Reset the server after Kerafyrm is awoken.

[Daldaen]

AA's give you a reason to play your maxed out character and they provides balance to underpowered classes like rangers and wizards.

Bazaar meant you didn't have to deal with people trying to flip stuff and undercut every price you list. They can still buy low and sell high, but you atleast don't have to deal with them directly (they can still buy your stuff while AFK) and then I won't feel like I need to wash my hands after every conversation with those slimy reseller folk.

[Dunes]

I agree entirely with you on both points. The problem with them, however, is that they changed EQ.

The Bazaar completely altered the forced interaction and haggling that makes the EQ economy so much fun. In hindsight, it was one of the first steps EQ made away from the group and peer-to-peer dynamics that makes EQ (and our beloved P99) so different from modern MMOs. You will still have the exact same number of slimy reseller folk with the bazaar. In fact, its easier for them to do so when prices are listed and so many more items are on the market at any given time (AFK selling).

AA's do give level 60's something to do... for a while. But as with all things, AA grinding is the same as levels - people will max in a short period of time. Is it worth allowing people to change the core attributes of a character? I still shiver when I think about the intro of PoT loot that affected these core mechanics. Its a weak argument to say "it changes play style and combat dynamics too much", but its still one of the two big changes that Luclin introduced that many P99 players are opposed to.

Keep in mind Im sort of playing devil's advocate here - I secretly enjoyed Luclin. That said, what brings us all to P99 is the authentic classic experience, and certain features released with expansions over the years eroded that to the tragedy of modern EQ.

[Messianic]

Originally Posted by Dunes [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The Bazaar completely altered the forced interaction and haggling that makes the EQ economy so much fun...You will still have the exact same number of slimy reseller folk with the bazaar. In fact, its easier for them to do so when prices are listed and so many more items are on the market at any given time (AFK selling).

Not exactly. Re-sellers have to commit a lot harder in the bazaar. A lot more sellers of the same items will be in the market, so they'd have to buy *all* of the same item on the market to do so. This isn't even an option for Lore items, so controlling the market on those types of items is really hard in a bazaar system.

On the p99 model, frequently only one of most mid/high-end items is sold at any given time, and if you don't want to wait forever or simply post in the forums to wait for a better price, you have to use that re-seller's service. The very reason they exist is because the system is inefficient and you can catch people simply wanting to sell low and get back to *playing the game*.

Haggling is anachronistic when information is aplenty. It's actually much more efficient in the bazaar since sellers must have an asking price (personal favorite feature of mine) and therefore *must* be aware of what other sellers are substantively asking for the same item (as opposed to merely advertising higher prices and expecting people to offer less), instead of checking ahungry.com logs and adding 10% and playing meaningless games.

In other words, the bazaar's system does the haggling for you. If I want to haggle, I'll go to craigslist. Not EQ.

Also, the bazaar actually creates a market for low end items while increasing their availability. Tons of <150p items that new folks want get vendored constantly simply because rational individuals don't want to waste hours attempting to sell them. It's incredibly annoying sometimes to try to find low-end items - reasonably so, no one wants to sit in EC and auction or update EC forum threads incessantly for minimal gain.

The bazaar is a net positive. Yes, it reduces direct p2p interaction. Yes, it creates a bot culture (if one doesn't already exist in EC). But speaking in terms of custom Luclin content, having a bazaar-like area near shady in the EC tunnel is something I would push for.

[Dunes]

Originally Posted by Messianic [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Also, the bazaar actually creates a market for low end items while increasing their availability. Tons of <150p items that new folks want get vendored constantly simply because rational individuals don't want to waste hours attempting to sell them. It's incredibly annoying sometimes to try to find low-end items - reasonably so, no one wants to sit in EC and auction or update EC forum threads incessantly for minimal gain.

Good point! I read the entire post, but hadn't really considered this specific advantage. Keep in mind Im secretly a casual - (most of us) don't have the time we used to prior to Luclin on Live, and anything that reduces "housekeeping" is a +1 IMO. In this case, housekeeping is selling off low value loot en masse and AFK rather than banking it for a year before giving it to the nearest noobie to make room for other stuff.

As I stated before, I personally am not opposed to Luclin (or even PoP up to, but not including Time). I just think both sides will have to give a little to strike a deal that is very close to classic with a few concessions made to the anti-cat crowd. I enjoyed the triggered events and relatively low light settings of Luclin. The aliens were a little hard to embrace, but overall there were some cool concepts introduced.

Not to hijack the thread, but how many expansions-worth of content do you think the P99 player base can populate before getting too spread out? There will likely always be "hot zones" where people like to group, but we all know the feeling of running through a zone and seeing your the only one there... some like it, but most of us enjoy running into and working with other players.

[Messianic]

Originally Posted by Dunes [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Good point! I read the entire post, but hadn't really considered this specific advantage. Keep in mind Im secretly a casual - (most of us) don't have the time we used to prior to Luclin on Live, and anything that reduces "housekeeping" is a +1 IMO. In this case, housekeeping is selling off low value loot en masse and AFK rather than banking it for a year before giving it to the nearest noobie to make room for other stuff.

As I stated before, I personally am not opposed to Luclin (or even PoP up to, but not including Time). I just think both sides will have to give a little to strike a deal that is very close to classic with a few concessions made to the anti-cat crowd. I enjoyed the triggered events and relatively low light settings of Luclin. The aliens were a little hard to embrace, but overall there were some cool concepts introduced.

Not to hijack the thread, but how many expansions-worth of content do you think the P99 player base can populate before getting too spread out? There will likely always be "hot zones" where people like to group, but we all know the feeling of running through a zone and seeing your the only one there... some like it, but most of us enjoy running into and working with other players.

Yeah, any aspects post-velious would have to be negotiated which is a grab bag. Honestly I wish they'd just implement it wholesale. I never got to experience much of the authentic Luclin experience.

Maybe we need an official discussion that addresses where EQ got silly and start putting together proposals on how to customize it to mitigate those downsides. I'm thinking more of a talent tree system for AA's, etc.

[Messianic]

I love how people are all so rabidly traditionalist about it. "LUCLIN RUINED EVERYTHING OMG" "LIFE WAS BETTER BACK IN THE VELIOUS DAYS".

Like most things in life, they were a mixed bag. There are elements of and zones in Luclin I really hope get implemented because they were fantastic improvements.

[Glenzig]

I'm actually very interested to see what happens after Velious has been out for a couple years. I'm pretty sure that their plan is to release custom content (I believe I have seen the post linked in other discussions, could be mistaken though). I wonder if the custom content will be selective content from further expansions? That would be pretty cool I think.

[iruinedyourday]

I'm still happy enough just running around the karanas RP'ing with the farmers.

[Ravager]

Originally Posted by iruinedyourday [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm still happy enough just running around the karanas RP'ing with the farmers.

Don't bother the farmers. There's only about a half dozen farms to feed three continents. They need to stay focused on their work.

[fastboy21]

i have a feeling that the devs are going to implement either a working post-woken sleeper's tomb or a mechanism to reset the zone to pre-awakening, or both.

as for resetting the server, the discussion will get more and more serious after release of velious...but i don't see any critical mass of folks being interested in wiping the server for at least 2-3 years after velious release here.

i have no real appreciation for how much it costs to run these servers, and certainly have no idea how much that cost has been offset by donations...but i would think the more realistic solution in several years would be to start a new server from classic launch with all classic mechanics and set it to a classic timeline. its all academic though.

to be honest, i'm just glad that nilbog and rogean (for whatever their personal reasons are...i like to think they really love classic EQ) keep this server alive and going!