What would it take for a new mmo to recapture the feeling of eq?

[natx808]

modern day MMO have no soul. that is what is needed to recapture the feeling of eq.

[tizznyres]

A world that feels large, open, and immersive. A world that doesn't offer automated GUI mapping with perfect GPS positioning, and doesn't brightly label every NPC or quest offering that is available; and certainly one that doesn't hold your hand directly to your objective(s). Less NPC driven / effortless fast-travel, at least without the help of other players. Less instancing whenever possible, and an effort to make more of the desirable content contestable among players.

An emphasis on player-to-player dynamics. In EverQuest, especially early on, player interactions were extremely important at all stages of the game. Before hand drawn maps were commonplace and easy to find, seeking the aid of other players who knew zones well, classes that could SoW, Buff HP or Regen, Cast Invis or IvU, Resurrect, or even Teleport you were extraordinarily useful.

A strict and punishing, but equally conquerable Risk vs Reward design both at the early and endgame stages of the game. Games where dying or making tragic mistakes means a only few seconds to a few minutes of inconvenience, or a slight durability / currency penalty really don't grasp this concept. Additionally, games that require little to no real dedication to gain the highest quality loot fall short in the same way.

A strong player-driven Economy that relies on individual players to harvest and craft much of the more desirable items in the game. Along with this, a distancing from the idea of server-wide, instant-transaction, zero-interaction Auction Houses or similar setups. A return to the idea of direct player trading, albeit with less of the tedium that was involved in early EQ trading. Simple things like linking items in chat are generally an improvement across the board.

A simple concept that's all but lost in modern MMOs: the idea of discovering and solving quests that most other players likely don't even know exist. Whether this is done through EQ's rather archaic idea of Hailing NPC's and trying to discover quest keywords or a more modern and less tedious method. This added a level of intrigue and mystery to EverQuest that I haven't seen in any online multiplayer RPG since. It helped make the world feel like it was something special, and that there were always secrets to be discovered. Not to mention solving the epic 1.0 quests originally were massive efforts on behalf of countless players in the community. Even in 2015 I find it fascinating to go back and read classic-era archived posts about how certain quests were solved originally.

A distancing from the common modern Cash Shops and similar real-money offerings, especially those that provide certain players advantages over others. Not only do I find these things offensive, they really don't make any sense at all and are entirely non-canon in regards to a game world.

Other less important, but very simple concepts such as Currency having a weight-value, and a rather substantial one at that. Struggling to move huge sums of money and valuable items around with ease may seem like an unnecessary inconvenience to some, but it adds a level of immersion and realism to a world.

Finally, the most abstract but perhaps most important thing: A clear and unique vision shared between the core development team that remains true throughout the game's career. I realize publisher and player demands may change over time, but remaining as true as possible to an original vision I feel is of paramount importance.

[Kika Maslyaka]

Originally Posted by tizznyres [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A simple concept that's all but lost in modern MMOs: the idea of discovering and solving quests that most other players likely don't even know exist. Whether this is done through EQ's rather archaic idea of Hailing NPC's and trying to discover quest keywords or a more modern and less tedious method. This added a level of intrigue and mystery to EverQuest that I haven't seen in any online multiplayer RPG since. It helped make the world feel like it was something special, and that there were always secrets to be discovered. Not to mention solving the epic 1.0 quests originally were massive efforts on behalf of countless players in the community. Even in 2015 I find it fascinating to go back and read classic-era archived posts about how certain quests were solved originally.

This doesn't really work as well as you imagine. Once a quest was discovered and solved - everyone just reads its walk-through online, including useful comments on how to skip unnecessary steps [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] How many people playing on this server have actually EVER found and solved their own quests without looking it up on Alakhazam first? How many people on this server have wiki page opened with check marks to each step done when doing their epics? This approach works well for a one time DnD campaign, but not for MMO.

[Zalmo]

Basically what everyone else has said is pretty spot on. I'd say an MMO like EQ could actually be possible in the not too distant future as MMOs have drifted quite far from this type of game so it would stand alone. It wouldn't need millions of players to be profitable, likely even 1-200k would be plenty enough. The problem is modern MMOs are trying to cast their net over the whole market.

[Clark]

Originally Posted by natx808 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

modern day MMO have no soul. that is what is needed to recapture the feeling of eq.

[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[mr_jon3s]

It's not really possible because EQ hit a sweet spot. The internet was young and didn't have many sources for information about games. Hardly anyone had MMO experience. It took years for people to figure out everything in EQ. Now in a modern MMO people know everything about the game in a week and are max level.

I think the only real way to recapture the feeling will be when the first full immersion VR MMO comes out. Pretty much with you actually being the character.

[StrangeTech]

Not being able to server transfer/name change one's way out of being a jerk helps. You build your own reputation and own it. In modern MMOs, you can do things "for teh lulz" and never have to worry about it. Chances are, they're never going to see you again.

Back in Classic, I had a guy do the trade scam which causes you to drop your bags. He then proceeded to snatch them up and claim innocence. I logged and switched toons, only to find he was selling my bags of gear. I confronted him in tells first, then OOC. He quickly coughed up the good, lest his reputation be ruined.

I'm not saying accountability makes EQ so much better than any other game, but (for the most part) it kept the servers and community clean.

[Barkingturtle]

First off, I have not read this thread so I'm not sure if someone already mentioned this.

The last few years when I'm not playing P99 I've been on Wurm. It has some similarities to classic EQ. It has certainly come closest to recreating that ol' EQ feeling. There are no quests. You get lost constantly. It's very hard at first. All your loot stays on you when you die and corpse runs can be truly horrifying. It is a massive time sink. It is terribly addictive. The graphics are crap. The controls are lacking. There are times when I think it's the greatest game ever.

[Blap]

- non instanced zones (group/raids) challenging runs against other guilds
- naked corpse run
- epic quests
- hard time traveling
- difficulty to mastering your class

[Aeaolena]

Originally Posted by Roth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I love eq. Love the game and mean it, when I play it I really appreciate the game even exists at all and I can play it in its original form and enjoy it. Love the entire game world and all the zones and everything. However sometimes I find myself wishing for new content or for small class changes that I know will never come. I think anyone who says nostalgia is what makes people like project 1999 are totally wrong... because EVERY time I play project 1999, I have that same amazing feeling of how cool and great this game world is that I never get from other mmos.

Personally I think what makes eq so fun is the simplicity and yet the detail of the world. Stuff doesn't always make sense. Things are just there and you don't really know why, you don't know what's out there. The world is dangerous and you have to respect it so you can actually survive. You can't just port around easily, for the most part travelling is slow and you have to think about where you want to go and where you want to be. When you go to an open zone out in the middle of nowhere with no one else around, it's a pretty great feeling. The lore is really great but there is no real directed path. You just go out and do what you want and I love that.

So the question is, what would it take for a new mmo to recapture the same feeling? As I said, I don't believe the "first mmo" theory holds up. I think there is something special here that just hasn't been revisited since. I feel like there is a strong chance we're gonna lose the potential for a spiritual successor to eq forever cause game devs just don't get it and don't care. So what would it take?

(Don't have time to read the replies so I'll just answer original post in case someone hasn't said this yet)

In EQ, you depend heavily on other players.

Thus, you earn a reputation.

In EQ, there are no instances, so there are always opportunities for players, guilds, groups to be dicks, or greedy.. or civil.

Thus, your guild earns a reputation.


----------------

The newer and newer games get, the more they do stuff "for you" so that you do not have to rely on other characters. Don't fight over boss mobs, here have some instances. Don't worry about asking someone for a bind, who might say yes if they are a saint, and no if they are too busy for the likes of you. Don't worry about asking someone for buffs if you stick to the path. Don't worry about how hard it will be to find a group, groups for experience don't matter anymore! You can solo quest! Don't worry about asking for a port and bugging someone for their time, we have NPC's with birds you can use! Don't worry about haggling in an EC tunnel where all the high level characters go to show off their cool gear and new epics (you know you do it)... because there's an auction house where you never have to have human interaction again! In fact, don't worry about ever having 'unique' looking gear again that people drool over.. because everyone can dye their armor to look JUST like yours. So never again will you look at someones red robe and say "ohhh, that necro has the CT robe". Don't worry about getting lost or needing to ask someone for help, there's a map! Don't worry about how much it sucks to die, and thus why you want GOOD/SKILLED players in your group - you won't lose that much exp! IN FACT, Don't worry about your reputation AT ALL, because we'll now set you up with a random group and insert you in an instance.. you don't even need to have human interaction or speak the same language.. and don't worry, if that person who hasn't said a word hits "NEED" on a roll to Ninja it and disconnects after everyone else rolled greed.. you won't remember their name. Because reputation doesn't matter.

In EQ, reputation matters. Ninja something from another guild's raid, and it's the yoink heard round the server. Guilds RUSH to Rants and Flames to talk about how loose that person's guild's morals are and how that guild lets in horrible people. Be a dick, can't play your class, are a spazz? Don't even think about getting a group in Sebilis, where the stakes are high for corpse recovery if you die!

It's about reputation. For reputation, things have to have lots of ways to go wrong to tell the morale of community members. Lots of opportunities for people to be jerks, basically... so they can prove they aren't jerks.

In EQ, you needed to be civil and you needed to interact with people for your gear, bind, rez, port, summon, group. The groups where static and boring.. thus you got to know people. Made friends. Made reputations.