sk starting points

[Ripqozko]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You cannot say things like:


And then try to claim people prefer hole over other camps lol.

I'm saying they are always open people are just bad and wait in kc, that's not the camps fault

[Vexenu]

DSM has yet to articulate a compelling argument or provide any actual evidence for his contention that the added mana from 20 INT confers a meaningful advantage for an Iksar SK. His only points are literally, "You should pump INT because it's harder to cap" and "It could theoretically give you enough extra mana to FD and save your life one day". But neither of these statements are logical arguments for pumping INT over STR:

1) CHA is the hardest stat for an SK to cap, so why not pump it? The answer is obvious: because it doesn't confer enough of an advantage to do so. The same logic applies to INT in this case.

2) Pumping INT just because you might one day get off an extra FD from it makes no sense. Theoretically, a lot of things might happen in EQ. Theoretically, extra STR might also make the narrow difference between life and death in some bizarre, highly improbable scenario. Or extra DEX might give you an Epic proc that saves your life. Or extra STA might give you just enough buffer not to die before a CH lands. Because of this, a theoretical argument for INT is no more valid than a theoretical argument for any other stat, most especially STR.

Why? Because STR is the only stat that provides IRREFUTABLE AND CONCRETE benefits both IN and OUT of combat, as has been exhaustively demonstrated in this thread. Whether the precise value is 4 or 5% added DPS is irrelevant, as is how many extra kills this might generate per hour in your tortured examples. The point is that this benefit exists. It is real. You cannot handwave it away. It is a real benefit that can be objectively proven. Added carry weight is also a real, concrete benefit. There is no argument against it. Carrying more weight provides meaningful value. Everyone who has played EQ understands this intuitively.

In contrast, there remains no way to demonstrate any sort of conclusive value from the extra mana provided by INT. SKs do not EVER dump their mana 100-0 in the way that a Wizard, Druid or Cleric regularly does, or the way that another caster might occasionally have need to do. Good SKs spend most of their active playtime hovering between 25% and 75% mana. They leave enough reserve in the tank to account for any emergencies, while ensuring that they don't waste any mana regen by sitting around at full mana. Because of this, adding extra mana on top of their mana pool provides little in the way of value to begin with, and whatever value it does provide simply cannot be accounted for accurately. It's like if your car holds holds enough gasoline to drive 500 miles without filling up, but you never drive more than 50 miles at a time. In this case, expanding your gas tank makes NO SENSE and provides you zero value. And that goes exactly the same for expanding the SK's mana pool by pumping INT in this scenario.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Ripqozko [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm saying they are always open people are just bad and wait in kc, that's not the camps fault

I am not blaming camps. I am simply pointing out camp distributions.

If most people prefer camps that have low mob counts and 30 minute respawn times, that means those camps are what people prefer to do. Your DPS is going to have diminishing returns.

[Lune]

Yep, and then KC gets cleared out and everyone gets shit XP. Apparently people should be gearing and allocating stats based on AFK camps and shitty overcrowded zones? Someone should tell OP lol

[Ripqozko]

Originally Posted by Lune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yep, and then KC gets cleared out and everyone gets shit XP. Apparently people should be gearing and allocating stats based on AFK camps and shitty overcrowded zones? Someone should tell OP lol

Yea he's just insufferable can't have a conversation with him good luck to you

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Ripqozko [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yea he's just insufferable can't have a conversation with him good luck to you

As per usual, when you realize you are wrong, you go back to insults.

I am really not sure why you think that respawn timers are not a significant factor for a ton of camps on P99. Popular ones at that. This is basic knowledge.

[Lune]

I had a dorm-mate with aspergers in college; sometimes he'd argue about something easily verifiable like the date something happened, and when pressed on it, he'd just continue to deny, and start laughing nervously, continuing to deny something plainly evident, like on some level he knew he was wrong but just couldn't bring his brain wiring to admit it.

[Troxx]

Ok so now that we have established that
-20 str gave 4.3% more dps
-that 4.3% is significant (about the same as 9% more worn haste which most would give a lot for)
-that math is math

Goalposts have been shifted …

And now we’re saying that more dps is not relevant because you’re gonna run out of mobs anyways?

And if you ran out of mobs how is 20int doing anything at all for you??

If anything it weakens the argument for intelligence. If you’re out of mobs sitting and waiting on respawns - you’re never using that extra 30-100 mana from having a slightly larger pool … …

But please carry on!




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[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Lune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I had a dorm-mate with aspergers in college; sometimes he'd argue about something easily verifiable like the date something happened, and when pressed on it, he'd just continue to deny, and start laughing nervously, continuing to deny something plainly evident, like on some level he knew he was wrong but just couldn't bring his brain wiring to admit it.

If it is easy to verify, please show me how many kills per hour you can get at the camps you believe to be most popular.

Also, please show us why you think everybody is constantly playing in these high volume areas, when even Ripqozko admits places like the Hole are fairly empty.

If you were correct, you should be seeing the Hole with a lot more people at all times of day.

I have already admitted to being wrong about various things multiple times in this thread. Other posters (including yourself) resort to trolling instead when they are confronted with the possibility of being wrong. Perhaps you are the one who cannot admit they are wrong, even when it is easily verifiable?

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by Ripqozko [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

People just sit at KC and pray they get a group because they are bad, these other good camps are always open. Surely even you aren't this dumb. Maybe you are

Meh maybe they are trying to finish our level 59 on their cleric and don’t have more than 30-90 minutes to play per session.

KC is trivial but unfortunately there aren’t people readily available in other zones to group with on a limited play schedule.

I sat a week’s worth of 60 minute sessions in seb. It was either empty or there were 3 level 60s farming fungis.

At least in KC I can log in and either quickly hop in a group or invite another random at the zone in and get the xp bar a bit closer to Aegolism [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]