Shamwowi's Shaman Race Guide

[XeroKill]

I stopped reading around page 11 because a very evident pattern made itself clear. If I may offer a small piece of criticism, DeathsSilkyMist... I think most people are actually frustrated by your posting style and attitude, rather than your information. To be blunt, you are relentless and egotistical. You respond to every single objection and in so many cases where you could simply accept the exchange for what it was, instead you double down, reiterate your point and you just won't let it go. I truly do not believe that anyone is arguing with your evidence or even your opinion at this point... they are arguing with you because of your ceaseless, holier-than-thou need to substantiate your findings and when coupled with your faux presentation of decorum, it really gets right in a person's craw. Mine included. I will tell you that I do not disagree with anything you have stated in terms of the actual debate and I find your arguments at least cogent and worthy of consideration... and yet I still find myself feeling compelled to argue with you after every post I read.

I mean absolutely no disrespect and I value very highly your contributions to this topic, but man... you really gotta learn when to let sleeping dogs lie. I also mean no injury or insult, even though it may seem otherwise. I mean this as sincere criticism. Please take a moment to reflect and be conscious of yourself. Read through your own posts and ask yourself, "Was that really necessary? Did that serve the truth or did it serve my own sense of right?" Count the number of times you say "My point" in this thread alone. That should set off some alarm bells.

Even if you are factually correct in the absolutely most technical sense, people have pointed out numerous mitigating factors that transcend it all, especially because the disparity is so trivial as to be barely worth mentioning. This is the part where you respond with "My point is that in a min/max..." just stop man. It doesn't matter. You presented your information, you argued your detractors, and you have added to the substance of the game and our knowledge. Now let the people absorb your information, let them offer their counters, and let the information do its job. You don't have to protect it. It is not YOU! YOU are not it!

My 2cp, for whatever that is worth to you. I won't weigh in on the argument itself because everyone has missed the only real argument and that is the Barbarian Female has the only set of tits worth looking at! End of debate!

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by XeroKill [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I stopped reading around page 11 because a very evident pattern made itself clear. If I may offer a small piece of criticism, DeathsSilkyMist... I think most people are actually frustrated by your posting style and attitude, rather than your information. To be blunt, you are relentless and egotistical. You respond to every single objection and in so many cases where you could simply accept the exchange for what it was, instead you double down, reiterate your point and you just won't let it go. I truly do not believe that anyone is arguing with your evidence or even your opinion at this point... they are arguing with you because of your ceaseless, holier-than-thou need to substantiate your findings and when coupled with your faux presentation of decorum, it really gets right in a person's craw. Mine included. I will tell you that I do not disagree with anything you have stated in terms of the actual debate and I find your arguments at least cogent and worthy of consideration... and yet I still find myself feeling compelled to argue with you after every post I read.

I mean absolutely no disrespect and I value very highly your contributions to this topic, but man... you really gotta learn when to let sleeping dogs lie. I also mean no injury or insult, even though it may seem otherwise. I mean this as sincere criticism. Please take a moment to reflect and be conscious of yourself. Read through your own posts and ask yourself, "Was that really necessary? Did that serve the truth or did it serve my own sense of right?" Count the number of times you say "My point" in this thread alone. That should set off some alarm bells.

Even if you are factually correct in the absolutely most technical sense, people have pointed out numerous mitigating factors that transcend it all, especially because the disparity is so trivial as to be barely worth mentioning. This is the part where you respond with "My point is that in a min/max..." just stop man. It doesn't matter. You presented your information, you argued your detractors, and you have added to the substance of the game and our knowledge. Now let the people absorb your information, let them offer their counters, and let the information do its job. You don't have to protect it. It is not YOU! YOU are not it!

My 2cp, for whatever that is worth to you. I won't weigh in on the argument itself because everyone has missed the only real argument and that is the Barbarian Female has the only set of tits worth looking at! End of debate!

Thank you for the two cents, I appreciate your concern[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] However, your long post fails to mention how people keep posting innacurate information. If I just let that go, someone reading may assume it is correct. I would rather be off-putting and helpful, instead of letting people spout nonsense, even if it makes me look bad. People read my guide to learn, not to mull over the finer points of my personality. I am flattered you care though!

[XeroKill]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

*snip* I appreciate your concern[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] However, your long post fails to mention how people keep posting innacurate information. If I just let that go, someone reading may assume it is correct. *snip*

The irony is palpable.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by XeroKill [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The irony is palpable.

Except it isn't, because you have done nothing to prove I have posted incorrect information. I would be happy to correct any mistake, if you can do more than simply claim it is a mistake. Your claim means nothing without evidence[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by Plumpys [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The dude put some work in giving different scenarios and which race prospers the most in each. I would expect him to defend it when most replies have been about fashion or other troll like behavior. Balar’s postings seem personal. Even his response in the other post about how FSI doesn’t stop interrupts only stuns. Well when you’re stunned, you get interrupted so that input is mute.

Dude contributed to some useful information and supplied why/how. What’s your beef man? And with reading your post, I’ll say nice vocabulary. Given how you wrote it, that seems to be the main thing you were trying to have the readers get out of it.

Thank you for the support, and the understanding! In regards to Baler, he simply is too biased in his opinion to admit he is wrong. I have asked him repeatedly to prove the claims he has made, but he has yet to do so. I sincerely wish he can make good with proof on those claims, as I love to learn new things.

Originally Posted by XeroKill [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Be fair at least. I have absolutely no beef with him as a person or his information. I was trying to help him understand the animosity. I did not dispute his information and I completely agree that he has contributed a significant work to the community. I made it a point to say as much. I was trying to help him understand that the resistance he is experiencing has nothing to do with the issue of Shaman race selection even if all the words on the page say otherwise. It is very much his dogmatic defense of his position and the false sincerity he exudes in his responses. I can see someone wanting to defend their work but at some point, after all the arguments have been made, restated, reiterated and then said again in a different way... you just have to let it go.

I can't speak to the issue with Baler, and I agree that it seems that at some point their disagreement became personal for both of them, even if DeathsSilkyMist won't admit it on his part. At least Baler's sincerity cannot be questioned because he doesn't equivocate.

As for my vocabulary... I mean, that is just how I think, speak and type. I make no apologies for my elocution. I think your need to bring it up says more about you than my choice of verbiage says about me. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

So, at the risk of running afoul of my own advice, I bid this thread and its participants good day.

I understand where you are coming from, and I am not offended at all. On the contrary, I was sincere when I said I appreciate the concern. I will say it again, my guide is here so people can get to the facts quickly. For some strange reason, a lot of people on P99 make this discussion about Shaman race mystical in some fashion, when it really is not. I do not support those kinds of mystical arguments, and I will not sit by and let them undermine the facts. This guide is not here for people to study my personality, it is here so people can learn without sifting through pages of nonsense. It is not my fault people keep trying to troll this thread or post nonsense in the hopes that it will undermine what I have shown. If you want to disprove something in my guide, bring the evidence[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by kjs86z [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

a whole lot of words for:

ogre for end game solo

barb/iksar for fashion

troll for everything else

This really isn't the full picture. Trolls are not the best raid only Shaman, or the best guild bot, for example.

[kjs86z]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This really isn't the full picture. Trolls are not the best raid only Shaman, or the best guild bot, for example.

Except it is 100% the full picture, complete and entirely accurate.

Its borderline nuts how you'll argue every little thing down to the most insignificant detail. Its 2021. No one cares.

I'm sorry you're hurt that I was able to summarize your painfully long-winded essay and endless nit-picky responses into 3 lines and 13 words.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by kjs86z [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Except it is 100% the full picture, complete and entirely accurate.

Its borderline nuts how you'll argue every little thing down to the most insignificant detail. Its 2021. No one cares.

I'm sorry you're hurt that I was able to summarize your painfully long-winded essay and endless nit-picky responses into 3 lines and 13 words.

I am not hurt at all, and you are factually incorrect[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] Next time put a bit more effort into your lazily written summary, so people can get the correct information.

Nobody cares about your opinion on what is significant to you. People want the objectice facts, so they can make up their own mind on what is significant to their playstyle.

[Crede]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I am not hurt at all, and you are factually incorrect[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] Next time put a bit more effort into your lazily written summary, so people can get the correct information.

Nobody cares about your opinion on what is significant to you. People want the objectice facts, so they can make up their own mind on what is significant to their playstyle.

But your facts aren’t objective, lol! Your guide just explains scenarios a shaman can encounter, then you state whether or not you think a particular racial is useful and then you tally up the results. This is 100% subjective. If you made a poll of every one of those scenarios and asked people to vote, you’d get vastly different results.

For instance I happen to feel that FSI is overall useless on raids in normal situations. We’re it that useful, people would be making a lot more ogres for raid purposes. Shamans aren’t getting focused down left and right trying to slow stuff, it’s rarely useful. And you even admitted iksars were the best raiding shaman. I actually wonder if you flipped that one to useful after thinking oh shit iksars won in my tally system.

With that one change of opinion in that scenario, that actually gives iksars the most points. So by your tally logic they are the best shaman now.

Please stop spreading your opinions as facts. Nobody needs to provide this new and improved secret counter evidence against ogres. One just simply needs to look at your guide and tally up the scenarios themselves and decide which works best for them. A good scenario calculator your guide is, objective truth it is not.