Dear Atheist,

[kylok]

Originally Posted by Ahldagor [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

the age of the universe is dependent upon light that we've detected with our own instruments. it's an arbitrary human thing. besides time is subjective.

Well.. yes and no. Since light travels at a constant speed we can say that the universe is at least so old if not older. The passage of time is relative, not subjective as it is a dimension of space-time. The measurement of time, much like the measurement of distance is indeed arbitrary but still based on the empirical. A fun fact to ponder is that from the perspective of a photon travel is instantaneous. Relativity is fun =D.

[r00t]

Originally Posted by kylok [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It's not quite that simple, but it's based on a parsec - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parsec
which is an easy calculation to make.

Also, this - "Measurements of the cosmic background radiation give the cooling time of the universe since the Big Bang, and measurements of the expansion rate of the universe can be used to calculate its approximate age by extrapolating backwards in time."
Since the universe expands at a more or less constant rate the age of the universe is not too hard to extrapolate.

LOLOL If scientists can tell that the universe is expanding then whats on the outside of it [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[kylok]

We don't know =P

[Ahldagor]

Originally Posted by kylok [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Well.. yes and no. Since light travels at a constant speed we can say that the universe is at least so old if not older. The passage of time is relative, not subjective as it is a dimension of space-time. The measurement of time, much like the measurement of distance is indeed arbitrary but still based on the empirical. A fun fact to ponder is that from the perspective of a photon travel is instantaneous. Relativity is fun =D.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_perception

don't hang yourself with time. it didn't exist until a pattern recognition was named and sustained by humans long before we were even eggs in our mother's bellies.

[kylok]

Let's say that you're r00ted to the ground, in the distance you see a mountain. Since you are immobile you have no way of knowing what is on the other side of the mountain.

If the only way you will acknowledge science is for it to explain every tiny facet of everything - that's an unreasonable expectation. That being said I don't really care if you do or don't, this thread has been fun and been a good exercise in at least attempting to explain what I have learned and feel to be true which I find to be valuable. Shit makes sense to me...

[kylok]

Originally Posted by Ahldagor [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_perception

don't hang yourself with time. it didn't exist until a pattern recognition was named and sustained by humans long before we were even eggs in our mother's bellies.

We're talking about two different things

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_measurement

[r00t]

if sciense is so smart what happens after we die

[kylok]

Einstein's classic example of relativity is that 2 hours with a pretty girl feels like 2 minutes. And 2 minutes of.. lets say reading this thread feels like 2 hours. Your perception of the time does not effect its actual passage.

[kylok]

Originally Posted by r00t [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

if sciense is so smart what happens after we die

Science doesn't know. There's far more that science doesn't know than it does. This does not discredit what science does explain. I personally don't care what happens after we die.. because I'll be dead.

[Ahldagor]

Originally Posted by kylok [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

We're talking about two different things

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_measurement

i now ask: how does someone measure something.

i'm not trying to be an ass, but the whole idea of time existing depends on a perception.


we didn't have time travel novels until the thinking about time changed (for a fun think about kind of thing that's not related to the points)