I made a P99 DPS calculator for melee classes based on EQEMU code

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I checked the code, and the problem I found was actually with the mob (not player) stats: they weren't using the form values.

Thanks again for the fix! Did some super quick testing and it looks like all the fields are working now.

[bcbrown]

Swarmcaller v Froglok Forager should be about 57 DPS but the calculator shows 17 DPS. Changes made:
Level 60, strength 235, mainhand 29/41, offhand 0 damage, haste 40%. Mob AC of 311. Everything else left default.

Woody vs Bloodmaw should be 39.5 DPS at 138 str and 43 DPS at 175 str, but shows 29 and 30.
Changes made: Level 52, strength 138 or 175, mainhand 31/35, offhand 0 damage, haste 22%. Mob AC of 94, defense of 50.

I respect the ambition but I'd be shocked if this ever got to a point of being even remotely reliable.

[Jimjam]

Nice took! I haven’t tried it yet but have 5*ed the thread on concept alone. Could a factor with the issues experienced be Wiki overestimating mob AC?

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Swarmcaller v Froglok Forager should be about 57 DPS but the calculator shows 17 DPS. Changes made:
Level 60, strength 235, mainhand 29/41, offhand 0 damage, haste 40%. Mob AC of 311. Everything else left default.

Woody vs Bloodmaw should be 39.5 DPS at 138 str and 43 DPS at 175 str, but shows 29 and 30.
Changes made: Level 52, strength 138 or 175, mainhand 31/35, offhand 0 damage, haste 22%. Mob AC of 94, defense of 50.

I respect the ambition but I'd be shocked if this ever got to a point of being even remotely reliable.

You didn't read my posts yet again. Your AC values are too high. 115 AC is roughly correct for a level 50 mob. Forager is 45. Of course your DPS is off when a level 45 has the AC of a raid mob at 311. You can't use wiki values, they are out of era.

Please stop going into this with the assumption it's wrong. You do that often, and it clouds your objectivity.

Originally Posted by Jimjam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Nice took! I haven’t tried it yet but have 5*ed the thread on concept alone. Could a factor with the issues experienced be Wiki overestimating mob AC?

Thanks! You are correct, the issue is the AC values on the wiki are basically all out of era.

[WarpathEQ]

So in that vein what is the source of AC data for mobs if wiki can't be relied on and how do you know that your AC values are correct and not just a reverse engineering to align to parse results and potentially mask inaccuracies in the calculator.

I assume NPC AC works differently from PC AC as the values stated seem wildly low compared to what I would expect if you were using the calculator to parse a player duel or pvp for example.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Swarmcaller v Froglok Forager should be about 57 DPS but the calculator shows 17 DPS. Changes made:

The other problem with this parse is that misses were turned off:

Originally Posted by Snaggles [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Thanks bcbrown!

Honestly the 100% hit factor could have been my missed turned off. I figured that would only affect what is displayed in-game. Sorry if that threw a curveball.

https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...4&postcount=91

So most likely the DPS value is wrong to begin with.

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Woody vs Bloodmaw should be 39.5 DPS at 138 str and 43 DPS at 175 str, but shows 29 and 30.
Changes made: Level 52, strength 138 or 175, mainhand 31/35, offhand 0 damage, haste 22%. Mob AC of 94, defense of 50.

I get around 43 DPS with Woody on Bloodmaw at level 52, 175 STR, 210 offense, 210 weapon skill, 210 double attack, 22% Haste, 16 Damage Bonus when you apply Bloodmaw's stats more accurately. Bloodmaw is level 1-8, so he's going to be similar to corudoth. Probably 25 Defense 25 AC, something around there. He also won't be parrying or riposting, so you'd set those two skills to 0.

Originally Posted by WarpathEQ [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So in that vein what is the source of AC data for mobs if wiki can't be relied on and how do you know that your AC values are correct and not just a reverse engineering to align to parse results and potentially mask inaccuracies in the calculator.

I assume NPC AC works differently from PC AC as the values stated seem wildly low compared to what I would expect if you were using the calculator to parse a player duel or pvp for example.

There is a comment in the EQEMU code that says:

According to the guild hall Combat Dummies, a level 50 classic EQ mob it should be ~115

https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=440

When I did a parse on a level 50 mob with my level 52 Monk, my DPS calculator got the same value as the actual parse when using 115 AC and 200 Defense. Those are the default values in the calculator right now.

When I reduce the mob to a level 5 mob with 25 AC and 25 Defense (corudoth, a level 5 mob), I also get basically the same DPS values as what I parsed in the linked post.

I also have other parses that match the DPS calculator that I haven't uploaded yet.

[WarpathEQ]

Seems pretty challenging when you have an unknown variable as an input (mob AC). No way to validate if the data output is accurate or if we're just reverse engineering the output based on actual parses to determine AC values as they would align to this calculator therefore rending the calculator itself meaningless.

Would be interesting to do some testing on combat logs against PCs with known AC values but I suspect PC AC and NPC AC likely work differently.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by WarpathEQ [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Seems pretty challenging when you have an unknown variable as an input (mob AC). No way to validate if the data output is accurate or if we're just reverse engineering the output based on actual parses to determine AC values as they would align to this calculator therefore rending the calculator itself meaningless.

This is incorrect. You can prove the calculator is correct by parsing a low level mob like Corudoth (level 5) on P99 and comparing the results to the calculator. If the parsed P99 DPS against Corudoth (level 5) matches very low AC and Defense values in the calculator, then you have a baseline to scale the rest of your AC off of. I already did this, and it is correct.

Remember also we have a comment in the EQEMU code:

According to the guild hall Combat Dummies, a level 50 classic EQ mob it should be ~115

When parsing the two FM Giants under the fort (level 50 mobs), the P99 parse matches the calculator when using 115 AC and 200 Defense.

The odds of both the Corudoth parse (level 5) and FM Giants parse (level 50) just happening to match the calculator with low AC/Defense on the level 5 and 115 AC/200 Defense on the level 50 is very low.

You can take a look at the parses I am refering to here: https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=440

My calculator gets basically the same DPS on Corudoth (level 5) and the FM Giants (level 50).

[Jimjam]

Would be nice to have a feature that estimates the ac of the intended emulated mob since the wiki is whacky.

Is this something that would be possible using the guild hall dummy resource you mentioned?

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Jimjam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Would be nice to have a feature that estimates the ac of the intended emulated mob since the wiki is whacky.

Is this something that would be possible using the guild hall dummy resource you mentioned?

The main reason why the comment about the guild hall dummy is interesting is because it's in the EQEMU codebase itself. Usually when this happens it's because the developer is trying to remember what value they are scaling their magic numbers off of. Since that 115 AC value happens to work perfectly with a P99 level 50 mob parse, that lends further evidence towards this being the case.

You can also take a look at the Kunark strategy guide to get a very rough idea of what mob stats were for the era:

https://dn790004.ca.archive.org/0/it...ial_eGuide.pdf

Mob AC is between 1 and 120 for mobs levels 1-42 in that book. This means in-era AC values are certainly not 300+ for mobs that are level 45+, like the P99 Wiki says.

"Typical skill level" for a mob levels 35-44 is listed as 185, which matches Defense skill scaling of 5 * level, similar to how players scale their Defense skill.

The strategy guide does have a number of errors in it, but I think the raw number values are probably more trustworthy. This is because the strategy guide writers were probably given spreadsheets of data by the Everquest developers, and the strategy guide writers transcribed them. Many of the inaccuracies in the strategy guide stem more from misunderstandings of concepts that are more complex than mere numbers.

I gave the range of 1AC -115 AC, where 1AC would be level 1, and 115AC would be level 50. A level 30 mob is probably around 60 AC.

For the Defense skill it looks like 5 * Mob Level with the same skill caps as a Warrior roughly speaking.

I could do something like auto scale those stats based on level, but some mobs probably do have higher AC than normal. The "raid boss" of a lower level dungeon like Splitpaw may have higher stats than the average. People may complain their DPS parse is off if they happen to parse a mob like that.

That's why I am leaving the AC and Defense skill open for people to play with for now, with general guidelines.