Please check my math on Troll vs Ogre Shaman

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

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Great show!

[sonofbaal]

two things will continue until the end of time

1. Skyrim memes
2. Ogre vs Troll debate
3. How many Turpors have you saved being Troll? Take your /played time and multiply it by your health regen

[Sabin76]

Originally Posted by sonofbaal [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

3. How many Turpors have you saved being Troll? Take your /played time and multiply it by your health regen

You spent your entire /played being under 100% health...?

[busted]

This thread is amazing. The back and forth is very good ��

Any sham with torpor will be great.

That said, I prefer Ogre sham. The frontal stun immunity makes a big different IMO.

Especially in scenarios like this:

1. Engage mob
2. Slow resist
3. Proceed in getting smacked
4. Re-cast slow. This has much lower chance of being interrupted due to FSI
5. Saving HPs instead of continued smackage.
6. Winning

Those HPs lost from unslowed mob (due to stun interrupts) add up.

I wish I could snare like Troll but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Ogres can snare but need to use un-rechargable items to do so

- https://wiki.project1999.com/Ball_of_Burlap_Yarn
- https://wiki.project1999.com/Scepter_of_the_Forlorn

or high-end raid items

https://wiki.project1999.com/Sap_Encrusted_Branch
https://wiki.project1999.com/Spear_of_Constriction

[Jibartik]

Originally Posted by sonofbaal [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So there is a lot of debate on Trolls vs Ogre for shaman, so I wanted to see just how much the troll regen really mattered. The objective is to find out which class is more efficient with mana , either in its regen or saving it.

Consider the following:

level 50:

Cani mana/hp ratio = .56
https://wiki.project1999.com/Cannibalize

ergo 50 hp turns into 28.

The Troll regen at level 50 is 1/4 (stand/sit) MORE hp than Ogre

Ergo, at level 50 , Troll canidancing will generate 2.24 effective mana per tick (.56*4), or 22.4 mana per minute, or 1344 mana per hour. How much is that?

4 evenomed bolts = 5112 dmg
9 gheals for = 2430 healing


Now comes the real question. In an hour , will you avoid that much damage of 2430 healing, by getting off a root/slow that would have gotten interrupted by stun?


Lets look at level 60:

Troll hp regen is is 7/11 respectively MORE than Ogre.
Which cana you would use the convert is going to depend on Kunark vs Vel, and how much time you want to waste canidancing. Lets go with the dirty quick canni3 with a ratio of .513 vels cani4 for .554


Kunark era quick = .513 * 7/11 =
for standing: 3.591mana/tick = 35.91 mana/min = 2154 mana/hour ,
for sitting : 5.643m/tick = 56.43m/min =3386 mana/hour .

Kunark era using CanI = .56*7/11 =
for standing: 3.92m/t = 39.2m/min = 2352mana/hour
for sitting : 6.16m/t = 61.6m/min = 3696 mana/hour

Vel cani 4 = .554
for standing : 3.899m/t = 38.99m/m = 2339mana/hour
for sitting: 6.09m/t = 60.9m/m= 3654 mana/hour

So how much is lets say 3600 mana end game?
about 24,300 healing per hour with turpor
and about 17,000 more dmg with Pox per hour.


The real question then ,is that worth it still?

Consider a single round of extra dmg you have to endure to root, lets say mid 50's thats around 400 dmg. How many times per hour does that happen? How many times in an hour do you have to take it in the face because you got bashed. Well in order to equate to 3600 mana per hour , you would have to take around 7000 dmg.

Of course are not soloing/tanking , then that is all moot. However, you cannot calculate saving your life because you got off a gate/root. But maybe , one might argue , you would have more mana as a troll , and could get off that gate/root that saves the day.

Finally there is the issue of the snare, which a Troll gets, and has utility when snare isnt available. Esp in velious when you can root and snare mobs.


Thoughts?Comment below , don't forget to leave a like ,share, subscribe, ring that bell, pull that lever, flip that switch, and toggle that dongle.

a level 60 shaman is unkillable, but by 1 of 2 things: they are stunned, or failed a resist.

So ogre>troll [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

edit: whoah this thread is 13 pages lol

Originally Posted by sonofbaal [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

2. Ogre vs Troll debate

I have a theory on that, it's because:

1. Ogre's are better.
2. Trolls look cooler.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Jibartik [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

a level 60 shaman is unkillable, but by 1 of 2 things: they are stunned, or failed a resist.

So ogre>troll [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

edit: whoah this thread is 13 pages lol



I have a theory on that, it's because:

1. Ogre's are better.
2. Trolls look cooler.

100% agree on all of this. Ogre Frontal Stun Immunity is better, but I do prefer the male Troll model and animations. Trolls have really cool looking armor sets, and the male Troll's animations look way better than most other races animations. I never understood how they could get a Troll's animations looking just right, but everyone else looks very stiff.

[Oddbaal]

I’m so proud of you my son

[kjs86z]

Originally Posted by kjs86z [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

To summarize 13 pages:

- Ogre if your focus is on soloing end game difficult targets.

- Troll if you're min/max but don't plan on doing the toughest stuff solo frequently (prefer grouping, raiding, etc).

- Barb if you want to level faster and/or look cool (polar bear master species IG and IRL).

- Iksar if you like the aesthetics and/or just want to start + RP in the same zone as your necro / monk duo / trio (pretty weak argument but hey you do you man).

oh hey look im still correct

[greenspectre]

Originally Posted by kjs86z [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

oh hey look im still correct

Hi still correct, I'm dad.

[Naethyn]

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Only one shaman race gets boot buckles. Also, the kunark experience is one of the best in game, and the shaman line of quests are great.