Camp list rules?

[azeth]

Originally Posted by maskedmelon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

As far as rules are concerned there are no lists :/ There is only who is next. You don't need to be online to be next in line for a camp. Players camping a mob may choose to pass the camp to whomever they wish. However, when asked whonis next in line, the camper must give the name of that player or the camp becomes FFA upon their departure ^^. The named player must arrive at the camp within 5 minutes of the prior camper's departure or the camp becomes FFA.

Hope hat helps! ^^

This is perfectly explained.

Consider this scenario:

Camp X is held by John Smith. Harry Stevens shows up and says "add me to the list"

When John decides to leave, even if he's told Harry Stevens that Harry is "next in line" - John is under no obligation to forfeit the camp to Harry Stevens.

John possesses the camp and at any point may decide to hand the camp to any person of his choosing.

This is why, in my eyes, lists are purposeless. Even if you're on a list, the person holding the camp may decide who will receive the camp next. They are not obligated to follow the list.

Now the only exception to choosing to follow or not follow the "list" is if a list-member stays at the camp with the camp holder. The camp holder cannot gift the camp to someone who is not currently present, or has not yet arrived if someone is physically there waiting for the camp.

[BulletCatcher]

So what you're saying is Joe Bob shows up; John Smith could hand the camp to Joe even though Harry was next on the list.... Unless Harry has been at the camp the whole time... your saying John is obligated to relinquish the camp to Harry because 1) John said he was on the list, and 2) Harry stayed and patiently waited. Is that what you're saying?

This doesn't seem concrete as far as the rules are concerned (more of a players working things out for themselves sans GM intervention). Couldn't John just say "Hey Harry, i know you've been waiting for a long time, but im gonna hand the camp to Joe Bob because I want to.(even though Harry had been waiting)"

I feel like the current rules would say Joe gets the camp. The player list thing is only a player construct and I would imagine a GM wouldn't get to involved in it to resolve a dispute.

I guess its up to the players to be amicable with one another.

[azeth]

Originally Posted by BulletCatcher [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

your saying John is obligated to relinquish the camp to Harry because 1) John said he was on the list, and 2) Harry stayed and patiently waited. Is that what you're saying?

exactly. Because Harry was on "the list" and was physically present during the camp's turnover - it is by rule Harry's camp.

If Harry was not physically present, John can hand the camp to whoever he wants.

[Ronnie328]

I've never kept a list. If someone asks, I tell them the approximate time I'm leaving, if no one is sorting at the camp when I leave, I announce my departure and I'm done with it.

[azeth]

Originally Posted by Ronnie328 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I've never kept a list. If someone asks, I tell them the approximate time I'm leaving, if no one is sorting at the camp when I leave, I announce my departure and I'm done with it.

Same. I basically ignore tells regarding camps I hold and I leave without notification whenever I choose to.

Just because I hold a camp doesn't mean it's my fuckin job to maintain a list.

[clouddynasty]

*http://www.project1999.com/forums/sh...19&postcount=9

Pretty clear-cut, and these exact rules have been around in one form or another for quite some time. I really need to compile a "Project 1999: Errata and other extraneous information" post to put all this stuff. For now, this will have to do:

Camp holder has the right to pass the camp to whoever he would like. However, and this is very important, two things must happen in order for this to be a legitimate hand-off:

1) The player being handed the camp must be present around the time the first placeholder spawns after the last holder of the camp has gotten his or her item in hand. The person handing off the camp must stay at the spawn until the next person in line arrives, if that person is on their way to take the camp. There is a little leeway here, and we refuse to set an exact timer on how long the placeholder can be up before the camp is forfeited, but in general it should never be for more than a couple minutes or so. We tend to give the benefit of the doubt to the person coming in to take the camp in these situations as CSR staff, so waiting a bit longer will never hurt. W

2) The person holding the camp cannot mislead you, or change his mind after telling you who is next. Something that no one ever does (and I will never understand why) is to specifically address the camp holder, asking who is next or if you can be next. The camp holder does need to reveal to you who the next intended camp holder is - if he doesn't, you may ask to be next and your claim will be valid unless he reveals the next person immediately. This person cannot change after the camp holder has "revealed" the next person to take the camp to you. It is an automatic forfeit if this occurs. If you ask to be the next camp holder and are told yes, the camp holder may not later retract or change this agreement and attempt to hand the camp off to someone else - it's yours once he has gotten his item or moved on from the camp.

Something else important to note about handing off camps - in particular, popular ones, but this applies to any camp that becomes contested. If you are solo camping, once you attain the item you were waiting for (an AC ring, for example) you are done camping that mob. The person coming to take the camp had better be prepared at this point in order to come eliminate the very next placeholder spawn in order to "stake his claim" on the mob. You cannot work wacky corpse lines on lore items in order to grab multiple items in the same "camp session" if there are others waiting to take the camp. Please be aware that we reserve the right to apply this same ruling to any camp if we deem it necessary, including camps with multiple players.

If the camp holder ignores you when you ask and nobody else is there waiting, you have claim but the camp holder is under no obligation to contact you when they're done, so you'll need to park your butt there. Basically exactly as Azeth said. =)

[maskedmelon]

Here is an old take on it from former staff:

http://www.project1999.com/forums/sh...19&postcount=9

[maskedmelon]

I want to say Sirken weighed in on the issue at some point after that, but I'm not the most adept forum sleuth ^^

[elhrairah]

Sorry to bump for an unrelated question, but I thought was better than making a new thread.

So I had this incident today in befallen. I was playing and camping elf skeleton on a lvl 18 cleric with 2 of my friends, lvl 16, and lvl 17. We were killing elf, but in between spawns we would clear other mobs, hoping to also get a thamaturge kill.

So we walk away from elf through the invisible wall and go clear thamaturges trash mobs, then see he is down and was killed 2 minutes ago by his corpse timer. So we walk back to camp and see that a high lvl player has invised past us (saw this looking at logs later), and is engaging the elf and kill it.

We dont freak out or rage on him. We tell him that we were indeed camping elf skele (we had been here for about an hour at this point, killing him on his 6m40s timer). He tells us that "that shit wont fly. You have to be in line of sight and you cant leave camps".

I try to explain that the forum rules allow you to camp multiple things, and that presence is only required when something is contested (which we now considered elf to be). He tells us that if something pops, it has to be engaged within 30 seconds. I tell him the forums said that it had to be "reasonable time" and that the example they gave was 5 minutes. (mind you he didnt even wait 30 seconds, he engaged it on pop).

After a few minutes of back and forth, he concedes without admitting anything wrong and sulks off. I come on the forums and read the rules again, and it seems we were indeed right. Am I missing something? This guy was from a well known high lvl guild, and if lvl 18's know the rules, was he just trying to bully us out of camp?

[Littlestgnome]

People like to get incredibly lawyer-ish about it. Take the Ass/sup camp for example. Shouldn't really be an issue if a group is holding the spawn from the much less claustrophobic room across from the ladder. Shouldn't be, but it is because people will try to claim it on grounds of not having a presence at the camp.

Not every spawn is lawyered this way however. Few if any groups camp the top floor spiders in Velks at their actual spawn locations. They camp on the ledge just below the ramp and bring them down. I've rarely if ever seen someone try to sit on those spiders and claim the group down below didn't have adequate "presence" at the spawn.

It's six of one, half dozen of the other. Neither group is literally standing on the spawn they're holding, but only one camp is ever challenged on those grounds. Furthermore only one group ever runs the risk of getting shouted down for not standing directly on the named mob they're holding either.

Honestly what it boils down to is the fact that one spawn can be soloed rather easily by most classes while the other cannot. Any coveted spawn that is easy to solo gets treated in this manner.