Who is the best car/truck manufacturer?

[Byue]

scroll down a bit, look at the pictures. these are our roads. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Gravydoo II]

Originally Posted by Mblake1981 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A good engine is a good engine, that is not my beefs. My beef is taking an established idea and doing that. They could have easily made a new model of car. They stuck the Supra on it because of the reasons, not all of them legit in my eyes.

When it comes to Japanese, American, German (whichever), prefer them to be from their country. That is getting harder to do these days I suppose. Japan like everyone else has their own quirks. When you hodge podge everything that is what you get.

I have a similar complaint with multiplatform standards in Windows gaming, which also seeks to remove the 'Windows' part of the equation.

You know how much money it cost to develop that car??? Billions of dollars. Billions. If you could half your costs, share the wealth, and develop/share technology with BMW, wouldnt you??? Like, BMW could take the GT3 championship. If you could get BMW to help, wouldnt you?? Its not like they asked fiat... they didnt ask buick.

The toyota idea of building cars goes way back. They are an island nation with hardly any natural resources. These people were making swords from sand because there was no iron ore to be mined. Anyways, they see natural resources are precious and should be used sparingly to make the absolute best product you possibly can because you might not have more tomorrow. BMW, not sure. Pivot round the hips, ultimate driving machine and all that but I think they got a little muddled on that recently. Ive only had 1 bmw and it wasnt an E so my views are skewed.

[Mblake1981]

Originally Posted by Gravydoo II [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You know how much money it cost to develop that car??? Billions of dollars. Billions. If you could half your costs, share the wealth, and develop/share technology with BMW, wouldnt you??? Like, BMW could take the GT3 championship. If you could get BMW to help, wouldnt you??

The toyota idea of building cars goes way back. They are an island nation with hardly any natural resources. These people were making swords from sand because there was no iron ore to be mined. Anyways, they see natural resources are precious and should be used sparingly to make the absolute best product you possibly can because you might not have more tomorrow. BMW, not sure. Pivot round the hips, ultimate driving machine and all that but I think they got a little muddled on that recently. Ive only had 1 bmw and it wasnt an E so my views are skewed.

1. Again, a good engine is a good engine, that is not my beefs.

2. Gravydoo, did you just go into a small but detailed history of that people?
I mean, I get the "used sparingly to make the best" when it comes to the 2jz engines,
which were all in house Toyoda (and rumored help from Yamaha)

But none of that explains setting aside the things that make it interesting. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Note: I also like the Nissan RB series.

[Gravydoo II]

Originally Posted by Mblake1981 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

1. Again, a good engine is a good engine, that is not my beefs.

2. Gravydoo, did you just go into a small but detailed history of that people?
I mean, I get the "used sparingly to make the best" when it comes to the 2jz engines,
which were all in house Toyoda (and rumored help from Yamaha)

But none of that explains setting aside the things that make it interesting. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Note: I also like the Nissan RB series.

Yeah, let BMW do all the heavy lifting. Toyota will tune it up, make it sexy. It was developed WITH toyota. Wasnt just BMW said heres your engine take it or leave it.

What did they set aside? Its a decent car. Its not 300k. Its 40k. A corvette is 50k, 100 more horse power. You are getting what you paid for and thats a good thing. BMW engine or not. The spirit of it is toyota. You think they'd put a piece of shit in their flag ship car?? Hell nah. Its sort of a committee car, but if you aint pagani or konigsegg, they all are.

Yes, I did just go into a small history of japanese craftsmanship and manufacturing.

[Gravydoo II]

Like I hear you. I want toyota to make a japanese dodge viper. I do. They wont though. Its just so unsightly and vulgar in a conservative society like that. They gotta make a car they can sell, in japan. lol.

[Danth]

How well do the 2jz engines actually work day to day? Mere strength doesn't necessarily impress. I have bad memories of stuff like GM's Northstar, which was quite strongly built--derived from racing engines--and perfectly capable of withstanding very high outputs....but which was also a POS for street cars due to problems like head bolt separation and excessive carbon buildup. That engine, by itself, probably sealed Cadillac's fate during the late 90's and 00's.

Danth

[Mblake1981]

Originally Posted by Gravydoo II [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yeah, let BMW do all the heavy lifting. Toyota will tune it up, make it sexy. It was developed WITH toyota. Wasnt just BMW said heres your engine take it or leave it.

What did they set aside? Its a decent car. Its not 300k. Its 40k. A corvette is 50k, 100 more horse power. You are getting what you paid for and thats a good thing. BMW engine or not. The spirit of it is toyota. You think they'd put a piece of shit in their flag ship car?? Hell nah. Its sort of a committee car, but if you aint pagani or konigsegg, they all are.

Yes, I did just go into a small history of japanese craftsmanship and manufacturing.

1. Guy, like I said in the first post, that I would be ok with that if they made a new model. Because it is interesting. But they put it in a Supra, which was as far as I know an all Japanese performance car. It's like someone trying to tell me Bioshock is a Windows game. You already know my scowls forming.


2. What did they sit aside? they sat aside an all Japanese design. My complaint is not about the price of the object or what social class it would appeal to, nothing queer like that at all. You are getting what you paid for, an interesting co-design between Toyoda and BMW. I am sure the quality is fine, my complaint is not about the quality.

Your comment about a committee car. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by Mblake1981 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Japan like everyone else has their own quirks. When you hodge podge everything that is what you get.

I have a similar complaint with multiplatform standards in Windows gaming, which also seeks to remove the 'Windows' part of the equation.

[Mblake1981]

Originally Posted by Gravydoo II [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Like I hear you. I want toyota to make a japanese dodge viper. I do. They wont though. Its just so unsightly and vulgar in a conservative society like that. They gotta make a car they can sell, in japan. lol.

I don't know what that means, but here is this.

http://www.speedhunters.com/2014/09/...led-2jz-mopar/

[Mblake1981]

Originally Posted by Danth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

How well do the 2jz engines actually work day to day? Mere strength doesn't necessarily impress. I have bad memories of stuff like GM's Northstar, which was quite strongly built--derived from racing engines--and perfectly capable of withstanding very high outputs....but which was also a POS for street cars due to problems like head bolt separation and excessive carbon buildup. That engine, by itself, probably sealed Cadillac's fate during the late 90's and 00's.

Danth

You are talking practicality and good sense, my apologies Danth as I am treating this as just mere interest. If I had the money for these things I wouldn't care all that much.

I drive a honda Si because it runs forever, but that has been true of Japanese products, even 4x4 'redneck' trucks since the 90s.

JZ engines were in many Japanese Toyoda models.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_JZ_engine

[Gravydoo II]

They are reliable. If kept up on maintenance, like anything. They do have some issues like the timing belt, its a belt and with age they stretch. It can jump a tooth, bend a valve or two. The tensioner goes bad after a while. The engines are all 20+ years old so this is life. Valve stem seals get not so sealed after 20 years. Their oil pumps are another weak point. The seals inside the accessories, pretty much. If you want it to last and work properly, needs to be maintained properly. Ive never owned one but had a few customers, my brother has one.