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  #21  
Old 11-21-2012, 02:37 AM
Daldolma Daldolma is offline
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Originally Posted by Heebee [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Fake subtitles. Nice try though!
Lol. Don't speak Hebrew -- is it even close, or just outright anti-Israel propaganda?
  #22  
Old 11-21-2012, 11:47 AM
Lazortag Lazortag is offline
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Originally Posted by Daldolma [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
You're being reasonable. But you're getting caught up in a false equivalence. Yes, Israel has committed war crimes and human rights violations. Yes, the Israeli government is, at times, excessively brutal. Yes, given their level of technology and progress they should be better than some of the things they've done.

But there is no parallel between Israel and Hamas. Hamas literally dragged a dead body from the back of a motorcycle today as bystanders cheered because they think he collaborated with Israel. They killed 6 alleged collaborators today. No trial, nothing. And obviously, they shoot rockets into Israel with absolutely no intent to target military personnel. They aim to inflict as much civilian damage as possible -- they're just not very good at it.

Israel, on the other hand, has dropped over 1300 missiles into Gaza, one of the most densely populated places in the world, and killed under 100 civilians. They have placed phone calls, dropped leaflets, dropped warning shots, and reserved many attacks for nightfall in order to minimize civilian casualties. You can absolutely blame Israel for perpetuating hostilities, you can absolutely blame them for prior violations, but in the current escalation, Israel is making, if nothing more, a very reasonable effort to spare civilian life.

Israel clearly has better technology and it's obviously not a level playing field in that regard, but Hamas is targeting Israeli civilians intentionally and recklessly. Israel is making efforts to preserve civilian life, even if their response is disproportionate (arguable). And the rhetoric from both sides supports this. Taken at their words, Hamas admits to targeting "every Israeli". Israel, though perhaps less than entirely sincere, has repeatedly expressed a desire to avoid civilian casualties. You can't evaluate these entities in a vacuum. Reasonably speaking, Israel cannot win with Hamas. They can absorb rocket attacks or they can respond and face condemnation for unintentional civilian casualties. There's no in-between.

Anyway, Israel's government has major flaws, and it's impossible not to sympathize with Palestinian civilians, but Hamas is far more radical and far more violent than Israel's government. Hamas is not a viable solution to anything. Then again, the unfortunate truth is that there may not be a viable solution to this conflict.
Sure, a lot of this is true. It was actually another poster who implied that the Israeli government and Hamas were "equally" bad, I was just saying they can both be in the wrong, and Hamas' crimes don't shield Israel from criticism (something you seem to agree with). Sorry if that was unclear.
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  #23  
Old 11-21-2012, 12:50 PM
Daldolma Daldolma is offline
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Originally Posted by purist 4.0 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
A cursory Google search will show it is in fact real.

This video was from an Israeli pro-war demonstration that was reported on in the Israeli media. The man giving a speech in this video is Michael Ben Ari, an Israeli Knesset (parliament) member. Look up who he is and what his National Union party is all about and nothing said in this video will surprise you. The subtitles are competely accurate.

Israeli MK incites violence against leftists, Palestinians
Ah I know the name, didn't know him by face. Yeah, he's a fanatic and pretty much the diametric opposite of a force for peace.
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