"wow raiding is takes alot more skill than eq" - SamwiseRed

[Niedar]

do agree

[Bardalicious]

Originally Posted by PhilMcKracken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you think World of Warcraft didnt try to come out with more efficient ways to keep you addicted and trying to learn from Everquests mistakes to get a higher player base

You're too stupid to realize you're arguing my point for me in this sentence and it makes me feel bad.

[Atamen]

Originally Posted by toolshed [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

EQ raiding has changed so much since the original game that I think it matters what expansion you choose to compare WoW to. Sure, the original game and first expansions had incredibly linear raid encounters, but especially with PoP and encounters like The Rathe Council - that shit took a lot of time to figure out and had a tremendous learning curve.

I only played WoW up to The Burning Crusade and never encountered a very 'hard' raid encounter like The Rathe Council in EQ.

Rathe Council was grueling. The sheer amount of focus it took everyone in the raid to exert for the 2 hours it took to setup the encounter was incredible.

All it took was 1 missed heal on the groups tanking the non mezzables or one enchanter or bard getting a badly timed mez resist and it was game over, total wipe and the encounter blown until it popped back up a week later or whatever it was.

In fact, 3 out of the 4 elemental plane bosses in POP were highly stressful due to the stakes, and the uniqueness of the encounters.

There are some aspects of wow raiding that make it difficult, but for my money nothing compares to some of those raids in PoP and later expansions. They were just cruel.

[Pokesan]

Originally Posted by Niedar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

WoW takes more skill this should not even be controversial

[toolshed]

Originally Posted by Atamen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Rathe Council was grueling. The sheer amount of focus it took everyone in the raid to exert for the 2 hours it took to setup the encounter was incredible.

All it took was 1 missed heal on the groups tanking the non mezzables or one enchanter or bard getting a badly timed mez resist and it was game over, total wipe and the encounter blown until it popped back up a week later or whatever it was.

In fact, 3 out of the 4 elemental plane bosses in POP were highly stressful due to the stakes, and the uniqueness of the encounters.

There are some aspects of wow raiding that make it difficult, but for my money nothing compares to some of those raids in PoP and later expansions. They were just cruel.

Glad someone else that was playing EQ at the highest level could come in and comment.

I've played both with high end guilds and PoP is my favorite raiding expansion of all time. Nothing compares to PoTime in its prime

[Colgate]

Originally Posted by toolshed [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

EQ raiding is way less forgiving than WoW. You can full wipe in WoW and be at the boss again within seconds; hell there are even safe zones RIGHT BY the raid boss where you can buff and rez the entire party if needed. In EQ - there is not a lot of forgiveness and a wipe at a boss could mean you have to clear the entire dungeon again (with no gear, unless you have a nec) to access the raid boss again.

by this definition would you say that red99 takes more skill than blue99 since you also have to deal with PvP as well?

[toolshed]

Originally Posted by Colgate [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

by this definition would you say that red99 takes more skill than blue99 since you also have to deal with PvP as well?

yes

[topgun1027]

Originally Posted by Secrets [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

WoW is harder than EQ by far. EQ is simply a timesink with far fewer mechanics.

The only reason why EQ is considered 'hard' is because people misappropriate 'hard' with 'unforgiving'. In WoW, you aren't penalized for your mistakes, at all, beyond getting a screen that says you lose. In EQ, if you make a mistake, it costs you more time, but you still made the mistake. There are more opportunities for mistakes in WoW as opposed to EQ which has a lesser decision making process due to number of steps and variables to consider. EQ1 PVE isn't even remotely close to the level of twitchyness that WoW offers.

And yes, twitchy games are still skill based. Most EQ1 players play EQ1 because they don't have a reaction time to play PvP games, hence why Red99 is less popular and most blue players are not willing to try red because 'it has pvp in it'. EQ1 is forgiving for time accumulated where as WoW is not forgiving for time accumulated. This is also where the social stigma and hatred for red players is formed by blue players; it's because they are lacking in reaction time for whatever excuse they offer, but what it comes down to is, EQ1 PvP is about on par for skill as WoW PvE.

Put the best WoW PvPers like Athene, Sodapoppin, etc, in Red99, and you'll see all major guilds dissolve because they can't compete with the metagame that they'll develop. I guarantee it.

Gave up agreeing with anything you said when these were mentioned..fanboys..

[wycca]

EQ Classic raiding is unforgiving, but fairly basic.

However, Blizzard had an employee guild in to mine EQ - first Storm Guard, then they merged into LoS. They pretty much had the benefit of years of distilling & reviewing EQ in creating their initial content.

What most posters here don't seem to realize, is that EQ raiding kept developing but still remained very unforgiving. Comparing Classic EQ raiding to WoW is like taking a Formula1 car 2-3 years old and comparing it to today's cars.

EQ raiding, in later expansions - DoDH, Solteris, etc became not only complex & scripted but also remained unforgiving. Basically you can't focus on EQ raiding 2-3 years before WoW launched, and compare it to years of development in WoW raids years later.

[Galelor]

Originally Posted by toolshed [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Glad someone else that was playing EQ at the highest level could come in and comment.

I've played both with high end guilds and PoP is my favorite raiding expansion of all time. Nothing compares to PoTime in its prime

PoP was my favorite expansion too. While some of Luclin had mechanics other than tank/spank, PoP was really where raiding took off imo. (By the way, PoP came out 2 years before WoW was even released.) I raided eq expansions on and off at a high level from Kunark though 14 or 15 expansions. P99 raiding has almost nothing in common with raiding from PoP after. If you haven't raided a lot of high end content past Luclin, you have no clue what the raid game is like.

Many later EQ encounters take 1 fuck up to wipe raids. Missed emotes, missed heals, not assisting, one mez break, not being aware of surroundings, etc. Not all encounters are like this, but many are like this.

I'd like to add that PvP on EQ was basically total garbage. This was because EQ was built as a PvE game. Comparing EQ PvP to WoW PvP is stupid because EQ wasn't built around PvP like WoW was. Red dudes can argue all they want, but the numbers don't bull shit...