Spells: 100 MR to resist MR nuke. 350 FR to reduce FR nuke.

[Dullah]

That would make sense, though I dont think Hero would have 10 counters. I dont think any buff had higher counters than the biggest dispel (recant) or that used by boss mobs like inny/phinny, as they seemed to always get 4 buffs. Again, just an assumption.

[Nirgon]

Proc rate for phinny/inny appears to be consistent with frequency of VS taps proc'd from melee from what I'm reading on eq zam.

I think strongest buffs are 9 counters... as annul always nabbed 2 from the top down.

[Haynar]

Agreed, strong buffs 9 counters.

What would strong buffs be? Hate to set all these manually.

H

[Nirgon]

Well I'd be careful if anyone says "everything above lvl 39" is 9+ counters... because some classes get the same spells at different levels.

IE: Shaman 9 gets sow, ranger 39 gets sow.

There's definitely a base line, I'm not sure what resource would provide what info... and probably crowd sourcing rather than just my opinion is a good idea here.

[Gigaslash]

talisman heroism symbol haste(maybe?) not sure on shaman stat buffs, probably not. Also for Velious - Aegolism, Focus of Spirit.. really not sure whether the pally hp buff would be or not.

Really need to find some evidence of counters or its never gonna be right without major thinking.

[Nirgon]

I have a very, very strong sneaking suspicion that the # of magic counters for buffs/debuffs will match the numbers for poison/diseases cast (for full dots, not debuffs) of their level to start. Not to mention shamans get poison/disease regularly enough that we can draw some conclusions.


@Gigaslash: I used annul for that reason in pvp on live instead of pumice (once I get annul...). I needed to manage my buff stack very exactly.

Special dots will be an interesting case.. like stream of acid.

[Dullah]

Originally Posted by Haynar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Agreed, strong buffs 9 counters.

What would strong buffs be? Hate to set all these manually.

H

This is just a guess, but I'd think every 8 or so levels buffs would gain a counter.

Level 1-8 = 1 counter
Level 9-16 = 2 counters
Level 17-24 = 3 counters
Level 25-32 = 4 counters
Level 33-40 = 5 counters
Level 41-48 = 6 counters
Level 49-56 = 7 counters
Level 57+ = 8 counters

Something like that. You could just do 60 / 9 which is 6.6 and say every 7 levels you get + 1 counter.

Originally Posted by Nirgon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I have a very, very strong sneaking suspicion that the # of magic counters for buffs/debuffs will match the numbers for poison/diseases cast (for full dots, not debuffs) of their level to start. Not to mention shamans get poison/disease regularly enough that we can draw some conclusions.


@Gigaslash: I used annul for that reason in pvp on live instead of pumice (once I get annul...). I needed to manage my buff stack very exactly.

That would be a great baseline. Compare counters on disease/poison of the same level with the buffs.

[Dullah]

Well, the parallel between cure and poison/disease may not exist.

The biggest dispel, Recant, is 4x9.

The biggest poison cure is 4x16, with the biggest poison being bane of knife (10 counters).

[Haynar]

I am thinking spells should be grouped into types.

I need more examples of what always took more than one cast and the such.

H

[Dullah]

Thats going to some really hard data to compile. By memory, I just remember low level dispels like nullify/cancel doing less and less at high levels. I remember casting them 2x before non-clickie spells started to drop.

My best guess is that it was simply based on level, but if you want to get techie with it you could look at the amount of mana it took to cast and consider that. For example, maybe a level 40s vision augment shouldnt be as many counters as a 44 arch shielding simply by virtue of the fact it took half the mana to cast.