Critical Suggestions for Raid Rules

[r0xx0r]

afk camping is illegal here- apply this rule to raid boss camping as well imho.

[Skope]

That's exactly what I'm trying to address with what i wrote up. Let me know what you think people

[Humerox]

Only problem with it Skope is there's no incentive for people to do it. It makes it a matter of blind luck as to who gets the spawn.

At least with Hasbin's PVE event idea and Supreme's ranking system, there is incentive for the players.

That's why I put out the GM NPC thing. It provides incentive, and could be much fun for everyone involved.

In order to address the issue we really need to start thinking outside of the box.

[Skope]

I think there definitely is some incentive, quite simply by challenging other guilds to the spawns. The longer you're there and awake the more chance you get. The less you challenge other guilds on overlapping windows the less likely you'll get a shot at it. It also asks guilds who wish to split forces the ability to mobilize at a moments notice and engage in 30 minutes. There's by far more incentive there than there is now, for all parties involved. What it does is remove the incentive to camp the spawn prior to the window opening, which may actually mean that we get some use for trackers again.

[Buhbuh]

The real problem with that is: any guild that is of worth has a batphone to call their guild members to arms within 10 minutes. With the current hour limit to gather forces in that scenario, guild A would still always get the mob with ease. Who isn't on speed dial when you're in guilds together? Full on nerdery, but it happens!


This server came out; why do you think Obama is pushing the unemployment extensions so hard? Put the pieces together pals, EQ1999.

[Humwawa]

Originally Posted by rioisk [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

wait for a text message to kill a mob that is 100% no fail

Apart from 100% no fail part (it does happen to the best of us), this is exactly what classic EQ raiding is. I'm sorry, but that is what it is. There's no uber in that anywhere, that's just what it is.

You have a mob that has a long spawn time, and several groups of people want it. Each group places a number of people in the zone to watch for it, be that number 1 or 15. When it spawns, the guild is alerted of its spawning via texts, phone calls, and ingame channels.

At this point in mobilization, the trick is who can get there first. In FFA, it's the first group who can aggro the mob first, and all kinds of flaws exist in that system. It is usually moderated by the majority, and usually makes GMs furious.

In Rotation system, mobs are reserved by a group through the consensus of the "major" guilds. How a guild is deemed "major" tends to vary, and is often cluttered in red tape by the most skillful diplomats to ensure their group stays where they are.

Our current "System" is kind of an inversion of the race war - essentially, the race begins before the mob even spawns, and is limited only by the presence of another guild. This means that in order to retain an advantage, guilds will show up earlier and earlier before a spawn window opens in order to hold the mob, ultimately causing a permanent lockdown of both zone and player.

The problem with this server, in my opinion, is that a large number of us are Top Dog has-beens on a server that's too small for all of us. The price of wanting to be in a "top guild" in Classic means that there must be players who are NOT "top guild." What do you do with that?

Edit: Changed one freaking word.

[Noleafclover]

Originally Posted by Bones [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What you just described is the opposite of effort. As Skope stated, its not skill, its not organization, its not effort, and its not "hardcore". It is simply a willingness to not play your character for days so no other guilds can kill a target which you feel you deserve or have earned for being camped there AFK for days prior to it spawning, because a rule allows it.

Heh semantics. That willingness to camp is what prevents me from doing other things in the game, and I call that an effort. You don't. Aight. It's surely somethin.

And whatever it is, it surely sucks. As I said. And it's funny you pick out a line in my post - 'cause I stated there my complete agreement that there was no skill involved, and that I'm in favor of a raid rules change. We're mostly in agreement, and you're just arguin semantics here.

[G13]

Originally Posted by Skope [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Could even potentially have a system where timers are called on guilds that are actually poopsocking. The current rules can stay in place, the only addendum would be a timer that relegates their #1 position to the next guild that has 15 in zone and has called the timer. This can go on endlessly and in any zone, so that it's only the guilds who are active that may be able to swap between the 1-2 or even 1-2-3 positions. The timers don't have to be short, but an hour or two and can happen at anytime during the windows.

That is already part of the current raid rules as written. Roll call. Timer. Nothing is stopping anyone from calling a timer and a roll call/applying pressure to any guild that is camping a spawn. Nobody ever does it though. I don't see Remedy druids tracking spawns for their guild to come apply any pressure to IB or DA. I don't see it from Divinity either. Oh that's right. By the time the boss spawns, and they send out a batphone that probably won't be answered anyways, IB or DA have cleared to the target and killed it. There have been plenty of times where IB or DA has called and the guild who has claim has 30 minutes to buff/clear to target and kill. There has been times when both guilds failed. You people are acting like shit spawns and the "poopsockers" lazily waltz to the target and kill it. Maybe if you actually were THERE when shit was spawning and IB or DA was killing it, you'd know you have no idea WTF you are talking about and that isn't the way it works. When shit spawns you have to mobilize, buff, clear, and do it efficiently. There is no room for error when another guild is applying pressure.

It would essentially be as simple as guild B entering the zone with 15/+ and calling a "priority" timer, this way there should be no incentive to get there before the window opens and would be a race to get in there first as to have the first 1-2 hour window before there is a timer called on you. You can have a 1 minute response timer where 15+ from the guild would have to respond otherwise you forfeit that prioritized position to the guild who called timer.

This is stupid. You people are trying to penalize guilds that prioritize ahead of time because frankly, you don't want to do it. Everyone is trying to make all these new convoluted solutions that ignore the obvious. 5 raid targets. 900 people on the server. Spawn variance. If you want to kill raid targets, you need to be there, in force, when they spawn. Otherwise you aren't getting jack shit. Now you can label that "poopsocking" fine, whatever floats your boat, but those guilds are killing bosses and you are not.

I don't really understand why the guilds that have put in the effort and time to guarantee their guild gets to experience the raid targets on this server should be penalized because a bunch of scrubs now want their cake and to eat it too. Not one guild has even put in 5% effort to try and use a little tactics and strategy with the current raid rules in place to try to get mobs. It doesn't even require camping a damn thing either. That's what so pathetic about it. You people want to claim that camping doesn't take any effort, yet you have never put in the initiative yourselves to out smart the campers.

[Bardzilla]

one thing to consider is what no 'poopsocking' @ raid targets would do to the non raid camps....they would be stuffed more than they are currently.

[Sidious]

A large part of the problem is raid targets not spawning when the server goes down, and something that definitely does not feel classic here. The boss bonanza was always a way for the guilds not at the top to be able to grab a spawn when there were multiple targets available, which does not happen here when you can just camp a boss and move on to the next with minimal timer overlap.