Let's talk teams

[runlvlzero]

Originally Posted by CrystalBlue [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Tottaly and utterly meaningless when we all have multiple free accounts. There was a reason why early SZ and DAoC restricted your account to one team/realm each.

"zone control" lol. If you were evil, Nihilum (or whoever) would log on their good toons to destroy you. If you were good, they'd switch to their evil accounts to destroy you.

Now if they somehow restricted every individual player to one account/team each, then yeah. But thats never gonna happen, and therefore "teams" is a non-issue.

Yeah man frickin 1 char, forcing you to delete if you wanted to reroll. That was like an SZ thing if i remember for quite some time. Or chars only on the same team, like you were locked neutral if u went newt. I forget.

But if someone did create a team server, I would totally vote for 1 char, one account per IP rule. maybe make people use SMS or something to authenticate, harder to dupe phone #'s then IP's... not an ideal solution but theres more then one way to skin that cat, unique pgp keys etc. Still work arounds but it would stop people from doing it en mass and probably make it enforce-able.

[SamwiseBanned]

Do you think great games like TFC or CS would be great had they been FFA? I prefere team gameplay, that doesn't make me stupid. Sure there is team Nihilum vs Anti-Nihilum but other than raids, what is there to fight for? Horde vs Alliance, makes sense. In Aika you have 5 nations which are at war. EQ2 has evil/good with exiles in between. I am sure StarWars has teams but I've never played. Sullon Zek made a lot of sense, as did TZ/VZ. EVE is FFA but you can take part in the Militias which is pretty close to team pvp and it fits in with the lore.

Okay maybe I should clarify, I prefere teams based pvp that is based on the lore of the game. It makes no sense for a halfling druid of Karana to gank another halfling druid of Karana for a PKT. However a halfing druid taking out a halfling druid that has gone rogue killing all the residents of MT does make sense.

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[CrystalBlue]

I "think" SZ started out as one character slot per account (like FV roleplay server), and it was later increased to three characters per account (again, like FV). Regardless, you could not use those extra char slots to make anything other then another character on the same team as what you already had on the account. So you had to buy and maintain a second account if you wanted toons on the other team (and several people did just that, but w/e, more money for sony to support the server).

Here though, its commonplace for people to put every single one of their alts on a whole new account, so they can of course sell them off easier when they get bored of them or w/e.

If I was in charge I would restrict all players to one account, I would also not allow "selling" (for plat or anything for that matter) accounts or toons.

Anyways, its also deeply retarded to talk of teams on a 85 pop server. Just be happy Nihilum stopped recruitment for awhile there to allow/force others to join Red Dawn.

I hear RD got a taste of some raid pvp last night, is this true??

If so, thats thriving.

[SamwiseBanned]

Best PvP I've had, win or lose, was defending the shire and HighKeep from evils. full immersed, without the acne.

[CrystalBlue]

Yes samewise , I prefer teams based on diety/lore too. I was a big fan of SZ and I was also a big fan of the "lore play" servers that Shadowbane eventually opened up.

Those "lore play" servers restricted your city/nation/guild to only classes and races that fit into the city charter of your city.

For example (and im going by memory here..) one city charter was "Barbarian Horde" and it only allowed .... barbarians, minotaurs, half giants, warriors, scouts, bards, and ummm... Furies. I'm sure it allowed a few other things to, but this is just an example.

It did make the game and the pvp more flavorful.

[runlvlzero]

Originally Posted by SamwiseBanned [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Do you think great games like TFC or CS would be great had they been FFA? I prefere team gameplay, that doesn't make me stupid. Sure there is team Nihilum vs Anti-Nihilum but other than raids, what is there to fight for? Horde vs Alliance, makes sense. In Aika you have 5 nations which are at war. EQ2 has evil/good with exiles in between. I am sure StarWars has teams but I've never played. Sullon Zek made a lot of sense, as did TZ/VZ. EVE is FFA but you can take part in the Militias which is pretty close to team pvp and it fits in with the lore.

Okay maybe I should clarify, I prefere teams based pvp that is based on the lore of the game. It makes no sense for a halfling druid of Karana to gank another halfling druid of Karana for a PKT. However a halfing druid taking out a halfling druid that has gone rogue killing all the residents of MT does make sense.

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here here, yeah man its not retarded to think of at all.

No one is demanding it for the server, were just talkin like its a good idea, which it is.

In eve its very team oriented like the first thing that happens in that game is you have a bunch of "corps" recruiting you. I dont know of many solo corps in eve, i would say its a pretty rare thing. So its very team oriented.

Quake CTF is were its at, not saying deathmatch is bad, but eventually the CTF and teamplay and frendship is were its at after you build skill in deathmatch. Its also not for everyone so deathmatch still has its place, but CTF is by far a great addition.

TBH if someone got off their asses and coded a really neat pvp emu with teamplay and some interesting features and zone control and bonus's... for fighting over stuff, theres great potential there.

I'm not demanding rogean or anyone else do it but don't knock sam around cause he said its a good idea.

[SamwiseBanned]

Originally Posted by CrystalBlue [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I "think" SZ started out as one character slot per account (like FV roleplay server), and it was later increased to three characters per account (again, like FV). Regardless, you could not use those extra char slots to make anything other then another character on the same team as what you already had on the account. So you had to buy and maintain a second account if you wanted toons on the other team (and several people did just that, but w/e, more money for sony to support the server).

Here though, its commonplace for people to put every single one of their alts on a whole new account, so they can of course sell them off easier when they get bored of them or w/e.

If I was in charge I would restrict all players to one account, I would also not allow "selling" (for plat or anything for that matter) accounts or toons.

Anyways, its also deeply retarded to talk of teams on a 85 pop server. Just be happy Nihilum stopped recruitment for awhile there to allow/force others to join Red Dawn.

I hear RD got a taste of some raid pvp last night, is this true??

If so, thats thriving.

Also I apologize if I sound like I am trolling the current server. Sirken asked for suggestions, teams was brought up, and here we are discussing it. I am 99% sure itll never happen, too much shit would have to change, guilds would be broken, ect ect. That being said, I still enjoy discussing it.

I would be for the 1-3 characters allowed per account as well as team lock. I think it would be impossible to prevent people from making separate accounts to spy but at least they couldn't be logged into their main while they did without an IP exemption.

The biggest step the server can take right now, imo of course, is enabling a beta YT with locations and changing the rules to FFA (No Rules.) Big pvp is starting to pop up and with it will come floods of petitions. He trained me, he feared my mob, ect ect. GMs shouldnt have to spend their free time sorting out all this BS. Let the server police it self. There is some real talk that will only help the server.

[CrystalBlue]

Naw, they cant allow FFA training. And if the server's history proves anything, they can and will ban the chronic trainers (see xantille, letsjoe, lethdar, and all the other chronic trainers who ate multiple suspensions and got griefed off to LoZ where they could train in peace).

Zone control needs to be decided by pvp, not who can log in throw away monks to train with.

Server really is as fine as we can expect, just needs a few more minor tweaks:

-YT
-Group xp bonus in place of all the flat xp bonuses

[SamwiseBanned]

I don't think any of the above have been banned, for sure not Lethdar. Slathar trained for months on end, I remember one day he had a dozen petitions about him training in Sol B, didn't even eat a suspension. Outside of a high quality FRAPS or GM witnessing, you cannot enforce that rule. I am not saying training should be legal because there is nothing wrong with it, I am saying its impossible to enforce it fairly. What will happen is some will get away with it, some wont.

I've been thinking about the group xp bonus, long and hard. I don't think it'll help as much as you would think. Ultimately you cannot pressure people into grouping. Times have changed sadly and even though EQ is a game of teamplay, it is heavily dependent on your time. Most people want to get xp the most efficient/fast way possible. It takes a long time to get a group going sometimes, between travel and finding the right classes, it can take hours.

Time - First getting the group together. Unless you are lucky, most likely people will be on different continents and certainly different zones. Druids and wizards being the only porters doesnt help since these are two classes you will almost always see soloing. So most likely you gotta find a druid out of group to port your members near where you are. Currently the porting situation isnt good, the few times I've logged on, I've been asked for ports. If you are fortunate enough to find a porter or people near you then you have the next problem, finding the right classes. Without a constant supply of priests to heal groups, untwinked melees are doomed. Even the majority of new clerics solo to 40 now. Besides Chellsea, all the recent chanters (I've seen), are soloers. Druids/Shammies soloin. Even my favorite classs to invite to groups (mages) be soloin it up. Everyone has tunnel vision towards end-game that they forget about the social aspect of this game. Okay now im ranting, back to study.

TL DR, people wanna get to end-game as fast as possible, leaving casuals/group dependent classes in the dust. Without a constant supply of group oriented healers (players that prefere groups over solo), groups wont happen even with a super group xp bonus. Outside a few situations, a healer is ALWAYS needed to form any group.

[Nirgon]

Maybe it was because I played Velious era on SZ but I never had evils come into Highkeep.. maybe once but probably never. The PvP I found I had to seek, I never really defended a zone.

Velks did get some frequent evil visitors like Kirban (another wizard who managed to survive in a classic resist system, and yes before he got mana burn too).