Class C loses mobs on every repop?

[falkun]

Originally Posted by Hitpoint [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

They aren't additional repops when the regular rotation applies to them. They are mobs we would have killed normally, that we now cannot kill because they happened to spawn on a repop.

Except these mobs wouldn't exist without the new raid rules. You wouldn't normally kill them because they wouldn't be there. The additional repops came with the new raid rules.

[Hitpoint]

Originally Posted by falkun [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Please tell me, where is C "losing" mobs compared to before these new raid rules?

Didn't look at your math, there's no need. We aren't comparing to "before," we are looking at the situation right now, within the new rules. I don't think I've ever once compared this to anything pre-agreement. The fact is that right now, with the way the rules are implemented, we potentially lose mobs from our 33% cut. And it's not even a HUGE deal. It just never has to be the case, ever. There are EASY fixes to this.

[Bruman]

You never had a 33% cut. You had a 33% cut, plus the chance at FFA mobs, with a bag limit of 2 on repop days.

The bag limit is to force sharing on the new server repop mobs. Without the bag limit, it's very unlikely Rogean would've ever agreed to all the new server repop mobs in the first place.

[Hitpoint]

Originally Posted by Bruman [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You never had a 33% cut. You had a 33% cut, plus the chance at FFA mobs, with a bag limit of 2 on repop days.

The bag limit is to force sharing on the new server repop mobs. Without the bag limit, it's very unlikely Rogean would've ever agreed to all the new server repop mobs in the first place.

I don't know what you're trying to say in the first two sentences. I mean...obviously. We can go lower than 33% with this plan, that shouldn't be the case.

Why are we sharing on a repop? This is a rotation, we shouldn't be forced to share rotated mobs ever. That's why we have a rotation.

We don't need to remove the bag limit, we can raise it by 1 and that would mitigate this situation almost completely. We can keep it at 2 (maybe even 1?) and make it only apply to FFA mobs.

[Bruman]

For what it's worth, I think the bag limit as it stands is silly when C-mobs are left up with no guild able to kill them until a timer ticks down. I think the situation Rogean is trying to avoid though is having the C-guilds target FFA mobs first, then afterwards stroll to the C mobs, then later VP.

Maybe he'd be open to something like not having a bag limit on C-mobs during repop as long as VP is down first, along with C-guilds not engaging FFA until the C-mobs are all dead. That avoids the loophole.

Granted, the current rule also makes it more enticing to move to C-class (free mobs left up? That's tempting.), which is also a goal of the current rule set.

[Vandy]

I'm mad because there are now more raid bosses spawning on P99 than ever before and I don't get them all. You lose nothing, I'm pretty sure that Rogean said simulated repops and variance reductions would only happen with a raid agreement. So we could go back to before and there would be less raid bosses(no repops and extended variance). So you have chance at more NPCs than ever before, how are you still upset?

[Hitpoint]

Originally Posted by Vandy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm mad because there are now more raid bosses spawning on P99 than ever before and I don't get them all. You lose nothing, I'm pretty sure that Rogean said simulated repops and variance reductions would only happen with a raid agreement. So we could go back to before and there would be less raid bosses(no repops and extended variance). So you have chance at more NPCs than ever before, how are you still upset?

Because through an oversight, the agreement *can* take more mobs from us than it should. I just want this to be exactly what we agreed to. It doesn't matter if you or someone else feels we aren't entitled to it. It's no secret that our leaders fought against the 1/1/1 plan, it was forced on us anyway. I personally had no problem with it from the start, the only thing I wanted changed was the bag limit moving up to 3. For whatever reason this wasn't implemented. Now, not only are we part of a plan that we didn't want to accept, but we're also getting access to less mobs than we thought we would, on a rotation that we didn't even want. I think a reasonable person could be "upset" about this purely on principal.

[Erati]

Originally Posted by Hitpoint [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Because through an oversight, the agreement *can* take more mobs from us than it should. I just want this to be exactly what we agreed to. It doesn't matter if you or someone else feels we aren't entitled to it. It's no secret that our leaders fought against the 1/1/1 plan, it was forced on us anyway. I personally had no problem with it from the start, the only thing I wanted changed was the bag limit moving up to 3. For whatever reason this wasn't implemented. Now, not only are we part of a plan that we didn't want to accept, but we're also getting access to less mobs than we thought we would, on a rotation that we didn't even want. I think a reasonable person could be "upset" about this purely on principal.

again, reread my comments ( which you probably have, though they are not with flashy "You Mad" gifs)

Write up what solutions would fix what ails Tier C on repops and it can get worked out with the brain trust. HOWEVER give this a little bit of time. Simply saying we have a huge problem with how things are working after 1 Sim repop is not a way to correct things. We need a larger sample size so the real problem can easily be explained, as I am sure you guys think you 'know' how to fix it, but I would wager after another repop or two you will REALLY know a good way to fix it.

The 33% split for Tier C mobs is obv not going to always be the case on a REPOP with a bag limit. Saying "This isn't what we signed up for, we were told 33%" is incorrect. You still get 33% on normal spawns and an extra 33% of FFA normal spawns that you will have the advantage on, and of course none of those figures include VP.

I think what we have going here is a wonderful thing, as for the first time since I have been here ( as you can see my name was registered back in 2009) I experienced what I would call a 'classic' EQ raid boss encounter. I imagine that the people that are leveling up right now have something to finally look forward to when they hit lvl 50+. Previously the entire time you leveled up all you heard was "Enjoy things now bc once you start to raid blah blah etc etc".

[Pan]

O - M - G. These are NOT anyone's MoBs. We're all here at the pleasure of those whose hands are on the power cords of the servers.

You are a damned guest here. Be grateful like the rest of us try to be. Or go play somewhere else - or, better, take the time to set up the ideal simulator and pull people away from p99.

[Hitpoint]

Originally Posted by Erati [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

again, reread my comments ( which you probably have, though they are not with flashy "You Mad" gifs)

Write up what solutions would fix what ails Tier C on repops and it can get worked out with the brain trust. HOWEVER give this a little bit of time. Simply saying we have a huge problem with how things are working after 1 Sim repop is not a way to correct things. We need a larger sample size so the real problem can easily be explained, as I am sure you guys think you 'know' how to fix it, but I would wager after another repop or two you will REALLY know a good way to fix it.

The 33% split for Tier C mobs is obv not going to always be the case on a REPOP with a bag limit. Saying "This isn't what we signed up for, we were told 33%" is incorrect. You still get 33% on normal spawns and an extra 33% of FFA normal spawns that you will have the advantage on, and of course none of those figures include VP.

I think what we have going here is a wonderful thing, as for the first time since I have been here ( as you can see my name was registered back in 2009) I experienced what I would call a 'classic' EQ raid boss encounter. I imagine that the people that are leveling up right now have something to finally look forward to when they hit lvl 50+. Previously the entire time you leveled up all you heard was "Enjoy things now bc once you start to raid blah blah etc etc".

I've posted my solutions somewhere in these pages, and a few others have posted reasonable ones also. I think bag limit of 3, bag limit of 1 or 2 only applying to FFA mobs are among those.

I'll give it time, as long as we can take a look at it in the future and people aren't like, "no this is what we agreed on it can't be changed." I do believe that the possibility to lose class C mobs on repop is just a mistake, and not intentional, and for this reason I can't fully agree with your third paragraph. I basically agree with everything else that you said though.

Edit to the guy above me: That is not helpful. We are talking about an agreement that was made where certain guilds were put on a rotation. And that agreement actually does guarantee mobs to them. Those are very profound thoughts that you have though. (Not really.) I've tried to be civil in this discussion so far.