Why are there hell levels still?

[Ooloo]

They aren't cheating. They lead very lonely and sparse lives. Do not envy them, you should rather study them like a sideshow curiosity.

[Tunabros]

Originally Posted by Ooloo [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

They aren't cheating. They lead very lonely and sparse lives. Do not envy them, you should rather study them like a sideshow curiosity.

shut up baler

[Arvan]

Cheating is confirmed

[dk0]

Few things on hell levels:

They were not built to artificially stretch playtime. Even after they were "smoothed out" (i.e. removed), the total exp required to hit max level remained the exact same, and therefore the time investment into leveling stayed the exact same. (You could argue nuances like spending longer in 58 and less in 59 means certain blue-cons will net more exp etc but overall the change was to remain equal.)

I'm not sure the hell levels were a mistake as much as they were just an outcome of the way the algorithm was designed. It's possible (even likely) that the outcome was unintended, but that may be forever debated. Exp calculations per level have a bunch of things that go into them, but one is an overall "level multiplier." The multiplier first jumps to a higher value at level 30, then again at 35, then 40, 45, and you get the idea. I don't remember the specifics of the level calculation here, but each jump in the multiplier created a large spike in required exp for that level, and hell levels were born.

Side note: the amount of exp you lose on death is calculated based on the total required exp of the PREVIOUS level. This is why you lose a shitload of exp when you die at 31, 36, 41, etc. and especially at 60.

Speaking of exp mistakes, though, my recollection is that the 5% bonus exp that halflings get was originally intended for humans. They were supposed to level more quickly to make up for having no innate racial features. Someone put a value in the wrong box and here we are.

Lastly, that PCGamer article linked above is an amazing read for any EQ fans (which I assume is most here). It was written for the 20th anniversary of EQ and dives into how this game came to be. Highly recommend!

[mycoolrausch]

Originally Posted by dk0 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Few things on hell levels:

They were not built to artificially stretch playtime.

Not specifically as such, but they wanted the 10 levels of kunark to last at least as long as the 50 levels of vanilla, so they had to arbitrarily make them all hell levels then add double hell levels on top of that.

There's pros and cons to the massive grinds and timesinks in EQ, but mostly cons. We still play it because mmorpg game designers haven't come up with a good answer to "how do you make lots of engaging content that rewards time and effort without tedious grinds" and hopefully not because we actually think the pinnacle of mmorpg game design was invented in 1999 by a rag tag team of stoned mud players and sony execs and will never be bested.

[unsunghero]

Seems like you have two options to keep people playing your game

1. Put them on a treadmill. You’re gonna need to use borrowed/temporary power systems or else you get mudflation like in wow or live EQ where chars went from having 4k health and doing 500 damage to having 100k health and doing 5,000,000 damage. So use a temporary power system that becomes useless next expansion to incentivize players to buy the next expansion

2. Make player driven content like pvp, in game politics. The problem here is that a decent amount of players especially gamers have shit personalities and so the type of content they will produce is not appealing to the player masses. And when players quit, you lose your content