Is Lull not classic?

[Selene]

I heard that Lull is not classic (not enough critical resists) and may be nerfed on P99. I currently play a pally and lull is such a huge part of my dungeon crawling life. I imagine it would affect enchanters and clerics big time too. I do remember lull on original EQ being way less reliable, but then again I had no idea what I was doing back then and might’ve tried to lull even and yellow cons too much.

Anyone know if lull will be nerfed? Might focus more on another class instead of investing so much into my pally then

[Snaggles]

Lull is just one of many tricks. Even if they nerf it to death it will still be useful with a bit of planning. Or just grind in places you don’t need to take any risks (solo pulls or easy resets).

I put my 230CHA set in the bank due to never getting used. In a couple hours pulling seb in ABC at level 60, I had only a few crit resists. Of which, DA and a little group work sorted out the 3+5 frogs easily.

[Goregasmic]

Here for more info:

https://project1999.com/forums/showt...=328802&page=5

TL;DR lulls should have unique resist modifiers that are not yet implemented but should come eventually. This will make things more difficult 50+

My personal theory is people in classic remember failing lull a lot because they were trying to lull ~even cons with starter charisma. My research also found that people barely cared about charisma back then. My naked brand new ench on p99 in 2024 was getting like 25% crit lull fails on steamfont kobolds which tracks but if they're saying they found a resist layer they haven't put in we'll see.

What sucks is chanters and necros have ways around this (reverse charming or resetting fights) but pallies/clerics/bards, not so much.

[sajbert]

Who knows if it'll ever be implemented or not. There is no roadmap, little to no communication and developments are sporadic if not scarce

That's precisely why I understand your fear. It's a big commitment leveling up a character and, to me at least, the dull toolkit is what makes the Paladin interesting.

Given this possible upcoming change and not knowing what it may result in, I'd rather level an SK over a Paladin.

[spoil]

Originally Posted by Goregasmic [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

My personal theory is people in classic remember failing lull a lot because they were trying to lull ~even cons with starter charisma. My research also found that people barely cared about charisma back then. My naked brand new ench on p99 in 2024 was getting like 25% crit lull fails on steamfont kobolds which tracks but if they're saying they found a resist layer they haven't put in we'll see.

Yeah, lull already seems to work as they've described. Character level vs. mob level makes a massive difference. On a 60 enchanter the difference between lulling a high-40s and a low-50s mob is like night and day.

I think most people are reminiscing about the difficulty they had trying to split near even cons in exp groups on their dwarf pally, not a CHA-capped level 60.

[Goregasmic]

Originally Posted by spoil [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yeah, lull already seems to work as they've described. Character level vs. mob level makes a massive difference. On a 60 enchanter the difference between lulling a high-40s and a low-50s mob is like night and day.

I think most people are reminiscing about the difficulty they had trying to split near even cons in exp groups on their dwarf pally, not a CHA-capped level 60.

Yeah, no shit lull hardly fails in places like HS basement or KC, by the time you reach that point you're late 50s killing 42-46 mobs on the verge of greening out. They also don't resist anything else either (nukes, charm, root).Try lulling krups+ and it is a resist fest. I remember doing froglok king in Lguk at 56 and I could pull him with crit fail lull reliably without stripping down. I've also done the naked disco corpse run a couple times and it was nerve wracking because lull clearly didn't work as well with 165ish cha. Made me strongly consider banking a CR cha set.

But like I said, in the other thread I researched staple enchanter items on allakhazam and looked at the pre 2002 comments and it is pretty clear people have a vague idea that ench needs cha but they don't know how much and why. If you don't know lull heavily leans on cha and level difference, you're going to have a bad time.

[Zuranthium]

Originally Posted by Goregasmic [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

My personal theory is people in classic remember failing lull a lot because they were trying to lull ~even cons with starter charisma.

We have the coding data for how Lull worked in classic. It was inconsistent at best and got relatively worse as you went up in level, regardless of Charisma. We also have in-era parses from players who had very high Charisma and were casting on much lower level MOBs.

Everquest emulators and TLP's have been far removed from Classic EQ the whole time, and this subject has been one of the biggest tells of who actually played Classic EQ and who didn't. Or at least who was paying attention back then.

One of my funniest memories from classic was my friend's sister storming out of her room, semi-raging about how her Enchanter couldn't lull a camp of things that were nearly green con, while a Ranger 10 levels below her had no problem lulling those things with harmony.

[PatChapp]

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

We have the coding data for how Lull worked in classic. It was inconsistent at best and got relatively worse as you went up in level, regardless of Charisma. We also have in-era parses from players who had very high Charisma and were casting on much lower level MOBs.

Everquest emulators and TLP's have been far removed from Classic EQ the whole time, and this subject has been one of the biggest tells of who actually played Classic EQ and who didn't. Or at least who was paying attention back then.

One of my funniest memories from classic was my friend's sister storming out of her room, semi-raging about how her Enchanter couldn't lull a camp of things that were nearly green con, while a Ranger 10 levels below her had no problem lulling those things with harmony.

Can you post those parses? Very curious just how different it is here,never played a lull class in classic.
I leveled a sk to 49 prekunark and didn't know about any exp penalty,i thought my friends were just playing more than me since they leveled a lot faster.

[Endorra]

Nowadays I only play enchanter for the lulls.

[Duik]

Had a static 6 person with a chanter who never charmed. He prioritized cha for CC only visited the chanter forums a lil bit to get a good idea for stat/equipment selection.

From just before Kunark dropping but we werent powerlevelers more adventurers/reliving the D and D of our youth. We lived in guk karnors and kaesora (eventually) hole and kedge.
Peeps did know early on that cha made lulls better, we were not uber guilded or leet players.
I remember being unsure if cha made a difference in mez/memblur success.