Best full group composition

[Morningbreath]

Originally Posted by fastboy21 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Inviting a druid JUST for the utility of ports is a mistake in a min/max group. Getting to a dungeon/camp is a one time-fixed cost. Having a better DPS toon is far better if you are min/maxing.

Are we talking about the same game? A dungeon camp may be a one-way trip for a caster who can gate out but not for melees. That's why people sit on the outer dungeon camps forever waiting for a spot to open up. Or they just give up and roll a caster.

Ask a cleric what they think about not having a backup healer. Poopsocking every night and healing through big pulls by yourself...that's another trip to the character select screen.

I just don't see the point in having a full regular group to do outdoor content. Leave that to the pugs.

[Twochain]

Iksar Monk (Tank/Pulls/Dps)
Enchanter
Shaman (Level 35+)
Cleric
Rogue
Rogue

[Teppler]

Shaman/chanter/monk is the holy trinity.

Otherwise I'd add necro then rogue.

[Teppler]

Originally Posted by Swish [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Necros are a better option than a wizard if played right..and by that I mean mana pumping, heals over time, sending the pet in every fight and applying a dot if its a mob with a lot of health. Doing undead stuff? A charmed undead pet is going to blow a wizard's Netflix game out of the park.

Problem is a lot of necros either don't realize their potential or just want to be lazy and think that by sending Kekeker in every fight counts as being useful in a group.

Necros can literally do anything mages and wizards can do in groups and better. Not to mention all the extra utility they have.

Necros are better and more effective nukers than mages and wizards because their mana regeneration is way higher.

Dps is higher with pets and exponentially higher with charmed pets.

Then necro has mez, snare, fd, dots and more.

[fastboy21]

Originally Posted by Bagger [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What about quests and such?

It won't really affect quests. I can't think of a single good rogue quest that is dark elf only...and if there is most good rogues can illusion dark elf or sneak to do turn in.

Same vice versa. I don't recall any good rogue quests that a dark elf can't do.

Maybe there is something I'm forgetting. I've never rolled a DE rogue, so maybe there is some racial/deity benefit in there somewhere that I'm unaware of. Certainly nothing game changing though.

[fastboy21]

Originally Posted by Morningbreath [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Are we talking about the same game? A dungeon camp may be a one-way trip for a caster who can gate out but not for melees. That's why people sit on the outer dungeon camps forever waiting for a spot to open up. Or they just give up and roll a caster.

Ask a cleric what they think about not having a backup healer. Poopsocking every night and healing through big pulls by yourself...that's another trip to the character select screen.

I just don't see the point in having a full regular group to do outdoor content. Leave that to the pugs.

If you have a good grp of smart players playing the right classes and you pick the right camp you will rarely need to evac. Again, I'm NOT saying its useless. For most groups it is extremely useful...and I even recommended druid to the OP. Same with back up healing and same with invising folks to your camp. Druid does help with all those tasks, but it isn't a needed thing if folks play right.

As a min/max grp, you're way better off risking not having evac and just dragging/96 rezzing. In terms of min/maxing time I'm 100% certain that the group that takes a pure DPS class over a druid is going to level faster. Lvl'ing faster is only one standard, but it a good one.

The truth of the matter is that taking a player of ANY class that knows how to play and isn't afk is a better choice than taking the best possible class if the player is a total idiot. The whole discussion is on ideal settings, ceteris paribus.

[Danth]

Disclaimer: I didn't read the entire thread.

For a pre-built group I recommend building in a certain element of redundancy instead of focusing on a min-max composition for specific tasks. Odds are you'll lose at least some of your group to attrition along the way, and it wouldn't be much fun if you lose, for example, your only healer.

For doing dungeons in a group with no repeat characters, the major jobs you want to have are a defensive melee (tank), a feign death puller/scouter, crowd control, debuffs (mainly slow), and healing. My preferred 5-man composition with the above considerations in mind is as follows: Shadow Knight, Monk, Shaman, Enchanter, Cleric. This composition provides redundancy for all jobs mentioned prior so you can lose any single person without crippling the group. Depending on who you lose, it's possible to lose several people and continue normally. Such a group comes with sufficient power to complete all standard group content in the game. Everquest is not that tightly tuned in terms of difficulty, and in truth the strongest solo classes can solo the great majority of group content.

You can replace the Cleric in favor of a Druid if you'd rather have ports than resurrection (or if someone wants stronger solo capability, as the Cleric solos only poorly). You can substitute the Enchanter for a Bard if desired. Any tank class works for the tank job, but the Shadow Knight's the only plate armor tank class that also has feign death, hence a different tank class sacrifices some role redundancy.

For a 6th person, you can add most anything to the above and it'll work fine since you already have the baseline jobs covered. Situational 6th-man considerations involve utility such as lock picking for accessing specific parts of some dungeons (Rogue), group teleport spells (Druid, Wizard), experience resurrection (Cleric, or Necromancer/Paladin at very high levels), and similar jobs. No single group can do absolutely everything, but a well-built group can do most of it without excessively relying on any single member. The most important thing is to pick classes and races you like, because people playing characters they like are more likely to stick with the game in the long run. An imperfect group might in that case be more enjoyable than a former group reduced to a duo.

Danth

[Bagger]

Originally Posted by Danth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Disclaimer: I didn't read the entire thread.

For a pre-built group I recommend building in a certain element of redundancy instead of focusing on a min-max composition for specific tasks. Odds are you'll lose at least some of your group to attrition along the way, and it wouldn't be much fun if you lose, for example, your only healer.

For doing dungeons in a group with no repeat characters, the major jobs you want to have are a defensive melee (tank), a feign death puller/scouter, crowd control, debuffs (mainly slow), and healing. My preferred 5-man composition with the above considerations in mind is as follows: Shadow Knight, Monk, Shaman, Enchanter, Cleric. This composition provides redundancy for all jobs mentioned prior so you can lose any single person without crippling the group. Depending on who you lose, it's possible to lose several people and continue normally. Such a group comes with sufficient power to complete all standard group content in the game. Everquest is not that tightly tuned in terms of difficulty, and in truth the strongest solo classes can solo the great majority of group content.

You can replace the Cleric in favor of a Druid if you'd rather have ports than resurrection (or if someone wants stronger solo capability, as the Cleric solos only poorly). You can substitute the Enchanter for a Bard if desired. Any tank class works for the tank job, but the Shadow Knight's the only plate armor tank class that also has feign death, hence a different tank class sacrifices some role redundancy.

For a 6th person, you can add most anything to the above and it'll work fine since you already have the baseline jobs covered. Situational 6th-man considerations involve utility such as lock picking for accessing specific parts of some dungeons (Rogue), group teleport spells (Druid, Wizard), experience resurrection (Cleric, or Necromancer/Paladin at very high levels), and similar jobs. No single group can do absolutely everything, but a well-built group can do most of it without excessively relying on any single member.

The most important thing is to pick classes and races you like, because people playing characters they like are more likely to stick with the game in the long run. An imperfect group might in that case be more enjoyable than a former group reduced to a duo.

Danth

Our tank changed his mind from being a Warrior to a SK. So we got that exact comp. and then we have a rogue, so I think we're covered. I didn't expect at all to play a Monk, but I think it's funny surprise and I take up the challenge. I might create a Mage or Necro at the side.

My group has been used to meet up many consecutive evenings, so it is likely that we would be able to continue our group together.
We might not reach to the end, Pantheonmmo is also a thing, and I've to try that out, and that may completely stop my run in this community, but let's see.
I'm gonna start either tomorrow or Friday for the first time, so I'm really exited!

[Danth]

Good luck. This game was difficult for new players to get "in" to even when it was new; it's quite harsh on genuine newbies. Now it has the additional handicap of looking outdated too. It's very much an acquired taste!

Group teleports are in no way necessary, but they're very nice to have--probably the strongest non-combat utility in the game. Folks who decide to stick with this game are well-advised to consider that nobody ever went wrong in having a teleport-capable alternate character if they don't happen to have one as a main.

Edit: As a Monk, you'll in many cases set the pace for your group. Monks are usually expected to pull (everquest is often more of a "bring monsters to you" game rather than a "dungeon crawl" game), so you'll need to build a knowledge of local geometry, zone and dungeon layout, monster spawn locations and types (melee/caster/healer, etc), and so forth. The Monk can also act as a tank if necessary. The class seems simple to play at a glance since there aren't a ton of buttons, but it's a proactive role with much room for learning.

Danth

[Bagger]

Originally Posted by Danth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Good luck. This game was difficult for new players to get "in" to even when it was new; it's quite harsh on genuine newbies. Now it has the additional handicap of looking outdated too. It's very much an acquired taste!

Group teleports are in no way necessary, but they're very nice to have--probably the strongest non-combat utility in the game. Folks who decide to stick with this game are well-advised to consider that nobody ever went wrong in having a teleport-capable alternate character if they don't happen to have one as a main.

Edit: As a Monk, you'll in many cases set the pace for your group. Monks are usually expected to pull (everquest is often more of a "bring monsters to you" game rather than a "dungeon crawl" game), so you'll need to build a knowledge of local geometry, zone and dungeon layout, monster spawn locations and types (melee/caster/healer, etc), and so forth. The Monk can also act as a tank if necessary. The class seems simple to play at a glance since there aren't a ton of buttons, but it's a proactive role with much room for learning.

Danth

I seek games that are harsh or even hardcore in nature, I only like my hand hold in the beginning and then figure or gather information about my next steps. If this game was made today with that kind of graphic I would have dropped it, but this is a classic, retro game so that shouldn't really bother me.

I'm looking forward to the challenge! And I hope to learn a lot about my role and be as effective and efficient as possible.

The only thing that is worrying me is, if it's gonna be hard to gather the whole group at Commonlands Tunnel.