My America

[Daywolf]

Originally Posted by ShadowWulf [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm posting from my phone so ill be very brief. I find it fascinating how ones definition is singularly focused on one issue, yet some would define liberty as persuing happiness and success, with or without a weapon, yet not hinge their definition on the ability or carry a full auto assault rifle since outside all but the most utterly extreme of circumstances such a weapon acts as a method of life and liberty denier to another.

I'm not sure how that applies. I don't have the time to write up every application of liberty. I even wrote more than you did... one along the same lines to what you were replying to (my post about gun rights etc), and another in general terms.

As for liberty and happiness, they have different meanings. I assume you are referring to "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness". Happiness is not guaranteed, can't leave out the pursuit part. If all the same word, they would have just used one. "Success" is not a part of the founding documents. What happiness is is self-determined, or should be.

Weapons do not act as anything, people do. I'm all for open concealment, it gives the "people do" second thoughts about violating someones rights or life. But first goes liberty and then goes rights, lastly you have a government trying to take care of you of which it is incapable of doing but only harming you if anything. I live near the southern border, so full-auto would be fine by me; maybe not needed today but shit happens eventually. I should have access to that if I wish, it's a constitutional right but with no liberty any longer. Yet someone in LA can get one illegally, but law abiding citizens cant. It's cockeyed.

[Daywolf]

Originally Posted by Taxi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

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Garment workers protests in Bengladesh this week

Government should fear the people. It's when they don't this becomes the norm at some point. It also works for people fearing the people, as who really sets out to potentially get killed for little to nothing? The greater the risk, the less of it happening. Sort of like MAD, blowing up the world is probably not the best course of action etc. The hidden danger is even more of a deterrent, because you don't know who is packing heat, find oneself outgunned by 20 random people lol

And even in the case of riot police, one would expect them to then behave. But too the protesters would possibly behave in the first place as non-protesters can settle matters as well, if need be. Even in California, it only went so far with the LA riots, as most of us had our scanners on and fresh ammo just in case it spilled over. But they wound up burning their own neighborhoods down... heh then wondering why business decided to not come back. LA just sucks, let it burn.

[Excision Rottun]

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[Shannacore]

Hahahah

[2pair]

Originally Posted by Taxi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

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US vetoes on UN resolutions:

1972-2002 Vetoes from the USA
---
Year -----Resolution Vetoed by the USA
1972 Condemns Israel for killing hundreds of people in Syria and Lebanon in air raids.
1973 Afirms the rights of the Palestinians and calls on Israel to withdraw from the occupied territories.
1976 Condemns Israel for attacking Lebanese civilians.
1976 Condemns Israel for building settlements in the occupied territories.
1976 Calls for self determination for the Palestinians.
1976 Afirms the rights of the Palestinians.
1978 Urges the permanent members (USA, USSR, UK, France, China) to insure United Nations decisions on the maintenance of international peace and security.
1978 Criticises the living conditions of the Palestinians.
1978 Condemns the Israeli human rights record in occupied territories.
1978 Calls for developed countries to increase the quantity and quality of development assistance to underdeveloped countries.
1979 Calls for an end to all military and nuclear collaboration with the apartheid South Africa.
1979 Strengthens the arms embargo against South Africa.
1979 Offers assistance to all the oppressed people of South Africa and their liberation movement.
1979 Concerns negotiations on disarmament and cessation of the nuclear arms race.
1979 Calls for the return of all inhabitants expelled by Israel.
1979 Demands that Israel desist from human rights violations.
1979 Requests a report on the living conditions of Palestinians in occupied Arab countries.
1979 Offers assistance to the Palestinian people.
1979 Discusses sovereignty over national resources in occupied Arab territories.
1979 Calls for protection of developing counties' exports.
1979 Calls for alternative approaches within the United Nations system for improving the enjoyment of human rights and fundamental freedoms.
1979 Opposes support for intervention in the internal or external affairs of states.
1979 For a United Nations Conference on Women.
1979 To include Palestinian women in the United Nations Conference on Women.
1979 Safeguards rights of developing countries in multinational trade negotiations.
1980 Requests Israel to return displaced persons.
1980 Condemns Israeli policy regarding the living conditions of the Palestinian people.
1980 Condemns Israeli human rights practices in occupied territories. 3 resolutions.
1980 Afirms the right of self determination for the Palestinians.
1980 Offers assistance to the oppressed people of South Africa and their national liberation movement.
1980 Attempts to establish a New International Economic Order to promote the growth of underdeveloped countries and international economic co-operation.
1980 Endorses the Program of Action for Second Half of United Nations Decade for Women.
1980 Declaration of non-use of nuclear weapons against non-nuclear states.
1980 Emphasises that the development of nations and individuals is a human right.
1980 Calls for the cessation of all nuclear test explosions.
1980 Calls for the implementation of the Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples.
1981 Promotes co-operative movements in developing countries.
1981 Affirms the right of every state to choose its economic and social system in accord with the will of its people, without outside interference in whatever form it takes.
1981 Condemns activities of foreign economic interests in colonial territories.
1981 Calls for the cessation of all test explosions of nuclear weapons.
1981 Calls for action in support of measures to prevent nuclear war, curb the arms race and promote disarmament.
1981 Urges negotiations on prohibition of chemical and biological weapons.
1981 Declares that education, work, health care, proper nourishment, national development, etc are human rights.
1981 Condemns South Africa for attacks on neighbouring states, condemns apartheid and attempts to strengthen sanctions. 7 resolutions.
1981 Condemns an attempted coup by South Africa on the Seychelles.
1981 Condemns Israel's treatment of the Palestinians, human rights policies, and the bombing of Iraq. 18 resolutions.
1982 Condemns the Israeli invasion of Lebanon. 6 resolutions (1982 to 1983).
1982 Condemns the shooting of 11 Muslims at a shrine in Jerusalem by an Israeli soldier.
1982 Calls on Israel to withdraw from the Golan Heights occupied in 1967.
1982 Condemns apartheid and calls for the cessation of economic aid to South Africa. 4 resolutions.
1982 Calls for the setting up of a World Charter for the protection of the ecology.
1982 Sets up a United Nations conference on succession of states in respect to state property, archives and debts.
1982 Nuclear test bans and negotiations and nuclear free outer space. 3 resolutions.
1982 Supports a new world information and communications order.
1982 Prohibition of chemical and bacteriological weapons.
1982 Development of international law.
1982 Protects against products harmful to health and the environment .
1982 Declares that education, work, health care, proper nourishment, national development are human rights.
1982 Protects against products harmful to health and the environment.
1982 Development of the energy resources of developing countries.
1983 Resolutions about apartheid, nuclear arms, economics, and international law. 15 resolutions.
1984 Condemns support of South Africa in its Namibian and other policies.
1984 International action to eliminate apartheid.
1984 Condemns Israel for occupying and attacking southern Lebanon.
1984 Resolutions about apartheid, nuclear arms, economics, and international law. 18 resolutions.
1985 Condemns Israel for occupying and attacking southern Lebanon.
1985 Condemns Israel for using excessive force in the occupied territories.
1985 Resolutions about cooperation, human rights, trade and development. 3 resolutions.
1985 Measures to be taken against Nazi, Fascist and neo-Fascist activities .
1986 Calls on all governments (including the USA) to observe international law.
1986 Imposes economic and military sanctions against South Africa.
1986 Condemns Israel for its actions against Lebanese civilians.
1986 Calls on Israel to respect Muslim holy places.
1986 Condemns Israel for sky-jacking a Libyan airliner.
1986 Resolutions about cooperation, security, human rights, trade, media bias, the environment and development.
8 resolutions.
1987 Calls on Israel to abide by the Geneva Conventions in its treatment of the Palestinians.
1987 Calls on Israel to stop deporting Palestinians.
1987 Condemns Israel for its actions in Lebanon. 2 resolutions.
1987 Calls on Israel to withdraw its forces from Lebanon.
1987 Cooperation between the United Nations and the League of Arab States.
1987 Calls for compliance in the International Court of Justice concerning military and paramilitary activities against Nicaragua and a call to end the trade embargo against Nicaragua. 2 resolutions.
1987 Measures to prevent international terrorism, study the underlying political and economic causes of terrorism, convene a conference to define terrorism and to differentiate it from the struggle of people from national liberation.
1987 Resolutions concerning journalism, international debt and trade. 3 resolutions.
1987 Opposition to the build up of weapons in space.
1987 Opposition to the development of new weapons of mass destruction.
1987 Opposition to nuclear testing. 2 resolutions.
1987 Proposal to set up South Atlantic "Zone of Peace".
1988 Condemns Israeli practices against Palestinians in the occupied territories. 5 resolutions (1988 and 1989).
1989 Condemns USA invasion of Panama.
1989 Condemns USA troops for ransacking the residence of the Nicaraguan ambassador in Panama.
1989 Condemns USA support for the Contra army in Nicaragua.
1989 Condemns illegal USA embargo of Nicaragua.
1989 Opposing the acquisition of territory by force.
1989 Calling for a resolution to the Arab-Israeli conflict based on earlier UN resoltions.
1990 To send three UN Security Council observers to the occupied territories.
1995 Afirms that land in East Jerusalem annexed by Israel is occupied territory.
1997 Calls on Israel to cease building settlements in East Jerusalem and other occupied territories. 2 resolutions.
1999 Calls on the USA to end its trade embargo on Cuba. 8 resolutions (1992 to 1999).
2001 To send unarmed monitors to the West Bank and the Gaza Strip.
2001 To set up the International Criminal Court.
2002 To renew the peace keeping mission in Bosnia.

2010 To tell the rest of the world to not fuck itself because America isn't the greatest country in the world.


Oh yeah, and you are aware the onion is a fake newspaper that reports fake news--- right?

[Vanech]

I only managed to read through four or five pages of posts before I gave up and decided to reply.

I am American born. 3rd generation American on my father's side, and 2nd generation American on my mothers side.

All of my immediate (not dead, male) family has served in the military for the U.S. of A.

My Grandfather and Uncle were in the Navy (grandfather was a Sea-Bee) father was army, my other uncle was Air force.

I have the utmost respect for my country and the men and women who have sworn their lives to protect our way of life... (the standing military.)

..but I absolutely $!@#$&# hate our government.

America is not a Democracy, it is a Capitalist Dictatorship. We have the false idea of choice thrown in our face every election year, but we're only ever voting for two sides of the same freakin' coin.

I could go on and on and on about this for days, but the majority of what I have to say isn't 'precisely related' to the thread so I'll leave it at this -

Fuck us. The world is better off without us meddling in every little #$@ @#$@ed thing. If anything we should be reduced to a second or third world country just so we are forced to stop sticking our fingers into the collective pie, thus ruining it for everyone else.

[Nedala]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWiBt-pqp0E

America should listen to this man he speaks the truth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Excision Rottun]

Originally Posted by Vanech [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I only managed to read through four or five pages of posts before I gave up and decided to reply.

I am American born. 3rd generation American on my father's side, and 2nd generation American on my mothers side.

All of my immediate (not dead, male) family has served in the military for the U.S. of A.

My Grandfather and Uncle were in the Navy (grandfather was a Sea-Bee) father was army, my other uncle was Air force.

I have the utmost respect for my country and the men and women who have sworn their lives to protect our way of life... (the standing military.)

..but I absolutely $!@#$&# hate our government.

America is not a Democracy, it is a Capitalist Dictatorship. We have the false idea of choice thrown in our face every election year, but we're only ever voting for two sides of the same freakin' coin.

I could go on and on and on about this for days, but the majority of what I have to say isn't 'precisely related' to the thread so I'll leave it at this -

Fuck us. The world is better off without us meddling in every little #$@ @#$@ed thing. If anything we should be reduced to a second or third world country just so we are forced to stop sticking our fingers into the collective pie, thus ruining it for everyone else.

Sir, I like the cut of your jib.

[blizzil]

As a Proud, Long Term, Liberal Activist, I will continue to do as I've always done.


I will continue to OPPOSE:
*Increasing the Power and Wealth of For Profit Corporations.

*Increasing Military Spending (Decrease by 50% immediately)

*Continuing the phony WAR in the Middle East (Out Now)

*A Free Pass for War Criminals and Torturers

*The Privatization of our Common Wealth and Common Responsibilities, including Social Programs

*The use of the "Secrecy" classification to avoid civilian oversight


I will continue to SUPPORT:
*Medicare for anyone who wants it

*The immediate break-up (Trust Busting) of everything "Too Big to Fail".

*Fair Competition Legislation that lets Mom&Pop (small locally owned businesses and farms) compete with Big Box and Factory Farms on a level playing field.

*An end to "Free Trade" (Race to the Bottom)

*Organized LABOR and local co-ops.

*An end to the two-tiered Judicial System

*Prosecution of rich American War Criminals and War Profiteers. (Oh yes they did!)

*An END to "Corporate Personhood"

*Strictly Enforced Publicly Financed Elections (severe penalties for criminals)

*Transparent and Verifiable elections (Why isn't this a front burner issue with the Democratic Party?)

*Re-Regulation with strict oversight of Banking/Investment, Transportation, Communications, Trade, Energy, Utilities, and Insurance.

*NO Public Money for private Prisons, armed Private Police, armed Defense Contractors, private intelligence agencies, or For Profit Health Insurance Corporations.

*Immediate Civil Rights and Equal Protection for ALL. (No Exceptions)

*Free Quality Universal Education to everyone who wants it.

*Strong Social Safety Net and Consumer Protections.

*An end to The Patriot Act and a return to The Constitution.(especially Habeas and privacy protections)

*A refutation of the "Unitary Executive", and legislation to ensure it NEVER happens again.

*An END to Republican/Corporate influence INSIDE The Democratic Party !
(NO! They DON"T deserve a seat at the table!)

These are values I strongly believe in. I have fought for these values long before I ever heard the name "Obama", "triangulation", or "Centrist" Democrats. I will keep fighting for these values no matter who is in the White House.

It is an "Issues" thing, not a matter of Political Personalities.
When politicians move toward the above, I will support them.
When they move away, I will oppose them.

I have been deeply disappointed over the last year as the White House has made concession after concession to Republicans, but when the Progressive Democrats held out for the Public Option, or opposed increased WAR funding, or offered up a Pro-LABOR challenger to an entrenched Anti-LABOR Senator, The White House sent the Winged Monkeys after them....Chicago Style.
I have seen no such effort to bend Centrist" Democrats or Republicans to his will during the first 1 -1/2 years of the "CHANGE" administration.

I don't expect to get everything, but I DO expect respect for these values, and a voice in the Party that is asking for my money and support.
If a Political Party does not at least acknowledge these values and give them a seat at the table,
I will find another Party that will.
If these values are no longer welcome in the d party, so be it.
If Standing Up for these issues and pointing out when the Democratic Party falls short is seen as an attack on the President...so be it.

"We have come to a clear realization of the fact that true individual freedom cannot exist without economic security and independence. “Necessitous men are not free men.” People who are hungry and out of a job are the stuff of which dictatorships are made.

In our day these economic truths have become accepted as self-evident. We have accepted, so to speak, a second Bill of Rights under which a new basis of security and prosperity can be established for all—regardless of station, race, or creed.

Among these are:

*The right to a useful and remunerative job in the industries or shops or farms or mines of the nation;

*The right to earn enough to provide adequate food and clothing and recreation;

*The right of every farmer to raise and sell his products at a return which will give him and his family a decent living;

*The right of every businessman, large and small, to trade in an atmosphere of freedom from unfair competition and domination by monopolies at home or abroad;

*The right of every family to a decent home;

*The right to adequate medical care and the opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health;

*The right to adequate protection from the economic fears of old age, sickness, accident, and unemployment;

*The right to a good education.

All of these rights spell security. And after this war is won we must be prepared to move forward, in the implementation of these rights, to new goals of human happiness and well-being.

For unless there is security here at home there cannot be lasting peace in the world.--FDR

FDR's Economic Bill of Rights

THIS is the Democratic Party I joined
THIS is the Democratic Party I love.

I find that my FDR/LBJ Democratic values are increasingly unwelcome in the Democratic Party, and has been construed as "not supporting the President" by some.
I disagree.
The very best thing I can do to support the Democratic Party and President Obama is to point out where the Party and our Leadership have drifted away from these values, and to call out for a return to the Working Class values that the Democratic Party once embraced.


The govt is what we make it. If you dont like it, vote and change it.


"If we don't fight hard enough for the things we stand for,
at some point we have to recognize that we don't really stand for them."
--- Paul Wellstone

[Qaedain]

I promised myself that I wouldn't get involved in this thread, but I was wondering if you could elaborate on these topics? I have no opinion, really, just wondering how you might go about it.

*The immediate break-up (Trust Busting) of everything "Too Big to Fail".

*Fair Competition Legislation that lets Mom&Pop (small locally owned businesses and farms) compete with Big Box and Factory Farms on a level playing field.