So how about that Zimmerman trial?

[Malice_Mizer]

Originally Posted by Samoht [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

but... that would be racist to assume :O

no

no it wouldn't

bankers take risks when they give you money. it's a fact, not racism, that minorities like blacks and mexicans cannot pay their bills as reliably as everybody else.

sorry [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You're drawing generalized conclusions based on a person's ethnicity or race. There's been so many laws enacted over the past 50 years to deny banks the ability to engage in redlining, block busting, or any of the discriminatory practices that you condone as "common sense." It doesn't even matter if, statistically, black people default on their loans more than other "races." In our individualistic society, it shouldn't matter what group you're born into, you should get a fair shake if your files are in order. You conservatives leap back and forth between collectivist and hyper-individualistic societal philosophies as it suits your fancy, and it's really very annoying.

What if my father or other relative was a huge debtor and criminal? Would it be okay for a bank to say, "Well, it looks like you have horrible qualities in your blood, innately, so we're going to make a judgment call about you despite the contrary evidence you're providing us."

But I'm sure you're also in favor of across-the-board racial profiling in all cases because you're a proud idiot.

[TarukShmaruk]

Originally Posted by Fael [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Actually, if it came in at all it would be because the defendant in a criminal case typically gets more of a pass when it comes to getting potentially unfairly prejudicial evidence. The rules of evidence is more concerned about a defendant being unfairly prejudiced than a victim.

Here, what you worry about, as a judge I would imagine, is that the evidence of MJ use would lead the jury to believe, as many people on these boards have suggested, that TM is a dead beat kid who, even if murdered, isn't much use to society, etc. That type of conclusion, of course, is unfairly prejudicial.

Moreover, you have other issues. Even if the evidence makes it 1% more likely TM would act hyper aggressively, you would still have to show that he was affected by the drug at the time, which i am not sure there was evidence of that. That too would substantially diminish the probative value of the evidence. It would also take time to put on experts to have a trial within a trial in regards to how likely it was that TM was effected by the MJ at that time. All the while, the subtext is how TM is a dead beat druggy.

Moreoever, this evidence itself is only conditionally relevant to the issue at stake here, which is whether or not Zimmerman reasonably feared for his life. Yes, perhaps it would make it marginally more likely that TM acted in a manner consistent with Zimmerman's story, and thus he acted reasonably in fearing for his life. But the Jury has other ways to evaluate the truthfullness of Zimmerman's story, without the state's case being subjected to an impermissible and irrelevant character assault.

Dolic

I think the issue I have here is that any drugs or alcohol in Zimmerman's system at the time would have been brought into the trial, but drugs or alcohol in Martin's system could have had the same affect (perhaps made Martin more aggressive or reckless in his assault on Zimmerman).

That said I'm pretty sure nobody in the history of the world has tried to kill someone *because* they were high.

[Malice_Mizer]

Originally Posted by TarukShmaruk [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think the issue I have here is that any drugs or alcohol in Zimmerman's system at the time would have been brought into the trial, but drugs or alcohol in Martin's system could have had the same affect (perhaps made Martin more aggressive or reckless in his assault on Zimmerman).

That said I'm pretty sure nobody in the history of the world has tried to kill someone *because* they were high.

Good thing the definitely not-racist Sanford Police Department drug tested the dead body of Trayvon Martin but didn't bother asking a thing of the ZimZam. He could have been on PCP for all we know. That would actually shed a lot of light on this case.

[Supreme]

Originally Posted by Malice_Mizer [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Good thing the definitely not-racist Sanford Police Department drug tested the dead body of Trayvon Martin but didn't bother asking a thing of the ZimZam. He could have been on PCP for all we know. That would actually shed a lot of light on this case.

Toxicology reports come from the coroners office.

I would like to spin this event though. Lets say that Zimmerman was a woman...and everything happened EXACTLY like it has been explained.

Would you still hate a lady Zimmerman?

[Frieza_Prexus]

Originally Posted by Malice_Mizer [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Good thing the definitely not-racist Sanford Police Department drug tested the dead body of Trayvon Martin but didn't bother asking a thing of the ZimZam. He could have been on PCP for all we know. That would actually shed a lot of light on this case.

They also failed to get Spengler and Venkman to come down with Tobin's Spirit Guide and a PKE meter to check for class VII wandering possessors.

[Malice_Mizer]

Originally Posted by Supreme [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Toxicology reports come from the coroners office.

I would like to spin this event though. Lets say that Zimmerman was a woman...and everything happened EXACTLY like it has been explained.

Would you still hate a lady Zimmerman?

I don't hate Zimmerman. I wouldn't hate hypothetical "lady Zimmerman."

And the pro-Zimmerman zeal would be even more intense and even more insanely racist if it was a white woman. Good Christ-- can you imagine typical southern American populism if it had a white woman vs. scary black man scenario on its hands? Sounds like a famous novel turned into an Oscar-winning classic movie, but the name escapes me.

P.S.: Speaking of lady Zimmerman, have you seen his sister? Holy God she looks EXACTLY LIKE HIM. It's quite shocking, actually.

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[Malice_Mizer]

If it were a white woman, Florida would do some legal acrobatics and this would be a trial of Trayvon Martin in absentia for the assault and attempted rape of Lady Zimmerman. They would then collectively quarter, behead, and burn Martin in effigy.

That's just the way it is.

[Splorf22]

Originally Posted by Malice_Mizer [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What if my father or other relative was a huge debtor and criminal? Would it be okay for a bank to say, "Well, it looks like you have horrible qualities in your blood, innately, so we're going to make a judgment call about you despite the contrary evidence you're providing us."

Why not? I brought up the free market point before and it was never refuted. 1) There is no reason for banks to do dumb shit that would cost them money and 2) All it takes is 1 bank in your city that isn't full of bigots for you to get your loan. There is no need for the government to step in.

[stonez138]

Originally Posted by Daldolma [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

would it be unreasonable to believe white home buyers, on the aggregate, have more experience with the housing market, whether it be through education or a more robust family history of home owners?

Would it be unreasonable to believe that white home buyers have better education and "a more robust family history of home owners" because people of color have been discriminated against in this country for hundreds of years? To the point to where they were forbiden to but homes in certain areas if permited to at all?

[stonez138]

buy*