Why Classic EQ is still the best online RPG (and how P1999 could make it even better)

[Hollywood]

Originally Posted by Noudess [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I also wanted to discuss how P1999 can make Classic EQ even better. This section will probably be flamed, and I guess so be it. So long as you ponder the points from a viewpoint of how the game was intended - where it came from - and frankly why classic EQ is the nest game available. While some of the things below may make YOU less powerful, they make the game a more true representation of a real world that we all get to enjoy forever.

Ok, so what is in classic EQ that is being corrupted today? Or misused? This is stuff I fell violates the intent of the original developers. And I agree with their vision. Some I'm suggesting the server GM fixes, others I am asking players to look at themselves and decide.

XP.

Experience Points/Power Leveling - I have no problem with power leveling on this game for three reasons.
A) It represents a time when developers did not completely hamper or hinder people for having achieved success. In real life, you may know someone who is rich and generous and you therefore reap the benefits of that relationship. Whether you are IN IT for the money is between you and them.
B) People who power through stuff might miss out on content. It's their loss, your gain.
You can't make the argument that it keeps people from grouping because they had no intention of grouping to begin with.
C)Modifying code to stop power leveling is not a simple flag to be turned on or off.

Originally Posted by Noudess [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Twinking


I'm not going to propose any changes here. Except by players themselves. I don't think, and I never will. Each of my characters is unique, they're not an extension of my penis, pardon the analogy. They are living , breathing , members of Norrath with personality and background. I believe we just cheapen our Experience by giving them level 40 gear and ignoring the what, dozens of zones we could be grouping in, improving teamwork skills, etc.

That said, its your game, your character, your experience. Nonetheless, if you are at all curious, try playing your next alt like he was your only character. I think you'd be surprised at how much fun it is to be challenged and to actually use that drop you just got instead of mocking it as vendor fodder because your level 60 gave you better, even though he's a troll and you're a wood elf :P

Similar to power leveling, I find that twinking is the ultimate example of player freedom bestowed via developers. Bind on Equip style items (which obviously didn't exist yet back then) are one of MMORPG's banes. To be able to find an item, and gift it to someone or yourself is simply reaping the benefits of the work you put in initially.
If I level a Necromancer to 60 and solo good items, I either sell them or gift them. Why sell when I don't need money? It's like a parent working hard to give their kids everything they could ever need. If you're worried about spoiling them, then teach them how to be gracious and grateful.

You should also take into account that EverQuest was severely imbalanced in places.
Sometimes a twink could make a difference and other times it was/is irrelevant.
A 40s something Druid won't be tanking in Karnor's castle..

And similar to power leveling, how do you recode to stop twinking? There is no BOE foundation/system in place. About best you could do is flag a bunch of normal lore items to be NO TRADE. Which then has the consequence of taking many items off the market and a further consequence of more people camping mobs that are in amongst group experience areas.

Originally Posted by Noudess [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Recharging via vendor


LOL.* I can hear all the l33t people screaming already. What, I can't recharge my leatherfoot helm?

Listen. Do you think the GMs meant for this? Think that the stacking bug on a merchant is intentional?

Hell guys, I've done it. And it makes me feel dirty.

I'd much rather the GMs fixed this bug.. It doesn't even bother me if they create an NPC that specializes in recharging for a fee. At least that would be immersive and in game RP. Taking advantage of this bug is just cheesy and it's a staple on P1999.

Agreed. This is fixable, and would stop half of the mobilization capabilities of guilds.
As well as half the forum posts about 'they stole our merchant sold items..'

Originally Posted by Noudess [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

MQing


Honestly.*I'm on the fence on this one. I see many instance where this falls into perfect RP. But, I'm sure the devs made the items no drop for this very reason. They didn't want Jboots in the hands of your level 2 warrior.

I'd be happy if they made it not work, but honestly, this falls into the same bucket as twinking. If you MQ, you're making a decision about how you want to experience the game. Earn everything for yourself with each character, or take shortcuts. Personally, as painful as it is to be Sowless, I'll take 35 levels of it for the joy of getting teh jboots with my own two hands once I earn it.

Agreed. Multi-questing was a horrible concept and entirely defeated the NO TRADE/ NO DROP system. It encourages people to camp mobs that are in amongst experience group areas. It also takes away NBG considerations. I read a post here not too long ago about someone who witnessed a Karnor's group get a Pawnbuster to drop a Monk pipe which was then taken by someone in group after they rolled on it - for the purpose of selling it later, even though they knew he needed it for his epic.

Rogean made a massive mistake when adding this in and it severely hurts classic status.

[Snagglepuss]

I like how in Vanguard you could "mentor" or "be mentored" by a higher level player. It was nice how my friends could temporarily de-level their character (and skills) to group with me and we could explore content while everyone was still receiving exp.

Something like that would have been nice on EQ and would kill the argument "I needz 2 PL my friend so he can get MaX LvL and we can camps phat luwtz, J00 SuX00Rz!!1!"

[fishingme]

Originally Posted by Handull [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

how is MQing a bug? just think for two second about how any reasonable programmer would code an NPC turn in. EQ makes it especially easy, because NPC turn ins can't be stacked. the easy way: player clicks trade, game checks if the items in the trade window match the items required for the quest reward. if yes, player gets reward, if no, return or eat items accordingly. but in order to MQ, the script not only has to remember what was turned in recently, but allow someone else to complete that set of turn ins for a reward.

you know no drop items can be looted by any level toon, right? why isn't that a bug/exploit? with a 7+ minute corpse timer you can easily kill a mob, log over, and be at the corpse b4 the 5 min free loot limit happens. i've done it a ton. would you rather all loot be no drop and you can't loot something unless you or your party god the exp kill? so no more farming green con mobs, if you ran from CB to kelethin to sell rusty weapons and that brass earring finally drops, too bad for you for being out of zone when it happened, etc. EQ eventually put in level suggestions and requirements for items along these lines, but that was when they already messed things up, as you describe it.

and it was said, but yeah, the "twice your level" rule is so silly. most mobs in the game are under level 50, especially the ones people exp off of, even when they are level 59, so that means a level 25+ can get PL'd no problem. Unrest mobs go up to level 35, so that means its still an amazing zone to PL 15-20, and you could easily push that into 21-25. if not unrest for 21-25, then guk/MM/etc still work. below 15 you could just do unrest yard trash/first floor, or if you really want to ruin someone's day go pull ALL of crushbone. CB is good exp for a legit group even into level 15, so it'll be great for a druid to PL a lvl 4-15 toon in no time while literally keeping the entire zone dead.

but enough hate, heres a real solution to the PLing problem that comes up here and there. if gms wanted to take a hard stance to it, make threats of suspensions, and then follow through suspending people who pull PL trains through exp groups and otherwise shit up a zone, then that might help. I haven't PL'd for a long time, but I did do it a bunch, almost always in unrest. I was very careful to usually do it in the morning. if i group was already there, i asked what they were pulling and left those floors up. if a group walked in, i asked what area they wanted to camp, and i left those mobs for them. its not hard to be nice to one another and still have a good PL session.

twinking, recharging, and MQing dont directly effect other players, so dont do it if you dont like it

re-read my original post. The end item is no drop, you can't trade no drop items.

[Karafa]

MQing was never a bug, infact it's even in the Kunark manual lol..

Mentoring is dumb. You're playing on a 1999 emulated server, if you want mentoring and no drop gear go play EQ2?

[Vellatri]

Originally Posted by Karafa [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

MQing was never a bug, infact it's even in the Kunark manual lol..

Really? I still have mine. What page?

[Taffan]

Originally Posted by Elements [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I would just like to point out the EQ is based largely on the hobbit/LotR and that bilbo twinked frodo with mithil anda badass sword. Also aragorn powerlevelled the hobbits.

/thread

[Bamzal Sherbet]

Originally Posted by Karafa [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

MQing ... infact it's even in the Kunark manual lol..

Ya.. Gonna call BS on this one

[bouncerr 2.0]

Originally Posted by Bamzal Sherbet [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ya.. Gonna call BS on this one

I believe it. Mq was never a ban able offense and I don't see anything wrong with it. If players can achieve the pieces and sell them that is there own hard work camping that said item and selling it to someone who needs.

[Bamzal Sherbet]

i just meant in the kunark manual or not. i got it show me what page [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

I like the OP. I would only add that frustration and not getting what you want when you want is part of the classic experience. All hail corpse runs.

the game declines, in general, as difficulties are nerfed from the dev side. The game self-declines, as the economy gets mudflated and every alt is heavily twinked.

instancing and world channels. two very diff things. both killed the experience big time, imo. Sometimes big things, sometimes little things.

you have to keep it hard.