How do Barbarian Shamans and their toys hold up in Velious?

[aegeryen]

Originally Posted by SomberSunday [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So basically what everyone is saying is: If you want to play a shaman, roll a Gnome.

Sound advise

[webrunner5]

Originally Posted by Reikerz [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

thx

God damn get rid of that Gif. How do you expect people to read your stuff with that stupid thing repeating 50 times a minute.

[Autotune]

So, knowing when a bash is coming up helps you know when to not cast, but what if you need to cast something when that bash timer is about to hit?

Do you
A) die
B) die
C) Change time and space so that you can some how change your spells around in a way that doesn't affect your efficiency and you don't run OOM from overlapping spells too soon.


To be bashed or not be bashed, that is the question.

When it comes to RNG bash will affect you, regardless of how well you can count to ten on your fingers, unless you're an ogre and you give 0ducks.

That said, I'd still rather be a lizard in velious.

[Orruar]

Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So, knowing when a bash is coming up helps you know when to not cast, but what if you need to cast something when that bash timer is about to hit?

Do you
A) die
B) die
C) Change time and space so that you can some how change your spells around in a way that doesn't affect your efficiency and you don't run OOM from overlapping spells too soon.

D) Cast either far enough in advance to land the spell right before the bash, or start cast right after the bash. You have a 6 second window in which you can land your torpor and have 0 waste. The only problem then is if the bash timer lines up exactly with the start of this 6 second window (or up to 1.5 seconds before the window starts). This situation can be avoided if you use your brain. Hint: Think about the pattern of bashes with a 32 second bash cycle and 24 second torpor cycle. Another hint: You can't control the server's timing on torpor ticks, but you can control when the bash cycle starts.

[Autotune]

Originally Posted by Orruar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

D) Cast either far enough in advance to land the spell right before the bash, or start cast right after the bash. You have a 6 second window in which you can land your torpor and have 0 waste. The only problem then is if the bash timer lines up exactly with the start of this 6 second window (or up to 1.5 seconds before the window starts). This situation can be avoided if you use your brain. Hint: Think about the pattern of bashes with a 32 second bash cycle and 24 second torpor cycle. Another hint: You can't control the server's timing on torpor ticks, but you can control when the bash cycle starts.

With melee interruptions and resists, I still can see where people will have to cast with a bash incoming or die.

[Orruar]

Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

With melee interruptions and resists, I still can see where people will have to cast with a bash incoming or die.

For interrupts: A mob's slowed melee timer is 8s, which dovetails nicely with the torpor and bash timers. Again, a little planning ahead of time ensures you can cast your torpor when you want to without any risk of being interrupted by either melee push or bash.

For resists: Torpor isn't resistable, and that's really the only spell that has a tough time with bash interrupts. For slows, you start reslowing a minute before it fades anyway. And it's a 3s cast time. So since you might get bashed twice in that minute, you'd maybe need to start slowing at 66s instead of 60s. This difference is trivial in the grand scheme of things.

[pasi]

When you time spells around bash, do you assume every bash is going to hit? Say spell cast recovery time finishes and you want to canni, but your bash metrognome shows there is a bash in 2.273 (repeating) seconds. Do you cast? The Ogre doesn't give a hoot.

I mean, this isn't some age-old question without an answer. There's probably a giant sticky on Samanna that says 'ROLL OGRE.'

Hint: Think about the pattern of bashes with a 32 second bash cycle and 24 second torpor cycle. Another hint: You can't control the server's timing on torpor ticks, but you can control when the bash cycle starts.

Since this is a Velious thread, are you timing your initial bash starting cycle around the first slow attempt? Most everything in Velious is very MR and you're going to have to spend a few attempts slowing, and possibly even kiting until you can override malo with malosini (or even proc tash).

[Orruar]

Originally Posted by pasi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

When you time spells around bash, do you assume every bash is going to hit? Say spell cast recovery time finishes and you want to canni, but your bash metrognome shows there is a bash in 2.273 (repeating) seconds. Do you cast? The Ogre doesn't give a hoot.

I mean, this isn't some age-old question without an answer. There's probably a giant sticky on Samanna that says 'ROLL OGRE.'



Since this is a Velious thread, are you timing your initial bash starting cycle around the first slow attempt? Most everything in Velious is very MR and you're going to have to spend a few attempts slowing, and possibly even kiting until you can override malo with malosini (or even proc tash).

Yes, you have to assume that every bash will hit and interrupt. You wouldn't delay casting a canni because of bash though. If it doesn't land, you get the canni. If not, oh well. There's no benefit in not casting. The only thing you really plan around the bash is torpor, since you probably want to keep that rolling 24x7 with no overlap.

Assuming you are kiting a mob around until it's slowed, which is the most common case in Velious as I understand, the first bash will come when the mob first melees you. So that's how you control when the bash cycle starts (and offset it sufficiently so it won't come in when you want to torpor).

[greatdane]

Stun immunity is particularly good when tanking several mobs. It's not like you spend your entire EQ life only ever fighting one mob at a time. You'll get trained, you'll get adds, you'll get healing aggro, all kinds of shit can cause several mobs to start hitting you. Try timing your casts around bash with four fuckers in your face. Suddenly you're getting bashed every few seconds if you aren't immune.

Not to mention the fact that ogres just have better stats, which really doesn't stop being relevant until you're balls deep into ToV. Less than ten shamans on this server will have Velious BiS gear. Contrary to popular belief, shaman gear isn't packed with stamina.

PS: iksar innate AC bonus is 42. That's as much as two and forty. And that's terrible.

[Nerosys]

I played a troll shaman through live and i did just fine, able to raid all high end content with not much problems.

However get a couple resisted slows in velious and tell me you don't want frontal stun immunity, alot of people talk through theorycrafting and not from actual playtime, Regen is great for a shaman but once you get Torpor it really doesen't make much difference whatsoever.


Rotokan