OFFICIAL PROPOSAL from FE/TMO

[Autotune]

Originally Posted by Lazie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't think they understand yet that point system will never be the majority either. People are going to have to meet in the middle. NO ONE is going to get EVERYTHING they want here.

Actually, it seems the majority of every guild is siding more towards the point system than FE & TMO's system. I'd think if IB stepped forward and made something more toward the point system or agreed to something like the point system than that would be the majority of guilds accepting a new system, the only hold back would be FE & TMO. Who is to say that the server and staff wouldn't move forward without those two guilds if all the others were in favor?

[radditsu]

Originally Posted by Yinikren [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This shitty proposal kind of did it to itself to be honest.

One system is fair, unbiased, and easy to police. The other system clearly favors the top end and is overly convoluted and full of problems. You can decide which.

Yup point system is fair. But you are doing nothing to help it. Your incessant posting probably killed any goodwill it had...and I LIKE the idea. Jesus Christ

[Hitpoint]

Originally Posted by Scoresby [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Are you being dense on purpose? Every guild gets the same amount of points, but not every guild will get kills to use up their points. it merely forces guilds to focus on targets that matter to them. You still would have to out compete everyone for the raid target, just can't exceed your point limit by killing any and everything. It's pretty darned simple.

The reward you get for being top tier is the best items, but the concession is the raid scene opens to a significantly larger playerbase....which was a requirement of the agreement to begin with.

So then half the people posting in this thread that think it is absurd and insulting that they should have to track and park, are still going to have to track and park. I don't see how that changes. And the top guilds are going to choose the same mobs all the time probably. We're going to end up with smaller guilds picking up scraps, not unlike this proposal.

[radditsu]

Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Actually, it seems the majority of every guild is siding more towards the point system than FE & TMO's system. I'd think if IB stepped forward and made something more toward the point system or agreed to something like the point system than that would be the majority of guilds accepting a new system, the only hold back would be FE & TMO. Who is to say that the server and staff wouldn't move forward without those two guilds if all the others were in favor?

See my flat point system idea for concessions to hardcore raiders.

[Autotune]

Originally Posted by Happyfeet [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Wow, who have you become? I was giving a good example of how to get around that shitbag idea and you call me shady? Go back to RNF Stealin. It's a terrible plan with no way to implement it. Call me whatever you want, but I can read a bad idea when I see one paaaaaaal.

That's exactly my point happyfeet. You aren't like that and you wouldn't stand for it even if you didn't agree with the system. The example you gave is easily defeated because people like you exist who wouldn't do something shady just because you don't agree with the new rules. I'm almost positive you'd test the new system and then try to change it or you might actually find that the a points system isn't actually that bad as long as it's weighted correctly.

[Yinikren]

Originally Posted by Pheer [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't understand why people have such a hardon for this point system. Its still possible for most of the casual guilds to never see a VS, Trak, or CT kill ever again depending on the more hardcore guilds' mob priority. Especially if IB/FE ever decided to part ways amidst such a system. Also what stops players from hardcore guilds apping their lesser known alts into other guilds for additional chances at loot once their main guild is done cleaning out their priority targets? Stealin and Derubael were debating about core groups of raiders splintering off from guilds to game the system when all they really have to do is slip their alts into a guild like BDA/Taken/Divinity and invest their time in whichever guild is after the most targets on that player's personal priority list.

What if for example draco is on low priority for a lot of guilds and one guild in particular has made it one of their main focuses to get as many BCGs as possible. Why not just app a caster alt into that guild and try to score a BCG for my main eventually since my main guild isnt prioritizing that mob anymore?

1.) because my guild watches out for shit like that.

2.) most of the server, in fact, are not assholes.

3.) we don't care about engaging VS every week. But the server cares when you kill VS, and Trak, and Talendor, and Sev, and Gore, and Inny, and CT, and Draco, and Fay in the same week. There's the issue and my system fixes that. Pick the damn targets you need, and if you miss them better luck next week.

[-Catherin-]

tracking and parking will ALWAYS been necessary with the variance. whatever system we end up agreeing on doesn't change that unless it was a flat out rotation that included everyone. And that isn't going to happen. And before someone accuses me of being a rotation socialist again, id like to point out im not in support of it happening either [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Autotune]

Originally Posted by radditsu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yup point system is fair. But you are doing nothing to help it. Your incessant posting probably killed any goodwill it had...and I LIKE the idea. Jesus Christ

Definitely.

[Yinikren]

Originally Posted by radditsu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yup point system is fair. But you are doing nothing to help it. Your incessant posting probably killed any goodwill it had...and I LIKE the idea. Jesus Christ

I'm just attempting to keep my side of the argument. Sorry for being bored at work. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Daldolma]

How about instead of creating a system that apportions raid mobs based on the same non-classic ability to mobilize 30 camped alts at 4AM, with leftovers being handed out charity-style on a percentage basis to guilds unwilling to compete, we fix the horribly non-classic mechanics and CSR of the endgame?

No socking, no camped alts, and vastly reduced variance. Make guilds actually race to the mobs once they spawn, without a prohibitively insane variance that requires round-the-clock tracking. When you have guilds racing from ZI and having to clear their way instead of just racing to character select, you'll have a natural spread based on legitimate competition instead of rewarding time inputs and sheer size.

Fixing this with "agreements" is just socialism. Fix the mechanics and the rules and you'll have legitimate competition and fair access for all guilds.