anichek]

Yes.

Found Unb's statement.

[hatelore]

Unbrella got snarky, and that was the wrong thing, but that should carry no penalty or punishment. It just means he acted like an ass. If you've been paying attention, you'd notice that we have dealt with the offender. The presence of an officer is meaningless if there was no real way to prevent the train. If he knew it was going to happen or if he ordered it, that'd be one thing. Here, someone took the matter into their own hands and ran off the rails. There's nothing that Unbrella could have realistically done to foresee this.



Then we end up in a situation where one party, with little to lose, holds the greater party hostage (see Catherin & raid discussions).



If I say I think someone deserved something does that make me responsible for it? While it's certainly poor taste to pop off as an officer, getting lippy doesn't mean that you should retroactively be considered the cause of something.



In real life, supervisors are responsible for the actions that are within the scope of the underling's duties. When Chest finally snaps and shoots a bunch of people while wearing his work uniform no one will be able to sue Burger King. Shooting people isn't something the management would put him up to nor is it something they should have foreseen. The only responsibility on Burger King is to say "Woah, yeah, he's crazy. GTFO."

That's precisely what happened here. Dinacarl went too far, and the guild has dealt with him.

I find it hilarious how willing people are to attach severe liability to situations that are clearly beyond the control of the ostensibly supervisory parties. If the guild leadership helps someone break the rules, or if they knew or should have known that something bad would happen then you can attach liability. If they refused to discipline the person then you can consider action, especially if that person screws up again after the leadership agreed to continue housing that person.



Stop setting up a false narrative. You're framing the issue as if Unbrella has done something actionable. He got mouthy, but he still was clearly making himself available for honest attempts at resolution. Unbrella did not train BDA. There is one crime here, and it was punished to the maximum extent within TMO's power.

Go play lawyer irl, this is rnf. Your guild member trained an entire raid. Your guild deserves a ban for that. Are you saying guilds have not been banned in the past from a member of said guild training? Companies are held responsible for the actions of there employees all of the time also, I call bullshit on your made up burger king analogy.

You can attempt to rule lawyer this all you wish, but the video does not lie. Your guild should be held responsible for the actions of YOUR guild's members. That is all. Court ajourned.

[hatelore]

And you find it hilarous that your guild cannot control its members? Yeah me too, But I bet by banning your guild for a few weeks, your guilds unruly members would fall right in line.

[Ravager]

Had there not been such damning fraps, Dinacarl would still be in TMO and every one of you would be defending his actions calling it a "pull" like he tried to claim before everyone knew how good the fraps was.

http://i.imgur.com/bEvDb28.jpg

[Gaffin 7.0]

http://i61.tinypic.com/311udlj.gif

[Frieza_Prexus]

Your guild should be held responsible for the actions of YOUR guild's members. That is all. Court ajourned.

The guild should be held responsible to the extent that it failed in its duties. One person running off and being an asshole when there was no prior indication that they would do so doesn't put the responsibility on the guild. Certainly, there's associative issues which is why he was removed.

It would be laughably easy to make a new account, use a different computer & connection, and level up something to the low 50's join any number of guilds and train people. Frankly, I'm surprised that level of P99 terrorism hasn't happened already.

And you find it hilarous that your guild cannot control its members? Yeah me too, But I bet by banning your guild for a few weeks, your guilds unruly members would fall right in line.

Shutting down the server would also stop all the trains. Stop the feigned outrage and hyperbole.

Companies are held responsible for the actions of there employees all of the time also, I call bullshit on your made up burger king analogy.

When the company has a responsibility to prevent such behavior, yes. It's called Respondeat Superior. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Respondeat_superior) I suggest you read more closely. The concept might seem less stupid if you actually understood it.

Had there not been such damning fraps, Dinacarl would still be in TMO and every one of you would be defending his actions calling it a "pull" like he tried to claim before everyone knew how good the fraps was.

He likely would have been off the hook. People get away for crimes all the time for a lack of evidence. It doesn't make it right, but that's the reality of the situation. Personally, I'm glad there's a FRAPS. It means that we can actually demand accountability for the actions of our members. That's about all any guild can do in a situation like this.

[Lazie]

I mean we could all adopt a misguided Messiah Complex like Chest based on blind hatred of a tag. We could all go around spewing vitriolic comments and antagonizing innocent bystanders with our actions because we can't get over that hatred that has no basis in the present.

No one is defending what the fraps showed. Most are trying to find a resolution to it that is reasonable and fair. However, the one person who keeps pounding a false horn of dissent in multiple settings and stopping positive progress is Chest. In this situation alone he first caused disruption in Fear. When a player reacted poorly to that and did something wrong. He pounds that false horn louder to stall progress further. Hopefully he eventually sees he is the one that truly stops a lot of progress and change from happening. That or the other officers in BDA see just how poorly he represents their guild.