Some Fun Raid Changes

[Sarius]

A+ Loraen!

I really like the idea of the anti-poopsocking code, that will really even things out without any sort of "handout"

[Splorf22]

Originally Posted by Kelven [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Antipoopsocking code: Too complicated honestly.

I'm telling you as a computer scientist that this can be implemented very easily.

Anyway if people don't like my particular ideas that's fine. I just think something needs to be done about how raiding on this server is 90% about camping multiple buffed chars out 20 feet away from the spawn points of the various bosses. On Live you were only going to have one toon, and you'd probably be busy leveling/farming with it, so a patch day would actually be about mobilization.

The same goes for the antileapfrogging ideas about the Plane of Fear. I'm just throwing some stuff out there; people are welcome to suggest other ideas. Throwing up your hands and saying 'people are too greedy' isn't going to change anything though.

I have to say I'm amazed this thread is staying civil. It must be because I namedropped Sirken ;D

[Frieza_Prexus]

I personally like the anti-socking code. For me, I enjoy the race to kill a mob with only minimal preparation and the target triage that always accompanies hard decisions.

In fact, an anti-sock code on repops encourages competition by ensuring that only the best and most organized can rally to a target as opposed to who has the best 4-5 man FTE crew with DA idols CH items. Skill and organization matters a lot more when you can't rely on 4 monks/sks/necros who have huge play times and large amounts of skill. Instead, your weakest links matter, and that's true competition.

[Ravager]

Originally Posted by Splorf22 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Also I'm curious that not more people like my repop probability proportional to player population. At least when I suggested simultaneous repops, I meant them mostly as a replacement for the retarded variance scene we have now, not an addition.

I think this is brilliant. Would be roughly the same number of raid mob pops, but a lot more competitive than it is now. I'd think TMO would want something like this if competition is truly their thing.

[kaev]

Originally Posted by Ravager [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think this is brilliant. Would be roughly the same number of raid mob pops, but a lot more competitive than it is now. I'd think TMO would want something like this if competition is truly their thing.

That's really a strawman argument (the TMO baiting bit.) Those who compete aggressively rarely do so out of love for competition. What they love is winning, thus the incredible popularity of cheating in competitions world-wide and since forever. It's human nature, winning by the safest and most reliable means you can come up with is an obvious response to competition for survival.

It's the makers and enforcers of rules that have responsibility for creating a "fair" competition, most competitors are not going to accept that responsibility no matter how impassioned your arguments that they "should". They'll pay lip service if you demand it, but they'll never stop looking for an edge (just look at the latest MLB juicing scandal.)

[falkun]

I think the combination of antipoopsock code, simultaneous respawns, and disallowing training in VP would help tier the Kunark raid scene. There are already small semblances of tiers (1: Trak/VS, 2: Sev/Inny/CT/Draco, 3: Gore/Tal/Fay, etc.), but the top tier, VP, is excluded because a small train force can easily save that tier for last. Disallowing training would move that tier back up on the priority list.

**EDIT** Also, everyone says "training in VP will always happen with the messed up pathing in the zone," but why do the raid mobs need to be brought to the zone in? Trakanon and VS are not allowed to be killed at their zone's zone-ins, is there that much additional difficulty racing into VP to kill the mobs near/at their spawn? Heck, the VP map on the wiki already lists "optimal" kill locations near spawns for the bosses from 1999-era strategies. With anti-poopsock code, mobilizing around VP would involve a lot more strategy following resets.

[Aaron]

I don't have much to add. Just want to give you a kudos for trying to be part of the solution. Great suggestions.

[pasi]

I'd like to see tokens or a test server with copy character to spawn lootless raid mobs. The specifics can be worked out obviously - maybe lootless instances so it can't be used to grief.

It's not even close to classic, but it would allow for a lot more people to have fun without taking anything away from those who wish to throw away their life for 150 more HP and 10 more DPS.

It would also allow guilds to fight these mobs with reasonable numbers - you know, raid mobs not dying in 20 seconds.

I know Nilbog would never go for this, but a man can dream.

[xarzzardorn]

you can't stop people from camping out as close to trak as possible until you just move everyone on the server to the same spot. i really don't think logging out is a huge problem except on VS and Trakanon. virtually every other mob has a large % of people moving to the raid from a difference place.

having mobs spawn only via server repop would change the game too much. a mix of single mob spawns and repops suits everyone better, imo. tracking sucks for that one guy who is tracking the mob but his sacrifice improves the experience for his guild tremendously. people camp exp mobs for their rare spawns/drops and that has always been a part of EQ

Well as I have stated before I think EQ is just not designed to deal with two raid forces in the same zone. It's always going to about training stuff away and there isn't a lot that can be done about this other without substantial changes to game mechanics. However, I think the issue is particularly severe in the Plane of Fear because of the way Cazic summons the zone. I remember when I was in VD we had like 10 zone desyncs in a row when zerging him with 75 players and 100+ mobs being summoned and that Botnet trying to hunt him down when he was at 5% or something.

circumventing the zone summon mechanic is the primary reason for this, not the leapfrogging. rushed engages with lots of people (ie on a repop) where the kites aren't being done properly create lag. when both guilds are managing things the correct way, it doesn't. ct is probably the most enjoyable raid when it's being contested and i don't see a reason to change that

[Sarius]

I think leap-frogging in general is completely fucked up. If a guild is clearly making progress towards a raid mob by clearing to him, I don't feel it's right for another guild to steamroll past then and get FTE.