How far are we from AI recreating EQ99?

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by BradZax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Because you wont say "oh, i thought you meant something else, my bad!"

You are making other claims besides the single claim: "People can learn to make games with youtube, chatGPT, etc.". That is why the conversation hasn't ended. For example:

Originally Posted by BradZax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

But I did say that in 1 to 2 years you could have a working game like everquest with the help of AI and youtube

I don't understand how you came to this conclusion.

[BradZax]

Yeah but i wouldnt have a problem with you disagreeing with me about those claims, but I would appreciate you met me halfway after I go through the trouble of clarifying.

I don't understand how you came to this conclusion.

Well I am assuming this is a late night kids are asleep hobby project. And I also am imagining building a smaller but comparable version of ever quest, you could have that working in a year or 2 with trial, error, learning how to use AI, what kind of AI tools are available etc, and building—and doing all with AI being your CORE educator and co-worker. (would it be high quality? idk depends on how cool the person making it is).

I am not arguing that you will ever be able to say, "alexa, make me everquest" and it would just do it. (though I am personally confident that is an inevitable future, just dont know how long it will take at all, could be 10 years, could be 10,000 because we nuke ourselves back to the stone age).

[loramin]

Originally Posted by BradZax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Never claimed that.

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Originally Posted by BradZax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think we're just waiting on more power. For example. Google image creation with Gemini using context costs about 3-5$ in wattage to generate a 6-10 second video. Vs their diffusion model for video generation is more like 5 cents or less.

That doesn't mean anything except it just gives you an idea about how much wattage context adds to the equation!

I am hoping corporations using their own nuclear reactors will be give us a big jump in usage.

https://www.latitudemedia.com/news/o...-nuclear-push/

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Originally Posted by BradZax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The OP question is "how far are we from making a game like EQ in AI" like the examples.

Right now, right now someone could do that.

Someone already did with unity, without AI.

So with AI, right now. Someone can make an everquest game with AI.

We just need someone to want to do it!

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Originally Posted by BradZax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ok heres the answer to op:

Right now anyone (except for DSM or Loramin) can.

You claim it a bunch more throughout the thread, but I have better things to do than quote troll posts back at trolls.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by BradZax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yeah but i wouldnt have a problem with you disagreeing with me about those claims, but I would appreciate you met me halfway and showed me that in the area we agree that you don't also disagree.

We both agree that people can learn to make video games via ChatGPT, youtube, etc. I apologize if you thought I was saying something else. Is there anything else you think we should meet halfway on?

Originally Posted by BradZax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You keep doubling down that im wrong about someone apt being able to build EQ right now by themselves with AI with no prior experience.

When you say things like this:

Originally Posted by BradZax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ai fits into this scenario because in the videos OP posted, someone with ZERO experience making games, managed to build a functioning doom executable.

Ai helped him write code he didnt know how to write. Ai helped tell him where to put stuff he didn't know where to put it. Ai tells you create accounts, and register to download all the programs you need to build something.

It sounds like you are saying a newbie can use AI to generate a significant portion of the code needed to create an Everquest-style MMO. Maybe that is not your intent, but that is how I read it. I disagree with this idea.

Originally Posted by BradZax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Well for one I am assuming this is a late night kids are asleep hobby project. And I also am imaginging building a smaller but comperable version of everquest, you could have that working in a year or 2 with trial, error, learning, and building, all with AI being your CORE educator and co-worker.

I and AI would suggest, hiring people on fiver, reaching out to reddit communities, etc to accomplish this goal, because that would all be a part of any hobby project like this.

I am not arguing that you will ever be able to say, "alexa, make me everquest" and it would just do it. (though I am personally confident that is an inevitable future, just dont know how long it will take at all, could be 10 years, could be 10,000 because we nuke ourselves back to the stone age).

It would take years for an experienced programmer to solo write an Everquest-Style MMO from scratch if they only worked on it like 2-3 hours a day as a hobby project, even with AI and some part time assistants from Reddit or where-ever else.

Now I don't know what you mean by a "smaller version" of Everquest, so maybe you can elaborate. If you just mean less zones, that doesn't reduce the programming workload, as all of the game mechanics would still need to be in place. If you cut game mechanics, there is a point at which you can say it isn't Everquest anymore.

[BradZax]

By not quoting the post that I was replying to you are misrepresenting what I am saying

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

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Quote I was replying to:

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

First, the context window. The AI can only "remember" so much at a time, out of everything it reads, everything you tell it etc. The context limits are inherent to how AI works: until there's some new innovation occurs, this isn't going to get much better.

I was saying more power would solve context limits you claimed were inherent to how AI works, not some new innovation

NOT that AI will make EQ with more power.

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Where does that quote even imply that AI can just make Everquest by itself, or that more power would make AI make evertquest by itself, that quote literally doesn't even support your argument, it breaks down and clarifies why someone can use AI RIGHT NOW to make Everquest if they wanted.

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Yes: Right now, me and DSM agree, someone can use AI to make their own Everquest game. I stand by that.

That is NOT what you are accusing me of: saying that with moree power AI could generate EQ on its own.

You claim it a bunch more throughout the thread, but I have better things to do than quote troll posts back at trolls.

I never once said what you are accusing me of saying, and you couldn't find one example of me saying it.

[BradZax]

It sounds like you are saying a newbie can use AI to generate a significant portion of the code needed to create an Everquest-style MMO. Maybe that is not your intent, but that is how I read it. I disagree with this idea.

Here's what I am saying about what is possible right now:

A newbie can sit down infront of a FREE version of chat GPT and say:

"Ok here we go, I want to make everquest like the 1999 version, i need you to set me up with a walkthrough and teach me how to build this every step of the way, starting from scratch, with nothing but windows 11.

IM ready to go, i have no idea, what is the first step, lets get going!"

It will first tell you to subscribe to the pro version so you can, and from there on it will walk you through everyone of the next steps.

And if you did that... and you were a SMART and CAPABLE person.

And you were dedicated to building your own everquest in your free time from scratch.

That you would be able to accomplish that, right now.

Will you be essentially, "learning how to do it yourself?"

Yes.

[OriginalContentGuy]

Originally Posted by BradZax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I never once said what you are accusing me of saying, and you couldn't find one example of me saying it.

Originally Posted by OriginalContentGuy

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by BradZax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Here's what I am saying about what is possible right now:

A newbie can sit down infront of a FREE version of chat GPT and say:

"Ok here we go, I want to make everquest like the 1999 version, i need you to set me up with a walkthrough and teach me how to build this every step of the way, starting from scratch, with nothing but windows 11.

IM ready to go, i have no idea, what is the first step, lets get going!"

It will first tell you to subscribe to the pro version so you can, and from there on it will walk you through everyone of the next steps.

And if you did that... and you were a SMART and CAPABLE person.

And you were dedicated to building your own everquest in your free time from scratch.

That you would be able to accomplish that, right now.

Will you be essentially, "learning how to do it yourself?"

Yes.

I agree. I think where my disagreement came from is some of the timelines you have previously posted.

In this specific scenario, it would probably take 5-10 years for a newbie solo developer to make an Everquest-style MMO from scratch in their free time using AI and paying people for some part time work. This assumes the newbie is a very good learner, is dedicated to the cause, doesn't take long breaks, etc. This also assumes the scope and quality of the game is similar to Original Everquest without expansions.

[BradZax]

Originally Posted by OriginalContentGuy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

excellent post

[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

In this specific scenario, it would probably take 5-10 years for a newbie solo developer to make an Everquest-style MMO from scratch in their free time using AI and paying people for some part time work. This assumes the newbie is a very good learner, is dedicated to the cause, doesn't take long breaks, etc. This also assumes the scope and quality of the game is similar to Original Everquest without expansions.

Im comfortable with 5 years, and you get the kids on weekends.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by BradZax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Im comfortable with 5 years, and you get the kids on weekends.

Lol sounds good!

My biggest worry with a newbie creating a multiplayer game is the networking code. Multiplayer games often die due to rampant cheating. Even AAA games have had bad cheating issues due to code created by seasoned programmers. AAA games at least have the money and time to mass ban cheaters, but indie studios don't always have that luxury.

So under the assumption that they do get it done in 5 years, they could still shoot themselves in the foot. That is why the time range I gave was large. Ideally you would spend a lot of time testing and refining after the game is largely done. That would take a long time as a single dev without a full time QA team. You could try and do early access, but this assumes the players would actually tell you about the cheats. They may keep it to themselves so they have an advantage when the game comes out.