Questioning GM Decisions

[Roanoke]

Originally Posted by Hasbinbad [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

That is the crux of what this entire post is about.

You are totally entitled to feel that way. I am not begrudging you that right. However, the proper method for raising grievances has been outlined, and I think that should be followed, rather than a group of people on this server being given the de facto right to slander the staff and certain players willy nilly.

New people might see digest this information differently than people who have been here a while. For instance, I see this as just another rogue wave on our journey. It will eventually be cleared up. However, if I was new I might see these kinds of posts and determine on false or hyperbolic evidence that the staff of this server was corrupt and just skip it. That is not healthy for any of us, as we need new players to keep up an already small population.

Agreed. I have gone to the extent of telling new players that I run into to avoid the forums at all costs, as it will only be detrimental to your attitude about P99. This thread alone is a perfect example so far. There's a place and time for trolling, but this is getting out of hand.

It's unfortunate that the server forums are so poorly moderated (more like understaffed I think, Guineapig does an excellent job when available it seems) and the trolls are allowed to run rampant and shit up every thread that's being created whether it's about the recent suspensions or not. One word replies and shit like "fat" belong in RnF and should stay there. Users who abuse their privileges to post here should be treated accordingly.

If it isn't a thread about the recent suspensions it's a thread about how Red99 is better than everyone else. We either need to start having these posts moderated or put a giant disclaimer at the beginning on every post that states "THE OPINIONS POSTED HERE DO NOT REFLECT THOSE OF THE SERVER POPULATION, PLEASE IGNORE THE FOLLOWING STUPIDITY:"

I realize the point of trolling is to ruin the fun for everyone else at your own amusement, but for fucks sake people, you're taking it too far.

There's a forum that's been around for a long time called General Mayhem- they had a 'jail' sub-forum called the Kiddie Corral. If you were a shitty poster and did nothing but try to troll threads you would be thrown into the KC for a determined amount of time (mods discretion, though you could donate money to the forum and put people in the KC). Literal forum time-out. You couldn't post or view any other forums until your sentence was over. It worked quite well.

[nilbog]

If anything, this thread turned out to be a great reason to get more moderators.. just to delete rant posts from server chat and ban people who can't distinguish between the two.

Thanks for showing me that, Hasbinbad and trolls.

[Hasbinbad]

Originally Posted by Skope [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I've never kept quiet. The fact is the GMs and staff here make mistakes just like the players do. Any rule forcing people to keep hush hush even when they see errors being made is completely ridiculous. The forum rule is there to make sure players don't go overboard and start whining incessantly over stupid shit where they're clearly wrong and the GMs/staff don't wanna hear about it. I've mouthed off to uthgaard and bumamgar and I think with the way both situations panned out i was right on both accounts. Bumamgar being added to the staff turned out to be, i think, one of the worst decisions the staff has ever made. Uthgaard not clamping down on petitions with guilds turned out (if you believe his post) not to be his fault at all. Of all the posts I've made I've never received a warning. I'll admit i'm belligerent, but at least i talk some damn sense. Keeping quiet when there's a point to be made is about as idiotic as you can get, even if it means calling out guides/GMs on their decisions.

Skope, I don't think anyone can try and accuse me of keeping my mouth shut, so trust me, I feel you. However there is a big difference between speaking yout mind and using repetition as propaganda with the method being used to the server's ultimate detriment. There is a way to handle this at this point, and spamming the forums as much as possible for a wipe or further punishment for a GM Decision that you don't agree with doesn't help anyone. The fact of the matter is that this forum does not guarantee you freedom of speech, it is usually a privilege here, a privilege that is being sorely taken advantage of.

Originally Posted by Skope [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

In fact I think it's gotten so bad that I can't play here anymore.

I feel bad for you man, because I understand where you're coming from on that, but you need to recognize that harming the server isn't going to solve anything. We need to do what we can to change the server for the better or realize that maybe we didn't find exactly what we were looking for here and move on without trying to ruin it for everyone.

[Skope]

they weren't rants, i was citing examples. and if you're going to edit the previous posts out, the last paragraph sort of reiterates my point and should have been left alone. it's a point that i think many people have been making and it's fallen on deaf ears. Let me try it with direct examples citing what the hell i'm on about.

I don't see myself playing on a server where the rules are applied differently to certain guilds (TR still hasn't been suspended for their third-party program use in a raid situation. In fact DA even received a guild-wide raid suspension over an incident that had nothing to do with raiding) and where cheaters are welcomed back with a slap on the wrist (whereas before you banned them permanently outright). Maybe they're mistakes that'll get sorted out, but it's certainly inconsistent and only invites more future criticism.

[Hasbinbad]

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think you're misquoting rogean.

I don't think I am. I think the import of that post is that the GM's are sick and tired of having everything they do questioned by the very people they are trying to help. Invariably, with every situation that involves a GM Decision, someone ends up being unhappy. You cannot please everyone, all of the time, nor should you try. It's hard enough being in their position, having to make decisions like these, without having the fucking peanut gallery tell them how corrupt they are for doing so while they are simultaneously working their asses off to make a fun game for everyone.

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

People felt that was too light and they are allowed to in my opinion because the facts are pretty clear on what transpired.

They are totally allowed to feel that way. Nobody is arguing that. I am arguing that at a certain point, posts should be moderated when they no longer serve a useful purpose to the server. If the point they were trying to make didn't bear fruit, then they should escalate the matter up the proper channels, not stand around waving torches and shouting. Nobody benefits from that.

[nilbog]

Originally Posted by Skope [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't see myself playing on a server where the rules are applied differently to certain guilds (TR still hasn't been suspended for their third-party program use in a raid situation. In fact DA even received a guild-wide raid suspension over an incident that had nothing to do with raiding) and where cheaters are welcomed back with a slap on the wrist (whereas before you banned them permanently outright). Maybe they're mistakes that'll get sorted out, but it's certainly inconsistent and only invites more future criticism.

Sounds like you're complaining, tbh. "Not going to play here for reasons x and y." Am I wrong?

[Roanoke]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If anything, this thread turned out to be a great reason to get more moderators.. just to delete rant posts from server chat and ban people who can't distinguish between the two.

Thanks for showing me that, Hasbinbad and trolls.

Thank you for cleaning this thread up.

To the people who are playing the "freedom of speech" card. The same thing goes for how you should deal with your opinion about GM decisions.

WE do not pay to play here. WE do not make final decisions. WE are not playing democracy here. The fact that the forums and server are up should be more than enough to keep people respectful of the hard work the Devs put in FOR FREE.

Forums and the P1999 server have rules. If Nilbog and Rogean decided one day that "only players who have a 45+ female troll Shadowknights may post on the forums" then so be it, they pay the bills, they make the final decisions.

And don't even start with "but I donated!" I donate to charity all the time, do I expect to be able to walk down to the nearest homeless shelter and boss people around because I've donated my time there before? No. The world doesn't work that way and neither does P99.

GM=GAME MASTER

Think about it.

[Skope]

Originally Posted by Hasbinbad [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I feel bad for you man, because I understand where you're coming from on that, but you need to recognize that harming the server isn't going to solve anything. We need to do what we can to change the server for the better or realize that maybe we didn't find exactly what we were looking for here and move on without trying to ruin it for everyone.

It's not unreasonable. Why is it even being debated?

Treat all players the same.
All the rules apply to everyone equally.
The GMs should enforce the rules they themselves established and the rules should be clear.

Right now it's people like me getting dicked over and it's gotten to a point where I'm willing to throw all the pretty little pixels I've gotten down the toilet. it isn't a decision i've made overnight in a rampage but something i've been noticing for over a year now. Hell, i even asked frankly if there was a chance the cheaters would be permabanned or a harsher decision is on the table atm? Would they rethink their decision? Because if the answer is no i'll spare nilbog the trouble and delete my forum account right now.

[Demetrium]

Originally Posted by Hasbinbad [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't think I am. I think the import of that post is that the GM's are sick and tired of having everything they do questioned by the very people they are trying to help. Invariably, with every situation that involves a GM Decision, someone ends up being unhappy. You cannot please everyone, all of the time, nor should you try. It's hard enough being in their position, having to make decisions like these, without having the fucking peanut gallery tell them how corrupt they are for doing so while they are simultaneously working their asses off to make a fun game for everyone.

They are totally allowed to feel that way. Nobody is arguing that. I am arguing that at a certain point, posts should be moderated when they no longer serve a useful purpose to the server. If the point they were trying to make didn't bear fruit, then they should escalate the matter up the proper channels, not stand around waving torches and shouting. Nobody benefits from that.

Your tone/message is extremely wishy-washy throughout this thread. Do you think people should be able to question GM decisions civilly via threads and polls or not?

[Hasbinbad]

Originally Posted by Skope [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It's not unreasonable. Why is it even being debated?

Treat all players the same.
All the rules apply to everyone equally.
The GMs should enforce the rules they themselves established and the rules should be clear.

Right now it's people like me getting dicked over and it's gotten to a point where I'm willing to throw all the pretty little pixels I've gotten down the toilet. it isn't a decision i've made overnight in a rampage but something i've been noticing for over a year now. Hell, i even asked frankly if there was a chance the cheaters would be permabanned or a harsher decision is on the table atm? Would they rethink their decision? Because if the answer is no i'll spare nilbog the trouble and delete my forum account right now.

While you may have several valid points here, none of this has anything to do with the point of this thread, which is that posts questioning GM Decisions and rabble-rousing because of those decisions to the detriment of the server should be moderated.