<ST> cucking out of Green99 due to Kingdom taking their merbz

[Viscere]

Exactly like how rampage disbanded when Forsaken started taking their warders

Muh warder lewts!

Discuss

[Scalem]

sorry you didn't get warder loot

[CancerMage]

sorry you lost.

[Phraxas]

Could be worse, could be in a guild that made a decision to never compete for ST keys until 7 months into velious (1 month after rampage woke it on blue) then after 2 months claim competition is here why you waking it? “GMs don’t count seconds”

[Tunabros]

Could be worse, could be in a guild that made a decision to never compete for ST keys until 7 months into velious (1 month after rampage woke it on blue) then after 2 months claim competition is here why you waking it? “GMs don’t count seconds”

rampage only woke it because someone pissed off hokushin and forsaken was starting

their attempt on warders

same thing here: you guys are just scared of competition

[Ripqozko]

Sorry you don't got, hope that helps

[Phraxas]

rampage only woke it because someone pissed off hokushin and forsaken was starting

their attempt on warders

same thing here: you guys are just scared of competition

Does competition go away after sleeper is woken? Or does it increase?

[Endonde]

6 years later and Visceral is still upset he couldn't get warder loot.

[Chortles Snortles]

(lol)

[Tunabros]

Does competition go away after sleeper is woken? Or does it increase?

doesn't change the fact that you guys are scared of competition

what does post sleeper have to do with what's going on right now? care to elaborate?

[Ripqozko]

doesn't change the fact that you guys are scared of competition

what does post sleeper have to do with what's going on right now? care to elaborate?

Sorry you weren’t apart of either , hope that helps .

[Viscere]

Does competition go away after sleeper is woken? Or does it increase?

usually the guild that wakes disbands 'cause they get bored to death

overall competition increases drastically over the years as the server bottlenecks on high end content

yw

[Phraxas]

usually the guild that wakes disbands 'cause they get bored to death

overall competition increases drastically over the years as the server bottlenecks on high end content

yw

I’d get bored also if Guild B took 9 months to finally FTE Vulak, or chooses RW over Vulak competition.

[Phraxas]

doesn't change the fact that you guys are scared of competition

what does post sleeper have to do with what's going on right now? care to elaborate?

7 Months before competition for ST Keys, 9 months for a Vulak FTE, what competition. Why do you feel anyone owes you competition after showing up 7-9 months late? Don’t spin a, your afraid of competition propaganda campaign when y’all failed to show up in the time it took children to be born.

Your participation award awaits for no man or woman. If you think we’re afraid of competition then I guess post sleeper will determine that theory since there’s going to be more competition now.

[gobby day]

Waking the sleeper now is like going home from class when your teacher doesn't show up for the first 15 minutes.

Sorry kingdom, you're too late. If your gameplan was to let seal team farm sleepers tomb uncontested for so long that their members actively get bored of the zone, then congratulations you won.

[Tunabros]

oh well guess it is our fault

GG seal team

[Chortles Snortles]

https://i.imgur.com/Liqro6i.jpg

[Phraxas]

Waking the sleeper now is like going home from class when your teacher doesn't show up for the first 15 minutes.

Sorry kingdom, you're too late. If your gameplan was to let seal team farm sleepers tomb uncontested for so long that their members actively get bored of the zone, then congratulations you won.

Why would anyone currently boasting about competition, decide to let a guild get free farm with no competition. Seems if you’re going to boast about competition then you might as well actually compete yourself ya??

Someone from blue remind me, how long rampage went before the competition got a key??

Oh and I’m assuming since we are 9 months in, you’ve finally thought ST has gotten enough Vulak loot that you can now start to contest that also. Cause RW > Vulak amirite.

[Scalem]

Why would anyone currently boasting about competition, decide to let a guild get free farm with no competition. Seems if you’re going to boast about competition then you might as well actually compete yourself ya??

Someone from blue remind me, how long rampage went before the competition got a key??

Oh and I’m assuming since we are 9 months in, you’ve finally thought ST has gotten enough Vulak loot that you can now start to contest that also. Cause RW > Vulak amirite.

RW = 5 loot, Vulak = 3 easy maths dude

[Elizondo]

raidbots literally have no life for bragging rights on a forum nobody reads anymore

[YendorLootmonkey]

Sounds like the other guilds need to band together and kill Yelinak before Kerafyrm gets there to spoil ST's attempt on Kerafyrm. Eye for an eye.

[LuffyP99]

Imagine poaching key members from all competing guilds at the end of kunark and having 2.5x as many people at every raid and hardcore zerg/monopolizing content the other guilds don't have the numbers for, then ask why guilds didn't go for keys.

Then wake the sleeper early and play the victim when in reality you're little children that the entire server despises for your selfish actions. Imagine. Seal Team can get bent, we all hate you.

[Chortles Snortles]

https://i.imgur.com/kF5i8ZE.gif

[PlsNoBan]

It's always the irrelevant warmbody members that come to RNF to brag about their guilds accomplishments. It's like being an ultrafat that can barely get off the couch bragging about how "their team" won a sportsball game. It's just max cringe to the avg person that isn't actively drinking koolaid.

[Scalem]

Imagine poaching key members from all competing guilds at the end of kunark and having 2.5x as many people at every raid and hardcore zerg/monopolizing content the other guilds don't have the numbers for, then ask why guilds didn't go for keys.

Then wake the sleeper early and play the victim when in reality you're little children that the entire server despises for your selfish actions. Imagine. Seal Team can get bent, we all hate you.

imagine hating someone over a 20 year old game, seek help, touch grass sometime soon.

[Phraxas]

Imagine poaching key members from all competing guilds at the end of kunark and having 2.5x as many people at every raid and hardcore zerg/monopolizing content the other guilds don't have the numbers for, then ask why guilds didn't go for keys.

Then wake the sleeper early and play the victim when in reality you're little children that the entire server despises for your selfish actions. Imagine. Seal Team can get bent, we all hate you.

Imagine having a Zerg force of the Federation with multiple guilds and still losing. imagine allowing ST free reign of sky at launch. Imagine not competing for Trak for 31 straight before GMs interfere and added Bag Limits. Imagine knowing from Blue that velious is a numbers game, and pretending you’re leaking ship of leadership didn’t cause those members to leave. Imagine leaving key mobs alone for 7 months, imagine leaving Vulak alone for 9 months. Imagine believing Kingdom is the good guild, when they were a nightmare on Teal bullying every other guild around when they had some power…

Just imagine your not blinded by propaganda. Imagine.

[LuffyP99]

Teal was a great experience and Kingdom was respectful to other guilds, and the time seal was banned was the least toxic period of Green history. You guys can act all self righteous and spin things however you want, but your decision to wake the sleeper will not only tarnish your legacy and be a reason people look back at your guild with distaste, but it will inevitably lead to your collapse. Mark my words.

[Phraxas]

Teal was a great experience and Kingdom was respectful to other guilds, and the time seal was banned was the least toxic period of Green history. You guys can act all self righteous and spin things however you want, but your decision to wake the sleeper will not only tarnish your legacy and be a reason people look back at your guild with distaste, but it will inevitably lead to your collapse. Mark my words.

Yea pretty sure eventually a lot of guilds are going to end… Also I know the memory of a Raider is like a gold fish, but literally the month ban from ST had more petitions in it then the 31 uncontested traks, also don’t forget your rotation between the federation ended after the first trak died. So least toxic might be an over exaggeration

[bitikan]

I just wanted to do cool shit with my Elf Pals. Sorry if we hurt anyone's feelings.

[adruidarkly]

Why would anyone currently boasting about competition, decide to let a guild get free farm with no competition. Seems if you’re going to boast about competition then you might as well actually compete yourself ya??

Someone from blue remind me, how long rampage went before the competition got a key??

Oh and I’m assuming since we are 9 months in, you’ve finally thought ST has gotten enough Vulak loot that you can now start to contest that also. Cause RW > Vulak amirite.

Yo your head is so far up your ass you don't even consider that there is zero other competition on the horizon for these targets at all to speak of on green. "Competitive" bluebeard zerg farm crew SeAL Team has always had the most uncontested targets cause the other guilds are actually progressing through content, not just repeating what they did on blue a few hours ago, you numb skull. Huh, I wonder why ST was the first guild to be banned on both servers? Uhhdoi! p99's tarded meta takes a while to get setup, afaik the opps didn't even have COTHbots for key mobs for a while. afaik only two guilds at all on green who have these cothbots in place. Meanwile seals always went hard with a 100+ zerg on key mobs for the sole purpose of blocking, the strategic choice to make is clear to anyone with half a brain.

The vast majority of people whose lives can consist of 16 hrs of EQ exist in your tag. It's whatever, thats p99, but acting like you're high & mighty cause of it is smooth-brained as fuck. Everyone in yer outfit is either pulling massive weight with their expertise and degenerate life requirements, or riding a fat ole dick. Which are you?

[Phraxas]

Yo your head is so far up your ass you don't even consider that there is zero other competition on the horizon for these targets at all to speak of on green. "Competitive" bluebeard zerg farm crew SeAL Team has always had the most uncontested targets cause the other guilds are actually progressing through content, not just repeating what they did on blue a few hours ago, you numb skull. Huh, I wonder why ST was the first guild to be banned on both servers? Uhhdoi! p99's tarded meta takes a while to get setup, afaik the opps didn't even have COTHbots for key mobs for a while. afaik only two guilds at all on green who have these cothbots in place. Meanwile seals always went hard with a 100+ zerg on key mobs for the sole purpose of blocking, the strategic choice to make is clear to anyone with half a brain.

The vast majority of people whose lives can consist of 16 hrs of EQ exist in your tag. It's whatever, thats p99, but acting like you're high & mighty cause of it is smooth-brained as fuck. Everyone in yer outfit is either pulling massive weight with their expertise and degenerate life requirements, or riding a fat ole dick. Which are you?

I’m a guy who never played blue, started on green in April 2020 but has played plenty of MMO’s in my lifetime to be able to see the big picture. What was that picture?! The federation at the time was getting their ass handed to them, interactions with other guilds as I was leveling was trash can. So when I decided I wanted to raid, I picked a guild I saw much more organized and efficient and was up to my standard of play. Guess where I am now? Bout to wake the sleeper and continue to raid and be competitive for KT, Statue, Dain, Doze, Vulak and other raid targets. How about yourself big guy??

[coki]

Teal was a great experience and Kingdom was respectful to other guilds, and the time seal was banned was the least toxic period of Green history. You guys can act all self righteous and spin things however you want, but your decision to wake the sleeper will not only tarnish your legacy and be a reason people look back at your guild with distaste, but it will inevitably lead to your collapse. Mark my words.

[adruidarkly]

I’m a guy who never played blue, started on green in April 2020 but has played plenty of MMO’s in my lifetime to be able to see the big picture. What was that picture?! The federation at the time was getting their ass handed to them, interactions with other guilds as I was leveling was trash can. So when I decided I wanted to raid, I picked a guild I saw much more organized and efficient and was up to my standard of play. Guess where I am now? Bout to wake the sleeper and continue to raid and be competitive for KT, Statue, Dain, Doze, Vulak and other raid targets. How about yourself big guy??

ah dick rider, gotcha
i play good games that don't require staring at walls for 0-16 hours
enjoy!

[Scalem]

Yo your head is so far up your ass you don't even consider that there is zero other competition on the horizon for these targets at all to speak of on green. "Competitive" bluebeard zerg farm crew SeAL Team has always had the most uncontested targets cause the other guilds are actually progressing through content, not just repeating what they did on blue a few hours ago, you numb skull. Huh, I wonder why ST was the first guild to be banned on both servers? Uhhdoi! p99's tarded meta takes a while to get setup, afaik the opps didn't even have COTHbots for key mobs for a while. afaik only two guilds at all on green who have these cothbots in place. Meanwile seals always went hard with a 100+ zerg on key mobs for the sole purpose of blocking, the strategic choice to make is clear to anyone with half a brain.

The vast majority of people whose lives can consist of 16 hrs of EQ exist in your tag. It's whatever, thats p99, but acting like you're high & mighty cause of it is smooth-brained as fuck. Everyone in yer outfit is either pulling massive weight with their expertise and degenerate life requirements, or riding a fat ole dick. Which are you?

sorry no warder loot, seek help touch grass its a game

[coki]

and continue to raid and be competitive for KT, Statue, Dain, Doze, Vulak and other raid targets.

Yeah... good luck with that one lol

[Phraxas]

Meanwile seals always went hard with a 100+ zerg on key mobs for the sole purpose of blocking, the strategic choice to make is clear to anyone with half a brain.

And you’re right, it’s almost like they had a plan, executed it, reaped the rewards from it and now dictate the next move. Got an issue? Ask your leadership what their plan is or continue to blindly follow them into mediocrity your choice friend.

[adruidarkly]

Teal was a great experience and Kingdom was respectful to other guilds, and the time seal was banned was the least toxic period of Green history. You guys can act all self righteous and spin things however you want, but your decision to wake the sleeper will not only tarnish your legacy and be a reason people look back at your guild with distaste, but it will inevitably lead to your collapse. Mark my words.

kingdom shat all over V/BL during that short period it was nothing but dogs diving on scraps, its funny though in hindsight that V/BL wanted their share of the pie without any competition and kingdom wanted everyone to take the time to get some experience competing and now 'we will not sock' FoW is life support for the soon to be sleeper wakers, pixels be a helluva drug

[adruidarkly]

And you’re right, it’s almost like they had a plan, executed it, reaped the rewards from it and now dictate the next move. Got an issue? Ask your leadership what their plan is or continue to blindly follow them into mediocrity your choice friend.

theres only so many players on this outfit. some wanted to proceed with skill, others zerged it down. it's an answer to why key mobs took so long to arrive at, if you can follow along i'd appreciate it.

[JDAm0nk]

I’m a guy who never played blue, started on green in April 2020 but has played plenty of MMO’s in my lifetime to be able to see the big picture. What was that picture?! The federation at the time was getting their ass handed to them, interactions with other guilds as I was leveling was trash can. So when I decided I wanted to raid, I picked a guild I saw much more organized and efficient and was up to my standard of play. Guess where I am now? Bout to wake the sleeper and continue to raid and be competitive for KT, Statue, Dain, Doze, Vulak and other raid targets. How about yourself big guy??

And you’re right, it’s almost like they had a plan, executed it, reaped the rewards from it and now dictate the next move. Got an issue? Ask your leadership what their plan is or continue to blindly follow them into mediocrity your choice friend.

Dear Big Guy,

P99 is a RMT pyramid scheme ran by a bunch of no-life neckbeards who seem intent on ruining classic era EQ for everyone. As if it wasn't a niche enough hobby already. Glad y'all have been able to pay your rent though... Hope that helps :D

(Not in a guild & not a raider. Happily fucking off from P99 although I am grateful to the Wiki & experience for helping me fall in love with EQ again.)

[Phraxas]

theres only so many players on this outfit. some wanted to proceed with skill, others zerged it down. it's an answer to why key mobs took so long to arrive at, if you can follow along i'd appreciate it.

As a guy who so boldly mentioned he plays better games, I’m shocked you inserted the word skill involving this game. I have yet to see much “skill” involved in the raid scene on P99. I guess the skill is the politics in creating a Zerg, then again the federation Zerg didn’t do much either. Makes you wonder what is needed to be successful, you wouldn’t know cause you play much better games and well continue to mediocre on p99.

[Phraxas]

Dear Big Guy,

P99 is a RMT pyramid scheme ran by a bunch of no-life neckbeards who seem intent on ruining classic era EQ for everyone. As if it wasn't a niche enough hobby already. Glad y'all have been able to pay your rent though... Hope that helps :D

(Not in a guild & not a raider. Happily fucking off from P99 although I am grateful to the Wiki & experience for helping me fall in love with EQ again.)

Maybe but if I’m making money on a video game, not sure I’ll targeting a hobby game with a following of 700-900 players on each green and blue.

[Detoxx]

Someone from blue remind me, how long rampage went before the competition got a key??

Day 1 of release we got a key and we had probably 25 or so 3 months in.

[Phraxas]

Day 1 of release we got a key and we had probably 25 or so 3 months in.

Day 1?! Now that’s competition, 7 months in… not sure if kingdom should continue the “competition is finally here” campaign

[Detoxx]

Seal Team earned the right to do this, just as Rampage did. The only thing that bothers me is someone like Jutebox who, over on blue, cried for years about how my guilds locked content down and they don't want to play our style of play etc etc to the point of forcing one of the dumbest things to ever happen to P99: The Draft.

And yet there he is, on Green, in Seal Team who has done exactly what he supposedly despised and probably worse than any other guild ever did on blue.

Fake people and hypocrites are the worst type of people.

[adruidarkly]

As a guy who so boldly mentioned he plays better games, I’m shocked you inserted the word skill involving this game. I have yet to see much “skill” involved in the raid scene on P99. I guess the skill is the politics in creating a Zerg, then again the federation Zerg didn’t do much either. Makes you wonder what is needed to be successful, you wouldn’t know cause you play much better games and well continue to mediocre on p99.

Your mental gymnastics are doing some pretty sweet cartwheels.

Yes, I generally play much better games(includes non raiding p99) and even I know what is needed is a large number of already knowledgeable blue players.

[Hideousclaw]

Exactly like how rampage disbanded when Forsaken started taking their warders

Muh warder lewts!

Discuss

This is where you're wrong.

<Foreign Policy> has arrived and is gathering a force. Rather than face true competition from FP, Seal Team has cashed out and is waking the sleeper.

Big dogs got scared

[Phraxas]

Your mental gymnastics are doing some pretty sweet cartwheels.

Yes, I generally play much better games(includes non raiding p99) and even I know what is needed is a large number of already knowledgeable blue players.

Sounds like you’re prepared for Green 2.0 if it ever comes

[adruidarkly]

Seal Team earned the right to do this, just as Rampage did.

I don’t think a single soul actually says they didn’t earn it by way of playing the game we all understand are playing. But the angles are cheesy and stupid. Like, they should just directly admit they had the best situation and worked it to your advantage, and are sick of socking the game and wanna trash the museum on the way out. No one can clown them on that cuz it’s real.

[xdrcfrx]

Seal Team earned the right to do this, just as Rampage did. The only thing that bothers me is someone like Jutebox who, over on blue, cried for years about how my guilds locked content down and they don't want to play our style of play etc etc to the point of forcing one of the dumbest things to ever happen to P99: The Draft.

And yet there he is, on Green, in Seal Team who has done exactly what he supposedly despised and probably worse than any other guild ever did on blue.

Fake people and hypocrites are the worst type of people.

i thought the draft was because of lavitzz.

you guys gotta work on your story lines a little more and make sure the continuity dept. has vetted them.

[adruidarkly]

Sounds like you’re prepared for Green 2.0 if it ever comes

Nah not interested in the repeated meta learned my lesson from seeing it.

[JDAm0nk]

Maybe but if I’m making money on a video game, not sure I’ll targeting a hobby game with a following of 700-900 players on each green and blue.

https://www.firesofheaven.org/threads/project-99-green-server-announcement.10893/page-36#post-3936034

"I mean, you're checking at like 4am which isn't really accurate. They're still getting like 700ish at prime time and plat is still worth 10$ per 1k. I don't play it anymore, I just sell stuff for friends on ectunnel.com. As cancer as the server is, it's not going anywhere anytime soon."

This is a former Kingdom member but it's all the same shit & representative of the entire P99 Green experience. A whole bunch of people who spent a decade+ playing on Blue and have gone out of their way to gatekeep all content on Green, propping up an inflated economy to help line their pockets. Especially legacy camps or anything perceived as being "valuable."

It's funny to me when people say shit like "Any new server on P99 will get quite a bit of attention." ... will it? Who the fuck wants to keep playing with these sort of people? Not me.

[MrSparkle001]

I’m a guy who never played blue, started on green in April 2020 but has played plenty of MMO’s in my lifetime to be able to see the big picture. What was that picture?! The federation at the time was getting their ass handed to them, interactions with other guilds as I was leveling was trash can. So when I decided I wanted to raid, I picked a guild I saw much more organized and efficient and was up to my standard of play. Guess where I am now? Bout to wake the sleeper and continue to raid and be competitive for KT, Statue, Dain, Doze, Vulak and other raid targets. How about yourself big guy??

Well I can't speak for anyone else but my troll shaman dinged 3 last night.

https://tenor.com/view/good-morning-gif-25086795

[Phraxas]

I don’t think a single soul actually says they didn’t earn it by way of playing the game we all understand are playing. But the angles are cheesy and stupid. Like, they should just directly admit they had the best situation and worked it to your advantage, and are sick of socking the game and wanna trash the museum on the way out. No one can clown them on that cuz it’s real.

Ok so it seems you have some logical common sense.

Why would a guild do any of that? Game doesn’t stop post sleeper. Green isn’t even in chardok 2.0 yet. Everyone has this idea that ST is going to die because rampage did. Which they might, or they might not. Doesn’t mean the game stops, just priorities. Competition doesn’t go away, come quake or windows you still going to see sock’s and RTE.

[adruidarkly]

Ok so it seems you have some logical common sense.

Why would a guild do any of that? Game doesn’t stop post sleeper. Green isn’t even in chardok 2.0 yet. Everyone has this idea that ST is going to die because rampage did. Which they might, or they might not. Doesn’t mean the game stops, just priorities. Competition doesn’t go away, come quake or windows you still going to see sock’s and RTE.

Why would a guild's mouthpiece tell the truth about their state of affairs? I dunno, pride? Denial? The members of a guild never lie, they say the truth its plain as day.

Truth is, a reason for this would have been found regardless. No matter what propa I see slung as the reason, like you said something about 'cheating' at raid targets etc. Theres any number of spins. They are all irrelevant when the truth is plainly stated by its members. I'm just glad its a concerted and conscious decision with a tag and names tied to it.

I doubt your guild will die, why would the guild who gets every Vulak ever die? You can split the loot with any number of starving guilds that exist on the server. The only thing that will really die is all the OG members and friends who get what they want or are sick of working hard to see things go to the warm body ally.

I do see a future with competition slowly dying, though, now that the priorities change from "keep out of sleeper's" to "keep out of the rest" but maybe I'll be wrong.

[tacomagradd]

Seal Team earned the right to do this, just as Rampage did. The only thing that bothers me is someone like Jutebox who, over on blue, cried for years about how my guilds locked content down and they don't want to play our style of play etc etc to the point of forcing one of the dumbest things to ever happen to P99: The Draft.

And yet there he is, on Green, in Seal Team who has done exactly what he supposedly despised and probably worse than any other guild ever did on blue.

Fake people and hypocrites are the worst type of people.

Tears so salty, tears so sweet.

Guess you didn't get the memo that the draft is loved on Blue, and who says I don't support it on Green? However, this is no apples to apples comparison. Blue is 7 years into Velious. Rampage rekt you and woke the Sleeper years ago, dooming you to an eternity of trying to get revenge on everyone else by denying them content. Blue is all the way at the end of timeline. I think its OK to do a draft 4 times a year under those conditions. However, if people put in the hard work, organized, and instituted a draft on Green, you wouldn't see me opposing it. Hell, they can even use the ruleset I wrote! Its open source ;)

My objection was never to dabbling in a end-game/hardcore competitive guild. It was submitting to asshole leaders that resort to cheating, like those in Vanquish. Hard pass on that! I don't regret my decision to experience warders, and now I guess I'll get to be part of the team waking the Sleeper. You can ask anyone in Seal Team and they will tell you that I tried to convince them to do a server-wide agreement to keep the Sleeper asleep. But in the end, it is the prisoner's dilemma, and fears that someone will wake it, no matter what, are authentic and amount to legitimate concerns.

Hope that helps.

-Jutebox

[Elizondo]

Pretty sure most folks bragging in this thread are over 50

Cringe

[adruidarkly]

Pretty sure most folks bragging in this thread are over 50

Cringe

shut up! out of all the people who play an old game too much I play it too much the most and best.

[Elizondo]

lol this thread is hilarious

old men tryin to brag like playground bullies

CRINGE

[Detoxx]

Tears so salty, tears so sweet.

Guess you didn't get the memo that the draft is loved on Blue, and who says I don't support it on Green? However, this is no apples to apples comparison. Blue is 7 years into Velious. Rampage rekt you and woke the Sleeper years ago, dooming you to an eternity of trying to get revenge on everyone else by denying them content. Blue is all the way at the end of timeline. I think its OK to do a draft 4 times a year under those conditions. However, if people put in the hard work, organized, and instituted a draft on Green, you wouldn't see me opposing it. Hell, they can even use the ruleset I wrote! Its open source ;)

My objection was never to dabbling in a end-game/hardcore competitive guild. It was submitting to asshole leaders that resort to cheating, like those in Vanquish. Hard pass on that! I don't regret my decision to experience warders, and now I guess I'll get to be part of the team waking the Sleeper. You can ask anyone in Seal Team and they will tell you that I tried to convince them to do a server-wide agreement to keep the Sleeper asleep. But in the end, it is the prisoner's dilemma, and fears that someone will wake it, no matter what, are authentic and amount to legitimate concerns.

Hope that helps.

-Jutebox

Lol you did your guild on blue real proud Jutebox. Join the "cheaters" on green, become a hypocrite and then just leave your shit Kittens guild to kill nothing for the 10 years of their existence.

Couldnt beat anyone on blue, ran to Green to flex his napoleon complex and now brags like hes something while leaving a legacy of utter garbage behind on blue.

Ill take my history over your pathetic attempts to lead a guild and blue and your coattail riding on Green anyday, my friend. At least I didnt sell out and abandon my guildies to go to another P99 server and actually kill dragons.

[Naethyn]

When Detoxx has the most level-headed reasonable replies you know we are on an interesting path.

[xdrcfrx]

At least I didnt sell out and abandon my guildies to go to another P99 server and actually kill dragons.

yeah you went to classic wow instead.

[Arvan]

finally a rnf thread with actual mad people in it i would give vanquish credit for finally making that happen but the credit goes to seal team on this one Clap

[Tunabros]

for once detoxx is actually making good points lol

[ClephNote]

This is where you're wrong.

<Foreign Policy> has arrived and is gathering a force. Rather than face true competition from FP, Seal Team has cashed out and is waking the sleeper.

Big dogs got scared

Real estate is a cycle. Seal Team bought early, developed the neighborhood, increased property value and purchased multiple rental properties.

Foreign Policy is basically Green's homeless problem. Sorry you don't got warder loot on two servers. But you will probably be the third guild (Seal Team, Force of Will, Foreign Policy) to kill Vulak here.

[Thaak]

yeah you went to classic wow instead.

And got LOL'd out of TAKP.

[hobart]

rampage only woke it because someone pissed off hokushin and forsaken was starting

their attempt on warders

same thing here: you guys are just scared of competition

It wasn't an attempt. Detoxx and pals killed the two shitty warders with like two groups.

[Tunabros]

It wasn't an attempt. Detoxx and pals killed the two shitty warders with like two groups.

all they got was some shitty smolder

[Ssarkachu]

Phraxas might be a dick bag but at least he makes better content than all the other trollers!

Also go Phraxas : go eat a bag of dicks.

Continue on ~

[Local]

Phraxes = camp monk. Can't be taken seriously.

[tacomagradd]

Lol you did your guild on blue real proud Jutebox. Join the "cheaters" on green, become a hypocrite and then just leave your shit Kittens guild to kill nothing for the 10 years of their existence.

Couldnt beat anyone on blue, ran to Green to flex his napoleon complex and now brags like hes something while leaving a legacy of utter garbage behind on blue.

Ill take my history over your pathetic attempts to lead a guild and blue and your coattail riding on Green anyday, my friend. At least I didnt sell out and abandon my guildies to go to another P99 server and actually kill dragons.

lol, Kittens killed Tunare on Saturday (after clearing the whole zone, I should add). I was there kiting for them, but you can ask them if they think I've "abandoned" them. In fact, it seems that Kittens has killed every encounter in the game now. Not so bad for what started as a simple leveling guild. And because of your toxicity, CSR's ingenuity, and the leadership of other guilds on the server, we're enjoying the draft every four months. So thank you, Detoxx. I give you a lot of credit for helping bring forth the draft. Probably couldn't have done it without you.

-Jute

[Prismaticshop]

Seems hypocritical from you to rejoice for carebear pixels on blue while being on green in the guild that just woke the sleeper out of bitterness to deny pixels.

Is it a consequence of your frustrations on blue ?

Legit asking

[Nibblewitz]

It’s gonna be good fun when we are reunited on the blue server.

[mycoolrausch]

Seems hypocritical from you to rejoice for carebear pixels on blue while being on green in the guild that just woke the sleeper out of bitterness to deny pixels.

Is it a consequence of your frustrations on blue ?

Legit asking

They should make all of blue carebear and move yellowtext raiding to green recycle servers exclusively

[Tunabros]

despite ST's shitty actions tonight, I had a lot of fun actually

so cool i guess

[Naethyn]

Forsaken losing on blue while telling Kittens they are hypocrites for helping Aftermath on green was the best part.

[Ratchet51]

What a good time! Thanks ST for the event!

[Ooloo]

As somebody with no real dog in the fight it was legitimately fun to watch larry's stream and just see a part of the game I've never seen in real time, and I dont really understand people who are mad about it. It doesn't change much at all.

[Tunabros]

As somebody with no real dog in the fight it was legitimately fun to watch larry's stream and just see a part of the game I've never seen in real time, and I dont really understand people who are mad about it. It doesn't change much at all.

shut up baler

[Chortles Snortles]

h-h-h-h-hi g-g-g-g-guys, will my 5th app to seal team be considered for my level 54 Druid???
(lol)

*POGGERS*

[Prismaticshop]

The real question is : whats next for p99 ?

Chardok 2.0 will hit Green, but then what ?

New server again that eventually merges into green ?

[apathe]

Jutebox 100% abandoned Kittens. Can confirm major drama afoot.

[Duckwalk]

Detoxx abandoning his attempt at green now that hes failed at warders a second time? Inquiring minds want know! Or is it just that there isnt 9M plat in circulation on green yet...

[Prismaticshop]

Feels like waking the sleeper is like a one night stand without condom

For 15 mins of excitement you end up with a lasting STD

[Trexller]

The real question is : whats next for p99 ?

Chardok 2.0 will hit Green, but then what ?

New server again that eventually merges into green ?

yeah thats all that is left

but fear not my friend, the drama is not over. these lifeless, soulless shut-ins will find new and innovative ways to hate each other.

[Vostok]

As someone who didn't get into everquest on live until it was to late. I'm glad I got to take part in all this cool stuff that I only ever heard of. Even if the mystery wasn't "authentic" or whatever I've enjoyed playing green from my first ding to tonight. I've done things on this server that me and my friends always thought was cool, but never had a chance to do Like seeing a titled player, dark elf druid, A necklace that turns you into a skeleton and many other things. If any of you ever see me running by feel free to ask me for buffs or a port or whatever. Without a community that interacts as much as this one does this game would just be like WoW. A bland theme park ride with a bunch of people you likely will never see again.

[Albanwr]

I hope someone takes this to heart and seeks the help you need. But some of you motherfuckers need Jesus.

[Detoxx]

Forsaken losing on blue while telling Kittens they are hypocrites for helping Aftermath on green was the best part.

Whats it like to be cucked out of a SoD by your own guild twice? lolol

[AenorVZ]

The real question is : whats next for p99 ?

Chardok 2.0 will hit Green, but then what ?

New server again that eventually merges into green ?

If we're going by what staff has discussed in the past, I assume a new PvP server would be on the horizon. Good riddance Green. Merge away.

[Pint]

Or is it just that there isnt 9M plat in circulation on green yet...

Oh sweet summer child

[MrSparkle001]

If we're going by what staff has discussed in the past, I assume a new PvP server would be on the horizon. Good riddance Green. Merge away.

A Sullon Zek server? I'd be down for that. It would be such a fun mess.

[Ankara99]

Teal was a great experience and Kingdom was respectful to other guilds, and the time seal was banned was the least toxic period of Green history. You guys can act all self righteous and spin things however you want, but your decision to wake the sleeper will not only tarnish your legacy and be a reason people look back at your guild with distaste, but it will inevitably lead to your collapse. Mark my words.

It was so friendly and non-toxic the Federation disbanded and stopped raiding together, going their own separate ways.

This server is the best when competition is spirited and friendly. Like KT races or Sev. Its the worst when envy happens.

If there is a collapse of Seal Team it is because there is no higher mountain top, not because there is "competition".

I've been party to 2 Sleeper awakenings and none were as toxic and salty as I saw in Skyshrine last night. When the sleeper gets awoken a server coalesces around a fun event, where people joke and banter in ooc and laugh as they get splatted by a big Crystal Dragon. Everyone works together to try and kill it and in the end a good time is had by all.

Last night was a lot of wounded pride and bitterness.

Do better Green Server.

[Local]

It was so friendly and non-toxic the Federation disbanded and stopped raiding together, going their own separate ways.

This server is the best when competition is spirited and friendly. Like KT races or Sev. Its the worst when envy happens.

If there is a collapse of Seal Team it is because there is no higher mountain top, not because there is "competition".

I've been party to 2 Sleeper awakenings and none were as toxic and salty as I saw in Skyshrine last night. When the sleeper gets awoken a server coalesces around a fun event, where people joke and banter in ooc and laugh as they get splatted by a big Crystal Dragon. Everyone works together to try and kill it and in the end a good time is had by all.

Last night was a lot of wounded pride and bitterness.

Do better Green Server.

I, too, was shocked to see Seal Team intentionally training a legitimate Lord Yelinak kill, celebrating the training in their Discord (thanks, Quicken, for streaming your comms all night. Keep an eye out for clips of some of those brighter moments coming out!), getting a player banned for that train, celebrating that in their Discord, spitefully ninja looting items off Lord Yelinak's corpse, and then laughing about that in Discord (they did kick the guy, not as a matter of principle, but for fear of a raid ban per their comms). A true display of Seal Team's character put on display for the entire server to witness last night.

Lot of wounded pride and bitterness, indeed.

[PlsNoBan]

My favorite is when people naively assume Green will be merged into Blue any day now.

See ya in 5+ years

[Ankara99]

I, too, was shocked to see Seal Team intentionally training a legitimate Lord Yelinak kill, celebrating the training in their Discord (thanks, Quicken, for streaming your comms all night. Keep an eye out for clips of some of those brighter moments coming out!), getting a player banned for that train, celebrating that in their Discord, spitefully ninja looting items off Lord Yelinak's corpse, and then laughing about that in Discord (they did kick the guy, not as a matter of principle, but for fear of a raid ban per their comms). A true display of Seal Team's character put on display for the entire server to witness last night.

Lot of wounded pride and bitterness, indeed.

Your words ring hollow. The only Kerafyrm kill required Yelinak tank it and basically skyshrine be trained onto Kerafyrm up at Yelinak. The sheer fact that the assembled raid force broke server rules to engage Yelinak as it did was proof positive that they intended to play spoiler as revenge. The talk in public channels revealed it.

The ninjalooting was wrong and the player involved has been according to my understanding IP banned. I applaud server staff for their quick and decisive action. Ninjalooting is not acceptable no matter what.

Do better Green. Do better.

[OuterChimp]

Once the Sleeper is awaken, are the mobs in STomb gone or something?

[OuterChimp]

One more thing...the Sleeper is still sleeping on Teal.

[Local]

Your words ring hollow. The only Kerafyrm kill required Yelinak tank it and basically skyshrine be trained onto Kerafyrm up at Yelinak. The sheer fact that the assembled raid force broke server rules to engage Yelinak as it did was proof positive that they intended to play spoiler as revenge. The talk in public channels revealed it.

The ninjalooting was wrong and the player involved has been according to my understanding IP banned. I applaud server staff for their quick and decisive action. Ninjalooting is not acceptable no matter what.

Do better Green. Do better.

No rules were broken - clearance was given by server staff beforehand.

0 members of the Yeli kill team were banned last night. Also 0 members from the participating guilds sat out the Yeli raid in protest of their own guild's actions.

How many Seal Team were banned last night (hint: it's a non-zero number)?

How many Seal Team did not participate in the awakening out of protest?

Seems like there's really just a specific subsection of the Green population that needs to do better.

[cd288]

I would respect ST a lot more if they just admitted that they woke the Sleeper because they were worried that their competition was starting to catch up and beginning to be able to kill warders. They just wanted to lock those people out of ever getting the gear. Kind of a dick move, but within their rights to do so. But they should at least admit it and own it

[red_demonman]

Your words ring hollow. The only Kerafyrm kill required Yelinak tank it and basically skyshrine be trained onto Kerafyrm up at Yelinak. The sheer fact that the assembled raid force broke server rules to engage Yelinak as it did was proof positive that they intended to play spoiler as revenge. The talk in public channels revealed it.

The ninjalooting was wrong and the player involved has been according to my understanding IP banned. I applaud server staff for their quick and decisive action. Ninjalooting is not acceptable no matter what.

Do better Green. Do better.

Green isn't ST's server even though you think it is. Hope this helps.

[Bardp1999]

Green isn't ST's server even though you think it is. Hope this helps.

They have gotten 90%+ of every raid kill since the server opened years ago, you are delusional. If you don't raid then none of this effects you anyways.

[red_demonman]

I do raid with my small guild and enjoy it, and you missed my point. ST does not make the rules and killing Yelinak was not a server rule as was mistakenly stated.

[bomaroast]

The P99 servers are dead and have been dead for a while. The over-management by the staff and the zerged-out, xp-highway playstyle preferred by the player base has killed it. As with many things going on in the world right now, the work is already done, now we're just watching it play out.

[Toxigen]

Anyone that thought Green would be any different than Blue is off their rocker.

[gkmarino]

Anyone that thought Green would be any different than Blue is off their rocker.True but Seal Team was pretending to want to keep ST open as long as possible and even sharing with other guilds, LOL.

[Naethyn]

Time to come home to blue.

[cd288]

The P99 servers are dead and have been dead for a while. The over-management by the staff and the zerged-out, xp-highway playstyle preferred by the player base has killed it. As with many things going on in the world right now, the work is already done, now we're just watching it play out.

Well actually none of that killed it; it's the having two servers at once that did. I understand that's kind of the point of the project and that blue was always going to be the beta server, but this type of project really can't support a sustainable population across two pve servers. If you merged them you'd have a really healthy pop and everything would be fine.

[gobby day]

True but Seal Team was pretending to want to keep ST open as long as possible and even sharing with other guilds, LOL.

I'm sorry but that whole concept clings to the notion that something 1 person supposedly representing a guild of 100 said on a videogame podcast over 1 year ago is legally binding.

Seal team members voted to wake the sleeper, not much else to it. Lotta stages of grief going on for people who thought nobody would ever wake the sleeper ever and that they could farm warder loot 2 years from now. Sorry try green2.

[Tunabros]

need new green asap!

[Toxigen]

Imagine being the monk highest on dkp for the next shroud.

lol

[coki]

I'm sorry but that whole concept clings to the notion that something 1 person supposedly representing a guild of 100 said on a videogame podcast over 1 year ago is legally binding.

Seal team members voted to wake the sleeper, not much else to it. Lotta stages of grief going on for people who thought nobody would ever wake the sleeper ever and that they could farm warder loot 2 years from now. Sorry try green2.

your just hurting the overall population and community though by being selfish dickbags

[mattydef]

The P99 servers are dead and have been dead for a while. Blue population before green was pretty much 1500-1700 daily. The population between blue and green combined right now is about, you guessed it, 1500-1700. How exactly did you come to the conclusion that the P99 servers are dead?

[Viscere]

Brad McQuaid designed the game like that and that's what makes it good.

It's a dick move. It's glorious. It's controversial. It's epic...

It's classic

[MrSparkle001]

Brad McQuaid designed the game like that and that's what makes it good.

It's a dick move. It's glorious. It's controversial. It's epic...

It's classic

You forgot "It's flawed"

And "It's still addictive"

[Chortles Snortles]

thanks for putting me on to Warsong 10 years ago :o

[MrSparkle001]

thanks for putting me on to Warsong 10 years ago :o

Omg I remember that. You're the one I showed the screenshots of beating the very first map?

[Chortles Snortles]

sips in ur direction

[layhousehours]

thanks for putting me on to Warsong 10 years ago :o

in chortles head as he writes this post "quick try and post something that isn't spam or the same gif over and over so they will not ban me again"

[Chortles Snortles]

gayhousehours
(lol)

[mycoolrausch]

Imagine being the monk highest on dkp for the next shroud.

lol

First in line for Fangs of Vyzh`dra in Luclin.

lol

[Elizondo]

I would respect ST a lot more if they just admitted that they woke the Sleeper because they were worried that their competition was starting to catch up and beginning to be able to kill warders. They just wanted to lock those people out of ever getting the gear. Kind of a dick move, but within their rights to do so. But they should at least admit it and own it

nah bro

They just wanted to 'follow the story line and role play'

Yes that was actually one of the excuses

[Grumph]

nah bro

They just wanted to 'follow the story line and role play'

Yes that was actually one of the excuses


Yes.

Actually the same as everyone who cried for server drafts or trakanon bags or you name it.

Exactly the same.

Please whine more about the one-time-only content you just experienced.

Thats whats it all about amirite? Totally not about gettjng loot. Status. Or denying others.

Never.

[arsenalpow]

Vampire Survivors is pretty fun. Maybe try that.

[Tunabros]

your just hurting the overall population and community though by being selfish dickbags

people change super fast just for loot. gobbyday aka hektor was super anti seal team

back in venerate

but one day, he pulled off a pretty neat FTE in plane of sky so ST sent him a tell

saying yo! wanna join up?

and the rest was history

[Tunabros]

same thing with dewbes

I remember him saying "fuck seal team" multiple times in gu chat and in discord

but look where he is today

pixels is one hell of a drug!

[Magaman]

I, the sleeper, woke up this morning. Pretty drama free. Will recycle the content and do it again tomorrow.

[Chortles Snortles]

i remember seeing newbes lvling up charming in kaesora original staff attempt
doesn’t like being called newbes

[Dewbes]

same thing with dewbes

I remember him saying "fuck seal team" multiple times in gu chat and in discord

but look where he is today

pixels is one hell of a drug!

I don't talk in discord so half of that is a lie, and oh no I said fuck seal team!! I also said ST should wake sleeper multiple times before I ever left Kingdom. I'm sure ive said fuck seal team multiple times since joining too.

[Dewbes]

i remember seeing newbes lvling up charming in kaesora original staff attempt
doesn’t like being called newbes

did you ever get your fear staff

[Ooloo]

Blue population before green was pretty much 1500-1700 daily. The population between blue and green combined right now is about, you guessed it, 1500-1700. How exactly did you come to the conclusion that the P99 servers are dead?

Yeah people always love to declare servers "dead" when really it only feels that way to them. Meanwhile it's, ya know, an mmo and there are people leveling and killing shit and enjoying the game at this very moment, even with no more sleeper!

[Tunabros]

pixels is one hell of a drug

#spreadawareness

[Fammaden]

The best pixels you ever get are the newbie sword and tunic with your first note to your guildmaster. Everything else is chasing the dragon.

[Phraxas]

I do raid with my small guild and enjoy it, and you missed my point. ST does not make the rules and killing Yelinak was not a server rule as was mistakenly stated.

We just going ignore the server rule where yeli’s race line is WL zone line. I’ll wait for the response lol

[Wiff]

We just going ignore the server rule where yeli’s race line is WL zone line. I’ll wait for the response lol

The server rule for naturally-spawning and quake-spawned Yeli, you mean, not Sleeper event Yeli. This was confirmed ahead of time with staff.

A GM sat and watched as this all occurred, and yet the only people that were discovered to be breaking server rules wore the <Seal Team> tag.

[Phraxas]

The server rule for naturally-spawning and quake-spawned Yeli, you mean, not Sleeper event Yeli. This was confirmed ahead of time with staff.

A GM sat and watched as this all occurred, and yet the only people that were discovered to be breaking server rules wore the <Seal Team> tag.

Let me guess they were confirmed in DMs, I know there’s a quota for back channel communication.

[Wiff]

Let me guess they were confirmed in DMs, I know there’s a quota for back channel communication.

And how would you like to explain away the GM that was sitting there watching?

[Phraxas]

And how would you like to explain away the GM that was sitting there watching?

I can’t nor will I speak for another person who volunteers their time to help organize a zoo of adults playing a fantasy game. Regardless of why or why not they did something at the time speaks to no volume to whether or not it was a illegal FTE. I’m still waiting for the proof it wasn’t illegal. I do see them saying there’s no lock out time like other triggered mobs like Statue/AoW.

[adruidarkly]

I can’t nor will I speak for another person who volunteers their time to help organize a zoo of adults playing a fantasy game. Regardless of why or why not they did something at the time speaks to no volume to whether or not it was a illegal FTE. I’m still waiting for the proof it wasn’t illegal. I do see them saying there’s no lock out time like other triggered mobs like Statue/AoW.

i mean its blatantly obvious you are seal team at this point. hope all this defense nets you scp or something idk, so i can ask questions in that light

even if this caveat was defined ahead of time, which by the way i have no idea if it was or not, wonder what this would have changed as far as your guilds plans? would you have gimped your own over-arching plans of getting sleeper to summoning range?

the real play would have been server-wide buy-in on a holiday weekend, but didn't want to risk another spawning of warders i assume?

[Wiff]

I do see them saying there’s no lock out time like other triggered mobs like Statue/AoW.

Correct. Which in itself would strongly suggest that standard engagement rules don't apply to the Sleeper event making it seem a tad outrageous to make accusations of ignoring them.

[Phraxas]

i mean its blatantly obvious you are seal team at this point. hope all this defense nets you scp or something idk, so i can ask questions in that light

even if this caveat was defined ahead of time, which by the way i have no idea if it was or not, wonder what this would have changed as far as your guilds plans? would you have gimped your own over-arching plans of getting sleeper to summoning range?

the real play would have been server-wide buy-in on a holiday weekend, but didn't want to risk another spawning of warders i assume?

Yea my forum name and game name are the same, I’m not hiding lol. And I don’t know, we’ll never know because in the end Foreign Policy, Kingdom, Castle, Safe Space, maybe some others? Got “Server First Sleeper Event Spawned Yeli” as their consolation prize. Rumor has it kingdom paid 75k for the yeli…

[Phraxas]

Correct. Which in itself would strongly suggest that standard engagement rules don't apply to the Sleeper event making it seem a tad outrageous to make accusations of ignoring them.

Pretty big leap to go from “no” to a lockout question to “ well they said no so clearly all server rules are thrown out.” Which if that’s the case, then maybe the training if there was any, would of been fair game. Or is that too big of a leap too?? Lol you tell me since your so keen on assumptions and speculations.

[Wiff]

Pretty big leap to go from “no” to a lockout question to “ well they said no so clearly all server rules are thrown out.”

There's a difference between "throw out all server rules, ever" and "rules specific to an encounter might not apply in this narrow circumstance". A rational person might look at a case where something is declared exceptional in a way and think "hmmm.. this seems like an exceptional situation; maybe it's exceptional in other ways, too". Since A does not apply, it raises the very real possibility that B and C might not either.

I'm not advocating any leaps. To the contrary, I'm suggesting that you firmly establish that what you believe to be correct is actually correct before you begin pointing fingers.

Which if that’s the case, then maybe the training if there was any, would of been fair game. Or is that too big of a leap too??

I would say so considering the trainer got banned on the spot.

[Wiff]

Oh wow, I almost missed this

then maybe the training if there was any

Yikes! :eek:

[Phraxas]

There's a difference between "throw out all server rules, ever" and "rules specific to an encounter might not apply in this narrow circumstance". A rational person might look at a case where something is declared exceptional in a way and think "hmmm.. this seems like an exceptional situation; maybe it's exceptional in other ways, too". Since A does not apply, it raises the very real possibility that B and C might not either.

I'm not advocating any leaps. To the contrary, I'm suggesting that you firmly establish that what you believe to be correct is actually correct before you begin pointing fingers.



I would say so considering the trainer got banned on the spot.

Maybe? At the end of the day, we aren’t GMs, so this is just a bunch of words you and I have wasted. No matter if we come to an agreement on this subject or agree to disagree none of it matters, what will be conceded the next sleeper event yeli trigger? El oh el.

But my point if I was to make any, is something you did as well, you take an answer to one question and assume other pieces. In your example “since A doesn’t apply, there is a real (possibility) that B and C doesn’t either.” Take that possibility out and get that confirmation and you’ll see things go a lot smoother in the end.

[Phraxas]

Oh wow, I almost missed this



Yikes! :eek:

Always gotta leave reasonable doubt, that debate 101.

[Wiff]

But my point if I was to make any, is something you did as well, you take an answer to one question and assume other pieces.

Raising the possibility that you might be wrong in your conclusions is not an assumption.


Always gotta leave reasonable doubt, that debate 101.

Cameras all pointed at Yelinak's lair in one of the largest events that can occur on a P99 server. ST's comms were being streamed. A GM delivered a very quick response. I think it's safe to say the standard of proof has been exceeded in this case.

[adruidarkly]

Yea my forum name and game name are the same, I’m not hiding lol. And I don’t know, we’ll never know because in the end Foreign Policy, Kingdom, Castle, Safe Space, maybe some others? Got “Server First Sleeper Event Spawned Yeli” as their consolation prize. Rumor has it kingdom paid 75k for the yeli…

we'll never know if those same guilds wouldn't have left it sleeping, either. thats kind of how i notice everyone operates here, worst assumptions and projection

haha wow, paid who, the other guilds as mercs to come to their side?

[Ooloo]

I still wanna hear like a hypothetical, clear description of how the idyllic p99 raid guild should operate and behave. Should a server go ten years without ever waking the sleeper, until everyone agrees it's okay to do? Who gets to vote? What if some wide-eyed newb just joined the server yesterday? Are you gonna DENY him pixels??? Every time you get to a camp before somebody else who wants it, you are CHOOSING as a PLAYER to DENY HIM PIXELS, which is totally different and super-worse than.... something.

Nobody's hands are clean. Be happy we have somewhere to even be mad about this.

[Elizondo]

I still wanna hear like a hypothetical, clear description of how the idyllic p99 raid guild should operate and behave. Should a server go ten years without ever waking the sleeper, until everyone agrees it's okay to do? Who gets to vote? What if some wide-eyed newb just joined the server yesterday? Are you gonna DENY him pixels??? Every time you get to a camp before somebody else who wants it, you are CHOOSING as a PLAYER to DENY HIM PIXELS, which is totally different and super-worse than.... something.

Nobody's hands are clean. Be happy we have somewhere to even be mad about this.

As long as you can comprehend it's player triggered and not like manastone who gives a fuck

[Arvan]

I still wanna hear like a hypothetical, clear description of how the idyllic p99 raid guild should operate and behave. Should a server go ten years without ever waking the sleeper, until everyone agrees it's okay to do? Who gets to vote? What if some wide-eyed newb just joined the server yesterday? Are you gonna DENY him pixels??? Every time you get to a camp before somebody else who wants it, you are CHOOSING as a PLAYER to DENY HIM PIXELS, which is totally different and super-worse than.... something.

Nobody's hands are clean. Be happy we have somewhere to even be mad about this.

I dont care about this at all cause i don't play green but still that's a pretty poor comparison. Taking a normal camp doesn't make that camp cease to exist when you leave lol they can just come back tomorrow.

[unsunghero]

If you put 100$ on the ground with a sign saying if you return this spot a week later and the original $100 is still there you get $10,000, no one would get $10,000. Someone gonna pick up that $100 before a week

If God came down and said everyone has to say they believe in him or he blows up the world, we all die

You’ll never get everyone to cooperate on something

[Nuggie]

I'm not reading all the stuff before this. Just wanted to say: in another few years you all that are mad will have the chance to do ST with warders in it again(probably) on the next repeat server. Good luck.

[Prismaticshop]

^ pretty much this

[Ripqozko]

Consider yellow, sorry you don't got

[matticas]

same thing here: you guys are just scared of competition

Seal Team is the only guild on the server that has shown up every week to compete from the beginning of green up to this week. This 'scared of competition' nonsense is just weak.

[Zwieback]

Seal Team lost the game by waking the sleeper.

[Ooloo]

I just dont understand the logic of people still mad. If the top guild is only leaving the warders up out of some kind of server charity, would it really feel that epic to get a gnome mask or whatever the like two other things you can't get now are? It wouldn't for me, personally. It wouldn't feel very triumphant to say "Okay now that seal team waited 8 months for us to get keyed, let's compete!".

[Delekhan]

It's not realistic to expect people to understand all of the nuances of this matter, heck even Seal Team did not anticipate all of the complexities of Sleeper's Tomb. As each key drops and months pass, it becomes abundantly clear that it's just not a sustainable situation to keep the sleeper asleep indefinitely.

The drama only becomes more intense every single cycle and the number of players that want to end it grows and grows. Eventually either you wake it or it is woken for you. It's a fallacy to assume that waking is simply a choice by one or two individuals because contrary to popular belief, guilds are not authoritarian regimes. Once a critical mass of keys has been obtained, it's only a matter of time. 6-12 months asleep is a good expectation for any Everquest server. The better the guild relations at the top end, the closer you can get to 12 months.

Due to Warders on p99 being 48-hour windows (6 day +-24hrs) and the Golems being 24hour windows, it pretty much turns Sleeper's Tomb into a 24/7 sock and kills any guild that attempts it for a long period of time. That is clearly a huge problem, which forces rotations. Rotations are kryptonite to competitive players, so if it were to work, on future servers, you would want Key parity at Velious launch so that by the time Warders can be killed, it would require cooperation. That way, neither guild has a dominant presence and is forced to rotate the content to get their warder loot. In theory that should keep the competitive players on the back foot for a longer period of time. That sort of scenario may keep the sleeper asleep for at least an additional 6 months I think. You do run the risk of alienating the competitive players who could splinter off and form a new guild and blow up the agreement. (given P99's history, this is actually quite likely).

So for the next P99 server, I would recommend the top guilds compete for keys immediately and hope parity of keying takes place and dramatically increases the number of players desiring Warder loot. Maintain good relations proactively and arrive at a rotation agreement as quickly as possible and find a way to keep the hardcore players content. Avoid competitive ST so that socking is side-stepped because that will only lead to waking.

It's a mess of a situation, I can assure you all of that. In the end, if you want warder loot it should be your goal from the moment Velious drops, otherwise, it's unlikely due to the tsunami of politics and drama that arises.

[dareo]

It's not realistic to expect people to understand all of the nuances of this matter, heck even Seal Team did not anticipate all of the complexities of Sleeper's Tomb. As each key drops and months pass, it becomes abundantly clear that it's just not a sustainable situation to keep the sleeper asleep indefinitely.

The drama only becomes more intense every single cycle and the number of players that want to end it grows and grows. Eventually either you wake it or it is woken for you. It's a fallacy to assume that waking is simply a choice by one or two individuals because contrary to popular belief, guilds are not authoritarian regimes. Once a critical mass of keys has been obtained, it's only a matter of time. 6-12 months asleep is a good expectation for any Everquest server. The better the guild relations at the top end, the closer you can get to 12 months.

Due to Warders on p99 being 48-hour windows (6 day +-24hrs) and the Golems being 24hour windows, it pretty much turns Sleeper's Tomb into a 24/7 sock and kills any guild that attempts it for a long period of time. That is clearly a huge problem, which forces rotations. Rotations are kryptonite to competitive players, so if it were to work, on future servers, you would want Key parity at Velious launch so that by the time Warders can be killed, it would require cooperation. That way, neither guild has a dominant presence and is forced to rotate the content to get their warder loot. In theory that should keep the competitive players on the back foot for a longer period of time. That sort of scenario may keep the sleeper asleep for at least an additional 6 months I think. You do run the risk of alienating the competitive players who could splinter off and form a new guild and blow up the agreement. (given P99's history, this is actually quite likely).

So for the next P99 server, I would recommend the top guilds compete for keys immediately and hope parity of keying takes place and dramatically increases the number of players desiring Warder loot. Maintain good relations proactively and arrive at a rotation agreement as quickly as possible and find a way to keep the hardcore players content. Avoid competitive ST so that socking is side-stepped because that will only lead to waking.

It's a mess of a situation, I can assure you all of that. In the end, if you want warder loot it should be your goal from the moment Velious drops, otherwise, it's unlikely due to the tsunami of politics and drama that arises.

So due to the wide spawn window and the possibility of other people getting mobs if your guild doesn’t camp the zone 24/7 the solution is to remove the warders. You got yours and others might get some unless you flip the off switch. You have to flip the off switch because if you dont somebody else might! Oh the horrors! Should rename your guild to <Got Ours>

[DeathsSilkyMist]

So due to the wide spawn window and the possibility of other people getting mobs if your guild doesn’t camp the zone 24/7 the solution is to remove the warders. You got yours and others might get some unless you flip the off switch. You have to flip the off switch because if you dont somebody else might! Oh the horrors! Should rename your guild to <Got Ours>

You clearly didnt read the post lol. Read it again.

[Phraxas]

You clearly didnt read the post lol. Read it again.

i wouldnt even bother, short minded folks in the camp of "we can totally keep it sleeping" have never worked or gone through the troubles of getting the loot themselves. They live in a fantasy world of, if i log in i should get it. Champions of Participation awards, fathers and mothers of "my son didnt get a trophy and hes been to every practice and road the bench every game, he deserves an award~!"

[dareo]

I am short minded when it comes to velious but from what i can observe sleepers has a bottleneck to get keyed. Seals prioritized this and had the rewards of the exclusive zone. Eventually other groups got keys, it became harder to keep every warder spawn. There could be plenty of arrangements to keep warder farming a thing for longer. I don’t have a dog in the fight at all just seems rude to have waken it so early.

[Delekhan]

I am short minded when it comes to velious but from what i can observe sleepers has a bottleneck to get keyed. Seals prioritized this and had the rewards of the exclusive zone. Eventually other groups got keys, it became harder to keep every warder spawn. There could be plenty of arrangements to keep warder farming a thing for longer. I don’t have a dog in the fight at all just seems rude to have waken it so early.

As I said, I don't expect others to understand the entire situation. All I can do is provide factual information to aid others in their understanding because I believe some folks are genuinely curious.

One thing I've learned from this situation is that waking is guild agnostic, these challenges surface regardless of the guild in question. I've been on both sides of this, so I empathize.

[eisley]

I can't read 16 pages, but I'll offer my limited insight.

1) Farming Warders actually really sucks. If you decide to do it, like we did in Rampage, it is pretty much all you do. Klandicar, Zlandicar, Sontalak, Lendiniara, Yelinak, Golems, Warders. Over and over. This includes leaving Vulak alive.

2) If you believe it's even realistic to keep Warders alive forever, I suspect you have not raided much in this game. Even if every guild leader was staunchly supportive, eventually a splinter group would form and wake it. In fact, this almost happened on Blue AND Green.

3) Waking the Sleeper was the greatest relief I felt in Velious. Now I could finally play Velious. I gave zero shits about ST loot and was so tired of hearing people cry about it that I was close to quitting until it was woken.

4) The Sleeper wakening event is very underwhelming. Bind at Yelinak kand expect to see the epic faceoff? Yeah, prepare to be disappointed.

5) Remember, we still have non-Classic Warder loot. SoD should be 10/18. Monk Robe should be 6hp/tick. Who knows when theyll be nerfed/fixed.

6) ST is literally the least fun part of Velious. What a surprise it was when almost every person who got ST loot in Rampage quit the game right after. I actually remember thinking we were LUCKY that Meefus let us use his account. Every single other Warrior we geared quit raiding and didn't share accounts. It was a waste of time.

[Delekhan]

I can't read 16 pages, but I'll offer my limited insight.

1) Farming Warders actually really sucks. If you decide to do it, like we did in Rampage, it is pretty much all you do. Klandicar, Zlandicar, Sontalak, Lendiniara, Yelinak, Golems, Warders. Over and over. This includes leaving Vulak alive.

2) If you believe it's even realistic to keep Warders alive forever, I suspect you have not raided much in this game. Even if every guild leader was staunchly supportive, eventually a splinter group would form and wake it. In fact, this almost happened on Blue AND Green.

3) Waking the Sleeper was the greatest relief I felt in Velious. Now I could finally play Velious. I gave zero shits about ST loot and was so tired of hearing people cry about it that I was close to quitting until it was woken.

4) The Sleeper wakening event is very underwhelming. Bind at Yelinak kand expect to see the epic faceoff? Yeah, prepare to be disappointed.

5) Remember, we still have non-Classic Warder loot. SoD should be 10/18. Monk Robe should be 6hp/tick. Who knows when theyll be nerfed/fixed.

6) ST is literally the least fun part of Velious. What a surprise it was when almost every person who got ST loot in Rampage quit the game right after. I actually remember thinking we were LUCKY that Meefus let us use his account. Every single other Warrior we geared quit raiding and didn't share accounts. It was a waste of time.

I can relate to all of your points, thank you for sharing. Indeed as I suspected Rampage's experiences mimic Seal Team's.

[dareo]

If farming warders sucks, not saying it doesnt, can’t a guild just stop doing it? Farming a fishbone earring sucks but somebody is usually there signing up for it. Thats the game, camps that suck for stuff you probably dont need.

Is warder loot so good that you have to farm it 24/7 and the only relief is waking sleeper? Honest question.

[Phraxas]

If farming warders sucks, not saying it doesnt, can’t a guild just stop doing it? Farming a fishbone earring sucks but somebody is usually there signing up for it. Thats the game, camps that suck for stuff you probably dont need.

Is warder loot so good that you have to farm it 24/7 and the only relief is waking sleeper? Honest question.

if you worked on getting keys, prioritizing them for 9 months. Forgoing everything else, socking relentlessly. Would you just stop??

[Delekhan]

If farming warders sucks, not saying it doesnt, can’t a guild just stop doing it? Farming a fishbone earring sucks but somebody is usually there signing up for it. Thats the game, camps that suck for stuff you probably dont need.

Is warder loot so good that you have to farm it 24/7 and the only relief is waking sleeper? Honest question.

The demand for Warder loot is endless, and so too is the effort to acquire it. It's an unsustainable situation.

[dareo]

if you worked on getting keys, prioritizing them for 9 months. Forgoing everything else, socking relentlessly. Would you just stop??

Not likely. Taking a month off from the zone to do other encounters maybe. Im guessing the guild would be dragging a chunk of members to one side of the decision against their will either way.

[Elizondo]

Raiding ST is horrible and boring guyz

We did you a favor by waking the Sleeper we swear

[Phraxas]

Not likely. Taking a month off from the zone to do other encounters maybe. Im guessing the guild would be dragging a chunk of members to one side of the decision against their will either way.

now imagine for 9 months you played by the rules and the other entity for the last 2 months, have done everything in their power to play in the grey area of rules. For example, Telling you to drop an encounter because you didnt reach 97% in 60 seconds, then a week later go 65 seconds and say "GMs dont count seconds." or countless LTK exit room trains, or stalling a yeli and ignoring video evidence just to continue to kill it or better yet raid interfering a FTE and then their response is "control your FTE".

How many of the 100+ members who just spent 9 months working their butts off, just to see another raid force Kill 1 concede 2 to get a key, how many of them would just stop and essentially be ok with the other raid force getting whatever they want.

so many sides to the story of the sleeper that you just can't control it, but when you do control it, which Seal Team did, there still going to be that side that disagrees.

[Delekhan]

Not likely. Taking a month off from the zone to do other encounters maybe. Im guessing the guild would be dragging a chunk of members to one side of the decision against their will either way.

That's correct. All that would do is cause a guild to fracture and it gets woken. In all scenarios, the Sleeper is woken. As the number of keys grows, the less control any individual has over the outcome.

[dareo]

now imagine for 9 months you played by the rules and the other entity for the last 2 months, have done everything in their power to play in the grey area of rules. For example, Telling you to drop an encounter because you didnt reach 97% in 60 seconds, then a week later go 65 seconds and say "GMs dont count seconds." or countless LTK exit room trains, or stalling a yeli and ignoring video evidence just to continue to kill it or better yet raid interfering a FTE and then their response is "control your FTE".

How many of the 100+ members who just spent 9 months working their butts off, just to see another raid force Kill 1 concede 2 to get a key, how many of them would just stop and essentially be ok with the other raid force getting whatever they want.

so many sides to the story of the sleeper that you just can't control it, but when you do control it, which Seal Team did, there still going to be that side that disagrees.

"This is why we can't have nice things!" heheh

[Phraxas]

"This is why we can't have nice things!" heheh

im not saying this is the sole reason the sleeper was woken but its fair to say, everyone had their hand in it and every choice before, during, and after the sleeper was woken will have an outcome somebody out there doesn't like.

[Elizondo]

It's everyone fault that one guild triggered the event

Seal Team is the victim here guys. It's so boring and horrible to raid and your fault we triggered the event. We did you a favor anyways so stop being mad about it.

[Wiff]

How many of the 100+ members who just spent 9 months working their butts off, just to see another raid force Kill 1 concede 2 to get a key, how many of them would just stop and essentially be ok with the other raid force getting whatever they want.

so many sides to the story of the sleeper that you just can't control it, but when you do control it, which Seal Team did, there still going to be that side that disagrees.

And yet even your own story speaks of revenge and denying loot. Doesn't seem like there's different stories here, just different ways of telling the same one. /shrug

[Chortles Snortles]

did you ever get your fear staff

https://i.imgur.com/EHIybWW.jpg

[Phraxas]

And yet even your own story speaks of revenge and denying loot. Doesn't seem like there's different stories here, just different ways of telling the same one. /shrug

oh im sorry i just asume most people have read the 18 pages of this thread where other people have mentioned other stories. Or maybe you missed the 45 pg thread in Green Discussion thread explaining other members thoughts... my fault didnt think you'd read my 1 comment here and take it as gospel... oh wait simple minds tend to follow short easy slogans like "SealTeam is toxic" and "ST Doesn't want Competition"

[eisley]

rampage only woke it because someone pissed off hokushin and forsaken was starting

their attempt on warders

same thing here: you guys are just scared of competition

how does this meme still exist

i was in rampage from day 1 to the day it died. the gharns had almost nothing to do with the guild disbanding. did it piss off hoku? sure. but i assure you, our path was set well before forsaken even killed vyemm.

[Tunabros]

hoku still mad ;)

[Ripqozko]

hoku still mad ;)

So are you, imagine not getting warder loot on either server . Hope that helps.

Malding/Coping

[Tunabros]

cant be getting warder loot when I be playing for fun and have a 2% RA in my guild atm

I don't even have lv 60 toon on green hehe

[Chortles Snortles]

gets app denied by ST (x5) times on his level 54
g-g-g-g-g-guys im playing for fun!!!!!
(lol)

[Tunabros]

im still in your head, huh? ;)

[Chortles Snortles]

https://i.imgur.com/WLc3mk5.jpg

[cd288]

gets app denied by ST (x5) times on his level 54
g-g-g-g-g-guys im playing for fun!!!!!
(lol)

I loled

[Convict]

now imagine for 9 months you played by the rules and the other entity for the last 2 months, have done everything in their power to play in the grey area of rules. For example, Telling you to drop an encounter because you didnt reach 97% in 60 seconds, then a week later go 65 seconds and say "GMs dont count seconds." or countless LTK exit room trains, or stalling a yeli and ignoring video evidence just to continue to kill it or better yet raid interfering a FTE and then their response is "control your FTE".

How many of the 100+ members who just spent 9 months working their butts off, just to see another raid force Kill 1 concede 2 to get a key, how many of them would just stop and essentially be ok with the other raid force getting whatever they want.

so many sides to the story of the sleeper that you just can't control it, but when you do control it, which Seal Team did, there still going to be that side that disagrees.

Other guild got a couple keys out of the 30 plus they have by questionable means. Welp guess that means we have to wake sleeper and fuck the whole server over.
Well adjusted individuals.

Its comical you are even trying to explain your position rationally like anybody in here is going to agree with your perspective. You want exclusivity, period. Just be honest about it, there's no reason trying to spin it as kingdom is the bad guy, anybody with even 20% of a brain sees right through it. And stop trying to act like you wouldn't have woken it if Kingdom had gotten all their keys 100% legit. You were waking it soon as they had a warder kill force regardless of their method of obtaining keys.

The top guilds on p99 generally almost always house the most hardcore career everquest players whose lives completely revolve around p99. Their top priority from the time they create their character is to obtain items that nobody else can get. It validates the amount of time they pour into this virtual world. If some casual with 20% raid attendance in a 2nd or 3rd place guild gets that same exclusive loot, it hurts their ego and diminishes their accomplishments. That's why it was woken.

[cd288]

Other guild got a couple keys out of the 30 plus they have by questionable means. Welp guess that means we have to wake sleeper and fuck the whole server over.
Well adjusted individuals.

Its comical you are even trying to explain your position rationally like anybody in here is going to agree with your perspective. You want exclusivity, period. Just be honest about it, there's no reason trying to spin it as kingdom is the bad guy, anybody with even 20% of a brain sees right through it. And stop trying to act like you wouldn't have woken it if Kingdom had gotten all their keys 100% legit. You were waking it soon as they had a warder kill force regardless of their method of obtaining keys.

The top guilds on p99 generally almost always house the most hardcore career everquest players whose lives completely revolve around p99. Their top priority from the time they create their character is to obtain items that nobody else can get. It validates the amount of time they pour into this virtual world. If some casual with 20% raid attendance in a 2nd or 3rd place guild gets that same exclusive loot, it hurts their ego and diminishes their accomplishments. That's why it was woken.

Hate to say it but this is accurate

[Phraxas]

Other guild got a couple keys out of the 30 plus they have by questionable means. Welp guess that means we have to wake sleeper and fuck the whole server over.
Well adjusted individuals.

Its comical you are even trying to explain your position rationally like anybody in here is going to agree with your perspective. You want exclusivity, period. Just be honest about it, there's no reason trying to spin it as kingdom is the bad guy, anybody with even 20% of a brain sees right through it. And stop trying to act like you wouldn't have woken it if Kingdom had gotten all their keys 100% legit. You were waking it soon as they had a warder kill force regardless of their method of obtaining keys.

The top guilds on p99 generally almost always house the most hardcore career everquest players whose lives completely revolve around p99. Their top priority from the time they create their character is to obtain items that nobody else can get. It validates the amount of time they pour into this virtual world. If some casual with 20% raid attendance in a 2nd or 3rd place guild gets that same exclusive loot, it hurts their ego and diminishes their accomplishments. That's why it was woken.

I’ll be honest, I’m not here to try and paint kingdom as the bad guy or guild. Those were points for why some in Seal Team were more open to waking it. But if those same 20% of a brain people think for a second and ask well why are these people bitching about Sleeper being woken up when they spent the first 7 months of Velious doing everything in their power to avoid getting Sleeper Keys.

Y’all keep attacking and hammering the same point, Seal Team is toxic because they woke the sleeper. Well the people want to know, why did you wait 7 months to go for Sleeper Keys??

[DeathsSilkyMist]

If some casual with 20% raid attendance in a 2nd or 3rd place guild gets that same exclusive loot, it hurts their ego and diminishes their accomplishments. That's why it was woken.

This is such a silly statement. Why do you think this? I am curious as to why you have this victim mentality, where you assume all of the bigger guilds are simply out to get you. Why is other people playing the game normally a crime against you?

[Phraxas]

Hate to say it but this is accurate

Not accurate at all, the whole server would not, nor will ever see Sleepers Tomb. So no, the entire server didn’t get fucked over.

Painting kingdom to be the bad guy? Again, big nope! there, just questioning their leaders reason to avoid competing for keys for 7 months.

Career EverQuest players? Nope sorry been promoted twice in my job, keep a 30-40% RA in Seal Team and I’m doing pretty fucking good for myself Loot wise. So that’s 3 strikes…

Nothing accurate about this post

[Prismaticshop]

Other guild got a couple keys out of the 30 plus they have by questionable means. Welp guess that means we have to wake sleeper and fuck the whole server over.
Well adjusted individuals.

Its comical you are even trying to explain your position rationally like anybody in here is going to agree with your perspective. You want exclusivity, period. Just be honest about it, there's no reason trying to spin it as kingdom is the bad guy, anybody with even 20% of a brain sees right through it. And stop trying to act like you wouldn't have woken it if Kingdom had gotten all their keys 100% legit. You were waking it soon as they had a warder kill force regardless of their method of obtaining keys.

The top guilds on p99 generally almost always house the most hardcore career everquest players whose lives completely revolve around p99. Their top priority from the time they create their character is to obtain items that nobody else can get. It validates the amount of time they pour into this virtual world. If some casual with 20% raid attendance in a 2nd or 3rd place guild gets that same exclusive loot, it hurts their ego and diminishes their accomplishments. That's why it was woken.

Qft

[cd288]

Not accurate at all, the whole server would not, nor will ever see Sleepers Tomb. So no, the entire server didn’t get fucked over.

Painting kingdom to be the bad guy? Again, big nope! there, just questioning their leaders reason to avoid competing for keys for 7 months.

Career EverQuest players? Nope sorry been promoted twice in my job, keep a 30-40% RA in Seal Team and I’m doing pretty fucking good for myself Loot wise. So that’s 3 strikes…

Nothing accurate about this post

You’re relatively new here so let’s talk once you realize how accurate it actually is lol

[Phraxas]

You’re relatively new here so let’s talk once you realize how accurate it actually is lol

Might be accurate for your top 10% which in the case of blue and green your talking 1200-1500 or 120-150 players. But that’s any MMO, not just P99… so no, his statements are not accurate as I stated before

[Convict]

This is such a silly statement. Why do you think this? I am curious as to why you have this victim mentality, where you assume all of the bigger guilds are simply out to get you. Why is other people playing the game normally a crime against you?

Lol its not silly at all but whatever. What victim mentality? I don't think they are out to get ME in particular. We are talking about 1 guild making the decision to remove content for the rest of the players on server. Also, what do you mean ALL of the bigger guilds? It's just 1 guild in question at the moment. As far as playing the game "normally", I think that's a matter of perspective. It certainly doesn't have to be the normal mind set but it ends up always being the case for the reasons I've already stated.

These types of players cannot simply finish the progression of their character and move on, they have to maintain their exclusiveness forever, their names on a list on a wiki page as being the only ones to have xx item or some stupid shit just to feed their e-ego. Who do you think goes on the wiki page and edits the names in on the list of players with Shroud of Longevity? Someone in Castle? Nah.. they are doing it, Lmao. Its an ego thing mate, plain and simple.

[Jimjam]

Tbh even after years I still haven’t got a ST key on blue, let alone green, so i’ve decided this really doesn’t matter to me.

Maybe on green 3.

[Ooloo]

The only people this "fucks over" are people who maybe already have everything else in the game except.. a gnome mask and a robe, I guess? I can understand being mad if you're in that tiny minority of players but most well-adjusted people dgaf.

[billcrystals]

"Maybe this time the Sleeper won't be woken up almost immediately like literally every single other EverQuest server since 2001" - smart guys that definitely understand the game they are playing.

[Nuggie]

So for the next P99 server, I would recommend the top guilds compete for keys immediately and hope parity of keying takes place and dramatically increases the number of players desiring Warder loot. Maintain good relations proactively and arrive at a rotation agreement as quickly as possible and find a way to keep the hardcore players content. Avoid competitive ST so that socking is side-stepped because that will only lead to waking.



Pretty much this is what I wanted for Green in the early days. The C/R/FFA days on Blue were the Golden Era of raiding for casuals. Things could have ended up better if the staff had implemented and enforced it slightly differently, but alas hindsight.

[vanishedxD]

Wakey wakey

[Hyjalx]

Maybe next time don't join a UN during classic and Kunark. If you guys would have actually tried during these expansions instead of just taking welfare pixels one weekend a month, maybe you would have been able to learn how to be competent and actually compete for ST keys when Velious arrived.

By joining the UN, you guys allowed your leadership who never really cared to compete stay in leadership roles. Rather than having social pressures mount on them to step down to lesser roles as losses piled up, you guys continued to just soak up the soup kitchen pixels until it was too late.

This should be a lesson to those who are upset or were actually in these guilds. Don't allow the same leadership to guide you next time, and don't join a UN until sleeper is woke. You guys dug your own grave by allowing leaders who were more concerned about their blue guilds than actually running a competent guild.

Lastly, claiming Seal Team was scared of competition is LAUGHABLE. You guys mailed it in DURING CLASSIC and you stuck by it until the game was practically over.

Grats Seal Team on winning Green. Everyone else has a few years to think about their mistakes before p99 yellow.

[Rethalis]

Maybe next time don't join a UN during classic and Kunark. If you guys would have actually tried during these expansions instead of just taking welfare pixels one weekend a month, maybe you would have been able to learn how to be competent and actually compete for ST keys when Velious arrived.

By joining the UN, you guys allowed your leadership who never really cared to compete stay in leadership roles. Rather than having social pressures mount on them to step down to lesser roles as losses piled up, you guys continued to just soak up the soup kitchen pixels until it was too late.

This should be a lesson to those who are upset or were actually in these guilds. Don't allow the same leadership to guide you next time, and don't join a UN until sleeper is woke. You guys dug your own grave by allowing leaders who were more concerned about their blue guilds than actually running a competent guild.

Lastly, claiming Seal Team was scared of competition is LAUGHABLE. You guys mailed it in DURING CLASSIC and you stuck by it until the game was practically over.

Grats Seal Team on winning Green. Everyone else has a few years to think about their mistakes before p99 yellow.

[Ooloo]

You can't cast aspersions about people being too obsessed with the game and have a signature on the forum announcing that you are officially RETIRED I mean cmon

[Tunabros]

shut up baler

[Rethalis]

You can't cast aspersions about people being too obsessed with the game and have a signature on the forum announcing that you are officially RETIRED I mean cmon

I did give all my stuff away today. :)

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Lol its not silly at all but whatever. What victim mentality? I don't think they are out to get ME in particular. We are talking about 1 guild making the decision to remove content for the rest of the players on server. Also, what do you mean ALL of the bigger guilds? It's just 1 guild in question at the moment. As far as playing the game "normally", I think that's a matter of perspective. It certainly doesn't have to be the normal mind set but it ends up always being the case for the reasons I've already stated.

These types of players cannot simply finish the progression of their character and move on, they have to maintain their exclusiveness forever, their names on a list on a wiki page as being the only ones to have xx item or some stupid shit just to feed their e-ego. Who do you think goes on the wiki page and edits the names in on the list of players with Shroud of Longevity? Someone in Castle? Nah.. they are doing it, Lmao. Its an ego thing mate, plain and simple.

You have a victim mentality because it seems that your first assumption is that the primary reason why Sleeper is awoken is to somehow spite players in a lesser guild lol. Why isn't your first assumption people want to wake the Sleeper because it is a cool event, and a once per server event? Not a lot of games have a mechanic like Sleeper, so of course people want to experience it. Let's play devils advocate and say all members of Seal Team did want to spite as many people as possible on the server. It doesn't matter, because they just played the game as intended, following the rules. Can you spitefully run around Norrath, abiding by the rules? No.

All the big guilds on a server contribute to the Sleeper awaking, not just the guild to do it. Why? Because the big guilds are all competing to see who gets keyed first. It isn't like Kingdom members didn't want Warder loot.

Waking the Sleeper is playing the game normally. Sleeper was scripted to only be awakened once by the P99 developers, there isn't a bug with his script, and there aren't any PnP rules against awaking him. Pretty sure playing the game by the rules, as intended by the developers, is playing the game normally.

Exclusivity is one of the perks that P99 has that other MMO's don't. You can easily play any other modern game if you want to just progress like everyone else, get the exact same items as everyone else, and quit in a few months like everyone else. Exclusivity is something that keeps P99 alive, and you shouldn't be so quick to try and remove it. Just look at how quickly people lose interest with the Daybreak progression servers. They did exactly what you want, made Everquest instanced in the classic timeline. People get what they want quickly and leave. It's really that simple.

It is honestly the height of silliness to want P99 to be like a free version of the Daybreak progression servers. That will be the death of P99, because it will follow the same trend as the progression servers. People get their loot in a few months and leave.

[Twochain]

You have a victim mentality because it seems that your first assumption is that the primary reason why Sleeper is awoken is to somehow spite players in a lesser guild lol. Why isn't your first assumption people want to wake the Sleeper because it is a cool event, and a once per server event? Not a lot of games have a mechanic like Sleeper, so of course people want to experience it. Let's play devils advocate and say all members of Seal Team did want to spite as many people as possible on the server. It doesn't matter, because they just played the game as intended, following the rules. Can you spitefully run around Norrath, abiding by the rules? No.

All the big guilds on a server contribute to the Sleeper awaking, not just the guild to do it. Why? Because the big guilds are all competing to see who gets keyed first. It isn't like Kingdom members didn't want Warder loot.

Waking the Sleeper is playing the game normally. Sleeper was scripted to only be awakened once by the P99 developers, there isn't a bug with his script, and there aren't any PnP rules against awaking him. Pretty sure playing the game by the rules, as intended by the developers, is playing the game normally.

Exclusivity is one of the perks that P99 has that other MMO's don't. You can easily play any other modern game if you want to just progress like everyone else, get the exact same items as everyone else, and quit in a few months like everyone else. Exclusivity is something that keeps P99 alive, and you shouldn't be so quick to try and remove it. Just look at how quickly people lose interest with the Daybreak progression servers. They did exactly what you want, made Everquest instanced in the classic timeline. People get what they want quickly and leave. It's really that simple.

It is honestly the height of silliness to want P99 to be like a free version of the Daybreak progression servers. That will be the death of P99, because it will follow the same trend as the progression servers. People get their loot in a few months and leave.


Well said.


Also you guys should have trained the warder onto the clear squad u guys really dropped the ball.

[Chocolope]

Sorry you still don't got

[cd288]

Oh man DSM couldn’t contain himself in the discussion forum thread so he joined in here too lol

[Convict]

You have a victim mentality because it seems that your first assumption is that the primary reason why Sleeper is awoken is to somehow spite players in a lesser guild lol.
It was. That doesn't make it a "victim mentality" just stating the facts kid

Why isn't your first assumption people want to wake the Sleeper because it is a cool event, and a once per server event?

lol is that a serious question? Timing dude.. timing. If it wasn't woken for another 4-5 months sure that's a valid assumption/argument. But to do it soon as Guild B gets enough keys to start competing and possibly getting a contested kill or 2 and get warding loot though? What the fuck are you on about my guy? You are deluded forreal.

Didn't read rest of that long ass post after seeing first 2 batshit crazy sentences so not even going to address it.

[Lewkeng]

why are guilds so fucking scared of competition in ST? i never understood this part of it...once a guild trys to compete for warders, they wake it... its a big time bitch move. say what you want... its part of the game blah blah people want to experience the 2min of him wrecking a few zones.. wow exciting.. i dont even play on green, but its pointless to wake him once another guild comes in the zone.

[Delekhan]

why are guilds so fucking scared of competition in ST? i never understood this part of it...once a guild trys to compete for warders, they wake it... its a big time bitch move. say what you want... its part of the game blah blah people want to experience the 2min of him wrecking a few zones.. wow exciting.. i dont even play on green, but its pointless to wake him once another guild comes in the zone.

Warders are 48 hour windows.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

It was. That doesn't make it a "victim mentality" just stating the facts kid


lol is that a serious question? Timing dude.. timing. If it wasn't woken for another 4-5 months sure that's a valid assumption/argument. But to do it soon as Guild B gets enough keys to start competing and possibly getting a contested kill or 2 and get warding loot though? What the fuck are you on about my guy? You are deluded forreal.

Didn't read rest of that long ass post after seeing first 2 batshit crazy sentences so not even going to address it.

You are just mad. That is why your post is so angry. Four or five months wouldn't have mattered, you would still be mad.

Yes, you have a victim mentality for assuming people playing the game normally are out to spite you or other people. The flaw with this assumption is it's not possible to spitefully play the game as intended by the rules, regardless of Seal Teams intent. They didn't break the rules, hack the game, take advantage of an exploit, etc.

[MrSparkle001]

You are just mad. That is why your post is so angry. Four or five months wouldn't have mattered, you would still be mad.

Yes, you have a victim mentality for assuming people playing the game normally are out to spite you or other people. The flaw with this assumption is it's not possible to spitefully play the game as intended by the rules, regardless of Seal Teams intent. They didn't break the rules, hack the game, take advantage of an exploit, etc.

Actually the "rules" allow for exactly that. It was a mistake for the devs to add the Sleeper event the way it was because nothing player-controlled in a MMORPG should have such permanent consequences. Future MMORPGs learned from Everquest's mistakes, like not having an event that can be used to spite the rest of the server and forever lock them out of content.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Actually the "rules" allow for exactly that. It was a mistake for the devs to add the Sleeper event the way it was because nothing player-controlled in a MMORPG should have such permanent consequences. Future MMORPGs learned from Everquest's mistakes, like not having an event that can be used to spite the rest of the server and forever lock them out of content.

First off, the intentions and/or mistakes of the original Everquest developers are irrelevant to P99, as P99 can make whatever changes they want to P99. They are not in the same situation, where they are developing a game organically and reacting to how players respond. The P99 developers know all of the flaws that Everquest has, and put them in P99 anyway.

Whether or not it is a mistake gameplay wise is irrelevant. Obviously the P99 developers like the mistake, or they wouldn't have put it in P99. The P99 developers had to work hard to rebuild the Sleeper script. They didn't do that on accident, they intentionally allow people to wake the Sleeper. Therefore, it is a normal part of the game and not spiteful.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

First off, the intentions and/or mistakes of the original Everquest developers are irrelevant to P99, as the P99 developers can make whatever changes they want to P99. They are not in the same situation, where they are developing a game organically and reacting to how players respond. The P99 developers know all of the flaws that Everquest has, and put them in P99 anyway.

Whether or not it is a mistake gameplay wise is irrelevant. Obviously the P99 developers like the mistake, or they wouldn't have put it in P99. The P99 developers had to work hard to rebuild the Sleeper script. They didn't do that on accident, they intentionally allow people to wake the Sleeper. Therefore, it is a normal part of the game and not spiteful.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

I hate not being able to edit posts in RnF lol.

[MrSparkle001]

First off, the intentions and/or mistakes of the original Everquest developers are irrelevant to P99, as P99 can make whatever changes they want to P99. They are not in the same situation, where they are developing a game organically and reacting to how players respond. The P99 developers know all of the flaws that Everquest has, and put them in P99 anyway.

Whether or not it is a mistake gameplay wise is irrelevant. Obviously the P99 developers like the mistake, or they wouldn't have put it in P99. The P99 developers had to work hard to rebuild the Sleeper script. They didn't do that on accident, they intentionally allow people to wake the Sleeper. Therefore, it is a normal part of the game and not spiteful.

Of course it's relevant that it was a mistake. I'm not talking about P99 developers though but the original developers that thought it was a good idea.

You are correct that the P99 developers worked hard on that script to make it accurate to that original mistake, but can't this be an opportunity to correct it? It's possibly the biggest mistake the Everquest developers made, but in a way understandable because they were paving the way so to speak and had no examples of previous 3D MMORPGs to learn from. It's Everquest that other MMORPGs learned from, and one thing they learned was to not add events controlled by players that could forever and irreversibly remove content.

The P99 devs put the flaws in because the flaws were there originally. Is that the correct thing to do? I'd say mostly yes. In cases like Hollish Tnoops' bugged pathing sure keep the flaws. In cases like the Sleeper nah, it needs to be reset either through players putting it back to sleep or just after a certain amount of time, and that's because the server will never progress to the point where the loss of the Warders won't matter because that loot is superseded.

That's only my opinion though.

It could also be that awakening the Sleeper is the signal to merge the two servers. Both are basically at the same time point and so there is no need for them to stay separate. In a case like that yes keeping the Sleeper a permanent event is fine, it means time to merge and start a new TLP server.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Of course it's relevant that it was a mistake. I'm not talking about P99 developers though but the original developers that thought it was a good idea.

You are correct that the P99 developers worked hard on that script to make it accurate to that original mistake, but can't this be an opportunity to correct it? It's possibly the biggest mistake the Everquest developers made, but in a way understandable because they were paving the way so to speak and had no examples of previous 3D MMORPGs to learn from. It's Everquest that other MMORPGs learned from, and one thing they learned was to not add events controlled by players that could forever and irreversibly remove content.

The P99 devs put the flaws in because the flaws were there originally. Is that the correct thing to do? I'd say mostly yes. In cases like Hollish Tnoops' bugged pathing sure keep the flaws. In cases like the Sleeper nah, it needs to be reset either through players putting it back to sleep or just after a certain amount of time, and that's because the server will never progress to the point where the loss of the Warders won't matter because that loot is superseded.

That's only my opinion though.

It could also be that awakening the Sleeper is the signal to merge the two servers. Both are basically at the same time point and so there is no need for them to stay separate. In a case like that yes keeping the Sleeper a permanent event is fine, it means time to merge and start a new TLP server.

The P99 developers are not bound to make P99 exactly the same as the original game. They have already made plenty of non-classic changes such as mob windows, nerfing clickies, etc. So they have already proven they are willing to make non-classic changes if they deem them necessary. They have had years now to fix the Sleeper script since Blue, and chose not to do so. Therefore, they want to keep Sleeper the way he is. That means it is perfectly fine and not spiteful to play that game mechanic whenever you want.

As I said before, the original Everquest developers are not relevant to P99, because the original Everquest developers are not making the decisions here, and P99 is not organically building an MMO during a time when game developers knew little about them. One of the problems I see people have on the forums is they are blending their thoughts and experiences of the original game with P99. On the one hand that means P99 is doing a great job replicating the original game. On the other hand, it creates a lot of strange ideas as to what P99 is. P99 is a custom server that the P99 developers can do whatever they want with. They choose to try and replicate the game as it was in 1999-2002, but they actually have no obligation to do so. The custom content they already have put in prove this.

[MrSparkle001]

The P99 developers are not bound to make P99 exactly the same as the original game. They have already made plenty of non-classic changes such as mob windows, nerfing clickies, etc. So they have already proven they are willing to make non-classic changes if they deem them necessary. They have had years now to fix the Sleeper script since Blue, and chose not to do so. Therefore, they want to keep Sleeper the way he is. That means it is perfectly fine and not spiteful to play that game mechanic whenever you want.

As I said before, the original Everquest developers are not relevant to P99, because the original Everquest developers are not making the decisions here, and P99 is not organically building an MMO during a time when game developers knew little about them. One of the problems I see people have on the forums is they are blending their thoughts and experiences of the original game with P99. On the one hand that means P99 is doing a great job replicating the original game. On the other hand, it creates a lot of strange ideas as to what P99 is. P99 is a custom server that the P99 developers can do whatever they want with. They choose to try and replicate the game as it was in 1999-2002, but they actually have no obligation to do so. The custom content they already have put in prove this.

Choosing to keep it as it was in classic does not mean it can't or won't be used in spite. That's the thing. Unless the majority of the server votes for it it's basically done in spite.

I honestly, genuinely don't care either way. I just wish the devs in the future are open to changing the script to making it a timed event only, or a reversible event in some way (don't ask me how lol) so that once it's awake it stays awake for a while then goes back to sleep and can't be reawakened for a while. Wouldn't that solve the issue? Assuming there won't be a merging of the servers that is.

[bomaroast]

It's spring time. Summer is coming. Time to log off for six months. You can do it!

[MrSparkle001]

It's spring time. Summer is coming. Time to log off for six months. You can do it!

I logged off for years and just came back lol, but I return super casual and no longer willing to allow games to dictate what I do on nights or weekends. Seriously, I would often choose to not go out because I wanted to stay in playing games. No more.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Choosing to keep it as it was in classic does not mean it can't or won't be used in spite. That's the thing. Unless the majority of the server votes for it it's basically done in spite.

This is incorrect. Nobody is forcing you to play P99. By playing P99, you are agreeing to play within all the rules and gameplay mechanics created by the developers. How can you spitefully do something within rules everybody has agreed upon? If Sleeper is a dealbreaker rule, you stop playing P99.

[MrSparkle001]

The rules allow for spite, that's how. You awake the Sleeper so that nobody else can get Warder loot.

Being allowed by the rules does not mean it can't be done out of spite. Imagine if a guild awoke the Sleeper and then quit the server with a middle finger? Allowed and done in spite.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

The rules allow for spite, that's how. You awake the Sleeper so that nobody else can get Warder loot.

Being allowed by the rules does not mean it can't be done out of spite. Imagine if a guild awoke the Sleeper and then quit the server with a middle finger? Allowed and done in spite.

No. That is not how spite works. You can't spitefully do something everybody has agreed upon. By playing P99, you agree that Sleeper can be awoken at any time. Unless you can show me the staff enforced rule that says the entire server has to agree to wake the Sleeper?

[Elizondo]

No. That is not how spite works. You can't spitefully do something everybody has agreed upon. By playing P99, you agree that Sleeper can be awoken at any time. Unless you can show me the staff enforced rule that says the entire server has to agree to wake the Sleeper?

spite

Malicious ill will prompting an urge to hurt or humiliate another person

a particular instance of such an attitude or action; grudge

something that causes vexation; annoyance

to annoy or thwart

[DeathsSilkyMist]

spite

Malicious ill will prompting an urge to hurt or humiliate another person

a particular instance of such an attitude or action; grudge

something that causes vexation; annoyance

to annoy or thwart

Precisely. It is not possible to maliciously play a game by rules everybody has agreed upon. Please show me an example of how someone can maliciously run around East Commonlands. And please don't try to ask "What if they are training people while running around?", because that is already against the rules lol.

It is spiteful to train people, because that is not an intended use of the game mechanics, which is why it is also against the rules. You are comparing apples to oranges, as you love to say:)

[MrSparkle001]

No. That is not how spite works. You can't spitefully do something everybody has agreed upon. By playing P99, you agree that Sleeper can be awoken at any time. Unless you can show me the staff enforced rule that says the entire server has to agree to wake the Sleeper?

Nope. Unless the server agreed by vote or something to wake the Sleeper it can be done in spite, and so far looks like it was from what I've been reading.

Spite has nothing to do with the rules. Like I said, if a guild woke the Sleeper as a big F.U. to the server before quitting it's spite. Totally allowed but still spite.

Not that I care, I'm just bored at work today.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Nope. Unless the server agreed by vote or something to wake the Sleeper it can be done in spite, and so far looks like it was from what I've been reading.

Spite has nothing to do with the rules. Like I said, if a guild woke the Sleeper as a big F.U. to the server before quitting it's spite. Totally allowed but still spite.

Not that I care, I'm just bored at work today.

There are no rules that require Sleeper to be awoken by a server-wide vote. By playing P99 you agree to the rule created by the developers, which state Sleeper can be awoken at any time for any reason. You cannot maliciously do that, even if you claim ill intent. I could say that I am maliciously running around East Commonlands, but that doesn't make it true.

[MrSparkle001]

Precisely. It is not possible to maliciously play a game by rules everybody has agreed upon. Please show me an example of how someone can maliciously run around East Commonlands. And please don't try to ask "What if they are training people while running around?", because that is already against the rules lol.

It is spiteful to train people, because that is not an intended use of the game mechanics, which is why it is also against the rules. You are comparing apples to oranges, as you love to say:)

Ok so hypothetically, what about someone camping a mob needed for an epic just to keep others from obtaining it? Nothing in the rules say you can't camp a mob but that's spite. What about someone camping the ancient cyclops not because they want the boots but because they don't want anyone else getting the boots?

Rules and spite are two different things.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Ok so hypothetically, what about someone camping a mob needed for an epic just to keep others from obtaining it? Nothing in the rules say you can't camp a mob but that's spite. What about someone camping the ancient cyclops not because they want the boots but because they don't want anyone else getting the boots?

Rules and spite are two different things.

If you camp the mob within the rules of the PnP, it cannot be spite. Why? Because you could also camp the mob for the exact same amount of time for a non-spiteful reason, and the outcome would be exactly the same. If I camp a mob for 20 hours to deny a player loot, or I camp a mob for 20 hours because I want the loot, what is the difference? The other player is still waiting 20 hours lol.

[Elizondo]

Precisely. It is not possible to maliciously play a game by rules everybody has agreed upon. Please show me an example of how someone can maliciously run around East Commonlands. And please don't try to ask "What if they are training people while running around?", because that is already against the rules lol.

It is spiteful to train people, because that is not an intended use of the game mechanics, which is why it is also against the rules. You are comparing apples to oranges, as you love to say:)

Running around in EC is like farming raid mobs for 7 months?

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Running around in EC is like farming raid mobs for 7 months?

I never said that. Nice straw man. Both running around EC and farming raid mobs are within the gameplay mechanics and rules of the server. You have agreed to play with all of the game mechanics and server rules by playing P99. This is an opt-in experience. Nobody is forcing you to play.

[MrSparkle001]

If you camp the mob within the rules of the PnP, it cannot be spite. Why? Because you could also camp the mob for the exact same amount of time for a non-spiteful reason, and the outcome would be exactly the same. If I camp a mob for 20 hours to deny a player loot, or I camp a mob for 20 hours because I want the loot, what is the difference? The other player is still waiting 20 hours lol.

Spite is about intent. The reason why it's being done.

Do you seriously not know the difference here?

[Elizondo]

I never said that. Nice straw man. Both running around EC and farming raid mobs are within the gameplay mechanics and rules of the server. You have agreed to play with all of the game mechanics and server rules by playing P99. This is an opt-in experience. Nobody is forcing you to play.

You've totally dug yourself in a hole trying to conflate human intent and behavior with gameplay development

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Spite is about intent. The reason why it's being done.

Do you seriously not know the difference here?

I do know the difference. The problem is you assume intent matters in all cases. It doesn't matter in all cases. Again, please tell me how I could "maliciously" run around East Commonlands if I am obeying all of the server rules. Even if my intent for running around East Commonlands is somehow evil, nothing evil can come from it lol. So who cares? That is why intent doesn't matter in all cases.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

You've totally dug yourself in a hole trying to conflate human intent and behavior with gameplay development

No. The problem is you are conflating an opt-in experience such as a video game with real life. Human intent and behavior is largely irrelevant in a video game, because there are no actual consequences, and everybody has opted in to the experience. By opting in, you agree to the gameplay mechanics and rules of the server by default. If you disagree, that means you stop playing.

The only time human intent and behavior matters in a video game is if you are breaking the rules of the video game, or are somehow creating problems in real life, such as revealing someone's home address.

Waking the Sleeper is within the rules of the server, which you agreed upon by opting in to play P99. You cannot maliciously wake Sleeper, unless you can somehow show Seal Team broke the rules. Sleeper does not give out peoples home addresses upon awakening, so no real life consequences have occurred either.

[Elizondo]

No. The problem is you are conflating an opt-in experience such as a video game with real life. Human intent and behavior is largely irrelevant in a video game, because there are no actual consequences, and everybody has opted in to the experience. By opting in, you agree to the gameplay mechanics and rules of the server by default. If you disagree, that means you stop playing.

The only time human intent and behavior matters in a video game is if you are breaking the rules of the video game, or are somehow creating problems in real life, such as revealing someone's home address.

Waking the Sleeper is within the rules of the server, which you agreed upon by opting in to play P99. You cannot maliciously wake Sleeper, unless you can somehow show Seal Team broke the rules. Sleeper does not give out peoples home addresses upon awakening, so no real life consequences have occurred either.

Keep digging

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Keep digging

Yet again, no way to disprove my points. Thanks for showing your lack of rebuttal:)

[Elizondo]

Yet again, no way to disprove my points. Thanks for showing your lack of rebuttal:)

Human behavior and intent only applies to Real Life?

Feel free to keep posting and digging that hole deeper /shrug

[MrSparkle001]

I do know the difference. The problem is you assume intent matters in all cases. It doesn't matter in all cases. Again, please tell me how I could "maliciously" run around East Commonlands if I am obeying all of the server rules. Even if my intent for running around East Commonlands is somehow evil, nothing evil can come from it lol. So who cares? That is why intent doesn't matter in all cases.

Intent DOES matter. That's how spite is determined.

East Commonlands has nothing important in it besides the tunnel auctions so how can you run around maliciously aside from intentionally training the griffin or Sergeant Slate or something? Legal or illegal doesn't matter when determining if it's spiteful or malicious.

So that actually leads me to an example: training. How can you determine if that train that killed you was malicious or not? Most of the time you can't. You don't know if the person ran through you with a train to grief you or if he was just trying to zone to safety and you happened to be there. It's usually the latter (or I like to believe it is).

So intent makes all the difference. It matters.

If the intent behind waking the Sleeper was to prevent other guilds from getting Warder loot for whatever reason, then it was done in spite. Intent matters.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Human behavior and intent only applies to Real Life?

Feel free to keep posting and digging that hole deeper /shrug

Yes. Please post logical reasons for why you disagree. Otherwise, you are just saying "I am right, you are wrong", and that is not an argument. You are going back in to time out until you can do so.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Intent DOES matter. That's how spite is determined.

East Commonlands has nothing important in it besides the tunnel auctions so how can you run around maliciously aside from intentionally training the griffin or Sergeant Slate or something? Legal or illegal doesn't matter when determining if it's spiteful or malicious.

So that actually leads me to an example: training. How can you determine if that train that killed you was malicious or not? Most of the time you can't. You don't know if the person ran through you with a train to grief you or if he was just trying to zone to safety and you happened to be there. It's usually the latter (or I like to believe it is).

So intent makes all the difference. It matters.

If the intent behind waking the Sleeper was to prevent other guilds from getting Warder loot for whatever reason, then it was done in spite. Intent matters.

Yes, intent determines whether or not spite has occurred. I never denied that. However, you assume intent always matters, and it doesn't, as I explained earlier. Please re-read my comment.

Exactly! You cannot maliciously run around East Commonlands maliciously if you are playing by the rules (not training). Waking Sleeper is also playing by the rules, so it cannot be malicious.

Your example of training proves my point. Training is against the rules, which means the GMs will look in to training instances that are reported, and determine if they are malicious or not. Because you BROKE THE RULES, intent comes in to play to determine if it was accidental.

Sleeper has no rules against waking it, so GMs will never look into it, unless they are suspicious of Seal Team cheating somehow. Intent doesn't come in to play.

[Elizondo]

Yes. Please post logical reasons for why you disagree. Otherwise, you are just saying "I am right, you are wrong", and that is not an argument. You are going back in to time out until you can do so.

You're reasoning is silly

The game isn't being played by robots

Typing a bunch of paragraphs doesn't mean you are making a coherent argument. You're just being childish and stubborn.

[Raj]

This is some if the gayest RnF I have ever seen in my life. Everyone should put DeathsilkyMist on /ignore for at least 2 weeks or just make fun of him ceaselessly calling him fat, nerdy, pathetic, weirdo otherwise.

If you play on Green somehow still at 60 in a raid guild, you should ceaselessly train every raid you can but make it look lilke an accident. Start compiling audio best of hits of shut-in single nerds and autismo supremos raging out about their fake lives in Norrath being so painful as they must "concede" or (whatever the fuck they call it) to another guild. If you cant train or afraid of getting banned, you are probably A+ fucking bad at real life relationships and a pussy that needs to put down the P99 crackpipe.

tLDR: Train more, train better.

pS. If youre kinda nice and just wanna get laid or fall in love, just quit and give your account away to some p99 crackhead you really like

From India with Love :cool:

[DeathsSilkyMist]

This is some if the gayest RnF I have ever seen in my life. Everyone should put DeathsilkyMist on /ignore for at least 2 weeks or just make fun of him ceaselessly calling him fat, nerdy, pathetic, weirdo otherwise.

If you play on Green somehow still at 60 in a raid guild, you should ceaselessly train every raid you can but make it look lilke an accident. Start compiling audio best of hits of shut-in single nerds and autismo supremos raging out about their fake lives in Norrath being so painful as they must "concede" or (whatever the fuck they call it) to another guild. If you cant train or afraid of getting banned, you are probably A+ fucking bad at real life relationships and a pussy that needs to put down the P99 crackpipe.

tLDR: Train more, train better.

pS. If youre kinda nice and just wanna get laid or fall in love, just quit and give your account away to some p99 crackhead you really like

From India with Love :cool:

So basically you want to censor people who disagree with you. Lol classic move by people who can't cope with being wrong.

Terrible post, even by RnF standards. Lurk more to git gud at your posting skills.

[christmas_ham69]

So basically you want to censor people who disagree with you. Lol classic move by people who can't cope with being wrong.

Terrible post, even by RnF standards. Lurk more to git gud at your posting skills.



Judging by your EQ tutorial videos, you should git gud at playing video games. Amputees can pull higher APM than you. STFU

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Judging by your EQ tutorial videos, you should git gud at playing video games. Amputees can pull higher APM than you. STFU

This post is even worse. Please show us your amazing videos. I doubt you have them though, because you are too embarrassed to make them in the first place. Your play style must be way worse than what you accuse me of if you are too embarrassed to post them:)

[MrSparkle001]

Exactly! You cannot maliciously run around East Commonlands maliciously if you are playing by the rules (not training). Waking Sleeper is also playing by the rules, so it cannot be malicious.

Wait wait, running around East Commonlands cannot be compared to waking the Sleeper. East Commonlands has nothing of import. Even if you hacked and killed every single NPC in the zone with a single key press it wouldn't affect anything in the game. Or as a more feasible example, a bard kiting every single mob in the zone wouldn't affect anything except a few low levels that might need to move a zone over because that damned bard is hogging all the mobs.

Waking the Sleeper irreversibly alters the game and forever locks out some content.

You cannot compare them.

Again, the rules have nothing to do with intent.

You know, for a while on Rallos Zek the Drowned Citizens would not aggro the guards. The guards happily ignored them. I used to use my bard to pull them into the newbie area and let them go by zoning. Those drowned citizens would wind up running around killing all the newbies that were there passing time because their main server was down (Rallos Zek newbie zones were very populated when another server was down). I wasn't training anyone, just bringing the drowned citizens to the surface and zoning, and when they walked back along the wall to their spawn hopefully they would aggro a newbie running around. If they didn't I'd go back and try again.

It was (to me) hilarious to zone back in and watch as they ran amok killing newbies indiscriminately, and watch as some would run to the guards for protection but the citizens would run right past them through the gates. Sometimes they'd be all over the place in WFP lol. You'd like run to the caster trainers and a drowned citizen was there in the street.

It was considered within the rules. I was petitioned for it, I know. No consequences other than a name change because I didn't actually train anyone but my name was a popular singer. You know because from my point of view I aggroed too many citizens and had to zone to save my life, is it my fault the guards don't kill them? Oops. Sorry bout the name thing though lol :D

They wound up patching the drowned citizens so the guards. It was no longer fun to bring them out into the yard and the city in general.

So it was malicious intent on my end but totally within the rules. And I wanted to share the story of how I got the drowned citizens patched to be killed by the guards lol.

[christmas_ham69]

This post is even worse. Please show us your amazing videos. I doubt you have them though, because you are too embarrassed to make them in the first place. Your play style must be way worse than what you accuse me of if you are too embarrassed to post them:)

I think you may be intellectually disabled on some level. hope this helps

[Raj]

"Ill always run FRAPS or some recording Program" when i play EQ for fun on an emu hobbyist server ti catch "Evil Trainers and petition them" was never said or done by anyone who wasnt a spineless, weasel and/or giant fay gate.

Server is overrun by hopelessly addicted Pixel dick-suckers, sad days