Let's talk teams

[Vile]

"No melee left behind"

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[SamwiseBanned]

a wizard with a stack of buffs with buried lev is enough to kill most melees without jboots. where root comes into play? well i have no idea.

[runlvlzero]

Originally Posted by CrystalBlue [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Naw, they cant allow FFA training. And if the server's history proves anything, they can and will ban the chronic trainers (see xantille, letsjoe, lethdar, and all the other chronic trainers who ate multiple suspensions and got griefed off to LoZ where they could train in peace).

Zone control needs to be decided by pvp, not who can log in throw away monks to train with.

Server really is as fine as we can expect, just needs a few more minor tweaks:

-YT
-Group xp bonus in place of all the flat xp bonuses

I always hear about how horrible trains were on RZ blahblhablha.

U know what I played on a server with rampant trainers. It can be controlled. Trains can be broke, they can be recovered from. The better team will still win reguardless of whether training is enabled or not. Most of all I still had fun for the majority of time i played there even though we had to defend against trains hourly every single night we spent in fear.

The only factor training is causal too is GM involvement in player affairs.

Don't fear the trains. Its been a part of MMO's since way back in the day, even muds and that old AOL version of NwN involed NPC's in pvp. I think even UO had some form of training as a tactic. It also can add more depth to the gameplay on top of 1vs1, 1vsmany, 20vs20, you can have many creative and unique and imaginative ways to fight a superior force. It adds depth. It also adds a reason to find people and hunt them down. It makes guilds work out agreements when they do want to get something done. It creates politics and drama. Its got potential. It makes mobilization and game/zone knowledge matter more.

I garantee after the two diehard guilds (groups of people) spend 2 months training eachother here, eventually there might be peace talks about it. Who knows. Can't know unless you give it a chance. Furthermore what if they did come to an agreement and a 3rd party came on the scene and started trying to train, they might even work toghether against that third party as a common goal. Lots of really cool things are possible when liberty and freedom are allowed.

If anything training and agro dispearsal could be tweaked a lil on emu to be more classic.

I think most people here, or the majority are willing to give FFA a try.

P.S. don't forget about the bards man, or the clerics, pallies, or wiz0rds or anyone who can escape their own trains for that matter or dump agro. Its not just monks!

In defense and playing devils advocate, rampant trains for awhile "could" "maybe" damage population. Depending on the maturity and dedication the current end game players have. It might also make room for more that wont play here because of fear of being put down over it.

Final edit: It will, would, definately stir the pot, i'm going with will, i'm hopeful it will work if tried.

I lied one more edit: If its a problem to enforce fairly and equally, the just thing to do is not enforce it at all. Yeah and also this is a bad idea if it were something like hacking, but the object is to enforce fairly or not. Not kinda half enforce. Of course the goal should be full and fair enforcement. Wanna voulenteer to be a fair an unbiased observer 24/7? I doubt it. I sure as hell don't. I wan't to play the box.

[CrystalBlue]

Originally Posted by runlvlzero [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I always hear about how horrible trains were on RZ blahblhablha.
!

I stopped reading right there. We were talking about SZ.


p.s. try and stop a rez box DA trainer from dumping most of sleepers tomb on you all night.

p.p.s. even if you like it, 99 percent of your guild will quit and it will be you alone in sleepers tomb with one rez box DA trainer.

p.p.p.s. at this point the server dies.

p.p.p.p.s. then all four pvp servers get merged and EQ pvp dies.

[Cwall]

Originally Posted by Vile [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

"No melee left behind"

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yeah just keep killing elephants and lionesses bro, we'll be over here killing aviaks

[runlvlzero]

Originally Posted by CrystalBlue [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I stopped reading right there. We were talking about SZ.


p.s. try and stop a rez box DA trainer from dumping most of sleepers tomb on you all night.

p.p.s. even if you like it, 99 percent of your guild will quit and it will be you alone in sleepers tomb with one rez box DA trainer.

p.p.p.s. at this point the server dies.

p.p.p.p.s. then all four pvp servers get merged and EQ pvp dies.

Wasnt the sleeper woken on SZ? Yes.

http://www.albrandes.com/skden/articles/sleeper.asp

So. I'm sure the rampant trains killed that server. Not going to buy it. My point being stuff still happend on these servers. Not sure if sleeper was killed but I am not going to blame it on trainings.

Super PS and final lob in this debate, training may have contributed to the demise of live EQ pvp but it was not the nail in the coffin nore the only factor involved. WoW, MMO hopping, all kinds of other things are involved. Something I cannot really debate further because i'm not knowledge-able enough about what the real demise of EQ pvp was. Can training be tiresome, yeah sometimes u really dont want to deal with it, but from what i hear its happening as we debate it.

[Nirgon]

PvP servers died when resists became super fucked up with PoP gear and weapons got out of control. Obvi.

(Can't wait for the counter argument that the above is just like making root unresistable at 51mr to an even target... worlds of dumb)

[SamwiseBanned]

Originally Posted by Nirgon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

PvP servers died when resists became super fucked up with PoP gear and weapons got out of control. Obvi.

(Can't wait for the counter argument that the above is just like making root unresistable at 51mr to an even target... worlds of dumb)

i dont know, i took my first break from eq pvp shortly after luclin. things like manaburn were pretty stupid and luclin as a whole seems out of place. I came back for pop. I liked the idea of leveling in the planes but PoK really made Norrath seem small. as far as pvp is concerned. i think as the gap between casual and poopsocker grew, eq pvp died. my leather equiped ass has a chance in classic/kunark against a dragon loot whore but against an elemental geared raider, forget about it. at this point you needed to raid to compete and for me, that wasnt happening.

[runlvlzero]

I remember allot of flaming about resists breaking in pop now that you mention it (one of the reasons I did not get back into the SZ scene) - and the revamps, and how root would land for 10 seconds instead of full duration and all kinds of crazy things tried.

And I remember allot of complaining about PoK and safe zones, people clicking up to the book.

Also cant forget rangers... I remember people complaining about ranger discs and someone more recently bragging about that vex-thal bow that would wreck casters.

So for sure lots of things contributed. But I wouldnt blame it on balance.

Maybe it would be best to generalize it as "Pace" so the pace got too quick, or unfair, for or unbalanced for some and not others... I dunno how to put it. The pace changed and it was more wow and less what people who played EQ liked. One click kills does not make an EQ pvp server good would be the best generalization (derp).

Also this pretty much sums it up, ide /agree

Originally Posted by SamwiseBanned [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

my leather equiped ass has a chance in classic/kunark against a dragon loot whore but against an elemental geared raider, forget about it. at this point you needed to raid to compete and for me, that wasnt happening.

its sorta like forcing people to play the game a certain way when u have to do that kind of thing, its not the end, but its another factor.

[Samrothstein]

This Crystalblue guy is an embarassment to humanity