How are Bards in the DPS department?

[pickled_heretic]

Originally Posted by Francois [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Did you play a bard on live? just curious where you're getting your information from.

personally no, i never played a bard on live. but i certainly remember nothing like bards mezzing huge trains

anyway, there's plenty of supporting evidence here:

http://www.project1999.org/forums/sh...29&postcount=1

a dev has never responded to this thread, i don't know why; maybe they don't care. anyway it would have solved all the ridiculous VS training to the zone so rogean wouldn't have had to fabricate rules for the zone in order to prevent all the exp groups from being trained to death for 20 minutes every time VS pops.

[falkun]

The OP in that post has lots of misinformation or misunderstood game mechanics.

>>>Kelin's Lucid Lullaby, I recently tested this song out vs. a level one human warrior. My Bard was level 37 at the time, using the Lute of the Gypsy Princess and I have charisma of 141. Every round I got the 'so and so head nods' message and every nearly every round the test subject was able to attack me (about 1 in 10 rounds he would not).

As was stated, this mez lasts 1 tick, if you do not chain cast (not let it tick, but RECAST), you will not remez in time. This is because you can chain cast every 3 sec due to the 3sec cast, but the song will only pulse on the server tick, every 6 sec, the same as the tick for the mez wearing off. This is working as intended.

4 targets

You'll notice in the EQDiva website link I provided, the official description also states 4 targets. However, reading the comments reveals that the 4-target limit did not actually exist.

The fact that this song is resisted very easily doesn't really help this situation.

If he is trying to mez dark blue mobs without someone malo/tashing each one, of course he is going to get a lot of resists. In the case of KC, you had multiple 55+ (probably all four are 60) bards mezzing mobs that were low dark blue at the most, green at the least. And there were 4 of them, of course they are going to be able to lock down the mobs better.

[pickled_heretic]

what mobs in KC are green to a 60? I am level 57 and I haven't seen a single mob con LB yet.

There are multiple sources repeating the 4 target max, EVEN THE DATABASE THAT YOU LINKED EARLIER SAYS 4 MAX LOL.

The song is currently broken and needs to be fixed.

[Rusl]

Half the zone is green or light blue at 60.

Back on topic. Bards aren't a dps class unless you think banging on a drum while punching a dragon counts as dps.

[falkun]

EQDiva comment, dated 3/11/01.

And you can mezz more then 4 creatures at a time.

The link I provided was Lucy's, which reads directly from the database. I'm not arguing that the in-game tooltip states "4 target max", I'm arguing that the limit did not truly exist, regardless of what the tooltip states. The links you provided rip data from the tooltip, but do not comment on a target limit when discussing actual use.

Even the link you provided regarding resists alludes to the lack of a target limit:

lull targets near you

Back on target: Pickled is dead wrong about bards in general, disregard his information about bard DPS. Bards do their best personal DPS using instruments and songs, not with melee weapons. Bards add the most DPS to a melee-oriented group utilizing melee weapons and haste+str songs (as haste is unaffected by instrument modifiers), with the caveat that if possible, temporarily charming an add is a great addition to DPS, but not something that is to be relied upon or available. Bards add teh best DPS to a group of casters utilizing drums with DPS songs that also contain negative resist components, while also singing mana song so casters have more mana to DPS with.

But a bard is not brought for his personal DPS, he is brought for the utility he adds to the group through regen, hastes, slows, stat buffs, debuffs, and the other songs within his vast arsenal of ballads.

[pickled_heretic]

neat, one random comment from a lvl 17 bard disproves the multiple cross-referenced comments as well as the original tooltip that states 4 target max.

if you twist like you argue your group is in some serious trouble :O

Originally Posted by falkun [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Back on target: Pickled is dead wrong about bards in general, disregard his information about bard DPS.

how about, instead of being dismissive, try to be civil and find some specifics that you disagree on?

Originally Posted by Rusl [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Half the zone is green or light blue at 60.

if you can screenshot a green con non-pet mob in KC I will give you a thousand platinum.

[falkun]

2:http://web.archive.org/web/200104211...gs.asp?song=15

I believe that the cap of 4 mobs is only for sung. With strings it's unlimited. Though I may be wrong.....

While it is wrong that the instrument increases the limit of mezzed mobs, it still indicates more than 4 can be mezzed.

3:http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/spell.html?spell=724

Here's the REAL story of the former AE mez...
In beta it was super overpowered. It could lock down an entire zone. This caused all bard mez songs to have a second resist check added. Essentially, the song could land but not affect the creature. This led to the supremacy of Enchanters in crowd controlling (and monks in pulling, as a bard's only tool for controlling a lull failure was removed).

Bards complained bitterly about this state of affairs, while Verant denied there was any problem. This came to a head in a famous (among bards at least) episode where a dev came to watch a demonstration in the Qeynos newbie yard as a high level bard attempted to mez the level 1 snakes, only to have a near 100% resist rate.

Eventually the second resist check was removed, and this song changed to single target.

4:http://eqclassic.de/wiki/Kellin%27s_Lucid_Lullaby

This song will put to sleep mobs in close proximity to you.

While not technically a dated source, its another classic emulator whose Kelin's Lucid Lullaby works in the same manner.

5:http://scmelze02.tripod.com/sitebuil...dsincombat.htm

Disengage temporarily if down to two and a quarter bubbles of HP, do not reengage until up to more than three bubbles. Sometimes it may also be necessary to stop singing any song so the fighter can get those monsters off you. Exception: If you've started singing Kelin's Lucid Lullaby, it's usually a BAD idea to stop singing.
Disengage if attacked by multiple enemies, or use Kelin's Lucid Lullaby.

Multiple enemies, without a target limit reference.

How many more sources would you like? Also, note that P99 server developers -changed- the Kelin's on this server from the nerfed single target mez back to the "classic" AE mez. I don't think that is the type of thing they do lightly.

[Gmal]

I can do 135 dps as a berzerker warrior with 2 wurmslayers. just an FYI. Thats better then most monks can do unless they have 2 mastery fists. I compare to some rogues out there that are medicor geared.

[Szeth]

Originally Posted by pickled_heretic [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

if you can screenshot a green con non-pet mob in KC I will give you a thousand platinum.

Make it 10k otherwise it's not worth my time. I promise you if you do I will deliver.

[Szeth]

Also calling shenanigans on 135 dps without a parse. I'm pretty sure Gmal is just trolling in any case. Especially since he said "most" monks with sky fists, and there aren't any monks w/ sky fists doing 135 dps.(without innerflame over an 18 second period)