Raiding on P1999 - Page 4

Maze513 · #31 09-11-2011, 06:07 PM

Move this to RnF and lets start all over again =p

Humerox · #32 09-11-2011, 06:07 PM

The funniest thing about variance is that it was put in to help promote competition. No one back then thought people would be insane enough to sit around for days on end waiting for a boss spawn. It actually worked for a little while, but no need to rehash what happened afterward...we all saw the results, and what strategy won the day.

Re Hasbinabad, he's always had a measure of respect for Divinity. The comment was an inside joke, for those who've been around long enough to remember.

It looks like Nilbog and Rogean are mandating a change, by withholding content. So unless everyone gets together and starts talking about solutions...

Rotation is more classic than ten billion server rules and huge guild summits. It's also a rather easy solution...and the only problem would be hashing out who deserves a shot in the rotation queue.

Ulivar · #33 09-11-2011, 06:23 PM

Not that i'm considered to be a raider but i'm going to throw my 2 cents in since theres a billion threads about this crap

heres the point

"- Veeshan's Peak will remain closed. We do not feel the behavior of the top raiding guilds over the last several months merits new content for them."

The actions and attitudes of those who are raiding, are harming their own interests.

Obviously there's nothing wrong with the raid scene right? right? lol

I'm from RZ, even on RZ we came to a raiding arrangement between the top guilds so that people could get shit done and improve their characters/get equip yada yada. However when the tides turned, there was massive waring and pvp and no one got anything done.

Its really funny that it can't or that people won't do it here. Even now, your holding back your own progression because people refuse to get along. Like its really that bad? Yall are more interested in burning people out than prolonging interest and this is overall bad for the server. Argue as much as you want to, if it doesn't get to a resolution then its completely pointless. As a newish player here i've expressed multiple times that I would be interested in a raid scene, but the state of it here completely turns me off to that idea. But again, raid scene is fine here...right?

Any sort of a rotation would be worthwhile with any time restraint, that leaves it up to the guilds to make sure they can kill the mobs, thats what everyone wants to do right, kill mobs? Argue about how long people will have to kill it.

OR yall can just keep doing what your doing, and keep hurting yourselves and wasting your time

Thanks, today's lesson has been about sharing, what should tomorrows lesson be?

Mcbard · #34 09-11-2011, 06:41 PM

Good post except the issue the devs brought to light and that you posted is already being worked on.

The issue and resolution everyone else in the thread seems set on enacting is rotating mobs between not the "top guilds" but "anybody capable of killing a mob" so that the 500 level 60s on the server all get a chance at raid mobs because they don't want to log their characters out prepared and track. They wish to have their cake and eat it too.. which I don't recall being classic.

That comes off kind of dickish, but seriously this is what it seems to boil down to from everything I've been reading on this subject in the last couple of weeks. "Man we really want to kill dragons, but on this server you have to track them during their windows and have your force buffed, logged out, and prepared to do so in order to kill anything, and we don't want to do that since it's not what we did in classic!"

I don't get it. =\

Edit: And it should be known that I personally, as well as most everyone I'm sure is all for a solution that makes everything as classic as possible, however we need to keep a few things in mind, imo:
1. Variances were put in for a reason
2. The solution should affect all people equally
3. It should be easier for the GM's not more difficult
4. At the end of the day there are going to be 500 people standing around a pie and wanting a slice, but there just isn't enough to go around.

Nizzarr · #35 09-11-2011, 07:26 PM

We're enjoying the current raid environment as it is. Mob variance is good, everyone in both raiding guilds has to commit lots of time in tracking and mobilizing. Whoever said that you just need scores of poeple to raid on this server is ignorant. Theres a lot more to it than that and if you dont want to spend time in this game you dont deserve the spoils. We work hard in TMO to get those kills and TR works hard too.

Work harder and youll get raid mobs too. or you can try and whine about a rotation on forums, that sure is less time intensive.

As far as Veeshan's peak goes, I'm sure both guilds and the management will come to a decent agreement.

Lazortag · #36 09-11-2011, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mcbard [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The issue and resolution everyone else in the thread seems set on enacting is rotating mobs between not the "top guilds" but "anybody capable of killing a mob" so that the 500 level 60s on the server all get a chance at raid mobs because they don't want to log their characters out prepared and track. They wish to have their cake and eat it too.. which I don't recall being classic.

Wait, so what about tracking mobs for 4 day windows is classic?

Quote:

That comes off kind of dickish, but seriously this is what it seems to boil down to from everything I've been reading on this subject in the last couple of weeks. "Man we really want to kill dragons, but on this server you have to track them during their windows and have your force buffed, logged out, and prepared to do so in order to kill anything, and we don't want to do that since it's not what we did in classic!"

It's the fact that you have to track them for insane amounts of time (more than what was required in classic), and even if you do that, usually one of the top two guilds has either 30+ people logged on in the zone at the time, or 30+ people camped out next to the boss. Assuming they don't, you have a pretty good chance that the mob is going to spawn when your guild isn't even awake. In other words, the variance requires an unreasonable time investment. It's not that we're all not skilled or hardcore enough to compete on your level; it's that we just can't invest that much time into a game. If you love competition so much, you would either (a) want to lower the entry cost for aspiring guilds participating in the raid scene, or (b) stop doing things that are antithetical to competition (like poopsocking, or camping your guild near the boss, which is basically the same thing). And maybe if you're nice enough they'll open VP for you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nizzarr

Work harder and youll get raid mobs too. or you can try and whine about a rotation on forums, that sure is less time intensive.

Wow. Do you really think it's due to "hard work" that you have relative success on this server?

Quizy · #37 09-11-2011, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lazortag [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Wait, so what about tracking mobs for 4 day windows is classic?

It's the fact that you have to track them for insane amounts of time (more than what was required in classic), and even if you do that, usually one of the top two guilds has either 30+ people logged on in the zone at the time, or 30+ people camped out next to the boss. Assuming they don't, you have a pretty good chance that the mob is going to spawn when your guild isn't even awake. In other words, the variance requires an unreasonable time investment. It's not that we're all not skilled or hardcore enough to compete on your level; it's that we just can't invest that much time into a game. If you love competition so much, you would either (a) want to lower the entry cost for aspiring guilds participating in the raid scene, or (b) stop doing things that are antithetical to competition (like poopsocking, or camping your guild near the boss, which is basically the same thing). And maybe if you're nice enough they'll open VP for you.

Wow. Do you really think it's due to "hard work" that you have relative success on this server?

You want things handed to you while guilds like TMO and TR go out and GET what they want instead of waiting for it to be handed to them..

If you want the high end raiding loot for your guild then require higher attendance of your members or stop whining on forums about it..

The "oh this wasnt classic" argument is retarded because this server is not exactly classic anyway.. using that argument proves nothing and doesnt change the fact that you need dedicated players to get these targets.

Lazortag · #38 09-11-2011, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quizy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You want things handed to you while guilds like TMO and TR go out and GET what they want instead of waiting for it to be handed to them..

If you want the high end raiding loot for your guild then require higher attendance of your members or stop whining on forums about it..

The "oh this wasnt classic" argument is retarded because this server is not exactly classic anyway.. using that argument proves nothing and doesnt change the fact that you need dedicated players to get these targets.

Woah, relax. Your post is full of assumptions. I never said I wanted things handed to me. In classic mobs weren't just handed to guilds - the guilds had to actually kill them, for one. Secondly, I just want things to be classic. The fact that there are other non-classic things on this server is irrelevant - it's still a pareto improvement for the server to have one more non-classic issue fixed even if it means that not everything else can be fixed. Thirdly, this has nothing to do with my guild (I'm a free agent and I'm allowed to speak for myself), nor does it have to do with requiring higher attendance. You've participated very little in the raid scene if you think that's all it boils down to. The crux of the problem is that the majority of raid-capable guilds on this server simply don't have the time to poopsock or track mobs through outrageously long windows, for reasons I already explained. And again, like I already said, it's not some indication that the top guilds are just too "uber" that they get very little competition - it's that the current ruleset actively discourages competition and limits entry into the raid scene to the people who have no lives outside of eq. So, calm down, and actually read what people say before responding to them.

Tycko · #39 09-11-2011, 08:07 PM

If you want to raid on p99, expect to spend ungodly amounts of time playing everquest. If you are a normal 9 to 5 citizen, look forward to patch days for full repops so you can take a few shots at raid mobs while the people with no lives fight for the high priority targets.

Zenlina · #40 09-11-2011, 08:10 PM

As it stands with variances, lets say all agreed on a rotation. I mean if a boss spawns at weird hours for guild besides the two everyone else seem to want to blame, how long would it take you guys to get ready for it? 1-2-3 hours to organise, have the right classes log on, etc?

Sorry but most seem to think the two top guilds have no life but its quite the opposite, we dont have time to wait around for hours on end for the other guilds to muster enough to kill it, we pretty much go in, kill it and go back to real life/work/sleep/alts/whatever.