Global item rarity needs to be looked at

[falkun]

Originally Posted by Spitty [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Your math - it isn't math. For one, four times the population means four times the manpower to camp items.

No. The important camps are already camped. If fungi is camped 100% of the time, it doesn't matter if there are two people on the server camping those fungis or 10000 people on the server and 6 are camping the fungi. If its camped and kept clear, that camp is already producing its maximum amount of loot, regardless of server population.

Since everyone here knows where all the camps are, we don't bother camping non-loot places. Therefore the lower amount of manpower is more effectively utilized to exploit the environment than it was on Live, negating most advantages to increased manpower through optimization.

[Spitty]

That's some great rhetoric, but it's not applicable in real-world terms.

No single two people (or six, or twelve) can maintain a camp and continuously produce a maximum amount of loot over a timeframe greater than maybe a couple of days. So, routine cycling has to occur for that camp to continue producing at maximum output.

A greater population increases the potential for constant cycling, and therefore a greater population is directly correlated to more loot. 4x = 4x is likely inaccurate, but was the statement I chose offhand to discredit the notion that four times the population means four times the rarity of items.

[Picked]

Originally Posted by Samrothstein [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

There's a lot less people here than a live server, which is for the best in many senses.

But having 4x the pop means 4x the rarity ... not to mention that we all know what mobs to exactly go for.

If most items here were say twice as uncommon, would you feel better? I think that's what you're seeing. For the modern mmo gamer, maybe this promotes people being more likely to play. People love their pixels.

This makes the most sense of any post on here really. The population has more to do with it than anything. You got the same spawn spitting out as many of the same item, but only half the people to buy it or even less. So it's going to lose it's value quicker. But like I said. I don't why that is a bad thing. Means when you go to twink your next character it will cost you half as much pp.

[falkun]

Originally Posted by Spitty [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

That's some great rhetoric, but it's not applicable in real-world terms.

No single two people (or six, or twelve) can maintain a camp and continuously produce a maximum amount of loot over a timeframe greater than maybe a couple of days. So, routine cycling has to occur for that camp to continue producing at maximum output.

Originally Posted by falkun [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No. The important camps are already camped. If fungi is camped 100% of the time, it doesn't matter if there are two people on the server camping those fungis or 10000 people on the server and 6 are camping the fungi. If its camped and kept clear, that camp is already producing its maximum amount of loot, regardless of server population.

Emphasis mine.

Originally Posted by Spitty [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A greater population increases the potential for constant cycling, and therefore a greater population is directly correlated to more loot. 4x = 4x is likely inaccurate, but was the statement I chose offhand to discredit the notion that four times the population means four times the rarity of items.

So you concede the argument that camps are more effectively established and exploited on this server than on Live. Now lets add the smaller population, and therefore smaller market. Since fewer items are required to saturate the market due to the decreased total market size, the camps are not required to be farmed as much because the supply can be smaller and still match demand.

Any additional farming beyond market saturation will only further drive down the price and get left on random_alt_03 because now an individual user just obtains multiple of the same item instead of having to trade it back and forth between characters (which is only slightly trivial).

You're right, a camp not being exploited for loot due to lower server population will have a lower total output of items than a server where every camp is perpetually exploited. But that lower population also provides a decreased market size, which will require less supply to still meet demand. You can't have a lower population farming less items without also having a lower market to sell those items to. You are ignoring the demand side of supply & demand and just talking about supply.

[mwatt]

I have two opinions that I would like to contribute:

1) I think it is good to let new people have the same chance to get an item through camping that established people have had - even if it leads to eventual "overstock" in the market. This is a natural occurrence even if one were to slow the drop rates. I would guess that for the most part, people who are in favor of slowing the drop rates probably already have most of the items they want.

2) In my opinion, drop rates on P99 for many choice items are already less frequent than on Live. This may be due to a less frequent spawing of named mobs or lower drop percentage or some combination of the above. I will site as examples the Iksar Ceremonial Chestplate (Hunter/Forager cycle somehow spawns less nameds here) the FBSS (freaking uber-rare drop IMO) and the Heirophant Cloak -after many trips to the Crypt I have seen very few drop. Certain spells also seem a LOT more rare.

[Nerosys]

The biggest issue with things like the Fungi camp is Hide pulling which was not done on live now people just sit in tube room and single pull PH's all day therefore making it way too easy to obtain.

Rotokan

[Asher]

Originally Posted by falkun [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If its camped and kept clear, that camp is already producing its maximum amount of loot, regardless of server population.

As someone who is responsible for probably 30+ Fungi tunics on the server and been in many groups and eventually narrowed it down to just two people I can tell you that if it was not possible to invis pull king through all the mobs around him people wouldn't be pharming it as they have been.

That is the main reason why this particular item has become so common. Killing one mob every 28 minutes is much easier than keeping the camp clear.

Asher