Kunark/Classic World CHALLENGE - Official Thread

[Zuranthium]

Originally Posted by chillybob [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

fire giants being a tier below permafrost ice giants despite being a copy & paste reskin of the same mob?

They aren't a tier below, for the ones that have linked aggro. The permafrost giants all stand in range of another, creating pull difficulty, whereas there is a fire giant spawn who is alone. That specific one is lower tier (if it spawns under level 51).

Originally Posted by chillybob [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Mobs like Uulump and Prince Selrach are 'duo god' tier but both soloable by an enchanter?

I haven't heard about Uulump being soloed, but taking a look I can see it would be possible by charming Warlord Hikyg if that info is accurate, or without that pet if Uulump's HP is incorrectly listed as 32K right now. Please advise on his stats since you seem to know.

Prince has only been soloed by Enchanters who have used the busted version of Lull, which is slated to be nerfed to its useless classic version. If someone can show they are able to solo him without Lulling the room and without consumables, then it would merit a tier change. A solo kill without pull help will require running him to zoneline and getting a root to stick long enough to be able to fight him without a crowd around. Might be possible, but hasn't been shown yet.

Originally Posted by chillybob [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

having sky stuff on a challenge like this is silly on an emulated server that has daily sky guild-rotations.

Why's that? Guilds can choose to let their members do challenges if they want (it's already happened with challenges in Kael) and the content doesn't all get perma cleared anyway. No rotations on Red either.

Originally Posted by chillybob [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Khelkar Icepaw being god mode but Kerdelb & Bledrek being a tier lower?

As someone who has solo'd all three mobs many times I'd argue that Kerdelb and Bledrek are harder simply because they're a 2 part fight with their smaller versions spawning shortly thereafter...vs. Khelkar being a one and done.

Kerd and Bled aren't lower tier, you must be referring to the bad, old wiki page. As for Khelkar, he is in a room with several others, two of which are over level 50. Will be interested to see your thoughts after trying it without lull. And OFC, everything in the same tier doesn't have exactly the same difficulty anyway.

Originally Posted by chillybob [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Bristlebane Puppet being on the same tier as Emp Chottal [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Bristlebane Puppet doesn't have linked aggro and is perma rooted, so he can be freely loaded up with debuffs before engaging. Chottal is in a room with many guards. That said, Bristlebane is indeed very difficult and might merit moving up a tier, but seems possible with pre-parked charm pets. Also, Velious and Kunark content are separate challenges (although yes, the difficulty levels should still be similar between them).

[chillybob]

Originally Posted by Stryker85 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It's because he doesn't actually play EverQuest anymore, and hasn't in a very long time. Dude is out of touch and completely clueless.

oohhh, I see I see..... the geriatric gamer special, as brad intended

#bradbless [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I haven't heard about Uulump being soloed, but taking a look I can see it would be possible by charming Warlord Hikyg if that info is accurate, or without that pet if Uulump's HP is incorrectly listed as 32K right now. Please advise on his stats since you seem to know.

They're both accurate, can confirm. Maybe 20-25 uulump solo / duo kills at this point for various druids in need.
Why invite a full group of melee nerds when you can just do all the leg work with 1 charm.

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Prince has only been soloed by Enchanters who have used the busted version of Lull, which is slated to be nerfed to its useless classic version. If someone can show they are able to solo him without Lulling the room and without consumables, then it would merit a tier change. A solo kill without pull help will require running him to zoneline and getting a root to stick long enough to be able to fight him without a crowd around. Might be possible, but hasn't been shown yet.

Even without using pacify (which if its as broken as you insist why can't we get a bug report getting it permanently fixed?) you can do silly tricks for pulls using mesmerize abusing blur + social aggro mechanics.
Same for Khelkar's room.... Lets say we don't use pacify....
Rapture Khelkar, stun + fascinate the adds and then kill them 1 by 1. Easy. No risk of a crit resist pacify either!

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

and Bled aren't lower tier, you must be referring to the bad, old wiki page. As for Khelkar, he is in a room with several others, two of which are over level 50. Will be interested to see your thoughts after trying it without lull. And OFC, everything in the same tier doesn't have exactly the same difficulty anyway.

erm.... [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by chillybob [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The original framework for the Solo Artist Challenge ............

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Bristlebane Puppet doesn't have linked aggro and is perma rooted, so he can be freely loaded up with debuffs before engaging. Chottal is in a room with many guards. That said, Bristlebane is indeed very difficult and might merit moving up a tier, but seems possible with pre-parked charm pets. Also, Velious and Kunark content are separate challenges (although yes, the difficulty levels should still be similar between them).

Please feel free to go park 50 druid pets in PoM and show me you soloing BB puppet to make this realistic. Somehow pull it off on enchanter and I might just have to permanently move over to quarm for the rest of my EQ career!


Last thing to say ~ linking that silly ass post (that you drafted this morning at 6am) has got to be ragebait. You have Tpos Icepaw (killable easily by any enchanter with a brain at level 57) on the same level as the others? A crystal destroyer is harder than khelkar in some instances. Just tell me you don't hunt in velks. Play the game more and your list might seem more realistic.


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-bob out

[CrazyPro]

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Guildmasters are definitely difficult, particularly when grouped together, and especially certain classes. Many of them are absolutely among the hardest things in the game to Solo, and some likely impossible to Solo (hence why they're in the Duo God tier instead).

I am perfectly aware of the 32K HP cap pre-Velious (which only a few revamped Planes MOBs exceed). A small handful these Challenge MOBs on the wiki are incorrectly listed as having more than 32K, but I already disregarded that in the initial tier placements. Those listings on the wiki need to be corrected, which requires them being tested for their exact HP. I maybe should have already edited those pages to 32K in the meantime, since that's at least more accurate, BUT there's also a small chance that a few of these Classic World NPC's randomly got their HP buffed above 32K by a dev during Velious era...it's not like anyone was killing them back then to confirm.

Not sure what you're trying to say about 32,000 HP in the first place though...are you not aware that most Solo God targets already have much less HP than that? Fungi King is only 18k for example. Now look at Guildmasters who have 32k, and cast devastating spells like C-heal, and are standing next to a bunch of other Level 61 GM's: these are incredibly difficult targets.

This is the rubric I used to place GM's:

20k HP without a difficult pull = Grandmaster
32K without a difficult pull or 20K with difficult pull = God
32K with a difficult pull or 20K with difficult pull and difficult spellcasting = Duo God

The exact stats need to be tested though. Also note something I said about how much more content there could be if listing all the possibilities of fighting rooms head-on instead of FD splitting them: many of these GM rooms would be Full Group tier, and some of them wouldn't even be possible with a Full Group!

All guildmasters have 32k HP, some may in fact have been given 2 million HP post-kunark.

[Zuranthium]

Originally Posted by chillybob [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

linking that silly ass post (that you drafted this morning at 6am) has got to be ragebait. Tpos Icepaw (killable easily by any enchanter with a brain at level 57) on the same level as the others? A crystal destroyer is harder than khelkar in some instances.

The thread has been around for many weeks, with Kerd and Bled on the Solo God tier from the very start.

Saying one or two things you disagree with and ignoring the validity of the whole is not helpful, nor intelligent. As has already been stated, the placements are not set in stone. The entire point of these threads is to discuss the exact MOB specifics and come to the most objective placement.

Tpos is in that tier because of how many MOBs surround him. Enchanters to date have abused non-classic lull for these camps; it becomes significantly more time consuming and dangerous when that isn't an option. So far nobody else has said they think Tpos should be moved down a tier. Please describe why you think it will be so easy to split the entire upper dogs area. And are you saying you think Crystal Destroyer should be in God tier, or what?

Originally Posted by chillybob [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Even without using pacify (which if its as broken as you insist why can't we get a bug report getting it permanently fixed?) you can do silly tricks for pulls using mesmerize abusing blur + social aggro mechanics.
Same for Khelkar's room.... Lets say we don't use pacify....
Rapture Khelkar, stun + fascinate the adds and then kill them 1 by 1. Easy.

There is a bug report (literally linked in the first post of both threads), with the exact classic data, and it's been dev acknowledged that lulls are indeed wrong and will need to be changed.

Your stated Khelkar method is ofc one possible way, but it's not a guarantee given resists that can happen. Possibly he could go down a tier, but so far other posters have said they think the current category is correct.

If you think Prince Selrach is so easy to solo without lull, feel free to make a video of it and be the first person with an S+ kill of him on the Hall of Fame, and in the meantime describe exactly how you think the pull would work. Also just objectively looking at the encounter, wouldn't you say it's significantly harder than other things that have already been worthy of being considered solo god tier?

Originally Posted by chillybob [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

go park 50 druid pets in PoM and show me you soloing BB puppet to make this realistic.

Where did the Druid talk come from? I don't think they'd be able to do it, the unslowed Bristlebane Puppet does too much damage for the pets they'd be able to line up. Enchanter however may be possible with 3 pets, which is an amount they can feasibly park before the fight. Have you ever seen anyone try? (I doubt it)

--

Originally Posted by CrazyPro [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

All guildmasters have 32k HP, some may in fact have been given 2 million HP post-kunark.

What's your source for them all having 32k? The 2 million number also contradicts what you were trying to say earlier, and is something that shows how all of these GM's need to be individually tested either way. For now they have to be placed somewhere, and after people report back with actual facts, then their tiers can be altered (and the wiki pages updated).