Petition: Guild raid suspensions should be progressively longer every time

[August]

Originally Posted by HallyVee [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Surely this is hyperbole, and you realize some simply raid for fun, literally for the fun of group play? Honestly, I'd raid even if I never got a single item drop, ever. It really is a valid gaming goal, the experience rather than the progress derived.

Are you a pumpkin?

[Tasslehofp99]

The nature of "competitive" raiding on p99 often breeds error in the heat of the moment, and occasionally someone will do something intentionally shitheaded.


What we really need is public raid petitions instead of them being behind closed doors. Aside from being 100% transparent, this would also help to establish a place that can be referenced for precedent. The GMs from live who were paid CSR reps didn't interfere as much as the volunteers we have here. OR.....

Players need to be able to work shit out on their own; maybe even have a player tribunal made up of all of the guilds. When one guild is proven to have made an infraction, the rest of the guilds vote on their fate. No GM's necessary.

[Kope]

+1

Guilds have left the server before (IB) But they came back. This server does have something special about it that others cannot replicate easily, and people are drawn to that. I've stopped playing multiple times since I started playing here, but I always come back, there's nothing like P99.

Cleaning up the raid scene doesn't mean halting competition or the drive to kill raid mobs, that will all still happen. Heck, look at class R, not everyone liked the rotation but it was easy to manage and the GMs had less to deal with, even with the large amount of guilds in class R (Still applicable today).

What happened to earthquakes? What was the reason they stopped happening so frequently (it was part of the raid discussions that they were to happen to make sure class C got the same amount of mobs while class R had mobs too)? I wasn't here when they stopped happening but I've heard Rogean put a nix on them because of the toxicity that occurred in class C? Would it really be a bad thing to clean all of that up?

I'm not talking about disbanding guilds randomly because I don't like them, I'm talking about repeat offenders being punished adequately and incrementally more dramatically as they continue to break rules, even while others are able to not do so in the name of the health of the entire server.

Take a look at the "Raid Discussion" forum. On the first page of the raid forum, there are 4 suspension posts for TMO alone. That's twice that of the guild with the second most suspensions (IB with 2).

What percentage of the population raids again? How much time do the GMs devote to them?

[azxten]

+1

Also add a three strikes rule. Get 3 suspensions in a year and your guild is disbanded.

[Nuggie]

There are ways to go about solving problems. The first step is to clearly identify a problem you see so that everyone is on the same page for the discussion. What specific problem are you trying to solve here?

Generally speaking I prefer less restrictions/rules/laws. Only select groups benefit from complex rules. Those who are willing to spend the time finding ways around them (rules lawyers).

Regarding August's post: we couldn't anticipate velious taking 4 or 5 years to finish. Also, most people have taken breaks during that time to do other things.

[Daldaen]

Problem: Training/Raid Interference Rules don't penalize enough to discourage the behavior.

Solution: Make the penalty actually hurt the guilds. Multi-Week, All mob suspensions. Not the current, 5 days off when nothing is in window or 1 single mob lockout.

[Nuggie]

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Problem: Training/Raid Interference Rules don't penalize enough to discourage the behavior.

Not everyone(playerbase-wise) see's this as a problem. So doesn't this then come down to one playerbase trying to dictate to another how to play the game?

[Daldaen]

Originally Posted by Nuggie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Not everyone(playerbase-wise) see's this as a problem. So doesn't this then come down to one playerbase trying to dictate to another how to play the game?

So you think that a guild who repeatedly trains around and week after week wipes other guilds, should simply have to sit out one spawn of that mob? And continue their typical ways?

[Llodd]

Originally Posted by Nuggie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Not everyone(playerbase-wise) see's this as a problem. So doesn't this then come down to one playerbase trying to dictate to another how to play the game?

Which is exactly what is happening now. The top guilds have set the precedent for the current shitshow of training without consideration to get at the pixels as fast as possible. If you don't conform to that mechanic you will get diddly-squat. Saying that; the CT race between Gimpatron and Divinity was more a case of clearing some trash first, which in turn made training one another far less likely. As far as I know neither side did.

Ofcourse the glorious irony in all this is that none of the top guilds can see that because they're stuck so far up their own pixel ass that without the dumb training where guilds do clear somewhat and open themselves up to being leap-frogged it's probable that the loot spoils in the long run end up being distributed the same between the guilds anyway.

[Basenji]

Originally Posted by Llodd [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Which is exactly what is happening now. The top guilds have set the precedent for the current shitshow of training without consideration to get at the pixels as fast as possible. If you don't conform to that mechanic you will get diddly-squat.

This really should be highlighted more. A relatively small group of people are monopolizing a major portion of the server's content. And they're doing it in a way that actively discourages me from wanting to participate.

I mostly want to raid to re-experience the raiding content, which is the point of this server as I understand it. I'd be happy to tag along without any chance at getting gear. But the current raid scene simply isn't classic. I stumbled on a Sev raid while running to CoM, so I decided to watch. The dragon died in like 15 seconds. There's just nothing to experience there for me. There never was anything new as I've raided all this content before, and in the current state there isn't even anything nostalgic. Plus, it seems like a lot of the people are dicks, given that they allow the training strats. It's just not worth it to run out there and watch a dragon die that fast, even if I were in on the loot. I can't be the only one here who feels like that.

A wipe would solve a lot of problems. The content would become available again. A lot of the dicks that like to monopolize content as a form of PVP would leave, because it wouldn't be easy for them anymore. And the server would a substantially more "classic" experience.

And if you're worried about the problem of an entire server population start over at level 1, don't. I can tell you that I dove in fully on the first EQ progression server. It was a blast. It's like traffic, people find other routes when their familiar one gets over-congested. You start leveling in places like Qeynos sewers, LFay, CT, Kedge, The Hole, etc. Porting becomes a valuable group asset. The most fun you can have in this game is with a dedicated leveling group where gear is statless, mobs are tough, and high level players are rare enough that you can't rely on finding one to bail you out.