Best Server Community Sin--Wait, Nevermind

soup · #1 02-23-2011, 03:38 PM

The amount of people who say stuff like "RULES IS RULES he lost the camp!" makes me sick. Rules don't determine what is and isn't a douche bag thing to do. Those people from VD were grade A douche bags, there's no way around it. Within the rules? Perhaps, but absolute douche bags nonetheless.

It's kind of sad how often people on this server will degrade into complete douchebaggery if it means citing the rules will give them a shot at some loot. There's a lot of good people in this community, but the community isn't anywhere near what we would like to think it is.

YendorLootmonkey · #2 02-23-2011, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by soup [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The amount of people who say stuff like "RULES IS RULES he lost the camp!" makes me sick. Rules don't determine what is and isn't a douche bag thing to do. Those people from VD were grade A douche bags, there's no way around it. Within the rules? Perhaps, but absolute douche bags nonetheless.

It's kind of sad how often people on this server will degrade into complete douchebaggery if it means citing the rules will give them a shot at some loot. There's a lot of good people in this community, but the community isn't anywhere near what we would like to think it is.

Cool. Let us know what camp you're at so we can come by and make up some sob story about how we had to leave for a few minutes to go pull a baby out of a burning house, but we were totally just camping that so you are a douchebag if you don't relinquish it back to us [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

soup · #3 02-23-2011, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Cool. Let us know what camp you're at so we can come by and make up some sob story about how we had to leave for a few minutes to go pull a baby out of a burning house, but we were totally just camping that so you are a douchebag if you don't relinquish it back to us [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

There's a difference between the story being true or made up. If I have been at the camp for an hour, obviously you're full of shit. If I just got there, then you tell me that, and random people in the zone who aren't in your guild confirm that, then I wil lgive you the benefit of the doubt and go elsewhere, as I have done countless times before. (the corpse sitting on the ground with 5 minutes missing from the timer could be a pretty clear sign you aren't full of shit also...)

See, unlike many of you, when an issue comes up, I don't ask myself "What do the rules say?" I ask myself "What would be the non-douchebag thing to do?"

So, like I said, you care about the chance of loot more than anything else. That's fine, but that generally makes you a douche bag. If you're okay with that, so be it, but don't lie to yourself and act like it isn't a douche bag thing to do.

YendorLootmonkey · #4 02-23-2011, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by soup [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

There's a difference between the story being true or made up. If I have been at the camp for an hour, obviously you're full of shit. If I just got there, then you tell me that, and random people in the zone who aren't in your guild confirm that, then I wil lgive you the benefit of the doubt and go elsewhere, as I have done countless times before. (the corpse sitting on the ground with 5 minutes missing from the timer could be a pretty clear sign you aren't full of shit also...)

See, unlike many of you, when an issue comes up, I don't ask myself "What do the rules say?" I ask myself "What would be the non-douchebag thing to do?"

So, like I said, you care about the chance of loot more than anything else. That's fine, but that generally makes you a douche bag. If you're okay with that, so be it, but don't lie to yourself and act like it isn't a douche bag thing to do.

No, I care about doing what's right. The problem is what my definition of right, your definition of right, and every individual's definition of right is all subjective. So then we turn to the established camping rules of the server which are the most objective set of standards available to all of us.

By your definition of doing what is right, you should be willing to give up whatever loot camp you're at no matter how long you've been there the moment someone comes along who wants it. Because hey, it's the nice thing to do, and you shouldn't care about a chance at loot, right? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

soup · #5 02-23-2011, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No, I care about doing what's right. The problem is what my definition of right, your definition of right, and every individual's definition of right is all subjective. So then we turn to the established camping rules of the server which are the most objective set of standards available to all of us.

By your definition of doing what is right, you should be willing to give up whatever Kooy camp you're at no matter how long you've been there the moment someone comes along who wants it. Because hey, it's the nice thing to do, and you shouldn't care about a chance at loot, right? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Like I said before, what is or isn't against the rules doesn't determine what is or isn't a douchebag thing to do. If you disagree then I question your ability to form your own opinions.

As for the second bit, you may want to take a look at this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

Badmartigan · #6 02-23-2011, 05:18 PM

-dead men cant hold camps /cry
-the sro AC is on a 31 min timer with a 10% chance to spawn maximum 2 times per day.. ON LIVE IT WAS DIFFERENT...but here.. it is NOT.. it's a static camp...

DA and VD work very well together.. haters gone hate.

YendorLootmonkey · #7 02-23-2011, 05:20 PM

I just find it interesting that it's only a douchebag move when someone takes over a camp if someone dies. Why isn't it an equally douchebag move to expect someone to relinquish a camp to you after you failed to maintain it? To me, that is equally loot-centric.

The only difference, of course, is what side of the situation you're on, now, isn't it?

While you're busy slapping down links to strawman arguments, go look up slippery slope. How long is someone expected to wait for someone to get back to a camp after dying before it becomes unclaimed? 5 mins? 30 mins? 3 hours? Now you're just making up arbitrary rules because the ones in place don't benefit you in a particular situation and anyone who disagrees is clearly a loot-centric douchebag? Convenient.

And utterly ridiculous and contrived.

Badmartigan · #8 02-23-2011, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I just find it interesting that it's only a douchebag move when someone takes over a camp if someone dies. Why isn't it an equally douchebag move to expect someone to relinquish a camp to you after you failed to maintain it? To me, that is equally loot-centric.

The only difference, of course, is what side of the situation you're on, now, isn't it?

While you're busy slapping down links to strawman arguments, go look up slippery slope. How long is someone expected to wait for someone to get back to a camp after dying before it becomes unclaimed? 5 mins? 30 mins? 3 hours? Now you're just making up arbitrary rules because the ones in place don't benefit you in a particular situation and anyone who disagrees is clearly a loot-centric douchebag? Convenient.

And utterly ridiculous and contrived.

Yeah.. look at it like this.. dude been sitting at that camp for 8-9 hours.. maybe he is unlucky.. maybe he is doing it wrong.. but its NOT greedy or douchebaggy to take a camp that is open..... 10mins or an hour or not...

For me to DIE at a camp.. and run back is my mistake.. and i OWN that mistake.. i dont blame others for moving in and taking over.. thats just the nature of the game... I'm not going to go calling people douchebags for playing EQ to the letter of this servers law.

In OOT theres been times i fell asleep and died and i came back and someone else had the camp.. i /bowed and said.. thank you sir for picking up my slack.. please allow me to get the camp back next ? And also, i have been there to take a camp when someone died... while they were sad they died they were humble and realized THEY makde the mistake and that a highly desired camp is going to get taken.. not by force.. but by the natural way of things.

soup · #9 02-24-2011, 12:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I just find it interesting that it's only a douchebag move when someone takes over a camp if someone dies. Why isn't it an equally douchebag move to expect someone to relinquish a camp to you after you failed to maintain it? To me, that is equally loot-centric.

The only difference, of course, is what side of the situation you're on, now, isn't it?

While you're busy slapping down links to strawman arguments, go look up slippery slope. How long is someone expected to wait for someone to get back to a camp after dying before it becomes unclaimed? 5 mins? 30 mins? 3 hours? Now you're just making up arbitrary rules because the ones in place don't benefit you in a particular situation and anyone who disagrees is clearly a loot-centric douchebag? Convenient.

And utterly ridiculous and contrived.

Bahahaha. You know that slippery slope is also a fallacy, right? Basically what you just did was get called out on a logical fallacy, so you use another logical fallacy to defend yourself, WHILE CITING WHAT THAT FALLACY IS. I mean, I've seen enough of your posts to think you probably aren't a complete moron or anything, but that wasn't a very well thought out response to my post, lol.

Darian · #10 02-23-2011, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by soup [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So, like I said, you care about the chance of loot more than anything else. That's fine, but that generally makes you a douche bag. If you're okay with that, so be it, but don't lie to yourself and act like it isn't a douche bag thing to do.

So the guys in the right place at the right time were selfish douchebags, but the guy who wanted an item so bad he was willing to wait on one mob for 24 hours is the unselfish, non-loot-greedy victim here?

Seriously, stop and think about what "camping" means. Rilen (presumably) answered "AC" to every camp check. What does that mean? For an ENTIRE DAY, Rilen told everyone who wanted Jboots, "No. You cannot kill this mob. Only I can." That's not selfish to you?

Everyone who has ever camped anything, ever, is technically selfish. They are monopolizing a spawn/item at everyone else's expense. Some people are worse about it than others, but it's a part of this game.

DISCLAIMER: I have no problem with Rilen, or his camping, or anyone else choosing to camp anything. I do not use the word "selfish" to describe this behavior. People do not play this game solely to help other people get lewt or levels. There is an inherent selfishness to Everquest. It happens. I'm okay with it.