Discussion: Play Nice (Training, Bind Camping)

[Haul]

Allow training and bind camping. Seriously people can make an alt if they getting owned on hardcore. Just come back for corpse hour or 2 later, or the next day if you can't compete. Anything disallowing them is not classic, and just adds to the list for losers to go "im reporting you to GM cause I'm not good enough to play this game and you're better." Shouldn't be rules on this stuff ya'll are just making it more pve like the servers you guys experienced. Training and bind camping are part of EQ pvp.

[beentheredonethat]

I have been guilty myself in the past of bind camping someone on RZ. It's not profitable, it was purely payback. Back then it seemed only fair since that individual ganked me twice while I was mid fight vs an orc and alligator.

A lot of these rules can't really be enforced, its a huge pain to try to enforce those, and do end up with tons of complaints anyway since rules like this provide a one sided advantage. Usually if there isn't a profit most people won't do it most of the time. So I would say ok on bind camping.

If you let people rez with full spell bar mana/hp, most bind camping would probably go away too anyway.

[lethdar]

Originally Posted by beentheredonethat [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you let people rez with full spell bar mana/hp, most bind camping would probably go away too anyway.

Hahaha holy fuck don't do this. Sup bindrush caster paradise.

[Haul]

The kind of rules that need to be enforced are catching MQ'rs, other variances of cheating, and people who expliot and dupe. Those are the people who are true scum and shitty human beings irl. Wasting man power and resources on training and bind camping, which are proven parts of the game PVP just makes the server into a freaking snitch/whining fest. Real talk.

[Rushmore]

Originally Posted by Haul [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Allow training and bind camping. Seriously people can make an alt if they getting owned on hardcore. Just come back for corpse hour or 2 later, or the next day if you can't compete. Anything disallowing them is not classic, and just adds to the list for losers to go "im reporting you to GM cause I'm not good enough to play this game and you're better." Shouldn't be rules on this stuff ya'll are just making it more pve like the servers you guys experienced. Training and bind camping are part of EQ pvp.

so you want a pvp level range in lowerguk but training is allowed? So I can't kill someone that is 8 levels below me but I can train them?

[Buhbuh]

I found on live that a good majority of training was unintentional.

On the box, enemies avoiding getting YT'd by running into mobs, and watching people chase after them (even my own guildies, with no recourse once the enemy died) was common. Sometimes those people would bring the mobs back to a group of their own allies, a real stupid thing to do. I think it's fair to say that some people that enjoy PvP on these emu servers just simply don't think beyond the kill shot.

Silikten and Tonomar (from an opposite guild perspective) were pretty huge on trains back when the first box was around. But guides and the general population learn who does it and what to expect when running into certain characters, naturally. Several from my guild on the box fought fire with fire too. Competing guilds learned to fight fire with fire if they wanted to succeed. There was no room for noble or honorable causes, because no one cared.

That said, I understand the frustration with trains. I usually play Monk. It gives a tactical advantage, it blocks guilds from advancing, and for strict PvP purposes, it's a horse shit way to get an advantage over an opponent that you're not certain you can beat alone. People train either to be a dick, or because there's no other way to accomplish what they came to do without mobs to assist them.

So, we have to understand that no matter what the consequences, training will never stop. Not everyone will be caught. I think if the GM's can find blatant, cut and dry cases of training (and it's probably most important during raids), then by all means, ban those fuckers. I would just take a go-with-the-flow sort of ruleset, as in, if caught being an asshole and trying to fuck up hours of effort by 15+ people, then show no mercy. But in cases where the material to merit a ban or suspension is murky, leave it alone or just give warnings out to those specific people (you're being watched).

[Haul]

Originally Posted by Rushmore [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

so you want a pvp level range in lowerguk but training is allowed? So I can't kill someone that is 8 levels below me but I can train them?

Exactly because ffa level range is not legit competition. Not hard for someone to kill someone 8-25 levels below them.

[Galacticus]

Bind Camping = NO.

Personally I think its silly to consider having this, really the only time this happens is when someone is stupid enough to go afk, or there is exploitation through pvp xp gains from killing them over and over. If you arent afk or exploiting, then why do you keep staying logged on to get killed over and over?

Who gets off on killing afk people?

If your getting legitly bind camped, you cant do shit but log out so thats pretty lame to get forced out of the game. If someone is corpse camping then at least you can still chat to friends to get them to help you or talk to the people on your body to convince them to leave.

Is there a good reason to bind camp someone? Ever? (being a dick to them doesn't qualify as a good reason to me)

Training = NO.

The real issue is that you can't stop people from training. The game is kind of designed with trains in mind, they happen on accident all the time, if you are overwhelmed what other options is there to run to a zone for some classes. With trains being allowed, 1 bard can ruin a raid of 40 people from a train. The issue isnt so much with people in zones grouping or leveling, but more with raids for me. Thats where big problems come up, when people get together to raid, they can be pvped, which is legit. But one or two guys taking out 50 because they can run fast or FD is a big waste of time for the other 40 people who dont play a bard or a class that can fd and go after that person and pvp them so they cant train everyone else. Those two people's fun doesn't equal the 50 trying to raid. Those few players most likely wouldnt have a legit reason to be in that zone since the 40 people came in to raid. If you want to contest a zone, or a raid mob, the way to do it is pvp, and this supports the pvp enviroment as well.

I think when 40 people are gathered waiting to raid and 3 people are stopping them from having a good time would be worth a GM's to come in and stop it.

Most importantly this can subvert the pvp level rules. A 60 can easily train a group of level 10s in blackburrow and grief them for hours if training is allowed, where if its not, that 60 has to get on a level 2-18 to actually do anything to those guys. Again, promoting legit pvp.

[Buhbuh]

Originally Posted by Galacticus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Bind Camping = NO.



Training = NO.

The real issue is that you can't stop people from training. The game is kind of designed with trains in mind, they happen on accident all the time, if you are overwhelmed what other options is there to run to a zone for some classes. With trains being allowed, 1 bard can ruin a raid of 40 people from a train. The issue isnt so much with people in zones grouping or leveling, but more with raids for me. Thats where big problems come up, when people get together to raid, they can be pvped, which is legit. But one or two guys taking out 50 because they can run fast or FD is a big waste of time for the other 40 people who dont play a bard or a class that can fd and go after that person and pvp them so they cant train everyone else.

I think when 40 people are gathered waiting to raid and 3 people are stopping them from having a good time would be worth a GM's to come in and stop it.

Most importantly this can subvert the pvp level rules. A 60 can easily train a group of level 10s in blackburrow and grief them for hours if training is allowed, where if its not, that 60 has to get on a level 2-18 to actually do anything to those guys. Again, promoting legit pvp.

I think you hit the heart of the playerbase's irritation with training. It's really only a big deal when it halts a guild dead in its tracks. I for one have no problem doing that to enemy guilds if they want training legal, but on a personal level I think it's a real shitty way to play the game. If you don't have what it takes to stop a guild, then you can pester them and slow them down by picking off a cleric or something, but training is just an action someone at the end of their rope uses. It's bullshit. It will happen intentionally, but it's bullshit.

[Rushmore]

someone mentioned this before me but training will kill a lot of massive pvp fights that would have happened if training was illegal.