Play Nice Policy/LNS/RvR needs overhaul before Velious

[Guido]

ah didn't see the two equal forces part

but the alliance combined is an equal force

so what you're really trying to say is merge lol - to have 2 same sized guilds

is that right or am I missing something here lol - with 2 equal sized guilds - this idea of sub 55 removal of pvp is possible?

[krazyGlue]

Originally Posted by Guido [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

ah didn't see the two equal forces part

but the alliance combined is an equal force

so what you're really trying to say is merge lol - to have 2 same sized guilds

is that right or am I missing something here lol

Voted no

[Guido]

but now we run into the same problem we witnessed this passed sunday

these two giant forces aren't capable of fighting over a mob boss at this current state of the server

any plans to upgrade the server so massive fights are still possible?

[Littlegyno 13.0]

Originally Posted by Guide.Chroma [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You uh....you might want to read the post where I disagree with you again.

i like dis dood.

[Guide.Chroma]

Originally Posted by Guido [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

ah didn't see the two equal forces part

but the alliance combined is an equal force

so what you're really trying to say is merge lol - to have 2 same sized guilds

is that right or am I missing something here lol - with 2 equal sized guilds - this idea of sub 55 removal of pvp is possible?

Size isn't the entire problem. Gear, the types of members, and expertise in general aren't equal between the two. It'd be like throwing class R guilds into C, sure they might seem prepared to kill the targets, but there's a whole other layer of (petitionquest) skills that they haven't needed, nor want to face.

IF(and note that's a big if) such a level system were to be set in place I would say level 60 (because I believe that the level 60 range is only other 60's?) and large scale engagements would be outside LNS. It still doesn't really sit well with me, since sanctioned corpse camping is likely to create more tears than LNS does.

For Red, I think LNS is necessary even as a necessary evil. I think FFA in general is a flawed system, but that's an entirely different issue. I'll keep the level limit idea in mind as I watch and learn more about Red, but right now I really don't think it would end well.

[Zalaerian]

Originally Posted by Guido [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I totally agree with you chroma

I think it sounds great and pras to ksah for the idea

but what lvl should it limit, say once you ding 55+ pnp no longer applies - but then how does everyone know these said levels

a code might need to be put in or something - not sure the best way

Not everyone wants "hard mode" pvp and would rather the casual pvp. By joining a guild instead, you are voluntarily waving pnp

[Guide.Chroma]

Originally Posted by Guido [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

but now we run into the same problem we witnessed this passed sunday

these two giant forces aren't capable of fighting over a mob boss at this current state of the server

any plans to upgrade the server so massive fights are still possible?

I'm almost certain now that was caused by you nerds zoning in and out en masse. Fight 100 v 100 in open field if you want a good fight. If it happens again in that situation, then the priority gets a lot higher.

[FaithlessKR]

Originally Posted by Guide.Chroma [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm almost certain now that was caused by you nerds zoning in and out en masse. Fight 100 v 100 in open field if you want a good fight. If it happens again in that situation, then the priority gets a lot higher.

The same desyncing that happened in kc is the same kind of desyncing when someone is training the entire fear zone and runs it too close to the raid. Whether or not people are zoning in is not the issue, the zone just couldn't handle that many people in that small of an area.

[Buhbuh]

Originally Posted by Guide.Chroma [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The lockout affects any zones in which large fighting/deaths occurred. "In large scale PvP there is no limit to the number of zones a force can be locked out of. If a fight took place across multiple zones the lockout will apply to all zones a PvP related death occurred in."

I'm not saying LNS is perfect, and if R99 was just being started I would advocate against it, mostly for the community building reasons above. However, since it's been a part of the creation of the culture of R99, taking it away would decimate the population and general enjoyment. Twinks who are "the slayers of virgins" are celebrated in the larger circles of R99.

I don't think straight removal of LNS is the answer, but there are definitely changes that could be made. It's supposed to be a tradeoff for the scooter, caused by the lockout. Perhaps one possibility is increasing the duration, or allowing the victor to name the zone (likely more important for guild vs guild engagements)?

I think it's ideal to have meaningful PvP, without punishing people that aren't twinked beyond reason in the lower levels. I wouldn't expect the red community to step up to bat for that.

In guild v. guild setting it needs to be more stringent on the loser of a PvP engagement. There's no risk right now. I want to feel like I'm totally screwed if I lose a massive fight, at least for a couple of hours.

The loophole to losing over contention of a mob is mass plugging, calling Force LNS, unplugging and porting out immediately to snipe other mobs. That's literally the culture we've built with the current PnP. There are no fights that force guilds to commit fully once engaged in a fight. The best fights in the game have been in VP because there's no way out.

You don't need to abolish PnP at the raid level, you just need a timeframe on when guilds can actually zone in and LNS once they've called it in mass PvP. That's the purpose of locking a guild out of a zone from getting their corpses for a set amount of time once Force LnS is called. There's plenty of options with that - like only being able to LNS once the victorious guild has left the zone, or only being able to LNS after two hours have elapsed since the LNS was called (or less time than that). Being allowed into a raid zone to clean up corpses once slain and then walk away virtually unscathed is really kind of stupid.

If you're contending over raid mobs, you're no longer a newbie on Red. You should expect some form of risk coming at other guilds, no?

[Guido]

Originally Posted by FaithlessKR [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The same desyncing that happened in kc is the same kind of desyncing when someone is training the entire fear zone and runs it too close to the raid. Whether or not people are zoning in is not the issue, the zone just couldn't handle that many people in that small of an area.

ya I seriously believe we would see the de-sync again with those numbers

an upgrade in server I think is necessary and should be looked into asap.

velious dragons are a lot harder than kunark ones - so more bodies will be needed in essence - more bodies more desyncing of gameplay