How to save red

[Swish]

Originally Posted by Silvurwolf [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Here it is. The reason. The problem. The solution. Are you ready?

It's the community. It's the players on the server.

Be the change you want to see on the server (goes for blue as well, because there's definitely some bad players).

[Baler]

A crowd argues about an issue that everyone in the crowd is concerned about.
Time passes
The crowd is still arguing and the issue has since gone obsolete days ago.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIk_yUkisPU

[Deliverator]

PVP is the playground for griefers. Always has been and always will be. The only way to fix Red is to either remove red completely or basically take away the whole point of having a PVP SERVER and just make it basically a PVP zone by allowing people to copy characters over to beat on each other when they are bored.

[nyclin]

don't give a fuck about saving red, eq pvp is a dumpster fire

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Deliverator [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

PVP is the playground for griefers. Always has been and always will be. The only way to fix Red is to either remove red completely or basically take away the whole point of having a PVP SERVER and just make it basically a PVP zone by allowing people to copy characters over to beat on each other when they are bored.

World PvP is for griefers, but I think the many successful team-based PvP MMOGs (eg. DaoC, SW:G, WoW, and even EverQuest with Sullon Zek) show that good MMOG PvP is possible.

[nyclin]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

World PvP is for griefers, but I think the many successful team-based PvP MMOGs (eg. DaoC, SW:G, WoW, and even EverQuest with Sullon Zek) show that good MMOG PvP is possible ... as long as you don't just let a bunch of idiots run around killing each other without purpose.

can't really compare other games to eq.. daoc actually had a semblance of balance, wow actively tries to balance pvp in the name of "esports"

eq pvp was an afterthought and is basically impossible to balance, even with significant non-classic changes

[Swish]

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[Jimjam]

I've tried EQ pvp. It's okay.

Really it is where the 'competitive' players belong, to me it is obvious that vanilla EQ is a collaborative game about working together and 'competitive' player are simply trying to work against players that want to play collaboratively.

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

World PvP is for griefers, but I think the many successful team-based PvP MMOGs (eg. DaoC, SW:G, WoW, and even EverQuest with Sullon Zek) show that good MMOG PvP is possible.

I had a toon on SZ that I would play when I wasn't feeling well. Bertox SK. Obviously it didn't get very high level.


Something I noticed was high level wizards and druids detour into the warrens on their way to the Hole just to clear out any non-team teens levelling there. This happened almost every session.

You could argue killing the younglings is team activity. However, I never had an on-team player show up to the warrens to see if there were any low level players that might need help. This ratio of kill vs help suggests to me the activity was grief based, not team based.

In this regard I think red is more successful than SZ; Although there used to be a fungusman problem, these days red has a decent number of players that will try give newbies a hand up or protection (at least until they hit their 50s).

Edit: just logged into live on zek to see my old sk, level 15 with almost a full set of ringmail and a cold iron shackle for that plate bracer look [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Tenlaar]

Originally Posted by Squire [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ah as I read that I could tell you had not played red here and made the same misconceptions that many do here.

This gets really irritating. Damn near every time I see people talking about shitty experiences on Red somebody comes along and basically tries to act like it didn't really happen and people are making things up.

Guess what? I tried red. The community WAS awful and I WAS griefed by multiple people as a level 9 wearing only the banded armor I'd managed to make myself so far, people who actually went so far as to send me tells to invite me to come and group with them multiple zones away just to attack me as soon as I arrive.

Just because you want to act like people are making these things up doesn't magically make the community not be shit.

[A1rh3ad]

I could see red being a thing and honestly I'm surprised there aren't more players. It's just not MY thing. I tend to opt out of pvp on even more balanced games nowadays. I've become too chill for it in my later years. Especially pvp on EQ where players can become absolute gods at low levels. It would be nice if you could kill players farming your factions npcs though. Like on wow where there are PvP timers. Hate to say it but vanilla pvp is one area WoW did absolutely right. Contested zones and pvp timers. PvP timers on pve servers too.