Why is boxing and live frowned upon? - Page 6

Swish · #51 09-06-2015, 01:35 AM

yikes

jcr4990 · #52 09-07-2015, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maestrom [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I've been in this debate a few times over the past few months on the live forums leading up to the completely failed launch of the shitshow that is the latest round of progression servers.

Instancing did not kill Everquest. The people that were "harmed" by instancing were either RMT, who make money off of scarcity and the ability to deny access to content to others, and trolls who get off on taking from other players but don't want to play a real PvP game like Ultima Online (at the time).

Instancing did not make the encounters easier. It did not change the amount of hitpoints targets had. It just meant that you didn't have to deal with getting griefed (as anyone who has been a few guilds behind the top in PoP will tell you, people killing triggers at 2am so your guild couldn't flag was ridiculous).

The "evidence" cited by many people who think instancing ruined the game is dubious at best. They claim that EQ subs dropped off a lot when instancing was released. This is kinda true, but it ignores a lot of other things that were going on at the time. Many mechanical updates were made to the game around the release of GoD that made it impossible to play on many older computer. Some people were faced with upgrades of hundreds of dollars or buying a whole new computer in order to continue to play. Also, many of the mechanical changes completely broke many zones. There were screen shots of my guilds main tank sitting in Fire with literally every monster in field two on him, but not able to get to him because they had fallen below the world.

There was also the launch of the WoW beta, which took many people from my guild and most of my RL friends that played EQ. This was, I think, the biggest killer to EQ. Althought WoW wouldn't launch officially for another 9 months or so, new people were being added to the beta every couple of weeks it seemed, which took a huge chunk out of EQ. It's worth noting that many of my friends cited instancing as a top 5 reason they picked WoW over EQ.

I never understood why people thought Bazaar was such a bad thing. It made trading easier. You could still negotiate with traders, i often did.

Boom. Hit the nail on the head. EQ was awesome in PoP. Could argue it fell off from there but I even enjoyed OoW a lot. After that I kinda stopped enjoying it very much and quit around Prophecy of Ro. People point fingers at bazaar and pok books and instancing. What really "killed EQ" is WoW. (Which btw is a game with lots of instances and an even easier version of the bazaar)

Frudrura · #53 09-08-2015, 01:02 AM

I like that, I think it is true, WoW killed EQ.

Sadre Spinegnawer · #54 09-08-2015, 04:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Man0warr [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I didn't say EQ died, I said the sense of community died. When people look back fondly on Classic EQ, it's the community that they are missing that newer MMOs lack.

That includes everything that goes into it good and bad - camp stealing, EC trading, forum questing, talking to group mates, etc.

Cucumbers made an exasperated post a couple months ago about community. Community isn't some deep thing, it can be as simple as having to ask someone for a port, or if they can help you locate your corpse, or when you give a player a buff that lasts not for hours, but just for the next half hour.

Little things that kept us in touch in order for the game to be played better. The need for those things died as port books entered the game, and some ridiculous long last buffs like KEI.

This is also the argument against boxing. Boixing decreases the need for that kind of need for other people.

And the bazaar killed it too. Quick little chats you have with a seller = community. Buying off an afk bot = none.

It is a complicated issue but wanted to chime in. imo, part of why classic works is, you kind of have to deal with people to play the game except for a few classes. I played swtor a few years ago, and got max level and good gear w/o ever interacting with anyone. classic eq makes that very hard, and kind of stupid, to play that way. It makes you have little contacts with people. And that's community. O know when I give someone a clarity, I'm giving them a rather short buff. Not something that will last 2 hours. I know when I get a sow, same thing. It keeps us always making contact as part of the game.

And that need to stay in touch, however trivial begins at the start. It's baked into the classic cake. my view.

LostCause · #55 09-08-2015, 06:00 AM

nowadays you can box a raid np.

if they just had it limited to one char boxed then... yea i dont see problem i mean back in 1999 it was rare to see someone boxing more then 1 char anyway.

myriverse · #56 09-08-2015, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sadre Spinegnawer [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Cucumbers made an exasperated post a couple months ago about community. Community isn't some deep thing, it can be as simple as having to ask someone for a port, or if they can help you locate your corpse, or when you give a player a buff that lasts not for hours, but just for the next half hour.

Little things that kept us in touch in order for the game to be played better. The need for those things died as port books entered the game, and some ridiculous long last buffs like KEI.

This is also the argument against boxing. Boixing decreases the need for that kind of need for other people.

And the bazaar killed it too. Quick little chats you have with a seller = community. Buying off an afk bot = none.

It is a complicated issue but wanted to chime in. imo, part of why classic works is, you kind of have to deal with people to play the game except for a few classes. I played swtor a few years ago, and got max level and good gear w/o ever interacting with anyone. classic eq makes that very hard, and kind of stupid, to play that way. It makes you have little contacts with people. And that's community. O know when I give someone a clarity, I'm giving them a rather short buff. Not something that will last 2 hours. I know when I get a sow, same thing. It keeps us always making contact as part of the game.

And that need to stay in touch, however trivial begins at the start. It's baked into the classic cake. my view.

"Community" died before the port books, and this was the reason the port books started in the first place. Fewer and fewer people were usually in bind areas, and people needed travel.

And it was pretty much the same in EC tunnel with auctions.

mr_jon3s · #57 09-08-2015, 10:15 AM

People need to stop lieing about the bazaar. People tunnelquested, people fought in the arena all the time for fun, and the search window helped out a lot of people finding items.