Watched the Nag kill, is classic raiding just cheese?

[Graahle]

Why is it such a big deal to pull Nagafen to where they did? Serious question.

It looked pretty smart to me, but I'm not entrenched in 10 years of P99 rules.

[Dolalin]

I did manage to find proof that Naggy wouldn't come out of his lair until 2003.

https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...0&postcount=12

[Haynar]

Originally Posted by WaffleztheAndal [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Props to Seal Team for the kill, but to be honest watching that was depressing lol. So much cheese and mechanic abuse.

Is this what classic raiding in eq is now that the game is 20 years old? Is there no real challenge left?

Or does challenge come from having to engage prematurely due to competing guilds?

Watching this Nag kill, for the first time, makes me see the value in a Red server. PvE on a 20 year old server has never seemed more stale to me than it did tonight.

You must be used to being in guilds that never kill naggy. You do whatever it takes when raiding in bronze and cloth sandles.

Enjoy never killing naggy if you have such rigid expections of what is allowed.

Grats Seal Team.

[Vexenu]

The only thing more tired than the oft-repeated calls for a new PvP server are the chorus of replies about how, "LOL RED IS DEAD, PVP IN EQ IS UNBALANCED AND TOTAL FAIL U MORAN." Invariably the people saying this know nothing about the history of Red and have never played on any EQ PvP server, classic or emulated.

The reality is that EQ PvP is literally more balanced than EQ PvE. All classes have a niche in EQ PvP, an area in which they can excel. Hybrids are particularly effective, whereas on a Blue server they are basically a joke. Wizards are useful for more than raid kills. Druids are extremely good. When you factor in PvP + PvE together EverQuest reaches its highest level of immersion and class balance.

The strange thing is that EQ as played on P1999 PvE is inherently a PvP game: the content itself is never the challenge, the only challenge is beating other players to that content. So these Blue players who decry PvP are totally incoherent, because they are actively engaged in competition against other players. They are just competing indirectly rather than directly. The PvP players simply prefer their competition to be more direct and concrete.

[azeth]

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The reality is that EQ PvP is literally more balanced than EQ PvE.

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Hybrids are particularly effective

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Wizards are useful for more than raid kills

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Druids are extremely good...

Do you uh, see what you did here?[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Vexenu]

Originally Posted by azeth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Do you uh, see what you did here?[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The point is that every class has a PvP niche in which they excel. In contrast, PvE niches are much more limited for the classes I listed. There is basically zero reason for a PvE guild to have Paladins, Rangers, SKs and Druids around. There is zero reason to ever have a Wizard in your XP group. But on a Red server you would be glad to XP with a Wiz, knowing that if PvP suddenly happened his burst damage would be very valuable. It's much the same having an SK or other hybrid around.

When you combine PvP and PvE the class roles become much more fleshed out and every class feels like they are contributing more.

[fadetree]

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The only thing more tired than the oft-repeated calls for a new PvP server are the chorus of replies about how, "LOL RED IS DEAD, PVP IN EQ IS UNBALANCED AND TOTAL FAIL U MORAN." Invariably the people saying this know nothing about the history of Red and have never played on any EQ PvP server, classic or emulated.

The reality is that EQ PvP is literally more balanced than EQ PvE. All classes have a niche in EQ PvP, an area in which they can excel. Hybrids are particularly effective, whereas on a Blue server they are basically a joke. Wizards are useful for more than raid kills. Druids are extremely good. When you factor in PvP + PvE together EverQuest reaches its highest level of immersion and class balance.

The strange thing is that EQ as played on P1999 PvE is inherently a PvP game: the content itself is never the challenge, the only challenge is beating other players to that content. So these Blue players who decry PvP are totally incoherent, because they are actively engaged in competition against other players. They are just competing indirectly rather than directly. The PvP players simply prefer their competition to be more direct and concrete.

This is a fair point. Still don't like EQ PvP, though.

[Wwen42]

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The only thing more tired than the oft-repeated calls for a new PvP server are the chorus of replies about how, "LOL RED IS DEAD, PVP IN EQ IS UNBALANCED AND TOTAL FAIL U MORAN." Invariably the people saying this know nothing about the history of Red and have never played on any EQ PvP server, classic or emulated.

The reality is that EQ PvP is literally more balanced than EQ PvE. All classes have a niche in EQ PvP, an area in which they can excel. Hybrids are particularly effective, whereas on a Blue server they are basically a joke. Wizards are useful for more than raid kills. Druids are extremely good. When you factor in PvP + PvE together EverQuest reaches its highest level of immersion and class balance.

The strange thing is that EQ as played on P1999 PvE is inherently a PvP game: the content itself is never the challenge, the only challenge is beating other players to that content. So these Blue players who decry PvP are totally incoherent, because they are actively engaged in competition against other players. They are just competing indirectly rather than directly. The PvP players simply prefer their competition to be more direct and concrete.

That might all be true, but for one reason or another no one is interested. Hell, look at WoW PvP. It's completely low-stakes, but people still chose to avoid those servers. Even the pops IN those servers usually avoid PvP. The only MMO that the PvP was the whole point is Eve Online in 0 security space where you have Corps and Alliances taking and hold space. (Warhammer made pvp a big part of it, but it's super dead)

You can promote PvP or Libertarians all you like, but we don't live in a culture that wants those things. And p1999 EQ PvP is a niche within a niche. You're better off trying to get family members on board than people already on PvE servers.

[Larken]

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The only thing more tired than the oft-repeated calls for a new PvP server are the chorus of replies about how, "LOL RED IS DEAD, PVP IN EQ IS UNBALANCED AND TOTAL FAIL U MORAN." Invariably the people saying this know nothing about the history of Red and have never played on any EQ PvP server, classic or emulated.

The reality is that EQ PvP is literally more balanced than EQ PvE. All classes have a niche in EQ PvP, an area in which they can excel. Hybrids are particularly effective, whereas on a Blue server they are basically a joke. Wizards are useful for more than raid kills. Druids are extremely good. When you factor in PvP + PvE together EverQuest reaches its highest level of immersion and class balance.

The strange thing is that EQ as played on P1999 PvE is inherently a PvP game: the content itself is never the challenge, the only challenge is beating other players to that content. So these Blue players who decry PvP are totally incoherent, because they are actively engaged in competition against other players. They are just competing indirectly rather than directly. The PvP players simply prefer their competition to be more direct and concrete.

This. You sir nailed it.

[Natewest1987]

LOL YES