Game Mechanics: sneak pull

[Haynar]

Originally Posted by Cecily [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

#1 That's wrong. Sneak is not supposed to break on attack.
#2 Correct. Projectiles should have flight times. Not sure what your point on sneak fails is, it's practically 100% (probably should be) for rogues and easy to check for monks.
#3 How it's functioning for sneak singles is accurate and there's safehouse articles to back that up.

My understanding, is you are supposed to drop sneak, throw, if sneak is up before dmg hits, good sneak pull.

If sneak is up when u throw, and u didnt drop sneak, it drops on sucessful hit. It does not on miss?

Please clear up details.

H

[Daldaen]

Originally Posted by Haynar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

My understanding, is you are supposed to drop sneak, throw, if sneak is up before dmg hits, good sneak pull.

If sneak is up when u throw, and u didnt drop sneak, it drops on sucessful hit. It does not on miss?

Please clear up details.

H

I'm not exactly clear on the hit/miss thing. One side suggests that the only way you could successfully sneak pull was on a missed throwing item when you never connected. This way the only way throwing item sneak pulling worked was when your throwing item missed.

Others suggest that so long as you had sneak engaged while the projectile was in the air, you will successfully sneak pull it. This situation is the one that has the most agreement on.

Cecily reread the posts in this thread. They disagree with your beliefs. The statements and posts from the Safehouse were updated over the years to include several changes, namely the sneak doesn't break on you hitting a mob patch in Luclin.

And no, you couldn't herpderp a train of 50 mobs in fear and sneak pull out one mob in the center of the pack. Projectile collisions didn't allow for it (a projectile would hit a mob inbetween you and your target, pulling the incorrect mob) and sneak shouldn't remove assist entirely just reduce it like the mob is harmonied. Again reread posts on this.

I find it funny that you hate the exploit rogues use to pickpocket Tani. But sneak pulling Myconid Spore King solo through the jail to the tube room is totally legit...

[Haynar]

Here is what i see from melee. Sneak up, a miss draws no aggro. Sneak up, a hit drops sneak.

So ranged attack, sneak up when attacking, a miss is easy mode. Sneak pull.

Ranged attack, sneak up when attacking. A hit drops sneak. Epic fail.

Ranged attack, sneak down when attack. If you get sneak up, before it hits (hit or miss). Score. Sneak pull.

That was what i can gather from posts i read.

H

[vouss]

Some of those mechanics seem conflicting. The hit/miss mechanics imply that attacking does not break stealth unless you hit the target. While having to turn on sneak after throwing would suggest that attacking DOES break sneak but you can simply re-apply the ability before your projectile hits the target. While it still works as you have it stated (hit/miss is the only deciding factor wether or not your sneak breaks, but turning on sneak after throwing a weapon before it hits creates some loophole around this?) It seems weird, and like that's not how the developers would have intended it to be.

[evilkorn]

http://sanguineblade.yuku.com/topic/1427/Sneak-pulling

When Mobs are relatively close together and facing the same direction (or at least not facing oppositie directions), this is when sneak pulling is the most possible.

What you do is have sneak/hide on, inch up behind the target you want (the closer of the two with it's back to you), and hit your range attak until it goes off. As soon as it goes off and you fire at the mob, keep stepping backwards. WHen you fire, you will unhide but will continue to sneak. The mob will then come towards you, but by the time it gets to you and breaks your sneak you are out of the aggro range of the other mobs you don't want to pull. THerefore, you've just singly pulled from 2+ mobs standing next to each other.

Feb 13 01 2:17 PM
No mention of sneak breaking when thrown or having to sneak again during flight.

[Man0warr]

Yeah I don't remember all the mechanics of it, I was like 14 in 1999 - but I remember sneak not breaking with ranged weapons on a miss or a hit. As a rogue, HIDE definitely does break on a ranged attack, which is why BOTH mobs had to be facing away from you when you did this or you would aggro any mobs facing you (and thus all the mobs near after proxy aggro) because only sneak was still on.

Some of these Safehouse posts are in late 2000 and 2001 with no edits.

I guess you could not trust these old archived posts but since that's the bulk of your proof for every other change you propose you can't have it both ways.

[Erati]

doesnt make sense that a 'miss' would be nearly exploitative and the desired result when using a throwing item while pulling

Sneak either broke or it didnt when using a throwing weapon - I doubt it broke only on 'hits' and not 'misses'

[Haynar]

Thats the issue. Some of old archived posts dont make sense.

I do have the delay from using ranged weapons working now.

So what is the issue really? Sneak pull should only work on mobs with no aggro? So you cant DA, and tag split?

H

[Man0warr]

Thats the issue. Some of old archived posts dont make sense.

A lot of stuff that worked in classic makes no sense to a game developer in 2015.

Heck it only took them a year and a half to admit that both Feign Death and Complete Heal (rotations) were being used in ways they didn't want/expect but it was too late for them to change it without causing huge uproars - in effect both of these abilities were broken and in FD's case, totally unintuitive in how it works.

I do have the delay from using ranged weapons working now.

Flight time on projectiles is classic, so that's good.

So what is the issue really? Sneak pull should only work on mobs with no aggro? So you cant DA, and tag split?

No one DA's and tags, so that's wouldn't change anything. It already works this way.

You either have a monk FDing a few times to wipe aggro, or a monk who pulls and then another person (who doesn't have aggro) with sneak pull off him.

Basically what they want to change is sneak tags not causing aggro on mobs near the mob you pull (even if all mobs are facing away from you), which would fundamentally change how sneak functions in all situations not just pulling.

[Haynar]

I don't want to disable sneak pulling.

But as i understand, it works in some ways that it shouldnt.

H