Regarding the new spell file and such.

[Messianic]

Originally Posted by runlvlzero [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Messianic you have no idea what your doing you just log on here to look for easy to critizize posts

Apparently yours fit the bill.

was i nice consise and assertive no, and i don't feel like being so

Then don't expect me to be when I respond to your nonsense.

but is my logic sound? yap

1) I can't PBAoE scarabs in EC - therefore, the devs aren't doing it right

That's some sound logic there.

I'm curious to see why you tied PBAoE spells to run speed. Do you mean targeted AoE's? Because they work fine when I quad specs. I've been killing junk with AoEs for more than 20 levels, and it works just fine.

2) The devs choose not to re-code run speed from the ground up (if that is even possible or wouldn't take 500+ man hours) - therefore, they're not serious about the server

Tell me, oh mighty God of coding, how long that would take. Then, I want you to tell me why that's such a massive priority despite the fact that the difference between classic mob run speed and current p99 run speed is probably a 15-20 percent difference - tops.

Originally Posted by runlvlzero [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

never said the devs were idiots lol

I never said that you said they were idiots.

You were more patronizing than that. You insulted them as "not being serious" about it. Given the time investment they've put into the server, That's pretty ridiculous. Would like to see you back that "logic" up.

[Weezard]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Hello, I understand you do not know what the client controls. It controls such things as the compass, newbie zone maps, etc. Obviously we didn't 'leave these in'. The client says you can have them, and how they work, so they work. So, you might want to look into what is illogical about saying non-classic, thanks.

If I had to guess.. the spell menus weren't removed on purpose. Probably a byproduct of the massive spells change done. Haven't seen that assumption posed yet.

Fair, and I honestly didn't know that. Lesson learned.

If it wasn't an intentional removal, does that mean there is a possibility it could be added back in? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Dr4z3r]

Originally Posted by Leokaiser [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Personally I would like to have seen the dev's take classic and improve on it, but as noted, what consitutes an improvement is subjective. I guess by following history as closely as possible everyone knows what they are in for (for the most part), even if it's not fun for everyone, or even the majority (the majority on one subject will be the minority on another).

I cannot /agree with this enough.

[runlvlzero]

Originally Posted by Messianic [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Apparently yours fit the bill.

1) I can't PBAoE scarabs in EC - therefore, the devs aren't doing it right

That's some sound logic there.

I'm curious to see why you tied PBAoE spells to run speed. Do you mean targeted AoE's? Because they work fine when I quad specs. I've been killing junk with AoEs for more than 20 levels, and it works just fine.

2) The devs choose not to re-code run speed from the ground up (if that is even possible or wouldn't take 500+ man hours) - therefore, they're not serious about the server

because scarabs ran slow an un-sowed wizard could do 8-16 in EC very fast by rounding up scarabs and using spells like numbing cold

Nothing is impossible code wise, it might just be that its easier to get 5 gold stars by CTRL F and replacing a text file 20x to remove the spell functionality vs learning 2 code functions or ... who knows maybe mob speed was left out because adding in dynamic ranges would slow the server down to a crawl... I havn't seen any posts about it other then "its really hard, and part of the greater bigger emu project they can fix it, were gonna do other stuff instead" which is a somewhat more valid reason then its just "too hard"

Is it game breaking? no, is it anything i'm upset enough about to not play a wizard no? same thing with spell gems...

But it is a FAR MORE relevant fix then nerfing the UI needlessly (which I am going to stand by)

Also if the emu code is anything like any freshmeat or sourceforge project or google code project or open CVS repository... it would simply take re-submitting code back to the original EMU code base and upgrading the servers from .8 to .801b or whatever they use...

I have no idea but it seems like a good place to start and they would help the entire emu community as a whole

again my logic is sound in that it is A. more relevant to a classic experience, it doesn't just affect wizards etc it also effects high end quad kiting for all classes and bard swarms etc.

Anyway name calling asside thanks for giving me a reason to type up a slightly more consise and assertive post to defend my position.

I had a cup of coffee, perhaps you should get one as well.

[Striiker]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

...

If I had to guess.. the spell menus weren't removed on purpose. Probably a byproduct of the massive spells change done. Haven't seen that assumption posed yet.

Hey Nilbog,

Thank you first of all for the server. It's a dream come true... I have lamented for so many years about the lack of a solid classic server and then I found P1999.

I wanted to ask if we should be posting in the bugs section with any changes which are noticed but aren't listed in the change log? An example would be the damage shield duration changes which were recently enabled or the significant reduction in agro to the disease cloud spell or the noted concerns around the spell menu changes. I ask only because when I experience changes which are not listed, I assume that that it was probably intended and learn to deal with it. Are the change logs usually accurate? Perhaps people would take their energy from complaining (as some do, although this thread was started with good intentions and in a mature manner) and put that energy into bug reporting.

[Messianic]

Originally Posted by runlvlzero [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I had a cup of coffee, perhaps you should get one as well.

I prefer tea [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] (not to sound too much like a wood elf hipster) but thanks, your response was at least relevant and you took a legitimate stand. However, I disagree here:

Originally Posted by runlvlzero [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

But it is a FAR MORE relevant fix then nerfing the UI needlessly (which I am going to stand by)

again my logic is sound in that it is A. more relevant to a classic experience, it doesn't just affect wizards etc it also effects high end quad kiting for all classes and bard swarms etc.

Unless I was p99 staff, I wouldn't feel qualified to tell them what was more relevant - i'd probably comment if i had combed the bug and and resolved issues forums to see if I could find any relevant facts then post in the bug forum. Also, it's intellectually dishonest to assume the ui nerf was intentional and done in some draconian "ITS NOT CLASSIC GRAWRRWRR" fashion.

See this:

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If I had to guess.. the spell menus weren't removed on purpose. Probably a byproduct of the massive spells change done. Haven't seen that assumption posed yet.

And getting back to bubbles' original post - it is nice to have the updated UI's (I use Duxa's and love it - even tho the nostalgia of the original ui is nice, it doesn't compare in functionality).

However, what i've read elsewhere tells me it's still there under the surface:

Originally Posted by Arkyani [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

As for your spell sets. They are all still there, or at least mine were. All you need to do is "/memspellset, /savespellset, or /loadspellset" followed by the name of the spell set you wish to load, create, or memorize as. Without spell sets the switching between all your buffs can get very tedious.

And Nilbog commented on that post and didn't repudiate the claim...

So in reality, I don't know if it's actually been nerfed. The dust doesn't appear to have settled, as is the case after massive changes take place.

All in all, my point in posting such a sharp reply was to get a real response out of you or see if you'd rageflame me. Glad I did get a real one.

[Mad Jacq]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Classically, there was no book button. So by default, that is how it appears.

However, I believe Savok included the spell bar WITH the spellbook as an optional piece of Velious UI extras. http://www.project1999.org/forums/sh...ad.php?t=11949

Hope that helps.

It helped me. I was previously using the classic Velious interface. Thanks to your post I now have the tricked out spell set one.

[nilbog]

Originally Posted by Striiker [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Hey Nilbog,

Thank you first of all for the server. It's a dream come true... I have lamented for so many years about the lack of a solid classic server and then I found P1999.

I wanted to ask if we should be posting in the bugs section with any changes which are noticed but aren't listed in the change log? An example would be the damage shield duration changes which were recently enabled or the significant reduction in agro to the disease cloud spell or the noted concerns around the spell menu changes. I ask only because when I experience changes which are not listed, I assume that that it was probably intended and learn to deal with it. Are the change logs usually accurate? Perhaps people would take their energy from complaining (as some do, although this thread was started with good intentions and in a mature manner) and put that energy into bug reporting.

Yah, if you see changes that aren't included in a changelog(spells), or patch notes, mention it as it might be a bug.

The spells_us.txt file, relevant changes, and a request for players to test with feedback.. were posted in January, by Uthgaard. So, you can consider that the changelog for the spells. Unfortunately, it appears most of the players hadn't even updated their spells since last summer, if at all. This makes it difficult for us, because we do not know what is really broken.. and didn't give us the feedback we needed. If we post something like New spell file, instructions and discussion.. and players want to know whats coming, and/or have a voice in what happens, they need to test it. This is precisely the reason there was a Test Server on eqlive.

So, as you might see from our perspective.. and the beta testers for the past 2 months, these changes aren't new, and might already be reported, awaiting additional details of what is wrong, or non classic about them.

[Bubbles]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If I had to guess.. the spell menus weren't removed on purpose. Probably a byproduct of the massive spells change done. Haven't seen that assumption posed yet.

[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So..you're saying... there's... a... chance? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[karsten]

i've posted before in my support of the original posting by bubbles, and I will reiterate what he and many others have echoed in this thread -- the line to draw between how classic this server should be is subjective, and with many issues, a large majority of us are in agreement with the changes being made.

I believe I can also definitively say that this is not one of those times. Not being able to right click spell gems is masochistic on a completely unnecessarily painful level, and I urge, please, for the devs to reconsider this particular issue.