How to add a teams element without coding teams

[Scribbles]

Originally Posted by Scribbles [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

hohoho civic pride

[Aenor]

Originally Posted by Aenor [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Idiots who are going to flame...

[Secrets]

Ok, if you want constructive feedback from someone who worked on the emu and p1999 code instead of me laughing off the idea, here's the issue:

It would be more work to code this idea than to code in any other ideas, sans the one Rogean presented. Here's why:

1) NPC to change team needs to be scripted. It's not like we can just do if(NPCHailed) { Gievteam } and expect results.

2) The attack rules are strikingly similar to EQEmulator's implementation. This means that if you want to code in a PVP rule, you'll need to implement basic math and already existing functions to enable certain things. Now, that's just for level range PvP.

What you are doing is funneling everyone into the same guild (guilds are terribly handled in eqemu, and were on p1999 for the longest time, which makes it require an incredible amount of cpu to not be slow with that many people in the same guild), making sure no one can form communities within those guilds (If we wanted to support that, we'd have to code "sub-guilds", and that would add to the development time), and lastly requiring a lot of reading for people to do before they get onto the server, or else they'll get roflstomped by a city guild or a player guild.

Believe it or not, having everyone figure things out can turn people off from the game. That wasn't the case in classic, but at least classic had an instruction manual and a prima guide.

3) Everyone goes to the same guild. Guild becomes unbalanced and dominates the server as an unorganized zerg. This happened in, I don't know, DAOC, WAR, EQ2, etc, you name the game's PVP system it happened. Which one will it be? I don't know what one it will be, but people will flock to one and stay in it. People do not like to be forced into being outnumbered, and not only that, but if everyone is in the same guild you might as well call it a blue server.

4) History has told us that this is done before and it does not work. Look at K&B, I thought that server was a great idea, and that it could go far. It was ultimately ended by what we talked about in #3.

5) More targets? No, you'll limit your choices by not having a FFA/Team-FFA system. That guy that is training you? Yeah, forget about PKing him, he's gonna grief you to oblivion. Say hello to GM-enforced rules, and goodbye to meaningful PVP.

6) Project 1999 already has a lot of the needed code in place to make this work, although it is geared for PVE, it can be made for PVP as well. Don't worry about p1999 not being able to code *anything*, they are more than capable of doing it, and time is not an issue at all.

Conclusion: It's a bad idea.

[Aenor]

This is much preferred. If my ideas suck, tell me WHY they suck. I'm sure Rogean and co, if they were so motivated, could find a streamlined solution to make this happen. But if they've settled on dynamic FFA, I'm perfectly happy with that. Just thought I would try to throw a bone to the teams fanatics out there.

However, I'm not one of the Sullon kiddies who's like "SZ was the greatest ruleset ever, never mind the fact that only a tiny fraction of the PvP player base ever bothered with it and it flamed out faster than any other server... if you don't make Red99 with hardcoded teams it will fail within a month..."

[Humerox]

Originally Posted by Secrets [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Project 1999 already has a lot of the needed code in place to make this work, although it is geared for PVE, it can be made for PVP as well. Don't worry about p1999 not being able to code *anything*, they are more than capable of doing it, and time is not an issue at all.

Conclusion: It's a bad idea.

It's only my opinion, but people flocked to a particular team because it had a distinct advantage from the start.

The biggest drawback to any FFA is psychological. There's no real "purpose" beyond normal EQ gameplay to bring people together. So there's no hook...no reason for blues to play, because they're not interested in PvP as a singular motive.

I don't know what a good solution would be. If coding and time isn't an issue, then the rest is creative process.

EQ had 4 PvP servers, 3 of which were team based: Sullon Zek, Tallon Zek, and Vallon Zek. Combined the populations of the team based servers far, far exceeded the 4th server (Rallos Zek). There was a reason for that...FFA is essentially pointless PvP, and that doesn't draw the blues.

[Yukahwa]

I think a teams element is a bad deal. The game wasn't designed for a team system and so the class / race and good/evil structure just doesn't work that nicely.

I think the natural system of "mean griefers" versus "I want to level up right now" creates a more interesting dynamic and does not create communities that are simply too small to survive. Especially on a server that will likely have a small population compared to what was seen on live.

PVP is something an individual chooses. Elves kill elves sometimes.

[lethdar]

Theres no need for teams. I'm sure there will be random newbie guilds inviting whoever can have just for the numbers on the first day. Aside from that, many of the people from p99 or vztz will already know people who will be playing and can join up with them.

[Humerox]

You guys are missing my point, lol. It'll ultimately just end up being the same 60-100 it always is, especially with the P99 experience rate.

Red99 is in the unique position of drawing a lot more, but compromise and creativity is required.

I'll play no matter what happens...I played the other failboxes too. I just want sh**loads of targets, and a fun experience. Not the same old humdrum BS. Can't do that without drawing in the carebears.