Necro or enchanter...Go!

[Uteunayr]

Originally Posted by Potus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Necromancers were always a DPS class. At launch they matched/exceeded monks and rogues in DPS. Necromancers had multiple DD spells, the most DoTs of any class in the game, was a primary pet class. They screamed damage, both immediately and sustained over long periods of time.

If Necromancers were a support class then Verant screwed up majorly. And no amount of Screaming Terror, Summon Corpse, and Shadow Bound could make up for real support classes like Cleric, Enchanter, or Bard.

In Kunark, Necromancers ceased to be a DPS class because Verant coded all the raid targets to resist a vast majority of Necromancer spells. This was intended to make Necromancers worse than other classes post 50.

Necromancers were a support until around Luclin/PoP era where they condensed DoTs to short duration, removed twitch, removed heals, removed pretty much all our utility (with ST being one to quickly follow), and made us rotate between 12+ DoTs.

We never "screamed damage". Rogues, Monks, Rangers, Wizards, these people were always on top of a Necromancer. Necromancers were in the position of being one of the inefficient DPS classes for group and raid fights until Velious when bosses started getting some real meat on them, and DoTs would tick to fruition. Our DDs are terribly inefficient relative to other specialized classes, and they would never match up to MDPS.

Necromancers were not a DPS class in Classic unless you were an idiot that adds to the culture of Necromancers not being seen good in groups. A smart Necromancer knows that is not their role, and they shine in other ways, namely as a support class.

This was not a mistake, it was intentional, and it was brilliant. It's among the first games to really dig into this side of Necromancy, namely being a conduit for the transfer of life, something that many games completely looked aside from. A Necromancer is not a Wizard, they do not cause the elements to cringe, they are not a Cleric, they do not create life through healing, as that is a divine power. No, a Necromancer is an arcane caster that can transfer life between things. You suck the life out of your enemies, and you deliver it to your allies. You burn it into mana, and transfer that to allies. You sacrifice the weak, and you can expend that soul to bring the strong back to life. The point is that the Necromancer does not create life, the Necromancer just moves life between the living.

It's the side of Necromancer that is missing from many games due to the time it takes to manage such a thing (such as Diablo 2, it wouldn't really fit in an ARPG), and it is the reason why Necromancers in classic were the best recreation of the class for a video game ever done by a game company.

Originally Posted by Potus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm kind of puzzled you'd argue this point. You really think Necromancers received equal positive attention in Kunark and scaled proportionately to other classes? Shaman? Enchanters? Monks?

I don't think I even have to provide data. It's pretty blatant when you look at itemization for Kunark. Do Necromancers get a kunark spell at level 30 that outdamages their level 49 dots? No, they don't. But melees have noob dungeon drops that make them vendor Ykeshas and delete planar drops.

The fact that little-to-no Necromancer spells landed on raid targets in Kunark proves my point.

Again, you're looking at this through the lens of "HOW MUCH DPS DO I DO? HURR DURR.", which is about the last thing a Necromancer should or needs to be concerned with, in classic, or in Kunark. It didn't even get onto the table for intelligent Necromancers until Velious when we had raid mobs with more meat on them to allow DoTs to tick, but also resulting in putting a greater need on our patching and twitching capabilities.

It is not as bad as you make it out, as you're damn near obfuscating reality through your lens of DPS Only. Damage needed was scaled up to kill anything, and Necromancers were no exception. But instead of our damage being ramped up incredibly, our utility, our support was, with modest increases to damage.

What Kunark brought to the many Necromancers who embraced their role as a support included abilities to bring back the dead, a pet that backstabs, quick-casting lifetaps, a fantastic heal (+125 for -60ish for 4 ticks), a self-Succor, a third Fear, tiny coffins, a second DA, and the most mana efficient engine until mid-Luclin.

Saying that because Necromancers can't land damage spells on Kunark raid mobs means Necromancers were treated unfairly since Necromancers are a DPS class is like saying that because Rogues can't bandage up to 100% proves the point that they were treated unfairly since Rogue is a Support Class.

I really want to believe you're trolling at this point. This perception is why Necromancers had to fight an uphill battle to group, and even more so now in P1999, because people who blindly believe Necromancer is a DPS class will be slinging DoTs onto mobs that die before 3 ticks get off, and they'll claim that's their job, no matter how inefficient and shitty it is. If you want to make arguments about the efficacy of a class based on DPS, find another class.