OFFICIAL PROPOSAL from FE/TMO

[Seltius]

Originally Posted by Tecmos Deception [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Wanting more concessions than were proposed doesn't mean anyone is shitting on this proposal. It's not like hardcore raiders are giving up that much on an absolute scale, seeing as they already have killed all this shit 300 times and have alts decked in raid loot and still have a relative monopoly on VP.

I don't know where you get all your information about alts. I would love to get some gear on my alts that I will never see unless I retire my main or put them in another raiding guild.

In the end if the raid scene were a pie then no one is happy with the slice they have been getting. Threads like this are offering a larger slice but unless the pie is cut in half or the guilds that feel they were being mistreated are getting the larger or largest slice they will refuse to allow the pie to be cut at all. I figure everyone loves pie so it was a safe analogy. I once ate at a place called Perfect Pies and they had an amazing assortment of pies it was great a pie for everyone.

[Toodles]

Originally Posted by Ella`Ella [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

In order to promote an environment that fosters a more friendly atmosphere between the “Casuals” and the “Hardcore” several raiding guilds have come together to draft this agreement for the server. The high-end raiding guilds have made several concessions in favor of the smaller guilds to get more targets. This proposal comes as a function of the input of many members of the server through posts, tells, and vent conversations from members and leadership across the server.

No poop socking agreement:
No guild will have more than 2 members present at any given time during period of time where either Venril Sathir or Trakanon are in window. Specifically those tracking for VS will not be in the room. This will apply to all mobs.

Naturally, there are times that will exist where it is necessary to have more than 2 trackers in the zone for an encounter. There are, however, instances where more than 2 characters from any guilds will need to be in zone. If a guild is CoTHing members down or buffing they may do so, and they may med to full. Upon reaching full mana or completing a CoTH the surplus members must log off and not maintain a presence.

There will no longer be grouping in the VS pit to circumvent the 2-player no-sock rule. This is easy to justify as it’s a terrible spot for exp and has relatively no value for any player to be here if they aren’t looking to manipulate this rule.

In addition, guilds are able to engage Prot and Tola within a reasonable amount of time and may not malinger in the zone after the mobs have been killed.

With the agreement to remove socking as a tactic, we request that GMs significantly reduce variance, as it only serves as a detriment to everyone at this point.

DA Stalling Tactics:
Any stalling tactic such as Divine Barrier or Aura, Harmshield, monk whirlwind or avoidance discs or DA Idol is considered 1 unit of stall. No guild shall employ more than 2 units of stalling during any raid target encounter (36 seconds). If said guild employs a stall tactic and fails to engage the encounter after that time period has concluded, they will forfeit any attempt to engage that target during this spawn period and retreat from the encounter.

CATEGORY A & B
Any guilds considered to be a raid guild will be categorized either A or B.

The Mystical Order, Forceful Entry, and Inglorious Basterds will start in category A. All other guilds will start as Category B.

If a category B guild kills 40% or more of targets in any given month during our “hands off” period (explained below), they will be promoted to Category A and be subject to the respective restrictions.

Any guild that is promoted to Category A will remain in this category for 30 days and will remain in this category until their kill percentage falls to 20% or below.

VP Dragons are excluded from percentage calculations.

Any guild that is VP capable (Kills a dragon in VP) will be considered Category A for 90 days.

HANDS OFF PERIOD
As of January 1, 2014, Category A guilds will be considered “Hands Off” for any Priority raid targets during the first 7 days of each calendar month. During that time period, Category A guilds will avoid any of their priority targets and open them to the rest of the server. This will however exclude raid targets in Veeshan’s Peak.

During the “Hands Off" Period, Category A Guilds may take this opportunity to go after Category A de-prioritized targets that they will be avoiding the other 3 weeks a month.

It is important to note that FE, IB and TMO will not necessarily be actively tracking these deprioritized mobs during this time, as we have agreed only to track and engage them during this time if there is a need for a specific item (e.g. we have a warrior holding a green scale that needs a maestro hand).

Repop Days
During a repop, the Category A and B restrictions will not apply, however TMO, FE, and IB have agreed that they will not pursue non-priority targets during a repop.

CAT A De-Prioritized Raid Targets:
Gorenoire, Talendor, Maestro of Rancor & Dracolich (solo spawn)

CAT A Priority Raid Targets:
Cazic Thule (Draco), Venril Sathir, Trakanon, Faydedar, Innourouk, Severillous

Nagy/Vox
As it concerns Nagafen & Vox; CAT A Guilds will alternate killing only one per week and the following week killing the other always leaving one available to the remainder of the server.

Plane of Sky/Noble Dojorn

The Plane of Sky rotation will be respected by all guilds participating, however guilds are free to renegotiate their days with whomever they please.

Guilds agree to leave Overseer of Air up (providing the mechanics on blue still allow for this) to spawn multiple Nobles per day/week/month. If a Noble spawns during a guilds scheduled time, it will be assumed that the guild currently engaging sky will have a first right to engage that noble or they may defer that target to another guild if they choose to do so.

Guild Council
In addition to the aforementioned agreement, I have spoken with Sirken and Derubael about creating a guild council consisting of the following guilds; Divinity, Taken, The Mystical Order, Forceful Entry, Inglourious Basterds, and Bregan d`Aerth. Each guild will have two members that will sit on the council and each guild will have a single vote. Voting for amendments will require a majority (4/6 votes). The council will also be responsible for sanctioning guilds that violate the terms of the agreement. Sanctions will require a super majority to affect (5/6 votes).

GMs Sirken and Derubael will oversee the committee if need be and their decisions will supersede those of the council. The CSR staff will defer to the judgement of the council however and will only intervene in extenuating circumstances. Guilds will also have the right to appeal decisions with CSR staff. The CSR staff has given the council the power to self-govern and use this committee to self-police. They also encourage guilds to work out disputes amongst themselves before bringing issues before CSR staff.

Will guild leaders please PM me with the members of their respective guilds that they would like to add to this council. Ideally, the members you choose will have the authority to make decisions on behalf of your guild or act in the stead of a Guild Leader in the event of the leader’s absence.

Please reference the above document for your consideration. The guilds that have drafted this agreement believe this is a monumental change for the server in a favorable direction for all parties involved. The leadership of each guild is asked to reply, “Signed” in support of the above.

Watch me counter that in one word, in one fell swoop..ready for it..you sitting down for this...


VARIANCE



Psst, it's the thing you remove...

[Seltius]

Catherin

you made that post you can cut and paste 1 line of every post I've made if you would like but I quoted your post not someone else's you were the first one I came to that really came out and said that YOU were willing to hold out and extort until things were settled this was your words not someone else's. I know others posted the same thing but who knows. They may have only said it because you said it first or gave them the idea. You posted like you had control and I just commented on it. You can say what you want to try and excuse it or justify it but in the end those were your words. Maybe I just like the others that have said it and decided not to point out that its a stupid idea to say something like that.

Oh and trust me unlike you I accept the criticism for my posts instead of setting out to prove that I didn't say it or that it wasn't my decision to say it but I said it anyway.

Now cut copy and paste what you would like of my comments above. Somehow im sure you can come up with something to deflect again the fact that you suggested or threatened extortion however you would like to put it.


I have included a wiki link just for you.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extortion

TL;DR let me know and I can copy and paste one liners in a pm like you seem to enjoy.

PS= beyond the jokes I have heard about you my only interaction with you ever has been attempting to buy stuff from you in EC. I don't know your role in the negotiations or even your status in Taken so if you have no authority then your like me and its probably a good thing.

Feel free to copy and paste anything I said in this thread for your benefit ill watch and feel all warm and fuzzy but will not be replying again it really just isn't worth it to try and forumquest I cant tell where I am in the game. I seem to lack some understanding to know if I'm winning or losing and without the desire to care it seems lackluster at best.

[-Catherin-]

I could post a wiki link to dictatorship or that same exact link to extortion and put my own spin on it to compare it to what everyone else has been dealing with for a couple years now too. but that wouldn't make it true. So just stop [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Also im willing to accept criticism. But yeah I do not like being called a liar. There is a difference.

As to my "power" I don't have any which I have already said a few times. This isn't about just you or me regardless and anyone that thinks they have more power than someone else is doing it wrong.

And really, the two of us going back and forth isn't doing anything good for anyone. And its not fun. I'm really not out to get you or anyone else whatever notion you have in your mind about me. I'd rather find a common ground where we can all get along, and I don't hold personal ill will against any of you

I truly want this all to stop and to see an agreement happen that everyone can accept. this whole thing makes me sad. You can have your last word if you still feel its necessary. Im not going to feed into it anymore [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Happyfeet]

We'll even let you have the first week of the EC tunnel Catherin

[-Catherin-]

Originally Posted by Happyfeet [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

We'll even let you have the first week of the EC tunnel Catherin

TY [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[whitebandit]

Originally Posted by happyhappy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

http://www.project1999.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=81892

Why is anything outside of VP in Priority class again?

tis a pretty damn good point...

[Seltius]

I really hope this works out. My whole issue isn't the raiding its what I do but it isn't why I play. I just want things done and in a way that I can still play the game and have fun for the reasons I play it now. Its already hit home and bothers me some of what has happened. Its our sandbox but atm I almost feel like id like to just kick sand in a few people's eyes call it a day and go home.

Even if the raid rules are agreed upon and change for the benefit of all the damage is done. Nothing will change that at this point and I'm not referring to the bans or suspensions or anything like that I am referring to the repercussions and indirect damage that was done. If I never get to raid until Velious it wont bother me personally but the ripple effect it will have will be want ruins this game for me.

I have seen the best and worst of people on these forums in recent months. Far worse in some cases than anything else id ever encountered in 13yrs of online gaming. And that says a lot after playing EvE Online.

Sorry to everyone I have given a hard time or criticized here but most of you don't know as much as you think you do about people. Hell I know less than I think I know about most people and always wish I knew more.

Please try and work together to find an amiable solution for everyone.

[Erati]

Originally Posted by Hitpoint [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I"ll be honest. It looks like Taken and BDA and whoever else are simply trying to squeeze more out of this situation because the GMs gave you the power to do so. Your right, raid suspension hurts the big guilds more. And yes, GMs want a unanimous agreement from all guilds.

Let's imagine that we weren't threatened with a raid suspension and this current proposal was posted. People would go fucking INSANE for it. Big guilds said they are willing to give up tons of targets every month, including 1/4th of the ones they want the most. Guilds that were previously getting nothing, can get multiple targets weekly. They can set up a rotation between themselves if they don't want to do any work. That's left up to them. And still allowed to compete with the top guilds if they choose to. Nothing even close to this has ever been on the table. It would be accepted without a second thought, there would be no holding out for MORE. Want some inside info? This agreement was drafted and posted on our boards for review a day before Sirken's threat. Our officers didn't come up with this because they had the threat of a suspension looming. They actually wanted to make the raid scene better. And you all shit on it like this, just because you can. Imo threatening the server was a mistake, and now this is all so messy and hateful when it doesn't need to be.

ur proposal woulda been a nice gesture if it didnt seem like a simple bone thrown at hungry dogs

we are trying to do something that the majority would like to see

the FE plan still requires u to shit up the raid scene and literally changes nothing besides a few more mobs for the bigger casual guilds

its not about giving BDA a couple Traks or Taken a Sev or two

its about making a change ... not throwing some mobs at us and saying " THERE! NOW YOU HAPPY?!?!!"

[Hitpoint]

Originally Posted by Erati [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

ur proposal woulda been a nice gesture if it didnt seem like a simple bone thrown at hungry dogs

we are trying to do something that the majority would like to see

the FE plan still requires u to shit up the raid scene and literally changes nothing besides a few more mobs for the bigger casual guilds

its not about giving BDA a couple Traks or Taken a Sev or two

its about making a change ... not throwing some mobs at us and saying " THERE! NOW YOU HAPPY?!?!!"

So you'd have been happy if you didn't misinterpret this as charity?