Green Class Distribution

[Tywulf]

Originally Posted by Graahle [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Accepting power leveling and pixel packages to swap from my Aradune Rogue to Green Rogue.

^^^

[Loadsamoney]

Need more Paladins.

[cd288]

Originally Posted by Rafiell [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't understand how im one of the very few SKs on the server, there seems to be lots of us in my guild...although I haven't been on much the last few months

Your 40% (or if you’re a Troll or Ogre 60+%) exp penalty probably has something to do with it

[Loadsamoney]

Originally Posted by cd288 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Your 40% (or if you’re a Troll or Ogre 60+%) exp penalty probably has something to do with it

People still haven't adopted the whole "play what you want to play, not just what is statistically the best."

[DMN]

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

In my experience, class distribution for the majority of 1999 was approximately:

01. Warrior (nearly every race has access to the class, and testosterone-driven dummies naturally like to be whatever looks physically the strongest, so inherently it was everywhere)
02. Ranger (the "cool kid" class, tons of people wanted to roleplay as one because of fantasy novels they read, and the class was actually considered very strong for awhile because of having the same equipment as Warriors and spells on top of it)
03. Cleric (people liked being supreme healers)
04. Wizard (they were touted as the "best damage caster", causing many people picked the class early on)
05. Druid (plenty of nature lovers, very well rounded skillset)
06. Paladin (seemed rather popular early on to me, both because of roleplay and because hybrids seemed to be good)
07. Necromancer (a lot of people were scared of being an "evil" character, but the power level of the class was apparent)
08. Shaman (looked weirder than Cleric/Druid, so the least played healer, but still it's still a healer with SoW)
09. Magician (not as many people understood the power level of pets)
10. Bard (more niche, but I saw a decent amount of them)
11. Rogue (a solid amount of people were into the class concept, but the actual gameplay could be disappointing; even needing to wait until Level 10 to get Backstab made quite a few players give up on it at a low level)
12. Enchanter (basically nobody understood the full power of the class, even utilizing Mesmerize properly was something a lot of groups didn't understand until the later part of 1999. It just seemed like the least sexy caster to most people when the game was new, especially at lower levels, although Whirl Till You Hurl being OP was an early notch in their belt, and Enchanters gradually continued to get more popular)
13. Monk (the weight limit thing was a turn-off, lack of racial selection, FD pulling wasn't well understood, and their combat ability at low/mid levels wasn't special enough to make them attractive over other options)
14. Shadowknight (I remember it being very niche, many people were scared of being evil, and the class lacked a clear identity, so a lot of people already choosing an evil race probably just picked Warrior as more understandable melee character. There was actually a "difficulty level" message in the game when making a character and I think Shadowknight was always listed as "high difficulty")

For the first year it Was more like:

High pop classes: druid, necro
Decent pop classes: warrior, cleric, SK, paladin, ranger. wizard, mage
Low pop classes rogue, shaman, monk
It's a unicorn! pop classes: bard, enchanter

By the end of kunark:

High pop classes: druid, necro
Decent pop classes: warrior, cleric, ranger, monk, shaman, rogue, bard
Low pop classes : SK, paladin, enchanter, wizard, mage
It's a unicorn! pop classes: NA

[cd288]

Originally Posted by Loadsamoney [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

People still haven't adopted the whole "play what you want to play, not just what is statistically the best."

I mean I’m not obsessed with min/maxing my exp but I also do like to get SOME progress out of my very limited play time lol

[Zuranthium]

Originally Posted by DMN [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

For the first year it Was more like:

High pop classes: druid, necro
Decent pop classes: warrior, cleric, SK, paladin, ranger. wizard, mage
Low pop classes rogue, shaman, monk
It's a unicorn! pop classes: bard, enchanter

By the end of kunark:

High pop classes: druid, necro
Decent pop classes: warrior, cleric, ranger, monk, shaman, rogue, bard
Low pop classes : SK, paladin, enchanter, wizard, mage
It's a unicorn! pop classes: NA

Necro was never one of the top population classes in my experience. It should have been in 1999, if everyone understood how OP it was (and if so many people weren't scared of "being evil"), but that wasn't the case. Perhaps on the high-end levels during 1999 there might a high amount of Necros (but not at the end of Kunark...), because of how much easier the class was able to level, but if you look at other levels I don't think they were so widespread.

Enchanter as a low population class by the end of Kunark isn't accurate to me. The term "holy trinity" (referring to having a Warrior, Enchanter, and Cleric in your party) was coined during Kunark. Enchanters were getting more popular by the month in 2000, people were understanding the power of their buffs and crowd control. Clarity was literally called "crack".

I also find it strange you say Bard grew in popularity a lot between 1999 and the end of Kunark. I feel like they got less popular during that period, partially because more people were learning about their exp penalty, and partially because other classes (especially Enchanter) were getting more popular. I would say Bard got a bit more popular again during Velious, because more people were learning to mass AOE kite, but they were always one of the lower population classes.

[DMN]

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Necro was never one of the top population classes in my experience. It should have been in 1999, if everyone understood how OP it was (and if so many people weren't scared of "being evil"), but that wasn't the case. Perhaps on the high-end levels during 1999 there might a high amount of Necros (but not at the end of Kunark...), because of how much easier the class was able to level, but if you look at other levels I don't think they were so widespread.

A lot of wizards quit and moved over to mage/necro, and quite a few mages and, heck, even some degree a few disillusioned druids also moved to necros over the first year. Necros probably weren't at the top the first couple months but would rapidly start to climb up in population. it was a simple case of "if you can't beat em, join em."

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Enchanter as a low population class by the end of Kunark isn't accurate to me. The term "holy trinity" (referring to having a Warrior, Enchanter, and Cleric in your party) was coined during Kunark. Enchanters were getting more popular by the month in 2000, people were understanding the power of their buffs and crowd control. Clarity was literally called "crack".

Enchanters were getting more powerful and people were wanting them in groups more often, indeed, but almost exclusively for CC and buffs. Most of the people who would want to play this type of passive character would have already rolled up a priest class or a bard. And generally people tend to like to play something a bit different on their "main alt". So they will roll up rogues, monks, warriors, etc, not an enchanter. In EQ the holy trinity for a group might have been a tank/enc/cleric, for raiding it was warrior/rogue/cleric. And by a year in a lot of people started to focus a lot on the hopes/intention of raiding. Since that was about all you had to do once you had maxed level and got some good gear.

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I also find it strange you say Bard grew in popularity a lot between 1999 and the end of Kunark. I feel like they got less popular during that period, partially because more people were learning about their exp penalty, and partially because other classes (especially Enchanter) were getting more popular. I would say Bard got a bit more popular again during Velious, because more people were learning to mass AOE kite, but they were always one of the lower population classes.

Reasons why bards became a lot more popular:
1. they got debatably the best epic in the game
2. People had begun to fully debunk the claim that bards were just group-only characters, who would often find themselves asleep at the keyboard playing the manasong.
3. AoE kiting became viable for people due to improve internet connections, making bards the fastest levelers in the game. The massive kunark outdoor zones also helped in this regard.
4. The general "raiding guild theory" back then was you wanted 1 bard for every 5-6 members of their guild. Bards ended up being more sought after in guilds than clerics because there were already a lot of clerics.
5. While You could easily get druid or wizard port to kunark only a bard in the group could move you around kunark at warp speed onc you arrived.
6. Fashionquest.

[Zuranthium]

I don't think your perspective of the whole playerbase back then is all that accurate. Most people were not raid-focused in Kunark. They were just trying to get to level 60 or trying to figure things out. Virtually nobody had a Bard epic in Kunark era and I don't at all remember the playerbase being amazed by that epic specifically and rushing to make a Bard because they heard about it.

I wouldn't call Enchanter "passive" either. Constantly mezzing a bunch of mobs is quite an active role, and I don't think mainly only people who were already playing a healer or Bard were the type who would do Enchanter, nor would those people be actively dissuaded from making an Enchanter as the class grew in renown. I'd say it's the other way around - some people who played Bard actually switched to Enchanter because it was the stronger class. I don't think too many Enchanter players were switching to Bard, heh. Bard was always its own specific thing that appealed to a specific type of player. It had more melee ability than other casters and song twisting was a strenuous thing, so it felt different, and the roleplay aspect of the game in 1999 was quite strong. A significant amount of people who picked the class back then just wanted to roleplay as a musician/performer.

Originally Posted by DMN [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A lot of wizards quit and moved over to mage/necro, and quite a few mages and, heck, even some degree a few disillusioned druids also moved to necros over the first year. Necros probably weren't at the top the first couple months but would rapidly start to climb up in population. It was a simple case of "if you can't beat em, join em."

1 year after the launch of the game is not the "majority of 1999" period that I was talking about. Wizards definitely started declining in population for several reasons (and the introduction of the Play Nice Policy was a big one, because they were no longer allowed to actually use their burst damage in an advantageous way) but they were very popular during that earlier era. They were literally named "masters of magical damage" by Verant, which was reinforced by the Magician and Enchanter class descriptions saying "this class does not have the same offensive ability as the Wizard", so many new players picked Wizard on that basis alone, but the actual in-game play of being able to burst things down back then was also impressive, as were the teleports.

The thing about Necros back then is they were constantly being nerfed by the time more people were realizing just how OP the class was, and a lot of players simply didn't want to switch over to the class even if they understood they were OP. Necros were noticeably most OP at the higher levels and after more people had found out about giving the pets low-delay weapons, but people who were already in their high 30's/40's didn't want to just abandon the character they were already playing. Plus, the whole "evil" thing. A significant amount of the playerbase back then simply refused to group with Necromancers or "evil" characters, and they themselves didn't want to make an evil character because of being scared about being attacked by more NPC's out in the game world.

[DMN]

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't think your perspective of the whole playerbase back then is all that accurate. Most people were not raid-focused in Kunark. They were just trying to get to level 60 or trying to figure things out. Virtually nobody had a Bard epic in Kunark era and I don't at all remember the playerbase being amazed by that epic specifically and rushing to make a Bard because they heard about it.

By the end of kunark people weren't raid focused? Really? so why the massive exodus of hybrids? They had already played their characters to 50+why were they abandoning them? And with kunark there were tons of new tings to keep the bigger/uber guilds occupied while the 90% of other guilds could move in to the planes left largely vacant. raiding became massively more accessible to everyone.

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I wouldn't call Enchanter "passive" either. Constantly mezzing a bunch of mobs is quite an active role.

Well, I would, since the entire game is about killing shit and enchanters were never killing anything. It takes a certain type of person to play those roles.

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

1 year after the launch of the game is not the "majority of 1999" period that I was talking about.

I covered about 2 years, which is the majority of 99's scope.

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The thing about Necros back then is they were constantly being nerfed by the time more people were realizing just how OP the class was

Because tons of people were playing them. The squeaky wheel gets the grease but in verant's world the squeaking mouse got "greased" as well.

Verant primarily used 2 ways to determine class adjustments (AKA nerfs/buffs) 1. how many people are choosing to play the class, and 2. how do the players generally feel about said class. I have no clue why they didn't do like in beta and have highly knowledgeable people give them feedback, but it's the path they chose nonetheless.

So your class could be incredibly overpowered and still get buffs if the pop of your class was small and most people thought you weren't a very good class. This is EXACTLY what happened to shaman/bard/enchanters who ere already overpowered in vanilla.