Best Server Community Sin--Wait, Nevermind

[YendorLootmonkey]

Originally Posted by soup [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

There's a difference between the story being true or made up. If I have been at the camp for an hour, obviously you're full of shit. If I just got there, then you tell me that, and random people in the zone who aren't in your guild confirm that, then I wil lgive you the benefit of the doubt and go elsewhere, as I have done countless times before. (the corpse sitting on the ground with 5 minutes missing from the timer could be a pretty clear sign you aren't full of shit also...)

See, unlike many of you, when an issue comes up, I don't ask myself "What do the rules say?" I ask myself "What would be the non-douchebag thing to do?"

So, like I said, you care about the chance of loot more than anything else. That's fine, but that generally makes you a douche bag. If you're okay with that, so be it, but don't lie to yourself and act like it isn't a douche bag thing to do.

No, I care about doing what's right. The problem is what my definition of right, your definition of right, and every individual's definition of right is all subjective. So then we turn to the established camping rules of the server which are the most objective set of standards available to all of us.

By your definition of doing what is right, you should be willing to give up whatever loot camp you're at no matter how long you've been there the moment someone comes along who wants it. Because hey, it's the nice thing to do, and you shouldn't care about a chance at loot, right? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Humerox]

Originally Posted by maegi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Humerox, while I disagree with a lot you said in this post, I will give you props for not being a selfish camp stealing douche bag all about the loot kind of guy. In fact, I've read a lot of your posts on other threads and agreed with most and laughed at a few. So you're good people despite our differences of opinion at times.

Thanks!

I'm gonna go a bit further on OP's issue. When I started playing, I thought P99 was something to be cherished too (*still do*)...and when I saw what was happening to the server a few months back, I went ballistic. Overboard. I had to step back and realize that this game means different things to different people, and no matter how much I wanted it to be a certain way, it wasn't going to be a bastion of love and happiness in a jaded MMO world.

I advise the OP to do what I did. Step back and realize that once your only concern is loot, you're lost. All issues between people here revolve around gear. It's not about competitiveness, because the guild dynamics here don't allow nor prefer true competition, nor do they allow for a shared structure.

Now that Kunark is coming up, I think a lot will change. There will be enough content to go around. ATM, you have a bajillion 50's with nowhere to go, competing with the newer playerbase for content.

The devs have gotten rid of most of the trash players, and they work hard to keep the game A$$hole free...and do a pretty good job of it, imho. Although we have lost some good devs because of player attitude, it's only because they took it to heart, and forgot that MOST of the player population doesn't play forum-wars.


Wait it through. The community here is fundamentally solid, and will get a whole lot better when new content opens up.

Hopefully, you'll stay.

Peace.

[soup]

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No, I care about doing what's right. The problem is what my definition of right, your definition of right, and every individual's definition of right is all subjective. So then we turn to the established camping rules of the server which are the most objective set of standards available to all of us.

By your definition of doing what is right, you should be willing to give up whatever Kooy camp you're at no matter how long you've been there the moment someone comes along who wants it. Because hey, it's the nice thing to do, and you shouldn't care about a chance at loot, right? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Like I said before, what is or isn't against the rules doesn't determine what is or isn't a douchebag thing to do. If you disagree then I question your ability to form your own opinions.

As for the second bit, you may want to take a look at this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

[Badmartigan]

-dead men cant hold camps /cry
-the sro AC is on a 31 min timer with a 10% chance to spawn maximum 2 times per day.. ON LIVE IT WAS DIFFERENT...but here.. it is NOT.. it's a static camp...

DA and VD work very well together.. haters gone hate.

[YendorLootmonkey]

I just find it interesting that it's only a douchebag move when someone takes over a camp if someone dies. Why isn't it an equally douchebag move to expect someone to relinquish a camp to you after you failed to maintain it? To me, that is equally loot-centric.

The only difference, of course, is what side of the situation you're on, now, isn't it?

While you're busy slapping down links to strawman arguments, go look up slippery slope. How long is someone expected to wait for someone to get back to a camp after dying before it becomes unclaimed? 5 mins? 30 mins? 3 hours? Now you're just making up arbitrary rules because the ones in place don't benefit you in a particular situation and anyone who disagrees is clearly a loot-centric douchebag? Convenient.

And utterly ridiculous and contrived.

[Badmartigan]

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I just find it interesting that it's only a douchebag move when someone takes over a camp if someone dies. Why isn't it an equally douchebag move to expect someone to relinquish a camp to you after you failed to maintain it? To me, that is equally loot-centric.

The only difference, of course, is what side of the situation you're on, now, isn't it?

While you're busy slapping down links to strawman arguments, go look up slippery slope. How long is someone expected to wait for someone to get back to a camp after dying before it becomes unclaimed? 5 mins? 30 mins? 3 hours? Now you're just making up arbitrary rules because the ones in place don't benefit you in a particular situation and anyone who disagrees is clearly a loot-centric douchebag? Convenient.

And utterly ridiculous and contrived.

Yeah.. look at it like this.. dude been sitting at that camp for 8-9 hours.. maybe he is unlucky.. maybe he is doing it wrong.. but its NOT greedy or douchebaggy to take a camp that is open..... 10mins or an hour or not...

For me to DIE at a camp.. and run back is my mistake.. and i OWN that mistake.. i dont blame others for moving in and taking over.. thats just the nature of the game... I'm not going to go calling people douchebags for playing EQ to the letter of this servers law.

In OOT theres been times i fell asleep and died and i came back and someone else had the camp.. i /bowed and said.. thank you sir for picking up my slack.. please allow me to get the camp back next ? And also, i have been there to take a camp when someone died... while they were sad they died they were humble and realized THEY makde the mistake and that a highly desired camp is going to get taken.. not by force.. but by the natural way of things.

[Teeroyoyort]

I'm curious how the enchanter died. He had to be lvl 29+ to cast clairty. So let's assume he was lvl 29. I'd imagine he'd summon a pet, and has root in his arsenal. Can a lvl 29 enchanter kill a sand giant with his pet? I'm sure he could with enough patience. So why did he die in the 1st place?

Answer: The entire guild of VD trained him! and left 3 to hold to camp.

[Zereh]

If I died and someone douchebagged my camp I'd be ticked; as you all would be were the roles reversed. Pretending otherwise is just plain BS.

[skipdog]

Originally Posted by Zereh [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If I died and someone douchebagged my camp I'd be ticked; as you all would be were the roles reversed. Pretending otherwise is just plain BS.

I guess I don't understand why you think that a camp is yours if you can't stay alive. Isn't that one of the only things required for you to say that the camp is yours in the first place? You have to be there, not be afk, and be able to stay alive. That's all that it takes to hold a camp.

I'm being honest with you in saying yes that I would be ticked. I would be ticked at myself for dying, not some other guy playing by the rules. I would expect somebody to take my camp the instant I die while trying to hold said camp.

If you die while on a camp, you lose that camp. I thought this was understood and it amazes me how many people here don't agree with those rules. I agree with Yendor/Badmartigan's views on the situation. I mean, how long do you wait after somebody dies until you claim their camp? It is a slippery slope and if people are camping something they should understand that if they DIE, that camp is lost if somebody else claims it before returning.

[Randy]

Originally Posted by Badmartigan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

For me to DIE at a camp.. and run back is my mistake.. and i OWN that mistake.. i dont blame others for moving in and taking over.. thats just the nature of the game... I'm not going to go calling people douchebags for playing EQ to the letter of this servers law.

I agree, losing a camp is just an added penalty if you/your group fails to maintain it. But if i get trained and die, should I still lose my camp? If my groups only healer goes LD during a pull and we die, should I still lose the camp? Its those type of situations where the "rules are the rules" thing doesn't work for me and i'd think you're a douche for taking the camp.

Most of the time, depending on the location, I think you should give someone 15-25mins to recover. That's just being nice.

Though in this case being the Sro/AC camp, I wouldn't fault them for taking over like they did cause you either had to be AFK, LD during combat, too weak to hold the camp, or have no clue what you're doing to you actually die there.