Originally Posted by nilbog

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Dolalin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

They haven't even had a patch yet since I wrapped up the Classic ZEMs bug thread, maybe wait for that before you declare they aren't listening Loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Please don't take this the wrong way, because I have immense respect for you, but ... you just rolled onto this scene. This is not "Loramin's crusade to insult the devs", this is just Loramin stating how it's been for over half a decade. Prior to your ZEM thread (from what, a month or two ago?), there was ZERO dev interest whatsoever in all things ZEM-related, and again it was "community knowledge" (since 2011!) that they were not interested.

Now to be fair, Nilbog never said "we're making ZEMS unclassic!" ... because Nilbog never says anything ... especially about ZEMS. I mean, even his post here was literally one word ... and it was a question! Literally no one but Nilbog knows what the word "classic" means to him, and whether ANY exception (ZEM or otherwise) qualifies. And he doesn't talk.

I've been a forum addict for five-plus years, plus at one point I went back through old dev posts to compile the Rulings page. I'm fairly confident that if there had been even a single word (even a "sources?") about this topic, I would have seen it ... but I didn't. If you see something (like Kedge's ZEM) stay unclassic on a classic project for that long, and the devs won't talk about it, the logical assumption is: they don't want to fix it (and that's even if I didn't have wiki and forum text going way way back that further supports the idea). And again, read old forum posts: I'm far from the only one to have believed this.

And if you go through those old posts you know what else you'll find? People didn't believe Green would ever exist (let alone Teal) ... and yet you will find me in giant one-sided RnF arguments with people (for years) saying "Blue is beta" with no one believing me.

So ... if I'm willing to argue with the entire rest of the forum community, because I took the dev's word and they didn't ... I really don't think it's fair to characterize me as someone who doesn't listen to, or doesn't believe the devs.

I just believe the proof is in the pudding. For a very long time everything the devs have said and done has at indicated a strong desire to keep the ZEM status quo. Now that the fire of Green and Teal in in Nilbog's belly I want to believe he's interested in classic evidence and classic ZEMs, because like all the other long-timers here I've drunk the classic kool-aid.

But I'm just not going to assume that my hopes and dreams have come true because Nilbog made a one word question post: I'm waiting for him to tell me off here, or (much better yet) answer your thread with a patch, and then I will absolutely believe. But look, four years ago there was more evidence that Green was coming, than there was just a few months back that Nilbog would even consider ZEM changes. Maybe forgive me for wanting to see something before I assume things have done a U-turn after five years?